Chemo brain...
And it's not "convenient", no matter what anyone thinks. It's terrible. Sometimes I cannot think of a perfectly ordinary word that I am certain should be rolling off the tip of my tongue, with no effort whatsoever. And it just lurks there, right outside the edges of my brain.
I hope it's reversible and I get my old memory back, once I am done with the Taxol.
Carlene
Comments
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I just did MRI of my brain,
I just did MRI of my brain, one of findings:" evidence of excess iron,this appearance may merely be normal variant".I search on line - iron increase in brain with age can lead to dementia and some other disease. I am 57, I not think it is a case of age dementia, I more blame chemoterapy. I start to catch my self with some memory and concentration problems after my second line of chemoterapy. But I did not lost all my memory, so at work co-workers and my husband try to convince me like " we all have some memory problem" or "why I remember one thing and not remember other", I feel like they tell me- You're lying! January 6 I will talk about this problem with my new onc/gyn doctor. Hope will have some answers. Thanks Carlene to bring "Chemo brain" issue up, I did make my husband toread it. (((HUGS)), Zina.0 -
Before I had even read azinaida said:I just did MRI of my brain,
I just did MRI of my brain, one of findings:" evidence of excess iron,this appearance may merely be normal variant".I search on line - iron increase in brain with age can lead to dementia and some other disease. I am 57, I not think it is a case of age dementia, I more blame chemoterapy. I start to catch my self with some memory and concentration problems after my second line of chemoterapy. But I did not lost all my memory, so at work co-workers and my husband try to convince me like " we all have some memory problem" or "why I remember one thing and not remember other", I feel like they tell me- You're lying! January 6 I will talk about this problem with my new onc/gyn doctor. Hope will have some answers. Thanks Carlene to bring "Chemo brain" issue up, I did make my husband toread it. (((HUGS)), Zina.
Before I had even read a post or heard of it online, the kids and I had noticed a difference and already knew it had to do with the Chemo. We have explained it to family and friends and use humor and also coping teniques, such as lists or I just tell the kids so they can remember for me.
As far as the few people that thought I was just trying to get attention or just could not be kind about it, well, I took advantage of my "Chemo Brain" and forgot their phone numbers and when they called I relagated their ring tone to "Ding Dong the Witch is Dead".
Lori0 -
I was luckykikiz said:Before I had even read a
Before I had even read a post or heard of it online, the kids and I had noticed a difference and already knew it had to do with the Chemo. We have explained it to family and friends and use humor and also coping teniques, such as lists or I just tell the kids so they can remember for me.
As far as the few people that thought I was just trying to get attention or just could not be kind about it, well, I took advantage of my "Chemo Brain" and forgot their phone numbers and when they called I relagated their ring tone to "Ding Dong the Witch is Dead".
Lori
i was lucky i have not had this0 -
I FORGOT
i think we all have chemo brain and i hope it gets better when chemo is done. hubby thinks it is an excuse when i screw up so i try to hide it from family and co-workers..not easy,,oh well i have more important stuff to worry about...lol...val0 -
IT GOT BETTER FOR ME
Well, Carlene, I can truly relate to 'chemo brain'. During my treatments there were times I just couldn't 'collect my thoughts' and verbalize them. Coming up with the right words sometimes seemed the most difficult for me. I will be coming up to the five-year mark on my recurrance/surgery/treatment, and I believe it has gotten better (didn't take that long, though). However, I beieve that my current 'bouts of forgetfulnes or inability to spit out my words fast enough' are more a result of the many things going on in my life right now and my new age - 56. Sure wouldn't have thought it would be this way at this age, but maybe the chemo 'jump-started' the process.
All in all, I believe it will get better for you. So, hang in there!
Luv & Hugs in 2011!
Monika0 -
Common Side Effects
I remember when my first onc/gyn had a "Guide to Chemotherapy" in her waiting room back in 2008. I read the booklet cover to cover and found under a list of the most common side effects and quick tips on managing them number 4 was >
CHEMO BRAIN: "Chemo brain" is a vague term that refers to an all-too real condition that has been associated with chemo. Patients describe it as mental fog or cloudiness; it affects memory, concentration, and the ability to process thoughts quickly. Although these symptoms can be distressing, they're usually temporary.
The funny thing was, I mentioned chemo brain to her and she said she never heard of that! I told her it was in an article from her office!!
I have chemo brain more than not and wonder if it will ever go away. Hopefully if I am off chemo long enough I will find out! I will let you know if I remember. Till then
......................now where was I? ☺
Happy New Year!
