Horrible Guilt Justified?
Hi. I'm new here and have met some of you in chat. You all are so encouraging and generous.
My husband, Gary, was dx'd with nsclc 3 wks ago. After the initial shock wore off I have been having thoughts that I do not want to have. You see, Gary has screwed around on me for the entire 20 years of our marriage. He's distant and cold to me. Just last Sunday he pretended to go to work and went on a date.
I have been seeing a counselor who showed me that I had been emotionally abused throughout our marriage. I had decided to leave him! But then, the same day, we discovered his cancer!
So now I feel obgligated to help him as much as I can while at the same time I'm filled with such pain, anger and hurt for what he's done. Is there any way to resolve this in my head? It hurts from the confusion. Btw, it was only last Sunday I found out about him pretending to go to work and going on a date. It turned out he had done that 2 sundays in a row. But I have been very aware that he messed around on me with multiple people all the time.
I should also mention that I am disabled and Gary has made sure I ate, and taken me to numerous doctor's appts all this time. He always showed disgust and anger at me for being sick.
I don't want to feel guilty if he doesn't make it.
What should I do or how should I think?? Donna
‹ What cancer facility is the best? too late for chemo? Lung cancer ›
Comments
-
get busy
I'm so sorry to hear of your sad situation, but it does not change the fact that your marriage is badly broken. Kind of like driving a car that won't start half the time, and won't go in reverse. You never get a smooth ride.
What is his stage and prognosis? Lots of people live a long time with this disease, and you may not want to stay after all. Because you are disabled, I would get busy figuring out how you are going to live independently. This does not mean you are abandoning Gary in his time of need, because you can still help him as much as you can.
You have nothing to feel guilty about, so lighten up on yourself.0 -
BarbaraBarbara53 said:get busy
I'm so sorry to hear of your sad situation, but it does not change the fact that your marriage is badly broken. Kind of like driving a car that won't start half the time, and won't go in reverse. You never get a smooth ride.
What is his stage and prognosis? Lots of people live a long time with this disease, and you may not want to stay after all. Because you are disabled, I would get busy figuring out how you are going to live independently. This does not mean you are abandoning Gary in his time of need, because you can still help him as much as you can.
You have nothing to feel guilty about, so lighten up on yourself.
Barbara, thanks for answering me. We will find out tomorrow the results of his pet scan. I think I'll be better able to make a desicion then.
Thank you for your reassurances. I think I just needed to know that I was not being horrible.
Donna0 -
DonnaDonnanva said:Barbara
Barbara, thanks for answering me. We will find out tomorrow the results of his pet scan. I think I'll be better able to make a desicion then.
Thank you for your reassurances. I think I just needed to know that I was not being horrible.
Donna
You have nothing to feel horrible about and nothing to feel guilty for. He's the one who should feel horrible and guilty for treating you bad. Whatever you decide I wish you the best.0 -
Be responsible to your own clarityDonnanva said:Barbara
Barbara, thanks for answering me. We will find out tomorrow the results of his pet scan. I think I'll be better able to make a desicion then.
Thank you for your reassurances. I think I just needed to know that I was not being horrible.
Donna
Donna:
You are certainly not a horrible person. Unfortunately, knowing that guilt is irrational doesn't necessarily make the guilt go away. From what you have said, you do seem VERY clear as to your marriage being over, regardless of his diagnosis and whatever care he had provided you in the past. Cancer robs us of a lot of things, take careful steps that it doesn't rob you of your own responsibility to yourself and your own clarity.
I would certainly encourage you to define limits (maybe with the help of your counselor?) as to how much (or little) care you are willing to provide him, given the circumstances and your sense of obligation. Allow yourself a lot of room to maneuver and adjust with this ongoing process.
Gentle hugs ....
Lucas0 -
Welcomelucas_88 said:Be responsible to your own clarity
Donna:
You are certainly not a horrible person. Unfortunately, knowing that guilt is irrational doesn't necessarily make the guilt go away. From what you have said, you do seem VERY clear as to your marriage being over, regardless of his diagnosis and whatever care he had provided you in the past. Cancer robs us of a lot of things, take careful steps that it doesn't rob you of your own responsibility to yourself and your own clarity.
