Here is what could be an interesting topic. What do you believe happens to "us" after we die?

PhillieG

Dear EVERYONE
This thread, and the forum for that matter, was set up so we can discuss the topics of Religion, Spirituality, and Meditation without fear of being attacked on a personal level for what we choose to believe and to have respect for the beliefs of others. For the MOST part, I think we have done that. There have been discussions and people have questioned others, sometimes to learn more, other times it seems to have the believer possibly question themselves. I can't speak for others at all so I do not know their reason why. Those are the reasons I post and comment.

It seems like we're getting back to the "disclaimer stage" again where we feel a need to state that it's "our opinion" and "no offense is intended". I hope we can try to get away from that. The point of this forum is to post our beliefs and opinions, however foreign they may seem to others. This is how people can learn about other faiths or schools of thought. I hope (and pray ;-) that we can maintain a level of respect for others on this part of the site at least. This is the sections where anything goes as far as what you believe, there are no right or wrong answers just what you believe.

I do hope that questions are raised to others if they want to find out more about why someone believes what they do. Of course, no one has to answer those questions either. If the discussion gets heated, remember what my Mom overheard in a playground in NYC when I was a kid.
Two Jewish Mothers were telling their kids to "fight nicely".
;-)
Peace out...
-phil

Hondo

Trew said:

Personal Beliefs
My view is that death is a sleep until Jesus comes and wakes us up on that great gettin' up morning.

Amazing how cancer can direct the thoughts to this topic. I remember coming back to the doctor's 7 days after prostate surgery. He informed me I had positive margins and that unless I had radiation I would die. I hardly remember hearing the words but my wife picked up on them. When we were going home afterwards I asked my wife what the doc has said, sort of like a dream, you know what I mean. During radiation the doctor told me my outlook was so/so, 50/50. Still a big step up from "will die." Anyway, life does look different on this side of cancer. Sort of like a mountain top experience with an extended view.

Hi Trew
According to the Bible I read you are right on the money, everyone sleeps till it’s over and Jesus comes back for the ones who put there faith in Him. My cancer did two things, first made me grow closer to God and helped me to appreciate what he has done for me.

We all have our opinions and this is just mine not to offend anyone else in what they believe,as we are all free to believe or not..

Take care and God be with you.

Hondo

PhillieG said:

Dear EVERYONE
This thread, and the forum for that matter, was set up so we can discuss the topics of Religion, Spirituality, and Meditation without fear of being attacked on a personal level for what we choose to believe and to have respect for the beliefs of others. For the MOST part, I think we have done that. There have been discussions and people have questioned others, sometimes to learn more, other times it seems to have the believer possibly question themselves. I can't speak for others at all so I do not know their reason why. Those are the reasons I post and comment.

It seems like we're getting back to the "disclaimer stage" again where we feel a need to state that it's "our opinion" and "no offense is intended". I hope we can try to get away from that. The point of this forum is to post our beliefs and opinions, however foreign they may seem to others. This is how people can learn about other faiths or schools of thought. I hope (and pray ;-) that we can maintain a level of respect for others on this part of the site at least. This is the sections where anything goes as far as what you believe, there are no right or wrong answers just what you believe.

I do hope that questions are raised to others if they want to find out more about why someone believes what they do. Of course, no one has to answer those questions either. If the discussion gets heated, remember what my Mom overheard in a playground in NYC when I was a kid.
Two Jewish Mothers were telling their kids to "fight nicely".
;-)
Peace out...
-phil

Phillieg
Thanks for clearing that issue up as sometimes I feel I am on pins and needles when I write my post in the fear of offend someone, which is not my intent at all but only to be able to express my own opinion

papajedi

PhillieG said:

Dear EVERYONE
This thread, and the forum for that matter, was set up so we can discuss the topics of Religion, Spirituality, and Meditation without fear of being attacked on a personal level for what we choose to believe and to have respect for the beliefs of others. For the MOST part, I think we have done that. There have been discussions and people have questioned others, sometimes to learn more, other times it seems to have the believer possibly question themselves. I can't speak for others at all so I do not know their reason why. Those are the reasons I post and comment.

