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I just happened on the net tonight, and walla, there you are.
It would be hard for me to respond without letting you know this, I am NOT religious either! But I am a Christian.....there's a differece.
Yes, my faith got me through, I don't know how anyone could go through this without.....well I won't go there because you asked me not to.
Joycelouise, I am sorry your going thru this down time, I did while on chemo. I had a doosy of a pity party one night while walking the floor til 5am....then came the morning and after spending the night crying tears failed me after that. Just remember hon, this too shall pass.....
I have enough faith for the both of us...and I will be praying for you even this night....sleep well and yes....God bless you0 -
Don't worry about expressing negative feelings if that is what you need to do just now. I will pray for you also, that you will find the support you need. Don't be afraid to go to a counsellor. They are trained to listen and help people find their way through difficult times. Just as you go to a medical Dr. when your body is giving you pain you can't handle alone, you can go to an "emotion Dr." when your feelings are giving you trouble you can't handle alone. There is no shame in either one, regardless of whether the trouble is caused by chemo, or just that life stinks right now. I believe in Jesus, but He has given us people because we just can't do it all all by ourselves.
God bless, seof0 -
Well, for someone who doesn't believe, your words and promise of prayer are nonetheless very soothing to me. It is strange (though you won't think so) that the Christians in my life have all been there for me with the same kind offer you made..and it makes a difference. Thank you.Skybuf said:I just happened on the net tonight, and walla, there you are.
It would be hard for me to respond without letting you know this, I am NOT religious either! But I am a Christian.....there's a differece.
Yes, my faith got me through, I don't know how anyone could go through this without.....well I won't go there because you asked me not to.
Joycelouise, I am sorry your going thru this down time, I did while on chemo. I had a doosy of a pity party one night while walking the floor til 5am....then came the morning and after spending the night crying tears failed me after that. Just remember hon, this too shall pass.....
I have enough faith for the both of us...and I will be praying for you even this night....sleep well and yes....God bless you
Joyce0 -
Your help must be what people are for when I can't do it all alone. Thanks. It was also good to read the phrase "life just stinks right now" Somehow there is just enough lightheartedness in those words to take the edge off. I will try to open myself up to the power of your prayers. Thank youseof said:Don't worry about expressing negative feelings if that is what you need to do just now. I will pray for you also, that you will find the support you need. Don't be afraid to go to a counsellor. They are trained to listen and help people find their way through difficult times. Just as you go to a medical Dr. when your body is giving you pain you can't handle alone, you can go to an "emotion Dr." when your feelings are giving you trouble you can't handle alone. There is no shame in either one, regardless of whether the trouble is caused by chemo, or just that life stinks right now. I believe in Jesus, but He has given us people because we just can't do it all all by ourselves.
God bless, seof
Joyce0 -
Dear dear Joyce, I need you to know I went through some really dark times on chemo and esp with the taxanes. Absolutely foul. I hated it esp when I used to "connect" so much with nature. It seemed like it was all gone. My family?? Well, nobody loves me. Why don't they phone, why don't they visit, don't they care??
I still feel the remnants of that every so often but not as much and not as deep. I had a severe mood disorder from the stuff. My chemo nurse said I was just depressed and needed antidepressants. But I knew it was from the chemo and sure enough it would go away and then reappear. You're not being negative, you are being truthful. And there's never been anything wrong with truth. I am not religious and didn't feel I had anything to raise me from it. I've always been spiritual and before chemo I thought by connection with my creator would see me through it. Well I guess she did 'cause here I am, but at the time it felt like I had really lost something important that I was afraid I would never have again.
With all these good people sending you loving thoughts and prayers, so many different beliefs all focusing on you, you have no choice but to start feeling better. So, it is natural to go through this as unpleasant as it is. You will start to feel better.
