husband cheating while sick
Comments
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Blame The Victim? No Way!
I have been trying to write you ever since I saw your post~ it is just so heartbreaking, I couldn't find the right words. I of course have read all of the replies, and can understand Eil's reaction to Robert...another can of worms is on the verge of being opened!
So much of life is a decision, isn't it? ( obvious exceptions include cancer, of course!) While visiting a neighbor, I might see $20.00 on a side table~ I COULD slip it into my purse, couldn't I? How about shoplifting? I COULD do that too, or perhaps not tell the food server that she forgot to add something to my bill. The list of sneaky, dishonest, hurtful things we COULD do is potentially endless. One thing I do know~ it would not be my neighbor's fault for leaving money out, or the fault of the store for having merchandise readily available, or even the fault of the food server for making an honest mistake. If I did any of these dishonest things, the fault would be MINE. I abhor blaming the victim~ it truly makes my blood boil.
Of course our partners are also human who are afraid, have needs, desires, lusts, and failings; fill in the blanks. Our having Cancer has certainly contributed to their anxiety,and it is well-known that we don't exactly feel womanly or desirable with our breasts removed and no hair on our heads! NONE OF THAT excuses betrayal. We are literally fighting for our lives~ having to also fight for our marriage on top of that is just unspeakable. Again, this is just MY opinion...I remember how our responses went into hyper-drive on another subject recently, and I don't want to go there again.
I am just such a loyal person, and demand/expect it from those around me; from my partner, my children, and my circle of friends.
Sorry to ramble, this one just bothers me so very much~ I hope you get to the place YOU need to be, and that YOUR heart will be mended and trust /love will be regained.
Hugs,
Claudia0 -
cheatingchenheart said:Blame The Victim? No Way!
I have been trying to write you ever since I saw your post~ it is just so heartbreaking, I couldn't find the right words. I of course have read all of the replies, and can understand Eil's reaction to Robert...another can of worms is on the verge of being opened!
So much of life is a decision, isn't it? ( obvious exceptions include cancer, of course!) While visiting a neighbor, I might see $20.00 on a side table~ I COULD slip it into my purse, couldn't I? How about shoplifting? I COULD do that too, or perhaps not tell the food server that she forgot to add something to my bill. The list of sneaky, dishonest, hurtful things we COULD do is potentially endless. One thing I do know~ it would not be my neighbor's fault for leaving money out, or the fault of the store for having merchandise readily available, or even the fault of the food server for making an honest mistake. If I did any of these dishonest things, the fault would be MINE. I abhor blaming the victim~ it truly makes my blood boil.
Of course our partners are also human who are afraid, have needs, desires, lusts, and failings; fill in the blanks. Our having Cancer has certainly contributed to their anxiety,and it is well-known that we don't exactly feel womanly or desirable with our breasts removed and no hair on our heads! NONE OF THAT excuses betrayal. We are literally fighting for our lives~ having to also fight for our marriage on top of that is just unspeakable. Again, this is just MY opinion...I remember how our responses went into hyper-drive on another subject recently, and I don't want to go there again.
I am just such a loyal person, and demand/expect it from those around me; from my partner, my children, and my circle of friends.
Sorry to ramble, this one just bothers me so very much~ I hope you get to the place YOU need to be, and that YOUR heart will be mended and trust /love will be regained.
Hugs,
Claudia
I notice a number of the posts seem to 'excuse' my husband by implying that maybe he was just upset about my cancer. He was upset (and he accompanied me to all appointments and was very supportive) and I wish I could say it was about the cancer, but once many years ago pre-cancer I caught him doing the same thing (writing to someone on the internet). At that time I threatened to tell my entire family if he did it again, and believed he had stopped, only to find another email now. Although I can understand the reaction to Robert's post (people seemed angry that he had cheated on multiple wives and I also had this reaction), one thing I agree with him about it that men (some, not all) cheat because they CAN. The email was sent when I was at an appointment with my plastic surgeon, so I am at a loss to explain how the same person who cheated on me was supportive with the doctors, etc. If anyone has any more insights, I would welcome them.
I will keep you all posted, Ohilly0 -
I second that emotion.... ..chenheart said:Blame The Victim? No Way!
I have been trying to write you ever since I saw your post~ it is just so heartbreaking, I couldn't find the right words. I of course have read all of the replies, and can understand Eil's reaction to Robert...another can of worms is on the verge of being opened!
So much of life is a decision, isn't it? ( obvious exceptions include cancer, of course!) While visiting a neighbor, I might see $20.00 on a side table~ I COULD slip it into my purse, couldn't I? How about shoplifting? I COULD do that too, or perhaps not tell the food server that she forgot to add something to my bill. The list of sneaky, dishonest, hurtful things we COULD do is potentially endless. One thing I do know~ it would not be my neighbor's fault for leaving money out, or the fault of the store for having merchandise readily available, or even the fault of the food server for making an honest mistake. If I did any of these dishonest things, the fault would be MINE. I abhor blaming the victim~ it truly makes my blood boil.
Of course our partners are also human who are afraid, have needs, desires, lusts, and failings; fill in the blanks. Our having Cancer has certainly contributed to their anxiety,and it is well-known that we don't exactly feel womanly or desirable with our breasts removed and no hair on our heads! NONE OF THAT excuses betrayal. We are literally fighting for our lives~ having to also fight for our marriage on top of that is just unspeakable. Again, this is just MY opinion...I remember how our responses went into hyper-drive on another subject recently, and I don't want to go there again.
I am just such a loyal person, and demand/expect it from those around me; from my partner, my children, and my circle of friends.
Sorry to ramble, this one just bothers me so very much~ I hope you get to the place YOU need to be, and that YOUR heart will be mended and trust /love will be regained.
Hugs,
Claudia
....and then some... I hope for nothing but the best outcome for you Ohilly!!! ..it does say something that your Significant Other is willing to go to counselling!
You may find there is something worth saving and you may not... either outcome will come it's own set of "Luggage".( I know I have a tendency to overkill that word..lol!!) Some things will be packed and some unpacked...
