Soy Soy go away!!!

Ann2800103
Ann2800103 Member Posts: 31
I am supposed to stay off of soy because of the treatments and keeping estrogen down. I just spent 15 minutes going through all the mayo in which first ingredient was soy. Then I looked at my 7 grain wheat bread in which it had three different soy properties in it. Being that Soy is a cheap product it is in everything. Any ideas how I can get away from the soy. There has to be mayo without it...... Help! My hotflashes have stopped and I swear its the soy kicking in I know I sound paranoid but my Doc is so against soy. What can I do?

Blessings to youall
Annie in Texas
1998 Diagnosis left Breast
2008 recurrence left hip and femur
On femara and Lupron shots to keep estrogen down.
after 15 months bones were still clean.

Comments

  • Noel
    Noel Member Posts: 3,095 Member
    I was told to avoid soy as
    I was told to avoid soy as much as possible, but, even my oncologist said that is impossible. Unfortunately, soy is hidden in many foods, so, you could be getting it and not know it. I wish you good luck in being soy free! Let us know any tips that you might have!


    Good luck,

    Noel
  • joannstar
    joannstar Member Posts: 403 Member
    my doctor oked soy
    for me--perhaps because I am triple negative, I don't know. I did ask and he said that while he used to be against it, he no longer is, which is a good thing I guess because as you said, it is almost impossible to avoid.
    But that was his advice for me specifically, so I would follow your doctor's advice for you.
    You may have to make your own bread and mayo from scratch (I used to do that 38 years ago when I was a "purist".) Perhaps Whole Foods would have mayo that you could use.
    Good luck,
    JoAnn
  • missrenee
    missrenee Member Posts: 2,136 Member
    joannstar said:

    my doctor oked soy
    for me--perhaps because I am triple negative, I don't know. I did ask and he said that while he used to be against it, he no longer is, which is a good thing I guess because as you said, it is almost impossible to avoid.
    But that was his advice for me specifically, so I would follow your doctor's advice for you.
    You may have to make your own bread and mayo from scratch (I used to do that 38 years ago when I was a "purist".) Perhaps Whole Foods would have mayo that you could use.
    Good luck,
    JoAnn

    Soy is not good for me either
    but like you, my onc. said it's in just about everything and to just really avoid the heavy soy products--like, obviously, soy sauce, edamame, most Asian take out, etc.

    I was also going to suggest making the mayo (or anything else you really love) from scratch. That's the only real way to control the ingredients.

    Good luck. Hugs, Renee
  • Double Whammy
    Double Whammy Member Posts: 2,832 Member
    missrenee said:

    Soy is not good for me either
    but like you, my onc. said it's in just about everything and to just really avoid the heavy soy products--like, obviously, soy sauce, edamame, most Asian take out, etc.

    I was also going to suggest making the mayo (or anything else you really love) from scratch. That's the only real way to control the ingredients.

    Good luck. Hugs, Renee

    What oncologist told me
    is that the jury is still out on phytoestrogens (particularly soy). A recent study showed no difference between women who had soy and those who did not - or something like that. She told me to use common sense and not to worry if I occasionally have chinese food. Life is too short to stay away from PF Changs forever. I do notice how many prepared foods have soy. I absolutely love Morning Star black bean burgers and thought I was being healthy until I read the ingredients - soy, etc. Mayo is not difficult to make at all. I used to make all kinds of things from scratch. Back in the day . . . .

    Suzanne
  • camul
    camul Member Posts: 2,537
    I have never been told what
    I have never been told what to eat or avoid... Sometimes I wonder if I shouldn't see a cancer nutritionalist. I have learned so much more practical information from all of you than I have from my onco's office.

    Thanks everyone,
    Carol
  • mickeymom
    mickeymom Member Posts: 117
    Soy isn't always soy
    I met with a cancer nutritionist during my chemo and we discussed soy a lot. It’s more complicated than just avoiding soy, but I wanted to understand it so I wouldn’t be so nervous seeing some kind of soy in so many products. You don’t need to avoid all soy, but some parts of it are a bad idea. I’m not trying to say this is exactly what you should know, but it’s what the nutritionist told me that I thought I would share.