It seems like we're getting back to the "disclaimer stage" again where we feel a need to state that it's "our opinion" and "no offense is intended". I hope we can try to get away from that. The point of this forum is to post our beliefs and opinions, however foreign they may seem to others. This is how people can learn about other faiths or schools of thought. I hope (and pray ;-) that we can maintain a level of respect for others on this part of the site at least. This is the sections where anything goes as far as what you believe, there are no right or wrong answers just what you believe.

I do hope that questions are raised to others if they want to find out more about why someone believes what they do. Of course, no one has to answer those questions either. If the discussion gets heated, remember what my Mom overheard in a playground in NYC when I was a kid.
Two Jewish Mothers were telling their kids to "fight nicely".
;-)
Peace out...
-phil

Pretty Funny
Nobody can beat a jewish mom for one liners LOL:)

papajedi

PhillieG said:

I think it's great
how cancer can direct our thoughts this way. Most people walk around clueless thinking they will live forever. Cancer or not we are all going to die. I was shaken up and started to smell more roses. I would smell them to some extent before but this has been a positive experience for the most part for me even though it sucks part of the time.

Yup
You are so right, sometimes ( I try to control it ) I get upset or jealous as I see people doing sport activities I use to be able to do............it's just hard to watch......:)

papajedi

PhillieG said:

True, that's why it's over here
in this thread and not on the Main pages.

Thank you for sharing your touching story about your Mom. I have a similar one with my Dad. He had been in and out of consciousness for a few days prior to his passing. The night he died we all were around him but he was not responsive at all. I just started to massage his "third eye" in the middle of his forehead. After a few minutes he woke up and gained consciousness, we all got to talk with him even though he couldn't speak he knew what was going on.
Later that night he passed away.
-phil

visit more and share more too if you feel inclined to

Glad
You got that chance!1 I never did, my Dad dies suddenly and it took me years to reconcile myself to never having gotten to say good-bye.

papajedi

sierrareef said:

I'm following a Buddhist path
I've only scanned this thread but I saw somewhere back a request for responses outside the Christian belief system so I thought I'd chime in. I recently lost my wife to cancer and have posted on the caregivers survivor board. My wife was a Christian with a strong Mormon influence, but before we began to date she had drifted from the church. Nevertheless, her Christian faith remained strong.

I was raised a Catholic, was saved in a Southern Baptist chruch as a new US Marine in training in Memphis. Not long after being saved I stopped attending the church and began to question where my faith had come from. I finally accepted that I was agnostic - wanting to believe in God but unable to do so without question, but also unable to say he didn't exist at all. I remained an Agnostic for years and began to formulate my own theories about what spiritual realms and realities were out there.

When my wife was diagnosed with cancer I thought I should help her reconnect on a deeper level with her faith so I began to read the Bible and the Book of Mormon to her at bedtime. From there, we progressed - she had an interest in other faiths so we got books that taught beliefs from different religions. One day she let me know that she had read about Buddhism and that she was quite intrigued with Buddhist teachings.

I then began to read about Buddhism and, simply put, I found my path. For me, for the first time, I had a profound connection to the teachings of a "religion" (some would argus that Buddhism is not a religion). My dear wife led me to my spiritual path when I was trying to reconnect her to her belief system.

Anyway, I am new to the path but feel I have learned enough to talk about it. Suffice it to say that the Buddhist path has been very helpful to me during my wife's cancer journey. I also learned to honor other people's faiths more than I had before. My wife's Christian faith was unwavering and she fought her battle with dignity, strength and a clear conscious, never fearing death because she knew she would be in her Heavenly Father's Kingdom at the end of her battle.

If you are curious about Buddhism, and if I'm capable, I'll try and answer some of your questions. Metta.

Sorry
About your wife, she had great courage and grace. What a great post!! I was in the Navy

papajedi

PhillieG said:

Ok, ok...My Dream
I dreamed that I ate a GIANT marshmallow, when I woke up my pillow was gone!!!
Sorry, I couldn't resist being the immature person I am.