Claudia... because I too... have such a STRONG Loyal Nature... its so difficult for me to find any reason or explanation for disloyalty that could be acceptable..... and unfortunately... since being diagnosed... I have been slapped in the face with it from almost everyone close to me...in one form or another...as many of you may or may not know... the bf & I had a very difficult time in dealing with the diagnosis and treatment options, and coping, and understanding anything that once upon a time had made perfect sense!!!!
Ohilly the positive news on that is the BF & I managed to find our way back ...he worked very very hard at getting back into my life....
as for the rest that I thought I could count on to be there for me, ... they werent there for whatever their reasons.......to me its not acceptable. I know it sounds unforgiving and it maybe so.... I prefer to consider it high expections, yet nothing more than I would expect from myself...
..my new motto, is I give what I get... my old motto was.. to find excuses for others stupity, sorry but cancer took their "get out of jail free card"....
Again, Ohilly.....I wish you all the best in this even far more difficult time of a difficult time...
Lotsa Love!
Trish0 -
Again?????ohilly said:cheating
I notice a number of the posts seem to 'excuse' my husband by implying that maybe he was just upset about my cancer. He was upset (and he accompanied me to all appointments and was very supportive) and I wish I could say it was about the cancer, but once many years ago pre-cancer I caught him doing the same thing (writing to someone on the internet). At that time I threatened to tell my entire family if he did it again, and believed he had stopped, only to find another email now. Although I can understand the reaction to Robert's post (people seemed angry that he had cheated on multiple wives and I also had this reaction), one thing I agree with him about it that men (some, not all) cheat because they CAN. The email was sent when I was at an appointment with my plastic surgeon, so I am at a loss to explain how the same person who cheated on me was supportive with the doctors, etc. If anyone has any more insights, I would welcome them.
I will keep you all posted, Ohilly
Oh Gosh, ohilly~ you do have decisions to make. I don't often quote a certain TV pop-psychologist, but in your situation, I think it just might apply: "The best predictor of Future behaviour is PAST behaviour"...
I am not saying that ppl cannot have a change of heart, but in both of these situations, past and present, you CAUGHT him! He did not, unless I have misunderstood you, come crawling with a tearful confession of something he almost did, or was tempted to do, or even did~so please ask yourself this: How would his behaviour have changed had you not seen what he is doing on the internet (again?)
I am sorry to say that going to Drs appointments with you does not now seem particularly supportive to me~ it seems more butt-covering, and conscience- fixing . I hope I am wrong, you sooo don't need this.
Hugs,
Claudia0 -
In defense of the 'excusers'....ohilly said:cheating
I notice a number of the posts seem to 'excuse' my husband by implying that maybe he was just upset about my cancer. He was upset (and he accompanied me to all appointments and was very supportive) and I wish I could say it was about the cancer, but once many years ago pre-cancer I caught him doing the same thing (writing to someone on the internet). At that time I threatened to tell my entire family if he did it again, and believed he had stopped, only to find another email now. Although I can understand the reaction to Robert's post (people seemed angry that he had cheated on multiple wives and I also had this reaction), one thing I agree with him about it that men (some, not all) cheat because they CAN. The email was sent when I was at an appointment with my plastic surgeon, so I am at a loss to explain how the same person who cheated on me was supportive with the doctors, etc. If anyone has any more insights, I would welcome them.
I will keep you all posted, Ohilly
If you read your original thread, ohilly, you didn't mention anything about this happening before. You also said you felt 'devastated'.
I, certainly, would have had different advice had I known he had been caught at this before. As I said in my post, 'if it happens again', if you remember.
Sounds like he just is looking for a way around it, having gotten caught with his 'hand in the cookie jar' again. I, personally, would be VERY distrustful of ANYTHING he says now...and you need to get your priorities straight. You know he has this behavior, and you need to ask yourself if you can just accept this as part of who he is, or start again with someone else.
You have a MUCH different set of decisions to make now....because he has proven that he cannot be trusted. Again.
Kathi0 -
To Eil4186Eil4186 said:Robert, I feel so sorry for your poor wife. Actually all of them
Robert, I was extremely dismayed upon reading your post. You took vows with ALL your wives and if you were no longer in love with them you should have divorced. By cheating you were dishonest, cowardly and unfaithful.
You blamed your cheating on your then wife's illness and bedroom issues. This literally sickens me.
Instead of being concerned about your loved one's suffering, all you were concerned about was your own selfish sexual needs. Again, I am shocked and sickened.
Lastly, you write that you definitely won't be cheating on your wife(even though you STILL think about it all the time) not because it is wrong and hurtful but because you are not good looking enough to get someone young. Sickening. Words cannot express how badly I feel for your poor wife that she is struggling through such a horrible disease and has a husband who cares so little about her. When she is in the hospital you are home thinking about having sex with someone else INSTEAD of being concerned about her and by her side.
Reading your post makes me so grateful to have my own kind, caring and patient, husband who loves me with or without sex.
I actually can't believe you had the nerve to even post your awful story. And I am shocked that the rest of the members here have not slammed your post.
I pray that your wife at least has other family and friends that GENUINELY care for her.
Whoa Eil4186,
First,I never said that I cheated on my current wife while she was sick, I said I almost did.Secondly,the vow I made to her was not one of our wedding vows as you know them. When I meet my current wife,June,(at a Parents Without Partners meeting in November of 1994)I was going through a Divorce and dating seven other ladies at the same time.(Now,let me say something about these other ladies.I meet most of them through a Dating Service,not that there is anything wrong with that,but I told them all up front that I was going through a Divorce and that I was not looking for a serious relationship.)Some knew of the others,some did not. Some were sexual relationships,some were not. When I started "seeing" June,I told her of the others.She said she would not date me until I was compleatly single. So I ended the relationships with the other ladies. When I started a "serious" relationship with June is when I made her the vow to never cheat on her without telling her first!Over the last 15 yrs. that we have been married I have told June of all my near "indiscretions". June and I have an understanding that I will tell her everything and that I will not lie to her. Even if it is something hurtful like thinking about having sex with other women.Afterall,I'm still a MAN!