    As Suzanne referred to, soy contains a phytoestrogen or plant estrogen called an isoflavone. Unless you are eating whole soybeans, the bean has been broken down into parts for use as food additives. The first thing that happens is to separate the soybean oil from the soy protein. The isoflavones stay with the soy protein, not the oil. The nutritionist says because of this soybean oil is fine for me to eat because it has no isoflavones. The other additive you see in everything is soy lecithin, which is a byproduct of soybean oil production. Since the isoflavones are not in the oil to start with, they aren't in the lecithin either. That also makes it okay to eat.

    Soy protein is a different story. Since the isoflavones stay with the protein, it can have the estrogenic effect that we are worried about. Soy protein is in a lot of things but it seems easier to avoid. The most common places to find large quantities of soy protein are tofu and vegetarian meat products and energy bars. (they almost all have it – Lara bars don’t). It is also a common additive to soup base and bouillon, canned soup, salad dressings, imitation dairy products and some cereals. As you already know – reading labels is important because not all brands have soy protein in them. Sometimes it is listed on a label as vegetable protein or hydrolyzed vegetable protein. It might be some other vegetable, but since they don't have to specify, I avoid those as well.

    As for soy sauce – the nutritionist told me it is fermented and that reduces the soy protein to little or none, so you can eat it, just keep it in moderation. Watch the labels though, I’ve found soy sauce with added soy protein. Whole Foods 365 brand is a good one.

    I should have said that, of course, this is most important is your cancer is estrogen positive. (mine is). If your cancer is estrogen negative – I don’t think you have to be concerned. (Although there are conflicting studies about soy in large amounts causing breast cancer in post menopausal women.) It's very confusing. I was happy to have a nutritionist at least clear some of this up for me because I have enough worries with this disease without having to concern myself with every little thing I eat!

    Happy label reading everyone!!
  • missrenee
    missrenee Member Posts: 2,136 Member
    mickeymom said:

    Soy isn't always soy
    I met with a cancer nutritionist during my chemo and we discussed soy a lot. It’s more complicated than just avoiding soy, but I wanted to understand it so I wouldn’t be so nervous seeing some kind of soy in so many products. You don’t need to avoid all soy, but some parts of it are a bad idea. I’m not trying to say this is exactly what you should know, but it’s what the nutritionist told me that I thought I would share.

    As Suzanne referred to, soy contains a phytoestrogen or plant estrogen called an isoflavone. Unless you are eating whole soybeans, the bean has been broken down into parts for use as food additives. The first thing that happens is to separate the soybean oil from the soy protein. The isoflavones stay with the soy protein, not the oil. The nutritionist says because of this soybean oil is fine for me to eat because it has no isoflavones. The other additive you see in everything is soy lecithin, which is a byproduct of soybean oil production. Since the isoflavones are not in the oil to start with, they aren't in the lecithin either. That also makes it okay to eat.

    Soy protein is a different story. Since the isoflavones stay with the protein, it can have the estrogenic effect that we are worried about. Soy protein is in a lot of things but it seems easier to avoid. The most common places to find large quantities of soy protein are tofu and vegetarian meat products and energy bars. (they almost all have it – Lara bars don’t). It is also a common additive to soup base and bouillon, canned soup, salad dressings, imitation dairy products and some cereals. As you already know – reading labels is important because not all brands have soy protein in them. Sometimes it is listed on a label as vegetable protein or hydrolyzed vegetable protein. It might be some other vegetable, but since they don't have to specify, I avoid those as well.

    As for soy sauce – the nutritionist told me it is fermented and that reduces the soy protein to little or none, so you can eat it, just keep it in moderation. Watch the labels though, I’ve found soy sauce with added soy protein. Whole Foods 365 brand is a good one.

    I should have said that, of course, this is most important is your cancer is estrogen positive. (mine is). If your cancer is estrogen negative – I don’t think you have to be concerned. (Although there are conflicting studies about soy in large amounts causing breast cancer in post menopausal women.) It's very confusing. I was happy to have a nutritionist at least clear some of this up for me because I have enough worries with this disease without having to concern myself with every little thing I eat!

    Happy label reading everyone!!

    Good clarification, Mickeymom
    It is complicated--you made things a little clearer for me. Thank you. I read all the labels--takes me a very long time to shop! I've thought about seeing a nutritionist as well. I agree, there's enough to worry about without having to worry about food as well.

