Vaccine 90 percent effective

At least one other company is pursuing the same (mRNA) technology.

But there are other approaches in development as well.

Hi there,

There are still immense logistical problems to overcome.
The vaccine has to be stored at dry ice temperatures which requires thermal shock resistant vials on an immense scale as you need two shots per person.
It also has to be transported in insulated containers packed with dry ice, we do not remotely have sufficient manufacturing facilities for this.
Transporting the vaccine to remote areas / getting people to vaccination stations will require a lot of effort.
Densely populated areas like cities will be fairly easy, low density rural areas will be a different ball game.
If people have to be regularly revaccinated then the problems will multiply.
The UK reckons they can vacccinate 10 million before Christmas and maybe 20 million in the first quarter next year, that is only 60 million injections to schedule and carry out in what is a small and densely populated island with a pretty efficient state controlled national health system.
Other places are a lot harder, I am calling it qualified good news for the moment.

Best wishes,

Georges

VascodaGama said:

Vaccines' effectiveness may not mach efficacy

I wonder how they measure the efficacy of the vaccines. Pfizer, Moderna and AstraZeneca who produces the so called mRNA-vaccines, claimed that theirs were 90% effective in accordance to the results from the short clinical trials, but I think that the reference regards the side effects from the vaccination which were considered as safe. Efficacy in combating the bug can only be substantiated if the trials involved injecting the live virus on the participants. Using nurses or people treating covid patients or belonging to the combat’s front line is not enough. I believe that efficacy will only be confirmed in one year time since inoculation, and that should include the results on those identified with the sars-cov2 variants. In fact, these mRNA vaccines using part of the genetic material of the virus to create T- or B-lymphocytes may not be adequate to all the variants. More time is needed to be certain that the present vaccines are the solution to Covid-19.

In another thread Grinder informed about the (Eli) Lilly vaccine which is produced with a deactivated sars-cov2. The purpose is to educate the immune system in recognizing it as foreigner, leading to an attack on the bug. This principle is similar to the common type of vaccines used around the world to combat the seasonal cold. However, sars-cov2 shows to be better prepared for invasion of lung cells than other virus as its protein “spike” got better affinity to cause infection at this vital and delicate organ. Once in the cell it goes through mutations becoming more intelligent at each time leading to variants that can be thought as new novel coronavirus (nCoV) that are not yet identified by the immune system. This type of vaccine would require being adaptable to each mutation to show efficacy.

In this regard I believe that the advanced Eli Lilly drug to treat infection (commented by our fella Grinder) is a better option. This is a monoclonal antibody (mAB) working similarly to the ones in use to treat cancer that we have spoken in previous threads regarding the clinical trials on mabs for PCa. Eli Lilly drug (Bamlanivimab) as passed some clinical trials and have been approved to fight Covid-19. MABs act as stealth missiles. They aim the bug’s “spike” wherever it lies; lungs, heart, nerves, brain, vessels, kidneys and skin.

In my lay opinion, the immune system doesn't kill the virus but it kills those cells that have been infected by the virus, eliminating the malady for good. The effects caused by the action of the immune system in the lungs can be so destructive to the extent of causing permanent scars affecting the patient for life. The long-haulers as they are known now. Too much intervention by the immune system can cause "cytokine release syndrome" which can be fatal in serious cases.

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year | Cancer Survivors Network

Let’s be careful to avoid bringing the virus into our homes or contracting it.

Best wishes to all.

VGama

Always good to read about these vaccines.  However, for now, I am sticking with the short guy, Dr Fauci and of course current guidance.  Take care.  

Not long after I opined on the various treatments above... lo and behold Hydroxychloroquine is being given renewed interest as an effective treatment for early onset symptoms in various medical journals.

Who knew?

This is an example of the confusion here regarding vaccines as well as positive case numbers:

****************************

Medical experts say the bottleneck could be loosened if the Food and Drug Administration approved Oxford-AstraZeneca, a vaccine developed by Oxford researchers that is more affordable than other vaccines currently available and far easier to distribute.

“The FDA needs to stop playing games and authorize the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine. It’s safe, cheap ($2-$3 a dose), and is the easiest vaccine to distribute,” says Dr. Marty Makary, a professor of surgery and health policy at the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine. “It does not require freezing and is already approved and being administered in the United Kingdom.”

Others agreed.

Economist Alex Tabarrok pointed out that AstraZeneca’s coronavirus vaccine is being produced at a Baltimore plantright now, and is capable of producing tens to hundreds of millions of doses annually.

hopeful and optimistic said:

.

• In the UK, vaccines Pfizer, Moderna, and AstraZeneca are being used to fight the pandemic. AstraZeneca's hasn't been approved for use yet in the US.
• AstraZeneca may not apply for a US FDA Emergency Use Authorization until the spring. The data from their UK trial was "odd" and had one "pretty serious error" in it, a US vaccine expert said. 
• AstraZeneca is now conducting a larger trial of nearly 30,000 people in the US. 

I was reading two days ago that clinical trials are having difficulty

recruiting people, and alternative methods of validation may be needed.

This is because prospective enrollees are preferring to get one of the available vaccines rather than enter a trial, and take the chance of getting a placebo.

Georges,

I was dawn on your comment in "...  three or four weeks after 60 - 70 % of the population is vaccinated  ...". Do you really believe that such percentages are achievable in one month? The pharmas do not stock pile enough quantities even to vaccinate just 30% of the EU population within this year.

According to the pharmas, in a two shot vaccine, the protection by the First Shot starts at about the 10th day and it only shows about 50% of effectiveness which requires a booster second shot to improve the effectiveness to close to 90%. The Second Shot is done 21 to 28 days apart but it may show still some considerable effectiveness if this period is extended up to 45 days. This means that the double shot is unavoidable to achieve the purposes; however, when we look on the issue globally we find that it will take over ten years to inoculate the world population for the success against Covid-19.

Israel that managed to get a high volume of vaccines, ahead of any other country of the world, in an obscure manner, may provide a clue about the efficacy of the Pfizer vaccine now that they have about 30% of vaccinated population, but still doubtful as they check effectiveness by the symptoms in each vaccinated person. They do not test to confirm inoculation.

Unless someone finds a drug that provides cure, I believe that sars-cov2 is to stay and that, even those that got the double vaccine, will require an annual boost similar to those that get the common shot for other coronavirus. This kind of boosting system will be hardly achievable worldwide in a time scale appropriate if more resources are not facilitated in the world.

Sorry for my above opinion.

Best,

VG

Hi there,

This seems to indicate that a high rate of vaccination will control the epidemic, at least at the moment.
However producing enough vaccine and carrying out worldwide vaccination is a herculean task.
The article was taken from the Guardian.

Best wishes,

Georges

No serious Covid cases among those receiving both Pfizer jabs in Israel, minister says

Hi again, 

Israel TV announced today in an interim report that 100 people from 130,000 with two shots of the Pfizer vaccine have contracted the virus. I would think that these patients unfortunately belong to the 10% group that were found from the trial as not beneficiaries. 

However, additional information regarding the cause of contraction is not provided yet, which makes me think that these positive cases occurred just at the time when the second shot was administered at the 21st to the 28th day or before it, because symptoms of infection is typically shown 10 to 15 days later. They started the shots on December 20th (38 days ago).

EU is approving today the Astra-Zeneca vaccine for uses in people aged 16 to 65 years old so that I am disqualified for the shot. I wonder why but it could relate to the flawed data in UK's trials commented by Hopeful above. 

Let's cross our fingers for good news on the results. 

VG