Thinking about sex is all we do!And which one would you rather know about? Me telling you that I'm thinging about having sex or not telling you and doing it? I agree with you that what I did to my two other wives was dishonest,cowardly,unfaithful and sickening to you women. When I married the two wives that I cheated on I was not in love with them.They were a marrage of "convenience". By that I mean that the first time I got married I was 18 and she was 17. We got married by a J.P. in Los Vages,NV. on Oct.7,1970.I only married her for the sex so I wouldn't have to pay for it.Boy did I ever Pay for it!(LOL)(That's a joke about paying for it by the way.) She wanted to get away from a Step-mother who treated her like a slave. I meet my second wife because I was cheating on my first wife.We got married by a J.P. in 1975,two years after I divorced my first wife.I thought I really loved her and never though about cheating on her. Mostly because I think she was a nypho when it came to sex! We did it anytime and anywhere,but I was young(21 when I meet her), dumb and full of c**! The last couple of months we were married we were having problems and I had moved out. I worked the graveyard shift and thought I'd surprise her with a birthday call at 7a.m only a man answered the phone.I was so devistated by her unfaithfulness that I could not think stright or do my job well for almost a week. I didn't even cheat on her until after the Divorce was final.I still wanted her back! So yeah, I know how much pain and suffering you go through when someone you love cheats.
My third wife was another marrige of "covenience".So there was no love there either. I thought that her parents had money and she wanted to have a baby legally.(Her mom was very strict about children born out of wedlock.) We were married in June of 1980 in a BIG church wedding.(Mine in a church, hers for the first time.)It was 6 months befor I cheated on her and we were married for 13 yrs.It was a good marrage for the first couple of years(except for my cheating).But she wanted a child,I did not.I had one from my first marrage that I did not want.But she finally talked me into it. Our first daughter was born in April of 1984. The second one was born in December 1985. We did not plan on the second daughter and after my wife found out that she was pregnant, she blamed me for getting her that way.For the rest of our marrage all she ever said to me was,"That I had done this to her and how much she hated my guts and wish that I would get out!" I "stuck it out for the kids" till I went on a trip to Kingsbay,GA. She came down one weekend when I was sick and found a girls phone number in my shirt pocket.She took my house key and called me an hour latter(on the way back to Charleston,SC)to tell me that she "knew" I was cheating on her because of the phone number she found.Now in my defence, I had done nothing with this girl and she left her number at the front desk after we talked the night before.I had to drive myself home with a 101F temp. the next day.That's when I decited it was time to go. But I did not file for the divorce untill a couple of years latter.
Lastly, what I wrote about not being good looking enough or young enough to get younger women WAS A JOKE!I think that's what LOL means.I'm sorry that you took offence to my post,it was not ment that way.I am just trying to let you women know what us men are thinking about. SEX! All the time,anytime. Weather they tall you about it or not. I truely LOVE my wife,June,and when she was in the hospital I was by her side every night! When I left work in Havelock at 4p.m. I went home to change. I left New Bern,NC at 5P.M. and drove to Greenville,NC to arrive at 6:30p.m. I ate my dinner on the way up there. Even though she slept most of the time I was there,I stayed till 10 or 11 o'clock before going back home where I got up at 5a.m. to go to work again. Yes,I did think about cheating on her and ALMOST did a time or two,but my love for her and my vow to her made me stop form doing it. I never blamed my cheating on her illness or our bedroom issues. I said I did it because I wanted too and because I could. All men think about cheating sometime and some men do occasionally. If they tell you anything else,they are lieing to you or you don't want to hear the truth. Sure ,I will give some men a reasonable doubt about cheating on their wives,but do they think about it? I'm sure it's crossed their minds once or twice.I may be married but my brain's not dead and I'm not blind and I'm still a man after all.
I am a 56 yr. old man,overweight and had a full left breast Radical Mascetomy last year so now I know somewhat what my wife went through 6 yrs. ago with her Kidney cancer. My Chemo was not as bad as hers but she did not have to go through radiation.I tell my wife everything I think about,good or bad(even about me wanting to cheat on her)and I think that is what keeps us close. In our marrage and our relationship. Because it is a relationship of two different people with two different ideas and different feelings. If you don't know what the other one is thinking about or how they feel about something,you don't know them at all. That's how a marrage and relationships last,NO SECRETS!
Again ladies, I hope that this gives you some insight into why men cheat.I know it does not stop the hurt or pain you feel when they cheat. I know,I've been there with my second wife.But some men just don't care how you feel because we ARE selfish beings.
A man who cares when a woman gets hurt by a man who cheats on her for whatever reason.
Sincerely, Robert0 -
Your Welcome Ohillyohilly said:thanks, Robert
Robert, of all the supports and posts I received, I want to tell you that yours was the most helpful. I have an appointment to start counseling with my husband, and you are right: I need to find out why he did what he did. My hunch is that it is what you said: he did it because he COULD, and that it has little or nothing to do with me. But I will keep you posted! Thanks for your insights. Ohilly
Thanks for the "Thanks". I tryed to let you know what a man thinks about when he cheats.
Having been on both sides of the cheating spouce. I sencerly hope that you and your husband can work this out with the counseling,he just has to be totally honest about why he's looking.
It is soooo easy for a man to cheat nowadays with all these websights and singles clubs that don't check on a mans marrital statis before throwing them in with the sheep!
Hugs to you,Robert0 -
Well this is fodder for aManWithaMission said:To Eil4186
Whoa Eil4186,
First,I never said that I cheated on my current wife while she was sick, I said I almost did.Secondly,the vow I made to her was not one of our wedding vows as you know them. When I meet my current wife,June,(at a Parents Without Partners meeting in November of 1994)I was going through a Divorce and dating seven other ladies at the same time.(Now,let me say something about these other ladies.I meet most of them through a Dating Service,not that there is anything wrong with that,but I told them all up front that I was going through a Divorce and that I was not looking for a serious relationship.)Some knew of the others,some did not. Some were sexual relationships,some were not. When I started "seeing" June,I told her of the others.She said she would not date me until I was compleatly single. So I ended the relationships with the other ladies. When I started a "serious" relationship with June is when I made her the vow to never cheat on her without telling her first!Over the last 15 yrs. that we have been married I have told June of all my near "indiscretions". June and I have an understanding that I will tell her everything and that I will not lie to her. Even if it is something hurtful like thinking about having sex with other women.Afterall,I'm still a MAN!