I would certainly encourage you to define limits (maybe with the help of your counselor?) as to how much (or little) care you are willing to provide him, given the circumstances and your sense of obligation. Allow yourself a lot of room to maneuver and adjust with this ongoing process.
Gentle hugs ....
Lucas
Hello Donna and welcome to our caregivers discussion board. I was a caregiver for my dad. He passed away in March from esophageal cancer. First question first....regarding your husband's cancer. A lot of the decisions you both are going to have to make with his cancer depends on a few things. What stage is the cancer at? Is is able to have surgery? What is his prognosis? As far as the best place to be treated, it depends on where you live. There are many wonderful hospitals and cancer centers. Now...on to the next question. You do not have anything to feel quilty about! You have done nothing wrong. He is the one who has done you wrong for the past 20 years, and he should be the one feeling guilty. You do not have to help him in his journey with cancer. You do owe it to yourself to take care of yourself and get out of a very disfunctional marriage. You have taken his abuse for long enough. He does not deserve you. Tell him if he needs help to go ask one of his many girlfriends. I am sorry for being so honest, but I feel that you already knew the answer to this question as soon as you typed it. Stop living in denial. and start living for yourself! Keep in touch.
Tina0 -
Hi~
I'm so sorry to hear
Hi~
I'm so sorry to hear about your husband's diagnosis and the difficult situation you're in. I can relate to a lot of what you posted. My husband just passed away 3/1/10 of colon cancer. He also truly victimized (and I really hate that term but it is true!) my children (four) and myself for many, many years. I won't go into all of the details because it's a very long tired story! You can go back and read my other posts some time if you'd like to. He emotionally and mentally neglected and abused us. I knew he was a selfish, lazy jerk who didn't really care about me or the kids - he truly lived for himself. I was just passing time until I divorced him - I was waiting for the kids to get a little older so they would be ok on their own for a while (when not is school, etc.) so I could go to work and so they could have a little more maturity under their belts to be able to deal with "the sperm donor" when (unfortunately) they would have had to stay with him. I also was seeing a therapist and she assured me that, with my help, they could be able to deal with him. I was so close to divorcing him when he was diagnosed. After he was dx, I decided to try very hard to change my attitude towards him and love him as much as I could to care for him. I figured I married him and had these amazing children and it was my job to be a good example and do the right thing. I never stopped caring for him as a wife - even before he was diagnosed - I always tried to do the right thing. At one point during his illness, I was so tired of trying to care for and have some kind of relationship with him - he was always so selfish and noncaring and difficult - I also suspected and really knew that he saw other women during the years of our marriage - I saw a divorce attorney - I will tell you her advice - she said: do not try to leave this man - she said if he really was as difficult as I was saying, he would find a way to keep the money from us and be awful through it and she said it sounded as if he wasn't going to live much longer and I had too much to lose. I'm glad I listened to her! My point to you is - he ended up being worse than I ever knew - after he died and I started going through the finances, etc. I found evidence of many affairs and one very intense one during the last year of his life when the kids and I were working so hard to care for him - he didn't value any of it. I had to pay off jewelry expenses, hotel expenses, flower and candy charges - you name it - I had to pay for it - purchases he made for other women and wouldn't even purchase a momento for this kids from their dying father!
Anyway, I understand your pain and please, please don't put yourself through the guilt! He made these terrible choices - not you! My advice is to weight it all out - look at what you stand to lose and make correct choices for yourself! He obviously doesn't care about you just like my husband didn't are about us! If you have too much to lose by leaving now, wait it out. That doesn't mean you're a terrible person - but you do have to look out for your life. I'm glad I waited it out and I did care for him throughout his illness - very well actually - I tried to love him the best that I could - he didn't want it - it was a realy slap in the fact to learn about he affair he had the last year of his life - I truly believed that was over and done with at this stage and just maybe he valued his family a little - not to be! Even though I know in the past that he had relationships with other women that were too close for a married man, I would have never believed they were what they ended up being - he truly led a double life. I am glad he's gone - he was a terrible man and we are a much happier family without him - the kids have even expressed that - I don't feel guilty about that - he did what he did and made those choices himself - we did our very best to love a very difficult person.
Hang in there, don't feel guilty, value yourself. I made the choices I made based on how I would feel about myself when it was all over with.
Sorry for the length.