    Hugs, Renee
  • camul
    camul Member Posts: 2,537
    mickeymom said:

    Soy isn't always soy
    I met with a cancer nutritionist during my chemo and we discussed soy a lot. It’s more complicated than just avoiding soy, but I wanted to understand it so I wouldn’t be so nervous seeing some kind of soy in so many products. You don’t need to avoid all soy, but some parts of it are a bad idea. I’m not trying to say this is exactly what you should know, but it’s what the nutritionist told me that I thought I would share.

    As Suzanne referred to, soy contains a phytoestrogen or plant estrogen called an isoflavone. Unless you are eating whole soybeans, the bean has been broken down into parts for use as food additives. The first thing that happens is to separate the soybean oil from the soy protein. The isoflavones stay with the soy protein, not the oil. The nutritionist says because of this soybean oil is fine for me to eat because it has no isoflavones. The other additive you see in everything is soy lecithin, which is a byproduct of soybean oil production. Since the isoflavones are not in the oil to start with, they aren't in the lecithin either. That also makes it okay to eat.

    Soy protein is a different story. Since the isoflavones stay with the protein, it can have the estrogenic effect that we are worried about. Soy protein is in a lot of things but it seems easier to avoid. The most common places to find large quantities of soy protein are tofu and vegetarian meat products and energy bars. (they almost all have it – Lara bars don’t). It is also a common additive to soup base and bouillon, canned soup, salad dressings, imitation dairy products and some cereals. As you already know – reading labels is important because not all brands have soy protein in them. Sometimes it is listed on a label as vegetable protein or hydrolyzed vegetable protein. It might be some other vegetable, but since they don't have to specify, I avoid those as well.

    As for soy sauce – the nutritionist told me it is fermented and that reduces the soy protein to little or none, so you can eat it, just keep it in moderation. Watch the labels though, I’ve found soy sauce with added soy protein. Whole Foods 365 brand is a good one.

    I should have said that, of course, this is most important is your cancer is estrogen positive. (mine is). If your cancer is estrogen negative – I don’t think you have to be concerned. (Although there are conflicting studies about soy in large amounts causing breast cancer in post menopausal women.) It's very confusing. I was happy to have a nutritionist at least clear some of this up for me because I have enough worries with this disease without having to concern myself with every little thing I eat!

    Happy label reading everyone!!

    Thank you Mickey
    Thanks for the clarification. Like I said lots of good information on this site!

    Carol
  • Double Whammy
    Double Whammy Member Posts: 2,832 Member
    camul said:

    Thank you Mickey
    Thanks for the clarification. Like I said lots of good information on this site!

    Carol

    Thank you Mickey !
    I'll know more what to look for - or look out for.

    No one told me what to eat either. I asked about soy, but did not get as clear an explanation as you provided. I'm perfectly fine living the rest of my life without tofu!

    Do you also have any information on sugar? I've switched artificial sweeteners to stevia per the Anti Cancer book and don't use much sugar, but it, too, appears on the labels of almost everything - and everyone needs a cookie sometimes!

    Suzanne
  • mollyz
    mollyz Member Posts: 756 Member

    Thank you Mickey !
    I'll know more what to look for - or look out for.

    No one told me what to eat either. I asked about soy, but did not get as clear an explanation as you provided. I'm perfectly fine living the rest of my life without tofu!

    Do you also have any information on sugar? I've switched artificial sweeteners to stevia per the Anti Cancer book and don't use much sugar, but it, too, appears on the labels of almost everything - and everyone needs a cookie sometimes!

    Suzanne

    I'm confused
    I read the anti-cancer book also but maybe i didn't understand it right but i thought soy was one of the things we could have oh my !!!
  • chenheart
    chenheart Member Posts: 5,159
    mollyz said:

    I'm confused
    I read the anti-cancer book also but maybe i didn't understand it right but i thought soy was one of the things we could have oh my !!!

    Soy is a good thing in the
    Soy is a good thing in the diet if we are hoping to stave off cancer, that is, have never had cancer~ I am pretty sure that is why it would be recommended in an Anti-Cancer diet! On the other hand, because I had/have estrogen positive cancer , my oncologist said that sometimes the body can't tell the difference between estrogen and soy, which, as explained earlier, is a phytoestrogen. He also said the jury is still out, and that as all have noted, it is nearly impossible to avoid soy all together. I just personally avoid it when I know it is the main ingredient. For example,I stay away from Tofu, edamame, soy sauce, etc. The fact that it is in other products I liken to adding wine when I am making a sauce~ it isn't the main ingredient, but a flavor. I never feel I am serving alcohol to minors when I add red wine to spaghetti sauce! In my way of thinking, it is much the same with soy in mayo, etc. No one has gotten drunk from my spaghetti sauce! LOL Hope this helps!