Thinking about sex is all we do!And which one would you rather know about? Me telling you that I'm thinging about having sex or not telling you and doing it? I agree with you that what I did to my two other wives was dishonest,cowardly,unfaithful and sickening to you women. When I married the two wives that I cheated on I was not in love with them.They were a marrage of "convenience". By that I mean that the first time I got married I was 18 and she was 17. We got married by a J.P. in Los Vages,NV. on Oct.7,1970.I only married her for the sex so I wouldn't have to pay for it.Boy did I ever Pay for it!(LOL)(That's a joke about paying for it by the way.) She wanted to get away from a Step-mother who treated her like a slave. I meet my second wife because I was cheating on my first wife.We got married by a J.P. in 1975,two years after I divorced my first wife.I thought I really loved her and never though about cheating on her. Mostly because I think she was a nypho when it came to sex! We did it anytime and anywhere,but I was young(21 when I meet her), dumb and full of c**! The last couple of months we were married we were having problems and I had moved out. I worked the graveyard shift and thought I'd surprise her with a birthday call at 7a.m only a man answered the phone.I was so devistated by her unfaithfulness that I could not think stright or do my job well for almost a week. I didn't even cheat on her until after the Divorce was final.I still wanted her back! So yeah, I know how much pain and suffering you go through when someone you love cheats.
My third wife was another marrige of "covenience".So there was no love there either. I thought that her parents had money and she wanted to have a baby legally.(Her mom was very strict about children born out of wedlock.) We were married in June of 1980 in a BIG church wedding.(Mine in a church, hers for the first time.)It was 6 months befor I cheated on her and we were married for 13 yrs.It was a good marrage for the first couple of years(except for my cheating).But she wanted a child,I did not.I had one from my first marrage that I did not want.But she finally talked me into it. Our first daughter was born in April of 1984. The second one was born in December 1985. We did not plan on the second daughter and after my wife found out that she was pregnant, she blamed me for getting her that way.For the rest of our marrage all she ever said to me was,"That I had done this to her and how much she hated my guts and wish that I would get out!" I "stuck it out for the kids" till I went on a trip to Kingsbay,GA. She came down one weekend when I was sick and found a girls phone number in my shirt pocket.She took my house key and called me an hour latter(on the way back to Charleston,SC)to tell me that she "knew" I was cheating on her because of the phone number she found.Now in my defence, I had done nothing with this girl and she left her number at the front desk after we talked the night before.I had to drive myself home with a 101F temp. the next day.That's when I decited it was time to go. But I did not file for the divorce untill a couple of years latter.
Lastly, what I wrote about not being good looking enough or young enough to get younger women WAS A JOKE!I think that's what LOL means.I'm sorry that you took offence to my post,it was not ment that way.I am just trying to let you women know what us men are thinking about. SEX! All the time,anytime. Weather they tall you about it or not. I truely LOVE my wife,June,and when she was in the hospital I was by her side every night! When I left work in Havelock at 4p.m. I went home to change. I left New Bern,NC at 5P.M. and drove to Greenville,NC to arrive at 6:30p.m. I ate my dinner on the way up there. Even though she slept most of the time I was there,I stayed till 10 or 11 o'clock before going back home where I got up at 5a.m. to go to work again. Yes,I did think about cheating on her and ALMOST did a time or two,but my love for her and my vow to her made me stop form doing it. I never blamed my cheating on her illness or our bedroom issues. I said I did it because I wanted too and because I could. All men think about cheating sometime and some men do occasionally. If they tell you anything else,they are lieing to you or you don't want to hear the truth. Sure ,I will give some men a reasonable doubt about cheating on their wives,but do they think about it? I'm sure it's crossed their minds once or twice.I may be married but my brain's not dead and I'm not blind and I'm still a man after all.
I am a 56 yr. old man,overweight and had a full left breast Radical Mascetomy last year so now I know somewhat what my wife went through 6 yrs. ago with her Kidney cancer. My Chemo was not as bad as hers but she did not have to go through radiation.I tell my wife everything I think about,good or bad(even about me wanting to cheat on her)and I think that is what keeps us close. In our marrage and our relationship. Because it is a relationship of two different people with two different ideas and different feelings. If you don't know what the other one is thinking about or how they feel about something,you don't know them at all. That's how a marrage and relationships last,NO SECRETS!
Again ladies, I hope that this gives you some insight into why men cheat.I know it does not stop the hurt or pain you feel when they cheat. I know,I've been there with my second wife.But some men just don't care how you feel because we ARE selfish beings.
A man who cares when a woman gets hurt by a man who cheats on her for whatever reason.
Sincerely, Robert
Well this is fodder for a thesis, should I be writing one, which I'm not! I have been reading these posts to my sweetie, who now has the proverbial deer in the headlights look on his face, and he is no doubt wishing I liked to watch Cage Fighting or NFL ( both of which I abhor!) ANYTHING but how the male/female psyches respond would be preferable to him at this point! He wisely did not weigh in, but actually let me read to him....
Bottom Line, Robert, ( in case YOU are writing a thesis!) Women really don't care WHY men cheat, we care THAT men cheat. Your reasons could be 20 pages long, and make perfect sense to you~ they make none to us! Truth be told, we don't even consider them reasons, we consider them excuses...and they don't fly.
I honestly don't want to know how many times my guy thinks a girl is beautiful, or wishes I were 30-something, or turns down a proposition at a convention....or whatever the scenario may be. Just as I can't imagine him wanting to know that I thought about cheating on him, or some guy I saw had a great backside...are you kidding me? What a dumb game of mental table-tennis that would be, and for what purpose? "I could have had sex with Joe the Plumber today, but I thought of you and didn't"? HUH? Lets' just be real, and partners, and not complacent , but SATISFIED and GRATEFULthat we have a person who loves us waking up with us and sharing what true intimacy is...LIFE.
Claudia0 -
Well said!chenheart said:Well this is fodder for a
Well this is fodder for a thesis, should I be writing one, which I'm not! I have been reading these posts to my sweetie, who now has the proverbial deer in the headlights look on his face, and he is no doubt wishing I liked to watch Cage Fighting or NFL ( both of which I abhor!) ANYTHING but how the male/female psyches respond would be preferable to him at this point! He wisely did not weigh in, but actually let me read to him....