Lots of love,
Tina0 -
Glad You PostedSamsWife said:Hi~
I'm so sorry to hear
Hi~
I'm so sorry to hear about your husband's diagnosis and the difficult situation you're in. I can relate to a lot of what you posted. My husband just passed away 3/1/10 of colon cancer. He also truly victimized (and I really hate that term but it is true!) my children (four) and myself for many, many years. I won't go into all of the details because it's a very long tired story! You can go back and read my other posts some time if you'd like to. He emotionally and mentally neglected and abused us. I knew he was a selfish, lazy jerk who didn't really care about me or the kids - he truly lived for himself. I was just passing time until I divorced him - I was waiting for the kids to get a little older so they would be ok on their own for a while (when not is school, etc.) so I could go to work and so they could have a little more maturity under their belts to be able to deal with "the sperm donor" when (unfortunately) they would have had to stay with him. I also was seeing a therapist and she assured me that, with my help, they could be able to deal with him. I was so close to divorcing him when he was diagnosed. After he was dx, I decided to try very hard to change my attitude towards him and love him as much as I could to care for him. I figured I married him and had these amazing children and it was my job to be a good example and do the right thing. I never stopped caring for him as a wife - even before he was diagnosed - I always tried to do the right thing. At one point during his illness, I was so tired of trying to care for and have some kind of relationship with him - he was always so selfish and noncaring and difficult - I also suspected and really knew that he saw other women during the years of our marriage - I saw a divorce attorney - I will tell you her advice - she said: do not try to leave this man - she said if he really was as difficult as I was saying, he would find a way to keep the money from us and be awful through it and she said it sounded as if he wasn't going to live much longer and I had too much to lose. I'm glad I listened to her! My point to you is - he ended up being worse than I ever knew - after he died and I started going through the finances, etc. I found evidence of many affairs and one very intense one during the last year of his life when the kids and I were working so hard to care for him - he didn't value any of it. I had to pay off jewelry expenses, hotel expenses, flower and candy charges - you name it - I had to pay for it - purchases he made for other women and wouldn't even purchase a momento for this kids from their dying father!
Anyway, I understand your pain and please, please don't put yourself through the guilt! He made these terrible choices - not you! My advice is to weight it all out - look at what you stand to lose and make correct choices for yourself! He obviously doesn't care about you just like my husband didn't are about us! If you have too much to lose by leaving now, wait it out. That doesn't mean you're a terrible person - but you do have to look out for your life. I'm glad I waited it out and I did care for him throughout his illness - very well actually - I tried to love him the best that I could - he didn't want it - it was a realy slap in the fact to learn about he affair he had the last year of his life - I truly believed that was over and done with at this stage and just maybe he valued his family a little - not to be! Even though I know in the past that he had relationships with other women that were too close for a married man, I would have never believed they were what they ended up being - he truly led a double life. I am glad he's gone - he was a terrible man and we are a much happier family without him - the kids have even expressed that - I don't feel guilty about that - he did what he did and made those choices himself - we did our very best to love a very difficult person.
Hang in there, don't feel guilty, value yourself. I made the choices I made based on how I would feel about myself when it was all over with.
Sorry for the length.
Lots of love,
Tina
Tina, I am glad you posted. As I read the other posts, I found myself thinking of you. You are the one person I think can best relate here. I agree that seeing an attorney might be a good idea. We all have to do what is right for ourselves. No one should be forced to stay in an abusive situation because the abuser has cancer. You need to consider all the options and not let guilt or fear prevent you from doing what is right for you. Emotional and verbal abuse are as damaging as physical abuse. It just doesn't show on the outside as much. Gay0 -
Has Anyone Heard?grandmafay said:Glad You Posted
Tina, I am glad you posted. As I read the other posts, I found myself thinking of you. You are the one person I think can best relate here. I agree that seeing an attorney might be a good idea. We all have to do what is right for ourselves. No one should be forced to stay in an abusive situation because the abuser has cancer. You need to consider all the options and not let guilt or fear prevent you from doing what is right for you. Emotional and verbal abuse are as damaging as physical abuse. It just doesn't show on the outside as much. Gay
Hello gay and Tina (also
)
I was just wondering if anyone here has heard back from Donnava since she posted this. Yes thank you Tina for sharing your story. You are the one that can mostly connect and relate to her. Your stories sound alot alike. Hope you are both doing ok. We just passed the 6 month mark of my dad's passing. As did you too Tina. It is still hard. I know it is going to be. Hoping Donna will come back here soon to give us her update. Keeping you all in thought and prayer.