Big Hugs
jan0 -
Joyce, you have been so strong for me, I only wish I had some words of wisdom for you. I happen to believe that all of life is a balancing act between happiness and sadness, before and after cancer. I beieve that as we go through cancer and all of its miseries, the scale slips toward the sadness side. Sometimes we just have to sit on the "sadness pan," scream, cry, pout, carry on and get it all out, then we'll have the energy to get back to the middle and once again sit in the "happniness pan" for a while. This may sound silly, but I think chemo knocks our scale out of whack - way out of balance. Don't be afraid to let those feelings out and don't be afraid to ask for help from a psychologist or counselor or other gals on this site. We all need help from time to time. Please know that we are all here for you and support you and care about you. Watch for the happiness pan. It's coming your way. Hugs, Marilynn0
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Good Morning Joyce
I am not religious either and indeed I have had some dark days. There is nothing wrong with those days. When you think about it you are under assault physically, mentally, emotionally. During chemo I had some personal situations that were very challanging (even without cancer) and yet I am here today with hope and a happy person in spite of my poor prognosis. I was just reading an article in a recent Oprah Magaizine about recent research on the brain and happiness. If you get a chance take a look. I did start seeing a shrink after I got through everything, because this is a whole new world for me. I'm trying to figure out the balance in living with the message that I might die tomorrow running in the background. I see a shrink who only sees the chronically and terminally ill and our goal is to get me some "new tools" for living.
Whether religious or not, happiness and peace of mind is available to all of us. Sometimes it just takes a little work, which is especially hard when we think we have no energy at all.
The dark days will pass and the sun will shine.
Sheilah0 -
Dear Joyce,
You reminded me of those dark days we all experience with chemo. Our brains lose so many cells, and thinking clearly becomes a common problem we all call "chemo brain", and it takes us to a very dark, ugly way of thinking that we have little control over. I remember having a panic attack at WalMart when my husband walked away for a moment, feeling like I didn't know where I was, who were these people, and what was I doing here? YOU ARE SO NORMAL DEAR! Talking it out with someone like a specialist should make you feel better, and they should explain that this is part of chemo they just don't tell us about in the beginning. I have a deep faith, and that got me through the tough days, as I could reach out and talk to Jesus as I felt He was the only one who really understood how I was feeling. I see that so many of your sisters are praying for you, and that in itself will bring you peace. Hang in there, it does get better, and keep in touch at this site, we love you and want to help in any way we can. Hope I have helped in some way. Sending you a bouquet of bright flowers :O)
Blessings,
bev490 -
Hi Joyce,
I absolutely believe that chemo can cause depression. Think about it: depression is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain. If chemo kills cells -- good and bad -- then it must be affecting those cells that affect mood. A couple days after treatment, that dark heaviness would come around like clockwork. Then it would diappear within a week. So, I really feel that this is a definite result of chemo therapy and no one should feel as if they've brought it on themselves: "I'm not positive enough. I'm not trying hard enough." That's my 2 cents.
I am not religious either. I do consider myself spiritual though. I spent a lot of time gardening and connecting with nature during treatment. It made me feel good to have control over something. Gardening is instant gratification. You show something attention and it thrives. Even though I had that dead kind of feeling on the inside, I spent a lot of time cultivating my surroundings.
Also, to keep my mind off the depression, I read a lot. Feel good books. I read a lot of Mitch Album "Tuesdays with Murray" and "The 7 People you meet in Heaven." They really helped me, and gave me moments of peace and got me out of my own mind and thoughts.
As these smart women have told you -- this too shall pass.
xoxo,
Kim0 -
Yep, its taxol time for me now. Sure feels good to hear that it is from the chemo, not 100% real. Thanks for writing!phoenixrising said:Dear dear Joyce, I need you to know I went through some really dark times on chemo and esp with the taxanes. Absolutely foul. I hated it esp when I used to "connect" so much with nature. It seemed like it was all gone. My family?? Well, nobody loves me. Why don't they phone, why don't they visit, don't they care??