Bottom Line, Robert, ( in case YOU are writing a thesis!) Women really don't care WHY men cheat, we care THAT men cheat. Your reasons could be 20 pages long, and make perfect sense to you~ they make none to us! Truth be told, we don't even consider them reasons, we consider them excuses...and they don't fly.
I honestly don't want to know how many times my guy thinks a girl is beautiful, or wishes I were 30-something, or turns down a proposition at a convention....or whatever the scenario may be. Just as I can't imagine him wanting to know that I thought about cheating on him, or some guy I saw had a great backside...are you kidding me? What a dumb game of mental table-tennis that would be, and for what purpose? "I could have had sex with Joe the Plumber today, but I thought of you and didn't"? HUH? Lets' just be real, and partners, and not complacent , but SATISFIED and GRATEFULthat we have a person who loves us waking up with us and sharing what true intimacy is...LIFE.
Claudia
Where were you when my ex flew the coop? LOL
'Course, he was already brain dead where marriage was concerned, so it was a lost cause anyhow.
Thank you for your wisdom and insight chen.0 -
Well said Claudia, and I'llchenheart said:Well this is fodder for a
Well this is fodder for a thesis, should I be writing one, which I'm not! I have been reading these posts to my sweetie, who now has the proverbial deer in the headlights look on his face, and he is no doubt wishing I liked to watch Cage Fighting or NFL ( both of which I abhor!) ANYTHING but how the male/female psyches respond would be preferable to him at this point! He wisely did not weigh in, but actually let me read to him....
Bottom Line, Robert, ( in case YOU are writing a thesis!) Women really don't care WHY men cheat, we care THAT men cheat. Your reasons could be 20 pages long, and make perfect sense to you~ they make none to us! Truth be told, we don't even consider them reasons, we consider them excuses...and they don't fly.
I honestly don't want to know how many times my guy thinks a girl is beautiful, or wishes I were 30-something, or turns down a proposition at a convention....or whatever the scenario may be. Just as I can't imagine him wanting to know that I thought about cheating on him, or some guy I saw had a great backside...are you kidding me? What a dumb game of mental table-tennis that would be, and for what purpose? "I could have had sex with Joe the Plumber today, but I thought of you and didn't"? HUH? Lets' just be real, and partners, and not complacent , but SATISFIED and GRATEFULthat we have a person who loves us waking up with us and sharing what true intimacy is...LIFE.
Claudia
Well said Claudia, and I'll leave it at that. Hugs, Lili0 -
This is the second mostchenheart said:Well this is fodder for a
Well this is fodder for a thesis, should I be writing one, which I'm not! I have been reading these posts to my sweetie, who now has the proverbial deer in the headlights look on his face, and he is no doubt wishing I liked to watch Cage Fighting or NFL ( both of which I abhor!) ANYTHING but how the male/female psyches respond would be preferable to him at this point! He wisely did not weigh in, but actually let me read to him....
Bottom Line, Robert, ( in case YOU are writing a thesis!) Women really don't care WHY men cheat, we care THAT men cheat. Your reasons could be 20 pages long, and make perfect sense to you~ they make none to us! Truth be told, we don't even consider them reasons, we consider them excuses...and they don't fly.
I honestly don't want to know how many times my guy thinks a girl is beautiful, or wishes I were 30-something, or turns down a proposition at a convention....or whatever the scenario may be. Just as I can't imagine him wanting to know that I thought about cheating on him, or some guy I saw had a great backside...are you kidding me? What a dumb game of mental table-tennis that would be, and for what purpose? "I could have had sex with Joe the Plumber today, but I thought of you and didn't"? HUH? Lets' just be real, and partners, and not complacent , but SATISFIED and GRATEFULthat we have a person who loves us waking up with us and sharing what true intimacy is...LIFE.
Claudia
This is the second most bizarre thread I have ever seen on here. But I am a relative newbie to this site... and the first one shall go un-named. LOL
Anyhoo, I am sorry for you Ohilly. Cheating sucks. Do you want to stay with him? Do you see a happy future together? Can you get over the hurdle again?
Robert, be glad that none of your wives was me. You wouldn't have made it to the next wife. If your "honesty policy" works for you and your wife, then that's great. But it wouldn't have worked for me. Rubbing my nose in the fact that he restrained himself wouldn't get my husband anything but his balls nailed to the wall. But that's the "policy" that works for us.
To each their own... 0 -
I love it!young_one said:This is the second most
This is the second most bizarre thread I have ever seen on here. But I am a relative newbie to this site... and the first one shall go un-named. LOL
Anyhoo, I am sorry for you Ohilly. Cheating sucks. Do you want to stay with him? Do you see a happy future together? Can you get over the hurdle again?
Robert, be glad that none of your wives was me. You wouldn't have made it to the next wife. If your "honesty policy" works for you and your wife, then that's great. But it wouldn't have worked for me. Rubbing my nose in the fact that he restrained himself wouldn't get my husband anything but his balls nailed to the wall. But that's the "policy" that works for us. To each their own...
Young one, I loved your post! balls nailed to the wall......priceless!0 -
Glad to read that you were supportive of JuneManWithaMission said:To Eil4186
Whoa Eil4186,
First,I never said that I cheated on my current wife while she was sick, I said I almost did.Secondly,the vow I made to her was not one of our wedding vows as you know them. When I meet my current wife,June,(at a Parents Without Partners meeting in November of 1994)I was going through a Divorce and dating seven other ladies at the same time.(Now,let me say something about these other ladies.I meet most of them through a Dating Service,not that there is anything wrong with that,but I told them all up front that I was going through a Divorce and that I was not looking for a serious relationship.)Some knew of the others,some did not. Some were sexual relationships,some were not. When I started "seeing" June,I told her of the others.She said she would not date me until I was compleatly single. So I ended the relationships with the other ladies. When I started a "serious" relationship with June is when I made her the vow to never cheat on her without telling her first!Over the last 15 yrs. that we have been married I have told June of all my near "indiscretions". June and I have an understanding that I will tell her everything and that I will not lie to her. Even if it is something hurtful like thinking about having sex with other women.Afterall,I'm still a MAN!