Tina in Va.0 -
Update?Tina Blondek said:Has Anyone Heard?
Hello gay and Tina (also)
I was just wondering if anyone here has heard back from Donnava since she posted this. Yes thank you Tina for sharing your story. You are the one that can mostly connect and relate to her. Your stories sound alot alike. Hope you are both doing ok. We just passed the 6 month mark of my dad's passing. As did you too Tina. It is still hard. I know it is going to be. Hoping Donna will come back here soon to give us her update. Keeping you all in thought and prayer.
Tina in Va.
No, I haven't seen an update. I hope all is going ok for her. I don't know why I keep making the typo with my name. It is Fay, not Gay. Donnava give us an update when you can. Fay0 -
Thank you Tina and Fay -grandmafay said:Update?
No, I haven't seen an update. I hope all is going ok for her. I don't know why I keep making the typo with my name. It is Fay, not Gay. Donnava give us an update when you can. Fay
Thank you Tina and Fay - it's always so great to hear from you guys! You've meant a lot to me. I somehow feel a need to come back here and read about the struggles people go through and the great insight and goodness! I'm really struggling with remembering that there really are a lot of good, good people in the world. I've run in to so many people that are just awful and I just can't believe it sometimes! I'm currently struggling with a terrible contractor that did some work for me - ugh! Anyway - that's another story!
Cancer is so, so terrible but I love reading the stories from people who work so hard to love each other - it truly gives me hope for myself and my kids - that someday they and I will also have that kind of love and devotion in our lives - as far as a spouse or significant other - we have it with each other and I am happy to report that we are thriving in a way we never have before! I'm still unloading baggage but I really believe in another six months to a year I am going to be in a really, really good place. It still just feels so unnatural to not grieve for this man who was such a huge part of our lives; but, in reality, he really wasn't - it really is a sad story for him.
Anyway - I hope you girls are doing well and I hope Donnava does reply so we can see how she's doing. Have a great day! Tina0 -
Hi Again
Thank you all so much for responding to me. I came down with pneumonia and that's why I've been gone so long.
I was so touched by all of you responding to me. Such compassion from folks who are suffering so much yet are still able to reach out to a stranger. It means alot to me.
Gary has finished his first week of treatment with chemo and radiation. He is tolerating it poorly. I had no idea it was going to hit him so hard and so fast. Despite what he has done in the past, and despite knowing he will continue to do those things if he's successful in treatment, it is awful to see him just lie there suffering. Wow. I didn't know it was going to be this hard.
I didn't know that after just one week of treatment he would feel so bad. Is that normal? One of the doctors had said that he should do pretty well during the first week or two.
Tina, I'm so sorry that your husband acted like an **** during your marraige too. especially that he continued even during treatment! I just don't understand what provokes people to think that they have every right in the world to do just what they please with no sense of committment to another. What is up with that kind of thinking???
I'll write again soon. How are you all doing? Donna0 -
Thanks TinaTina Blondek said:Welcome
Hello Donna and welcome to our caregivers discussion board. I was a caregiver for my dad. He passed away in March from esophageal cancer. First question first....regarding your husband's cancer. A lot of the decisions you both are going to have to make with his cancer depends on a few things. What stage is the cancer at? Is is able to have surgery? What is his prognosis? As far as the best place to be treated, it depends on where you live. There are many wonderful hospitals and cancer centers. Now...on to the next question. You do not have anything to feel quilty about! You have done nothing wrong. He is the one who has done you wrong for the past 20 years, and he should be the one feeling guilty. You do not have to help him in his journey with cancer. You do owe it to yourself to take care of yourself and get out of a very disfunctional marriage. You have taken his abuse for long enough. He does not deserve you. Tell him if he needs help to go ask one of his many girlfriends. I am sorry for being so honest, but I feel that you already knew the answer to this question as soon as you typed it. Stop living in denial. and start living for yourself! Keep in touch.
Tina
Your dad was lucky to have you as a caregiver. Gary is stage 3a. It is inoperable at this time but he may still have it if radiation and chemo shrink it enough.