I do believe though in the presence of other "people/spirits" or whatever you wish to call them. I don't think it's just lights out, everyone go home when it's over. While I know I do not believe in the catholic teaching of heaven/hell/original sin/etc, I really do not know what happens to us after we die. I do think religion was created to explain the unexplainable (until science had to come along and ruin everything!) and also to keep people in line and get property and money etc....

But who knows, maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm right. I think as long as you are not hurting anyone you're probably doing OK.

Yeah
You are right I think, there have been so many documented near death experiences that it 's hard to discount the afterlife.

papajedi

Shayenne said:

WoW....
....How could I miss this great thread? I never thinkn of looking here! I'm such a dummy!

I was raised Catholic, went to a Catholic school till 5th grade, church, all that, but not very practicing. I do believe in Jesus, and God, angels, Heaven and Hell, I believe in it all. There have too many experiences in my life that would be unexplainable, and there is no way our souls just die.

I will share a couple of things that happened to me....

After my father died, I had a dream that night, where he was laying in his casket, and when I went over to it, he sat up, and stretched his arms really wide, saying "Come give me one last hug before I move on" and I literally hugged him, crying in my dream, and when I woke up, I was still crying! I believe he came in my dream for that goodbye, it was so real.

Another time, when my grandmother died, the lights in my house blinked on and off 3 times, when I got the phone call from an aunt saying she died right at that time, it was very strange...too many deceased relatives that come in my dreams and talk to me, it just doesn't end.

I don't judge anyone their beliefs, everyone has their own opinion, I know my experiences may sound nutty, but in my heart, there is something out there after death, our bodies are just a shell, and when we die, our spirit goes free.

Glad to finally read other posts here...great views from everyone.

Hugssss!!
~Donna

That Is So Cool
It is sssooo comforting that God can step into our minds and reality to provide that healing and emotional touch when we need it most!! I'm so grateful he touched you that way!!

papajedi

RE said:

TIme to Share
Okay I am jumping in a bit late since this part of the tread happened in August but I will share one of the unique things that has happened to me. I have copied it from where I posted it on the bc board in Dec 08...here goes.

My sister passed away on Dec 15, 2007 sometime between 2:00 a.m. and 4 a.m. we were all there but none of us know the exact time. She was fascinated with things that lit up, toys, eye glasses that had lights in them to read (she called these her magic eyes and she made sure we all had a pair :-)) figurines that lit up and candles, oh how she loved candles. In her home she had at least 20 candles that she lit nightly, it was always beautiful and of course it smelled lovely. She also had a gorgeous heart shaped wreath that lights up which she gave to me day's before she passed saying she was sending her heart with me because she knew I would care for it and keep it lit, she was right.

I have told you this as a lead in to what has been happening in my home over the last week. Please read this with an open mind and heart and know that I am a very happy and stable woman (not a nut job). On my husbands side of the bed he has a touch sensitive lamp which has been there for a year and has functioned properly in all of that time. Well four nights ago it began turning on on its own the moment I would turn out my light to go to sleep; which is in most cases no earlier than 2:30 a.m. Now, I mean that I would close my eyes and the lamp would turn on. I thought how odd the first night and asked him to turn it off, it did it 6 more times till we finally just left it on. In the following days I have checked the light throughout the day and it has remained off. No further light shows occurred until last night, I closed my eyes and on came the light. I shut it off and that was the end of that. Tonight at 3:00 a.m. I turned my lamp out, got comfortable and closed my eyes, ping the room lit up. I asked my husband to turn the light out and he looked perplexed and checked his watch, it was then that I realized it is only turning on in the hours that she passed, in the month that she passed and it is a light and as I mentioned above she loved lights! I sobbed for a few moments and am still tearing a bit. It is just like her to want to soothe my pain of her loss by letting me know she is okay. I then vocally told her "I got it, I understand Susan it's you and you are okay. Once I acknowledged her it stopped happening Please understand that I am not making this up, I am in tears as I write this. I am trusting that you all will understand.