Thinking about sex is all we do!And which one would you rather know about? Me telling you that I'm thinging about having sex or not telling you and doing it? I agree with you that what I did to my two other wives was dishonest,cowardly,unfaithful and sickening to you women. When I married the two wives that I cheated on I was not in love with them.They were a marrage of "convenience". By that I mean that the first time I got married I was 18 and she was 17. We got married by a J.P. in Los Vages,NV. on Oct.7,1970.I only married her for the sex so I wouldn't have to pay for it.Boy did I ever Pay for it!(LOL)(That's a joke about paying for it by the way.) She wanted to get away from a Step-mother who treated her like a slave. I meet my second wife because I was cheating on my first wife.We got married by a J.P. in 1975,two years after I divorced my first wife.I thought I really loved her and never though about cheating on her. Mostly because I think she was a nypho when it came to sex! We did it anytime and anywhere,but I was young(21 when I meet her), dumb and full of c**! The last couple of months we were married we were having problems and I had moved out. I worked the graveyard shift and thought I'd surprise her with a birthday call at 7a.m only a man answered the phone.I was so devistated by her unfaithfulness that I could not think stright or do my job well for almost a week. I didn't even cheat on her until after the Divorce was final.I still wanted her back! So yeah, I know how much pain and suffering you go through when someone you love cheats.
My third wife was another marrige of "covenience".So there was no love there either. I thought that her parents had money and she wanted to have a baby legally.(Her mom was very strict about children born out of wedlock.) We were married in June of 1980 in a BIG church wedding.(Mine in a church, hers for the first time.)It was 6 months befor I cheated on her and we were married for 13 yrs.It was a good marrage for the first couple of years(except for my cheating).But she wanted a child,I did not.I had one from my first marrage that I did not want.But she finally talked me into it. Our first daughter was born in April of 1984. The second one was born in December 1985. We did not plan on the second daughter and after my wife found out that she was pregnant, she blamed me for getting her that way.For the rest of our marrage all she ever said to me was,"That I had done this to her and how much she hated my guts and wish that I would get out!" I "stuck it out for the kids" till I went on a trip to Kingsbay,GA. She came down one weekend when I was sick and found a girls phone number in my shirt pocket.She took my house key and called me an hour latter(on the way back to Charleston,SC)to tell me that she "knew" I was cheating on her because of the phone number she found.Now in my defence, I had done nothing with this girl and she left her number at the front desk after we talked the night before.I had to drive myself home with a 101F temp. the next day.That's when I decited it was time to go. But I did not file for the divorce untill a couple of years latter.
Lastly, what I wrote about not being good looking enough or young enough to get younger women WAS A JOKE!I think that's what LOL means.I'm sorry that you took offence to my post,it was not ment that way.I am just trying to let you women know what us men are thinking about. SEX! All the time,anytime. Weather they tall you about it or not. I truely LOVE my wife,June,and when she was in the hospital I was by her side every night! When I left work in Havelock at 4p.m. I went home to change. I left New Bern,NC at 5P.M. and drove to Greenville,NC to arrive at 6:30p.m. I ate my dinner on the way up there. Even though she slept most of the time I was there,I stayed till 10 or 11 o'clock before going back home where I got up at 5a.m. to go to work again. Yes,I did think about cheating on her and ALMOST did a time or two,but my love for her and my vow to her made me stop form doing it. I never blamed my cheating on her illness or our bedroom issues. I said I did it because I wanted too and because I could. All men think about cheating sometime and some men do occasionally. If they tell you anything else,they are lieing to you or you don't want to hear the truth. Sure ,I will give some men a reasonable doubt about cheating on their wives,but do they think about it? I'm sure it's crossed their minds once or twice.I may be married but my brain's not dead and I'm not blind and I'm still a man after all.
I am a 56 yr. old man,overweight and had a full left breast Radical Mascetomy last year so now I know somewhat what my wife went through 6 yrs. ago with her Kidney cancer. My Chemo was not as bad as hers but she did not have to go through radiation.I tell my wife everything I think about,good or bad(even about me wanting to cheat on her)and I think that is what keeps us close. In our marrage and our relationship. Because it is a relationship of two different people with two different ideas and different feelings. If you don't know what the other one is thinking about or how they feel about something,you don't know them at all. That's how a marrage and relationships last,NO SECRETS!
Again ladies, I hope that this gives you some insight into why men cheat.I know it does not stop the hurt or pain you feel when they cheat. I know,I've been there with my second wife.But some men just don't care how you feel because we ARE selfish beings.
A man who cares when a woman gets hurt by a man who cheats on her for whatever reason.
Sincerely, Robert
Robert, I did have a strong reaction to your post. I later felt that I should not have imposed my judgement on you. I was glad to read that you sat with June each night while she was in the hospital. You two obviously have an understanding. It would not work for me though because I believe that unfaithful thoughts are just as wrong as unfaithful behavior.0 -
One Mans' Fodder Is Anothers Truthchenheart said:Well this is fodder for a
Well this is fodder for a thesis, should I be writing one, which I'm not! I have been reading these posts to my sweetie, who now has the proverbial deer in the headlights look on his face, and he is no doubt wishing I liked to watch Cage Fighting or NFL ( both of which I abhor!) ANYTHING but how the male/female psyches respond would be preferable to him at this point! He wisely did not weigh in, but actually let me read to him....
Bottom Line, Robert, ( in case YOU are writing a thesis!) Women really don't care WHY men cheat, we care THAT men cheat. Your reasons could be 20 pages long, and make perfect sense to you~ they make none to us! Truth be told, we don't even consider them reasons, we consider them excuses...and they don't fly.
I honestly don't want to know how many times my guy thinks a girl is beautiful, or wishes I were 30-something, or turns down a proposition at a convention....or whatever the scenario may be. Just as I can't imagine him wanting to know that I thought about cheating on him, or some guy I saw had a great backside...are you kidding me? What a dumb game of mental table-tennis that would be, and for what purpose? "I could have had sex with Joe the Plumber today, but I thought of you and didn't"? HUH? Lets' just be real, and partners, and not complacent , but SATISFIED and GRATEFULthat we have a person who loves us waking up with us and sharing what true intimacy is...LIFE.