I still feel the remnants of that every so often but not as much and not as deep. I had a severe mood disorder from the stuff. My chemo nurse said I was just depressed and needed antidepressants. But I knew it was from the chemo and sure enough it would go away and then reappear. You're not being negative, you are being truthful. And there's never been anything wrong with truth. I am not religious and didn't feel I had anything to raise me from it. I've always been spiritual and before chemo I thought by connection with my creator would see me through it. Well I guess she did 'cause here I am, but at the time it felt like I had really lost something important that I was afraid I would never have again.
With all these good people sending you loving thoughts and prayers, so many different beliefs all focusing on you, you have no choice but to start feeling better. So, it is natural to go through this as unpleasant as it is. You will start to feel better.
Big Hugs
jan
Joyce0 -
I think reading an Oprah magazine is just what I need. It is not a good idea to drive a damaged car (my psyche right now) so I will park that car and lose myself in a magazine. I also like decorator magazines for getting lost in.3cbrca said:Good Morning Joyce
I am not religious either and indeed I have had some dark days. There is nothing wrong with those days. When you think about it you are under assault physically, mentally, emotionally. During chemo I had some personal situations that were very challanging (even without cancer) and yet I am here today with hope and a happy person in spite of my poor prognosis. I was just reading an article in a recent Oprah Magaizine about recent research on the brain and happiness. If you get a chance take a look. I did start seeing a shrink after I got through everything, because this is a whole new world for me. I'm trying to figure out the balance in living with the message that I might die tomorrow running in the background. I see a shrink who only sees the chronically and terminally ill and our goal is to get me some "new tools" for living.
Whether religious or not, happiness and peace of mind is available to all of us. Sometimes it just takes a little work, which is especially hard when we think we have no energy at all.
The dark days will pass and the sun will shine.
Sheilah
Thank you for writing and caring,
Joyce0 -
You have helped, and thanks....the flowers are beautiful. Just knowing someone else has gotten "lost in Walmart" (isn't that a great symbolic way of expressing it!) makes it easier for me.bev49 said:Dear Joyce,
You reminded me of those dark days we all experience with chemo. Our brains lose so many cells, and thinking clearly becomes a common problem we all call "chemo brain", and it takes us to a very dark, ugly way of thinking that we have little control over. I remember having a panic attack at WalMart when my husband walked away for a moment, feeling like I didn't know where I was, who were these people, and what was I doing here? YOU ARE SO NORMAL DEAR! Talking it out with someone like a specialist should make you feel better, and they should explain that this is part of chemo they just don't tell us about in the beginning. I have a deep faith, and that got me through the tough days, as I could reach out and talk to Jesus as I felt He was the only one who really understood how I was feeling. I see that so many of your sisters are praying for you, and that in itself will bring you peace. Hang in there, it does get better, and keep in touch at this site, we love you and want to help in any way we can. Hope I have helped in some way. Sending you a bouquet of bright flowers :O)
Blessings,
bev49
Take care,
Joyce0 -
Your timetable of depression is just like mine. Now, at least, I can set my clock by it and say things like "Gee, no, I can't make it for coffee on THursday. I will be depressed that day. But I should feel fine on Saturday, how 'bout then?" I too enjoy gardening and the weather is just about to switch over to gardening weather here, just as I am just about to finish chemo. Surely, that is grounds for a partnership!kbc4869 said:Hi Joyce,
I absolutely believe that chemo can cause depression. Think about it: depression is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain. If chemo kills cells -- good and bad -- then it must be affecting those cells that affect mood. A couple days after treatment, that dark heaviness would come around like clockwork. Then it would diappear within a week. So, I really feel that this is a definite result of chemo therapy and no one should feel as if they've brought it on themselves: "I'm not positive enough. I'm not trying hard enough." That's my 2 cents.