    Hugs,
    Chen♥
  • Ann2800103
    Ann2800103 Member Posts: 31
    mickeymom said:

    Soy isn't always soy
    I met with a cancer nutritionist during my chemo and we discussed soy a lot. It’s more complicated than just avoiding soy, but I wanted to understand it so I wouldn’t be so nervous seeing some kind of soy in so many products. You don’t need to avoid all soy, but some parts of it are a bad idea. I’m not trying to say this is exactly what you should know, but it’s what the nutritionist told me that I thought I would share.

    As Suzanne referred to, soy contains a phytoestrogen or plant estrogen called an isoflavone. Unless you are eating whole soybeans, the bean has been broken down into parts for use as food additives. The first thing that happens is to separate the soybean oil from the soy protein. The isoflavones stay with the soy protein, not the oil. The nutritionist says because of this soybean oil is fine for me to eat because it has no isoflavones. The other additive you see in everything is soy lecithin, which is a byproduct of soybean oil production. Since the isoflavones are not in the oil to start with, they aren't in the lecithin either. That also makes it okay to eat.

    Soy protein is a different story. Since the isoflavones stay with the protein, it can have the estrogenic effect that we are worried about. Soy protein is in a lot of things but it seems easier to avoid. The most common places to find large quantities of soy protein are tofu and vegetarian meat products and energy bars. (they almost all have it – Lara bars don’t). It is also a common additive to soup base and bouillon, canned soup, salad dressings, imitation dairy products and some cereals. As you already know – reading labels is important because not all brands have soy protein in them. Sometimes it is listed on a label as vegetable protein or hydrolyzed vegetable protein. It might be some other vegetable, but since they don't have to specify, I avoid those as well.

    As for soy sauce – the nutritionist told me it is fermented and that reduces the soy protein to little or none, so you can eat it, just keep it in moderation. Watch the labels though, I’ve found soy sauce with added soy protein. Whole Foods 365 brand is a good one.

    I should have said that, of course, this is most important is your cancer is estrogen positive. (mine is). If your cancer is estrogen negative – I don’t think you have to be concerned. (Although there are conflicting studies about soy in large amounts causing breast cancer in post menopausal women.) It's very confusing. I was happy to have a nutritionist at least clear some of this up for me because I have enough worries with this disease without having to concern myself with every little thing I eat!

    Happy label reading everyone!!

    Thank you so much
    You have cleared up so much for me. I am so glad you heard this from the nutritionist. It makes sense and I won't be going crazy in the grocery store. Since the mayo says Soy oil
    that means it would pass correct?
    Gods blessings to you
    Annie
  • mickeymom
    mickeymom Member Posts: 117

    Thank you so much
    You have cleared up so much for me. I am so glad you heard this from the nutritionist. It makes sense and I won't be going crazy in the grocery store. Since the mayo says Soy oil
    that means it would pass correct?
    Gods blessings to you
    Annie

    Mayonnaise is okay!
    Soybean oil and soy lecithen are okay. Soy protein is not - that is where the plant estrogen resides in the soybean.

    Actually, my nutritionist encourged me not to spent too much time worrying about soy. She wants me to worry about the overall health of what I eat - more whole foods, less processed - which will eliminate a lot of the soy additives anyway. She pretty much agrees with Chen's approach. You can't avoid soy all together so don't create more stress by worrying about it. There are so many conflicting studies out there about soy that I'm not sure you could ever know you were doing the right thing anyway.

    Her rule for label reading was watch for soy protein and beyond that, if there are too many words you can't pronounce or don't understand, then look for a different product. Or make it yourself. I will say that my cooking skills are getting much better. A silver lining for me!

    Blessings to you all!

    Debbie
  • carkris
    carkris Member Posts: 4,553 Member
    mickeymom said:

    Mayonnaise is okay!
    Soybean oil and soy lecithen are okay. Soy protein is not - that is where the plant estrogen resides in the soybean.