I am putting my reputation as a stable person on the line here. I hope this has not offended anyone as it is not my intention to push a spiritual aspect on anyone, it is just what is happening here and I wanted to share.

As I stated in my intro I wrote that on Dec 5, 2008, the lamp has never done that again and continues to function normally.

Thank you all for sharing your experiences which prompted me to do the same.

RE

Smiles
You are fine, sometimes he loves us so deeply and just wants to uniquely reassure us

papajedi

PhillieG said:

I always liked what Johnny Carson said
For days after death hair and fingernails continue to grow, but phone calls taper off.
~Johnny Carson

Holy Crap
Kep those coming, my God that's funny !!

Laura88

papajedi said:

Yup
You are so right, sometimes ( I try to control it ) I get upset or jealous as I see people doing sport activities I use to be able to do............it's just hard to watch......:)

jealousy
I totally relate. I try so hard to control it -- but sometimes I just want to scream. I have a friend who is so upset every birthday -- I'm so old, I'm so wrinkled, on and on. This year I could not take it!! I got so mad at her -- started screaming I hope I get to be as old as you!! My son is getting married in 14 mos. I know someone fighting with her daughter over stupid things about her wedding. Again, I want to yell and scream -- leave her alone -- I just hope I'm here for my son's wedding!!! It's so frustrating. I try to look at my cancer as a learning tool -- you quickly learn to appreciate every day, every little thing. I get very angry and frustrated when people close to me do not do that, even though they see my emotional struggles. Anyway -- I think this is what you are talking about. I totally understand - it's very hard. I hope I'm teaching people what is important -- maybe that's why I got this?

Glenna M

Laura88 said:

jealousy
I totally relate. I try so hard to control it -- but sometimes I just want to scream. I have a friend who is so upset every birthday -- I'm so old, I'm so wrinkled, on and on. This year I could not take it!! I got so mad at her -- started screaming I hope I get to be as old as you!! My son is getting married in 14 mos. I know someone fighting with her daughter over stupid things about her wedding. Again, I want to yell and scream -- leave her alone -- I just hope I'm here for my son's wedding!!! It's so frustrating. I try to look at my cancer as a learning tool -- you quickly learn to appreciate every day, every little thing. I get very angry and frustrated when people close to me do not do that, even though they see my emotional struggles. Anyway -- I think this is what you are talking about. I totally understand - it's very hard. I hope I'm teaching people what is important -- maybe that's why I got this?

Laura88
I know exactly how you feel when you say "you quickly learn to appreciate every day, every little thing. I get very angry and frustrated when people close to me do not do that, even though they see my emotional struggles". I appreciate everyday and I get upset when people take the little things for granted but then I realize I see things through different eyes than most people do, if you haven't been diagnosed with cancer you don't think of your time as being limited. Even though these people could die in a freak accident at any time they don't look at life that way, they just assume, like most of us used to, that they will live to a ripe old age :-)

I would also like to teach people, especially my family and friends, to appreciate what is important in life but I think it is hopeless. Not that they don't care but without daily reminders, like cancer patients have, they just get busy with their dail routines and forget that their time here could be cut short at any time.

Stay strong and keep smiling,
Glenna

Trew

Basics
I see the Bible as the authority on life and death. I read it regularly and note how these two themes are presented. A serious study of the first 3 chapters of Genesis will answer a lot of questions on life and death. I am not interested in folk lore, world views, or tradition so I often end up walking a different pathway than many. And why not? I have read Genesis very carefully.

Knowledge is an anchor. Emotions and feelings run wild, like the wind, and can blow one anywhere, my o' my have I expereinced that is year! Enjoy emotions for what they are worth on good days, but trust knowledge. As the Bible says, "Thy word is the truth."

PS: I like ping pong, too.