I am not religious either. I do consider myself spiritual though. I spent a lot of time gardening and connecting with nature during treatment. It made me feel good to have control over something. Gardening is instant gratification. You show something attention and it thrives. Even though I had that dead kind of feeling on the inside, I spent a lot of time cultivating my surroundings.
Also, to keep my mind off the depression, I read a lot. Feel good books. I read a lot of Mitch Album "Tuesdays with Murray" and "The 7 People you meet in Heaven." They really helped me, and gave me moments of peace and got me out of my own mind and thoughts.
As these smart women have told you -- this too shall pass.
xoxo,
Kim
Thank you so much for replying.
Joyce0 -
Marilyn, you have more than words of wisdom, you have words of love, and those are what I needed. I like your idea of the pans. At first I thought of pans on a scale, like for weighing gold, and us being either forces for happiness or sadness in our own lives. So we can actively switch pans and change the balance! Then I thought of frying pans on the stove and wanting to sit in the sad pan but after a while, as comfy as that pan may look, my rear starts to burn and I just don't want to feel sorry for myself anymore! Or fry!mgm42 said:Joyce, you have been so strong for me, I only wish I had some words of wisdom for you. I happen to believe that all of life is a balancing act between happiness and sadness, before and after cancer. I beieve that as we go through cancer and all of its miseries, the scale slips toward the sadness side. Sometimes we just have to sit on the "sadness pan," scream, cry, pout, carry on and get it all out, then we'll have the energy to get back to the middle and once again sit in the "happniness pan" for a while. This may sound silly, but I think chemo knocks our scale out of whack - way out of balance. Don't be afraid to let those feelings out and don't be afraid to ask for help from a psychologist or counselor or other gals on this site. We all need help from time to time. Please know that we are all here for you and support you and care about you. Watch for the happiness pan. It's coming your way. Hugs, Marilynn
You helped, thanks Marily. Guess we are now helping each other! That surely belongs in the happiness pan.
love,
Joyce0 -
Joycelouise~
You are sooo not alone in this! Chemo did things to my psyche I never thought remotely possible! I truly believe that it is not just chemo related, ( though those cancer-killing chemicals certainly wreak havoc with our entire bodies) but for me, it was the cumulative ball-of- wax. Trying not to show how afraid I was, going to work, faking being upbeat so others would not know how afraid I was, dealing with physical and mental exhaustion, caring for a teenaged foster child with demons of her own, and not wanting her to know how afraid I was, starting a new realtionship after 27 years of marriage, being afraid I was going to die, and oh yeah~ having left the religious organization I was a part of for 22 years. A religion which practices shunning...so that NO ONE I had associated with for the previous 22 years could, or even wanted to, speak with me or offer any encouragement to me. Talk about being a stranger in a strange land! And did I mention being scared??? :-)
Well, guess what? This month marks 5 YEARS since my surgery~ I have a new circle of friends, the "new relationship" I was in is almost 6 years old, and I am a happy, vibrant woman! You'll see that when we meet the next time I am in Sacramento!! hint, hint.
Do what YOU need to do to get through this. If it means a shrink, go! A book, Read! Discussion boards, Post! Support group, attend!
The blue days will indeed become a part of your past.....and the future looks good from where I am standing.
Hugs,
Claudia0 -
Boy, when I read your (old) problems, I sure know that I can trust you because, yes, that is what I am going through. Sooo...when I read your upbeat "report from the future" I am going to have to trust that too! It is good to remember that the future will be made out of things that we can't even imagine. So when we can't imagine a happy future, so what? It can still happen!chenheart said:Joycelouise~
You are sooo not alone in this! Chemo did things to my psyche I never thought remotely possible! I truly believe that it is not just chemo related, ( though those cancer-killing chemicals certainly wreak havoc with our entire bodies) but for me, it was the cumulative ball-of- wax. Trying not to show how afraid I was, going to work, faking being upbeat so others would not know how afraid I was, dealing with physical and mental exhaustion, caring for a teenaged foster child with demons of her own, and not wanting her to know how afraid I was, starting a new realtionship after 27 years of marriage, being afraid I was going to die, and oh yeah~ having left the religious organization I was a part of for 22 years. A religion which practices shunning...so that NO ONE I had associated with for the previous 22 years could, or even wanted to, speak with me or offer any encouragement to me. Talk about being a stranger in a strange land! And did I mention being scared??? :-)
Well, guess what? This month marks 5 YEARS since my surgery~ I have a new circle of friends, the "new relationship" I was in is almost 6 years old, and I am a happy, vibrant woman! You'll see that when we meet the next time I am in Sacramento!! hint, hint.