    Actually, my nutritionist encourged me not to spent too much time worrying about soy. She wants me to worry about the overall health of what I eat - more whole foods, less processed - which will eliminate a lot of the soy additives anyway. She pretty much agrees with Chen's approach. You can't avoid soy all together so don't create more stress by worrying about it. There are so many conflicting studies out there about soy that I'm not sure you could ever know you were doing the right thing anyway.

    Her rule for label reading was watch for soy protein and beyond that, if there are too many words you can't pronounce or don't understand, then look for a different product. Or make it yourself. I will say that my cooking skills are getting much better. A silver lining for me!

    Blessings to you all!

    Debbie

    thank you for the
    thank you for the clarification it was really helpful info.
    I try to avoid soy as well, but dont make myself crazy. I find it is better for me to make my own things then I can control what is in it.
  • Hippiechick58
    Hippiechick58 Member Posts: 320
    carkris said:

    thank you for the
    thank you for the clarification it was really helpful info.
    I try to avoid soy as well, but dont make myself crazy. I find it is better for me to make my own things then I can control what is in it.

    I've used Soy Milk for years
    I've used Soy Milk for years and years. Because of my est/prog+ BC, I have switched to Almond Milk. It tastes just as good, and almonds are good for fighting cancer! Thanky you for all the information. I'm sure it will come in handy. And believe that I will be reading lables to be sure.

    Be Well,
    Dianne
  • Jennifer1961
    Jennifer1961 Member Posts: 137
    Hmmmm. My onc. told me he
    Hmmmm. My onc. told me he was really against any kind of soy supplement, but that a glass of soy milk one in awhile was probably okay. A lot of stuff has trace amounts of soy. I think we can go crazy trying to stay away from everything. Just do what you can. We can't spend our lives getting freaked out about every little thing (at least that's what I keep telling myself, easier said than done, perhaps that's a good mantra!)
  • Jennifer1961
    Jennifer1961 Member Posts: 137
    mickeymom said:

    Soy isn't always soy
    I met with a cancer nutritionist during my chemo and we discussed soy a lot. It’s more complicated than just avoiding soy, but I wanted to understand it so I wouldn’t be so nervous seeing some kind of soy in so many products. You don’t need to avoid all soy, but some parts of it are a bad idea. I’m not trying to say this is exactly what you should know, but it’s what the nutritionist told me that I thought I would share.

    As Suzanne referred to, soy contains a phytoestrogen or plant estrogen called an isoflavone. Unless you are eating whole soybeans, the bean has been broken down into parts for use as food additives. The first thing that happens is to separate the soybean oil from the soy protein. The isoflavones stay with the soy protein, not the oil. The nutritionist says because of this soybean oil is fine for me to eat because it has no isoflavones. The other additive you see in everything is soy lecithin, which is a byproduct of soybean oil production. Since the isoflavones are not in the oil to start with, they aren't in the lecithin either. That also makes it okay to eat.

    Soy protein is a different story. Since the isoflavones stay with the protein, it can have the estrogenic effect that we are worried about. Soy protein is in a lot of things but it seems easier to avoid. The most common places to find large quantities of soy protein are tofu and vegetarian meat products and energy bars. (they almost all have it – Lara bars don’t). It is also a common additive to soup base and bouillon, canned soup, salad dressings, imitation dairy products and some cereals. As you already know – reading labels is important because not all brands have soy protein in them. Sometimes it is listed on a label as vegetable protein or hydrolyzed vegetable protein. It might be some other vegetable, but since they don't have to specify, I avoid those as well.

    As for soy sauce – the nutritionist told me it is fermented and that reduces the soy protein to little or none, so you can eat it, just keep it in moderation. Watch the labels though, I’ve found soy sauce with added soy protein. Whole Foods 365 brand is a good one.

    I should have said that, of course, this is most important is your cancer is estrogen positive. (mine is). If your cancer is estrogen negative – I don’t think you have to be concerned. (Although there are conflicting studies about soy in large amounts causing breast cancer in post menopausal women.) It's very confusing. I was happy to have a nutritionist at least clear some of this up for me because I have enough worries with this disease without having to concern myself with every little thing I eat!

    Happy label reading everyone!!

    Wow! Thanks so much for
    Wow! Thanks so much for this information. I'm going to save this for future reference.