Claudia
If you don't know WHY a man cheats,HOW are you going to stop him FROM cheating? By the time you find out THAT your man has cheated on you,it's too late! I'm trying to help Ohilly learn what her man might be thinking when he goes online to chat with other women.Being a"Cheater" once myself I can tell all you ladies now that EVERY man cheats or thinks about it,and if you want to "hide" your head in the sand and pretend it doesn't happen or turn a blind eye,then I feel sorry for you. I'm not trying to brag or write a thesis,although I should. It would be a BIG hit with the men. Some women are just so gullible that they will belive anything men tell them when they come home late or don't call when out of town. Some women just "want" a guy to feel secure or loved and don't want anything to "ruin" it. "Don't ask, don't tell!" A guy named "Rick" told me the other day that when he separated from his wife,"He felt single again." You women are everywhere. In the stores,resteraunts,banks and at his work,and some don't care if he is married because he'll divorce his wife for her. Right? And I haven't even gotten around to the internet or "singles clubs". Then there's the Post Office Box! What a way to get letters without the "wife" finding out about it.
I'm sorry if my posts offened anyone or hurt some feelings because I do not want to start another "WAR". But don't ask what a man thinks if you don't want to know! I'm done. Ice packs for black eyes and bandaids for all!(LOL)
Hugs and well wishes,
Robert0 -
Eil, you are sooooo rightEil4186 said:Glad to read that you were supportive of June
Robert, I did have a strong reaction to your post. I later felt that I should not have imposed my judgement on you. I was glad to read that you sat with June each night while she was in the hospital. You two obviously have an understanding. It would not work for me though because I believe that unfaithful thoughts are just as wrong as unfaithful behavior.
Eil, you are sooooo right about that last statement. Whether it is the man or the woman straying in their thoughts, it robs their spouse of something valuable. And the argument that 'everybody does' it does NOT make it any less harmful.0 -
It isn't MY job to stop him from cheating~ it's HIS job!!!!ManWithaMission said:One Mans' Fodder Is Anothers Truth
If you don't know WHY a man cheats,HOW are you going to stop him FROM cheating? By the time you find out THAT your man has cheated on you,it's too late! I'm trying to help Ohilly learn what her man might be thinking when he goes online to chat with other women.Being a"Cheater" once myself I can tell all you ladies now that EVERY man cheats or thinks about it,and if you want to "hide" your head in the sand and pretend it doesn't happen or turn a blind eye,then I feel sorry for you. I'm not trying to brag or write a thesis,although I should. It would be a BIG hit with the men. Some women are just so gullible that they will belive anything men tell them when they come home late or don't call when out of town. Some women just "want" a guy to feel secure or loved and don't want anything to "ruin" it. "Don't ask, don't tell!" A guy named "Rick" told me the other day that when he separated from his wife,"He felt single again." You women are everywhere. In the stores,resteraunts,banks and at his work,and some don't care if he is married because he'll divorce his wife for her. Right? And I haven't even gotten around to the internet or "singles clubs". Then there's the Post Office Box! What a way to get letters without the "wife" finding out about it.
I'm sorry if my posts offened anyone or hurt some feelings because I do not want to start another "WAR". But don't ask what a man thinks if you don't want to know! I'm done. Ice packs for black eyes and bandaids for all!(LOL)
Hugs and well wishes,
Robert
This is getting so far out of hand~ I just want to say I am NOT going to post about this anymore---we have once again stopped talking about Cancer. There really is no need to "feel sorry" that I wouldn't want to know WHY...we already do know WHY..."because you can". Everyone makes his or her own decision regarding what is or is not acceptable in a relationship~ I will only ever be abused by someone ONCE ....as I would be out of the door so fast and never ever look back. Ditto cheating. That's just how I am, which is the standard my FATHER raised me to have. I stand by my original reply about how the laundry list of things we can do which are dishonest and hurtful is endless. And, at the proverbial end of the day, when we close our eyes, we know how we are in the honesty department. I like how the Chinese describe the human conscience: Conscience is a metal triangle surrounding the heart; when we act against what we know to be right, the triangle spins and stabs our heart~ the more we go against the good, the more the triangle spins until all of its sharp edges are worn away and the triangle can spin unemcumbered, never touching the heart at all....
I don't care how many chatrooms, internet sites, clubs, bars, conventions there might be available. My man is either with me, or he isn't . And the reverse is true as well.
This is what works for ME...and what I expect/demand from my man. He will get no less from his relationship with me. As soon as he would decide otherwise, I would be out of there in less than a NY minute! Whatever is working in your relationship is for you and your wife to decide and live with. And if it works to the satisfaction of you both~ awesome! I am truly glad you are good to and for one another. So it should be!
No harm, no foul with the posts, Robert~ I am actually older than you are, and am long past the Ostrich phase in human relationships! No one is fooling me~ the cards are just laid on the table and no one is then surprised one way or the other.
Cancer Chat, anyone??? :-)
For the record, I hold the women who cheat in equal distain...not the ones who are fooled by their gullibility, but those who with knowledge of a mans' relationship status jump right in anyway. The reason most women hold onto the hurt from the man is this: We were never in a committed relationship with the "other woman"~ the woman did not cheat on us, the MAN did!
Which is why we rarely, if ever forget~ even if we do forgive .
Claudia0 -
I agree Eileen. Wouldn't beEil4186 said:Glad to read that you were supportive of June
Robert, I did have a strong reaction to your post. I later felt that I should not have imposed my judgement on you. I was glad to read that you sat with June each night while she was in the hospital. You two obviously have an understanding. It would not work for me though because I believe that unfaithful thoughts are just as wrong as unfaithful behavior.
I agree Eileen. Wouldn't be able to tolerate my husband cheating on me either. Nor, do I think my husband would tolerate it if I strayed either. Hugs, Lili0 -
What the heck -- here's my two cents
I don't think it's a bad thing for us to talk about things other than cancer. Cancer can get soooooo booorrring. And there's nothing wrong with a little bit of a healthy debate. We're all adults here. I think we can handle it.