This is the first time I've been through this kind of thing as an adult. I had always thought that if Gary went before I did it would be pretty easy for me but it's truely not! I don't think his prognosis is very high so I'm pretty sure I will help him as much as I can.
Thank you so much for letting me know you understand. I guess I've been pretty well protected and now I will really have to discover my own innate strength to get through all this...just as you guys have done and are doing.
Take care. Donna0 -
Thanks TinaTina Blondek said:Welcome
Hello Donna and welcome to our caregivers discussion board. I was a caregiver for my dad. He passed away in March from esophageal cancer. First question first....regarding your husband's cancer. A lot of the decisions you both are going to have to make with his cancer depends on a few things. What stage is the cancer at? Is is able to have surgery? What is his prognosis? As far as the best place to be treated, it depends on where you live. There are many wonderful hospitals and cancer centers. Now...on to the next question. You do not have anything to feel quilty about! You have done nothing wrong. He is the one who has done you wrong for the past 20 years, and he should be the one feeling guilty. You do not have to help him in his journey with cancer. You do owe it to yourself to take care of yourself and get out of a very disfunctional marriage. You have taken his abuse for long enough. He does not deserve you. Tell him if he needs help to go ask one of his many girlfriends. I am sorry for being so honest, but I feel that you already knew the answer to this question as soon as you typed it. Stop living in denial. and start living for yourself! Keep in touch.
Tina
Your dad was lucky to have you as a caregiver. Gary is stage 3a. It is inoperable at this time but he may still have it if radiation and chemo shrink it enough.
This is the first time I've been through this kind of thing as an adult. I had always thought that if Gary went before I did it would be pretty easy for me but it's truely not! I don't think his prognosis is very high so I'm pretty sure I will help him as much as I can.
Thank you so much for letting me know you understand. I guess I've been pretty well protected and now I will really have to discover my own innate strength to get through all this...just as you guys have done and are doing.
Take care. Donna0 -
QuestionsDonnanva said:Hi Again
Thank you all so much for responding to me. I came down with pneumonia and that's why I've been gone so long.
I was so touched by all of you responding to me. Such compassion from folks who are suffering so much yet are still able to reach out to a stranger. It means alot to me.
Gary has finished his first week of treatment with chemo and radiation. He is tolerating it poorly. I had no idea it was going to hit him so hard and so fast. Despite what he has done in the past, and despite knowing he will continue to do those things if he's successful in treatment, it is awful to see him just lie there suffering. Wow. I didn't know it was going to be this hard.
I didn't know that after just one week of treatment he would feel so bad. Is that normal? One of the doctors had said that he should do pretty well during the first week or two.
Tina, I'm so sorry that your husband acted like an **** during your marraige too. especially that he continued even during treatment! I just don't understand what provokes people to think that they have every right in the world to do just what they please with no sense of committment to another. What is up with that kind of thinking???
I'll write again soon. How are you all doing? Donna
As I read post I think this sounds like it could be me writing them. I think when you get hit with the "C" word you start noticing the things going on around you more.
I have been married 37 years, I want to say to a wonderiufl husband, but that is not true , I have been married 37 years to the guy that some times makes me so happy and sometimes he P"s me off so bad. I try to think is it me or him, It is both of us. I know that all the things he does not do does not mean he does not love me. I know the things he does that P me off he has always done them. I think I am scare and I am picking apart all these things out of fear. Maybe so if he dies I will not be so angry. So whos. I know at the end of the day, no matter what I think he did or did not do, should have done could have done. I still ove him. I hope he loves me with all of my faults . I am pretty sure I have many!
If they can still do for them selfs , Which my can I back away and let him do as much as he can. Sometimes I wait on him hand and foot. So things will equal out .
My husband my friend!0 -
ThanksDonnanva said:Hi Again
Thank you all so much for responding to me. I came down with pneumonia and that's why I've been gone so long.
I was so touched by all of you responding to me. Such compassion from folks who are suffering so much yet are still able to reach out to a stranger. It means alot to me.
Gary has finished his first week of treatment with chemo and radiation. He is tolerating it poorly. I had no idea it was going to hit him so hard and so fast. Despite what he has done in the past, and despite knowing he will continue to do those things if he's successful in treatment, it is awful to see him just lie there suffering. Wow. I didn't know it was going to be this hard.