Lisa13Q

Trew said:

Basics
I see the Bible as the authority on life and death. I read it regularly and note how these two themes are presented. A serious study of the first 3 chapters of Genesis will answer a lot of questions on life and death. I am not interested in folk lore, world views, or tradition so I often end up walking a different pathway than many. And why not? I have read Genesis very carefully.

Knowledge is an anchor. Emotions and feelings run wild, like the wind, and can blow one anywhere, my o' my have I expereinced that is year! Enjoy emotions for what they are worth on good days, but trust knowledge. As the Bible says, "Thy word is the truth."

PS: I like ping pong, too.

Question for the reigious here
If heaven is so great, and you truly believe in it, why aren't you all enthusiastic about going, and not joyful about dying? Personally, I don't think I can believe in heaven, if i did I would sure want to get there rather than endure this...

Shayenne

Lisa13Q said:

Question for the reigious here
If heaven is so great, and you truly believe in it, why aren't you all enthusiastic about going, and not joyful about dying? Personally, I don't think I can believe in heaven, if i did I would sure want to get there rather than endure this...

I Know
For myself, I don't care how beautiful and joyous Heaven is, I am sure it is, but I'm not ready to leave my children yet is why, and they aren't ready to see me go.

PhillieG

Lisa13Q said:

Question for the reigious here
If heaven is so great, and you truly believe in it, why aren't you all enthusiastic about going, and not joyful about dying? Personally, I don't think I can believe in heaven, if i did I would sure want to get there rather than endure this...

Look at Suicide Bombers...
They can't WAIT to get there!
How strange (to me) is that?

Marcia527

Lisa13Q said:

Question for the reigious here
If heaven is so great, and you truly believe in it, why aren't you all enthusiastic about going, and not joyful about dying? Personally, I don't think I can believe in heaven, if i did I would sure want to get there rather than endure this...

I believe in the next life
I believe in the next life (Heaven if you want to call it that). I know it's better than this life but believe we need to wait till it's our time to pass over and shouldn't rush it. There are lessons to learn and we might be able to help another in some way. This life is really short if you compare it to eternity. No matter how sick I feel or problems I have, I can wait for my time. Besides I'm teaching my husband to cook...he knows how to make eggs now. :>)

Trew

Lisa13Q said:

Question for the reigious here
If heaven is so great, and you truly believe in it, why aren't you all enthusiastic about going, and not joyful about dying? Personally, I don't think I can believe in heaven, if i did I would sure want to get there rather than endure this...

Knockin' on Heaven's Door
IF heaven could be gained by simply dying, your question makes sense. And I have no doubts that many have tried to enter that way- by dying.

But there are conditions laid out clearly in the Bible for enterance into heaven. The thief on the cross demonstrated those steps. He repented, believed on Jesus, and submitted or followed (as best he could). Dying is not one of the steps to gaining eternal life.

Paul, facing execution in the near future (he was beheaded) knew there was a glorious future waiting for him- not at death, but according to 1 Cor. 15- at the second Coming of Jesus. It is Jesus who rewards the faithful with life then- at His Coming. Jesus is the one who is in charge of "heavenly admissions," and not we ourselves. So we cling to life here while we live, knowing that life is not ours to take, but to live in a faith relationship with Jesus until our last breath slips away and we fall asleep in Jesus as described in John 11 and 1 Thess. 4.

So, while we live it our lot to be in a state of repentance and obedience before Jesus, and turst in Him and wait. You never know, some who have been close to death have recovered.

All that said, there is nothing wrong with letting a disease takes it course and refusing treatment that only complicates what life is left.

Trew

Marcia527 said:

I believe in the next life
I believe in the next life (Heaven if you want to call it that). I know it's better than this life but believe we need to wait till it's our time to pass over and shouldn't rush it. There are lessons to learn and we might be able to help another in some way. This life is really short if you compare it to eternity. No matter how sick I feel or problems I have, I can wait for my time. Besides I'm teaching my husband to cook...he knows how to make eggs now. :>)

Marica,
May the Lord bless you and keep you and thank-you for your insight and may the Lord bless your husband with culinary skills equall to your faith and humor!