I guess I get real tired of this idea that men just can't help themselves: "I'm a MAN! I can't help it!" That some how they're not physically or emotionally capable of denying their urges because their so much stronger than women's is a cop out and an excuse.
Before I was married (and back when my body produced hormones that acutally enabled me to have a sex drive), I had a libido as strong as any man's that I knew. I know what an urge is, and sometimes I controlled it and other times I didn't. But you know what? Knowing that about myself, I did not enter into marriage. When I finally did, I did so with the understanding that I would control those urges as long as I stayed married to my husband.
There comes a time when there's a desicion made on whether you cheat or not. I am not gullible, and I do not suffer from head in the sand syndrome. I know guys think about it. I know opportunities are out there. Women have them too. However, if you cheat on me, you're gone. And if I cheat on you, you can tell me so long as well. It's about intergrity. Either you have it or you don't.
To me, talking about other women that you want to screw while you're married to me is disrespectful, hurtful and devaluing. And if I had to put a whole lot of energy into coddling your fragile male ego by allowing you to make me feel as if it's a big chore and favor that you're being faithful to me, guess what? Good bye. Don't let the door hit you in the ****. Even if I loved you, I love myself more. That's not how my grandfather treated my grandmother, or how my father treated my mother. And it's not how I will raise my daughter to be treated.
I've known a couple of real men in my life. Being a real man isn't about making excuses. It's putting others and your familuy before yourself. It's about intergrity. It's about sticking around when things get rough, uncomfortable, ugly and hard. It's how your raised and it's about your values. It's not about being led around by your **** because you "just can't help it because you're a man." That's like saying I can't change a tire or be the breadwinner in my family because I'm just a women. There are choices in life. If you make the wrong ones, that's fine, but don't blame it on your gender. Place the blame where it belongs, which is your character.
No hard feelings, Robert. I just respectfully disagree.0 -
Ohillykbc4869 said:What the heck -- here's my two cents
I don't think it's a bad thing for us to talk about things other than cancer. Cancer can get soooooo booorrring. And there's nothing wrong with a little bit of a healthy debate. We're all adults here. I think we can handle it.
I guess I get real tired of this idea that men just can't help themselves: "I'm a MAN! I can't help it!" That some how they're not physically or emotionally capable of denying their urges because their so much stronger than women's is a cop out and an excuse.
Before I was married (and back when my body produced hormones that acutally enabled me to have a sex drive), I had a libido as strong as any man's that I knew. I know what an urge is, and sometimes I controlled it and other times I didn't. But you know what? Knowing that about myself, I did not enter into marriage. When I finally did, I did so with the understanding that I would control those urges as long as I stayed married to my husband.
There comes a time when there's a desicion made on whether you cheat or not. I am not gullible, and I do not suffer from head in the sand syndrome. I know guys think about it. I know opportunities are out there. Women have them too. However, if you cheat on me, you're gone. And if I cheat on you, you can tell me so long as well. It's about intergrity. Either you have it or you don't.
To me, talking about other women that you want to screw while you're married to me is disrespectful, hurtful and devaluing. And if I had to put a whole lot of energy into coddling your fragile male ego by allowing you to make me feel as if it's a big chore and favor that you're being faithful to me, guess what? Good bye. Don't let the door hit you in the ****. Even if I loved you, I love myself more. That's not how my grandfather treated my grandmother, or how my father treated my mother. And it's not how I will raise my daughter to be treated.
I've known a couple of real men in my life. Being a real man isn't about making excuses. It's putting others and your familuy before yourself. It's about intergrity. It's about sticking around when things get rough, uncomfortable, ugly and hard. It's how your raised and it's about your values. It's not about being led around by your **** because you "just can't help it because you're a man." That's like saying I can't change a tire or be the breadwinner in my family because I'm just a women. There are choices in life. If you make the wrong ones, that's fine, but don't blame it on your gender. Place the blame where it belongs, which is your character.
No hard feelings, Robert. I just respectfully disagree.
Only you can decide what is right for you and your husband. Glad to hear you are seeking counseling. Trust your heart and be strong!!!!0 -
Kbckbc4869 said:What the heck -- here's my two cents
I don't think it's a bad thing for us to talk about things other than cancer. Cancer can get soooooo booorrring. And there's nothing wrong with a little bit of a healthy debate. We're all adults here. I think we can handle it.
I guess I get real tired of this idea that men just can't help themselves: "I'm a MAN! I can't help it!" That some how they're not physically or emotionally capable of denying their urges because their so much stronger than women's is a cop out and an excuse.
Before I was married (and back when my body produced hormones that acutally enabled me to have a sex drive), I had a libido as strong as any man's that I knew. I know what an urge is, and sometimes I controlled it and other times I didn't. But you know what? Knowing that about myself, I did not enter into marriage. When I finally did, I did so with the understanding that I would control those urges as long as I stayed married to my husband.
There comes a time when there's a desicion made on whether you cheat or not. I am not gullible, and I do not suffer from head in the sand syndrome. I know guys think about it. I know opportunities are out there. Women have them too. However, if you cheat on me, you're gone. And if I cheat on you, you can tell me so long as well. It's about intergrity. Either you have it or you don't.
To me, talking about other women that you want to screw while you're married to me is disrespectful, hurtful and devaluing. And if I had to put a whole lot of energy into coddling your fragile male ego by allowing you to make me feel as if it's a big chore and favor that you're being faithful to me, guess what? Good bye. Don't let the door hit you in the ****. Even if I loved you, I love myself more. That's not how my grandfather treated my grandmother, or how my father treated my mother. And it's not how I will raise my daughter to be treated.
I've known a couple of real men in my life. Being a real man isn't about making excuses. It's putting others and your familuy before yourself. It's about intergrity. It's about sticking around when things get rough, uncomfortable, ugly and hard. It's how your raised and it's about your values. It's not about being led around by your **** because you "just can't help it because you're a man." That's like saying I can't change a tire or be the breadwinner in my family because I'm just a women. There are choices in life. If you make the wrong ones, that's fine, but don't blame it on your gender. Place the blame where it belongs, which is your character.
No hard feelings, Robert. I just respectfully disagree.
Brilliantly put.0
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