I didn't know that after just one week of treatment he would feel so bad. Is that normal? One of the doctors had said that he should do pretty well during the first week or two.
Tina, I'm so sorry that your husband acted like an **** during your marraige too. especially that he continued even during treatment! I just don't understand what provokes people to think that they have every right in the world to do just what they please with no sense of committment to another. What is up with that kind of thinking???
I'll write again soon. How are you all doing? Donna
Thanks for the update and private message. It was nice to know that you are ok. Everyone reacts to chemo differently. I'm sorry your husband is having an extra hard time. You still need to take care of yourself. Fay0 -
Worse than I thought
The situation is worse than I thought with Gary. I found some financial records from a secret credit card account. He has spent over 15,000, maybe lots more...I can only go back a year and a half. He's been making payments of 1000, 800, 200.00 every two weeks!!!!!
And I always thought we didn't have any money to spare!!!!!!!. There are so many things I've wanted to do with Gary but thought we just couldn't afford it. Now I find out he's been taking her to area festivals, restaurants, out for ice cream, etc!!!!! He always tells me that he hates to go to festivals because he hates crowds.
I am shocked beyond belief. I am hurt, angry and humiliated. Wow. I can't afford to life on my own. What in hell do I do to get through this except pray he dies.0 -
Worse than I thought
The situation is worse than I thought with Gary. I found some financial records from a secret credit card account. He has spent over 15,000, maybe lots more...I can only go back a year and a half. He's been making payments of 1000, 800, 200.00 every two weeks!!!!!
And I always thought we didn't have any money to spare!!!!!!!. There are so many things I've wanted to do with Gary but thought we just couldn't afford it. Now I find out he's been taking her to area festivals, restaurants, out for ice cream, etc!!!!! He always tells me that he hates to go to festivals because he hates crowds.
I am shocked beyond belief. I am hurt, angry and humiliated. Wow. I can't afford to life on my own. What in hell do I do to get through this except pray he dies.0 -
That's horrible!Donnanva said:Worse than I thought
The situation is worse than I thought with Gary. I found some financial records from a secret credit card account. He has spent over 15,000, maybe lots more...I can only go back a year and a half. He's been making payments of 1000, 800, 200.00 every two weeks!!!!!
And I always thought we didn't have any money to spare!!!!!!!. There are so many things I've wanted to do with Gary but thought we just couldn't afford it. Now I find out he's been taking her to area festivals, restaurants, out for ice cream, etc!!!!! He always tells me that he hates to go to festivals because he hates crowds.
I am shocked beyond belief. I am hurt, angry and humiliated. Wow. I can't afford to life on my own. What in hell do I do to get through this except pray he dies.
Donnanva,
Wow that's horrible! I would be so pissed (OOPS) off if I was you. Have you confronted him? I'm sure it's hard to feel sorry for him cause he's sick. As for taking care of him, that'll be hard to do also. Tell him you can't take care of him cause you hate sickness. No I'm not sure what I'd do in your situation. Guess you just have to take one day at a time and see what happens. Try to talk to your friends or family for support. Good Luck!
"Carole"0 -
Carole3Mana said:That's horrible!
Donnanva,
Wow that's horrible! I would be so pissed (OOPS) off if I was you. Have you confronted him? I'm sure it's hard to feel sorry for him cause he's sick. As for taking care of him, that'll be hard to do also. Tell him you can't take care of him cause you hate sickness. No I'm not sure what I'd do in your situation. Guess you just have to take one day at a time and see what happens. Try to talk to your friends or family for support. Good Luck!
"Carole"
Thanks for responding to me Carole. I don't know what I'd do if I didn't have this discussion forum where you guys come and talk to me. Donna0 -
Carole3Mana said:That's horrible!
Donnanva,
Wow that's horrible! I would be so pissed (OOPS) off if I was you. Have you confronted him? I'm sure it's hard to feel sorry for him cause he's sick. As for taking care of him, that'll be hard to do also. Tell him you can't take care of him cause you hate sickness. No I'm not sure what I'd do in your situation. Guess you just have to take one day at a time and see what happens. Try to talk to your friends or family for support. Good Luck!
"Carole"
Thanks for responding to me Carole. I don't know what I'd do if I didn't have this discussion forum where you guys come and talk to me. Donna0
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