Do what YOU need to do to get through this. If it means a shrink, go! A book, Read! Discussion boards, Post! Support group, attend!
The blue days will indeed become a part of your past.....and the future looks good from where I am standing.
Hugs,
Claudia
I would love to see you when you get into Sacto next time. We can meet in a coffee shop and I'll be the one in a head scarf. Oh, yeah, this sisterhood is such that there may be several people in headscarves, huh? Good luck to us all!
And thanks for the encouragement. It helps.
love,
Joyce0 -
Joycelouise~unknown said:Boy, when I read your (old) problems, I sure know that I can trust you because, yes, that is what I am going through. Sooo...when I read your upbeat "report from the future" I am going to have to trust that too! It is good to remember that the future will be made out of things that we can't even imagine. So when we can't imagine a happy future, so what? It can still happen!
I would love to see you when you get into Sacto next time. We can meet in a coffee shop and I'll be the one in a head scarf. Oh, yeah, this sisterhood is such that there may be several people in headscarves, huh? Good luck to us all!
And thanks for the encouragement. It helps.
love,
Joyce
Another "report from the future"...my sweetie and I participated in a High School fundraiser yesterday. We walked 5 miles in semi-wilderness, at about 600 feet! Yes, my knee is a bit swollen today, and my old bones a bit achy~ but I still did it! And Reggie and I were the 1st ones to finish the hike and arrive at the base camp! We had our picture taken crossing the Finish Line, and we positioned our upper bodies to mimic straining, while I hummed the theme from 'Chariots of Fire"! We laughed and were just plain silly! I have never been an athlete~ and for the record, I will be 59 this summer. So Good For Me! Which means, even better for you, because this is truly a case of "if I can do it, so can you"!
Hugs,
Chen0 -
Joyce, I read all the posts in this thread and I believe we, your friends, are trying to tell you that there is a WORLD of difference between religion and spirituality because religion is an external thing but spirituality is an inner force that WE ALL SHARE. And cancer is just one of the common roads that all of us here walk with you.
So, we invite you to join your spirit with ours, and we will be strong in the weak places for each other.0 -
Joyce..I like the JOY part of your name! there must be a reason for it...You will be JOYful again. I listened to mind relaxing CD's during my 'depression' time. I would just get lost in them and forget aobut the world. I still listen to them on hard days. I also got panic attacks ie: getting germs from the shopping carts handles, people breathing on me, and forget where I was going(I would have to stop along the side of the road to regroup! hahaha). I was also put on anti depressants, no big deal as long as they made me feel 'happy'.
Prayers for you are being lifted. May angels surround you to lighten your load.
Cindie0 -
It is unbelievable what a good lesson I have learned from you good teachers. You said it perfectly. And this new understanding, the type that comes from going through what we have all gone throug, is so true. I will carry a new understanding of religion and spirituality for the rest of my days...hopefully, it will grow inside of me, maybe in the empty place left by the C.unknown said:Joyce, I read all the posts in this thread and I believe we, your friends, are trying to tell you that there is a WORLD of difference between religion and spirituality because religion is an external thing but spirituality is an inner force that WE ALL SHARE. And cancer is just one of the common roads that all of us here walk with you.
So, we invite you to join your spirit with ours, and we will be strong in the weak places for each other.
Thank you,
Joyce0
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