Libby0 -
Are there really any
Are there really any scientific studies proving the existence of "chemo brain". I don't think so and personally I don't believe in it. I think people just become hypersensitive to things "not working right" as they age but if they go through chemo. Perfectly normal events are chalked up to chemo brain or old age. We are just to sensitive. I think back to my 20s and/or 30s and I remember doing some really stupid stuff that if I did now I would definitely attribute to alzheimers or chemo brain. It's just we are told this stuff exists and we start attributing everything to it; even not coming up with the right words immediately. Everybody does that no matter their age.
I know of some studies that have shown that older people still come up with right answers but just not in the milliseconds it takes someone in their 20s.
Anyway, that's my opinion. I don't need anything else to worry about these days. I firmly believe we are ok. :-)0 -
chemo brainDisneynutt said:Are there really any
Are there really any scientific studies proving the existence of "chemo brain". I don't think so and personally I don't believe in it. I think people just become hypersensitive to things "not working right" as they age but if they go through chemo. Perfectly normal events are chalked up to chemo brain or old age. We are just to sensitive. I think back to my 20s and/or 30s and I remember doing some really stupid stuff that if I did now I would definitely attribute to alzheimers or chemo brain. It's just we are told this stuff exists and we start attributing everything to it; even not coming up with the right words immediately. Everybody does that no matter their age.
I know of some studies that have shown that older people still come up with right answers but just not in the milliseconds it takes someone in their 20s.
Anyway, that's my opinion. I don't need anything else to worry about these days. I firmly believe we are ok. :-)
Chemo brain is real. You don't get naturally occurring, age-related memory problems overnight as you do with chemo. Short-term memory is effected. I went from being able to finish the Sunday New York Times crossword puzzle to not being able to complete more than just a few clues. The few times I could come up with the correct answer, I had difficulty finding the correct space to place it in the puzzle.
Chemo brain is not doing "stupid stuff." It's not an excuse for bad behavior. And there are scientific studies. Just go to www.pubmed.com and put in cancer, chemotherapy, cognitive impairment. There are 167 medical journal articles on the subject.0 -
I thought I had avoided
I thought I had avoided "chemo brain," until I went back to work. I have an awful time finishing tasks, and my short term memory is totally shot. If the kids didn't keep track of the things I put down, I'd spend most of my day searching for the papers I'd just copied or my keys!
I wonder if I can get some ADD meds from my onc. to try out and see if that helps. Anyone else tried that?0 -
I was told to do puzzlesleesag said:I thought I had avoided
I thought I had avoided "chemo brain," until I went back to work. I have an awful time finishing tasks, and my short term memory is totally shot. If the kids didn't keep track of the things I put down, I'd spend most of my day searching for the papers I'd just copied or my keys!
I wonder if I can get some ADD meds from my onc. to try out and see if that helps. Anyone else tried that?
My oncologist suggested I do puzzles like sudoku or word games but I don't seem to be to concentrate on them for more than a few minutes at a time. It's the only lasting side effect I've had from chemo and by far the most distressing, at least partly because it was so sudden. I used to have an exceptionally good memory, now both my memory and concentration are so poor I've had to stop working. She said it would go eventually but I'm due for another round of carbo/taxol in a few weeks so I suppose I'm stuck with it, at least for a while longer.0 -
Hi Disneynutt! I respectDisneynutt said:Are there really any
Are there really any scientific studies proving the existence of "chemo brain". I don't think so and personally I don't believe in it. I think people just become hypersensitive to things "not working right" as they age but if they go through chemo. Perfectly normal events are chalked up to chemo brain or old age. We are just to sensitive. I think back to my 20s and/or 30s and I remember doing some really stupid stuff that if I did now I would definitely attribute to alzheimers or chemo brain. It's just we are told this stuff exists and we start attributing everything to it; even not coming up with the right words immediately. Everybody does that no matter their age.
I know of some studies that have shown that older people still come up with right answers but just not in the milliseconds it takes someone in their 20s.
Anyway, that's my opinion. I don't need anything else to worry about these days. I firmly believe we are ok. :-)
Hi Disneynutt! I respect people opinions and believes. But in my case I am happy you are not my manager at work! In Russia as the sayng goes: сытый голодного не понимает; if I will translate it is wiil be close to: not hungry(satiety) people not understand hungry people. Sorry, love you,Zina.0 -
Like Sarah, I was alwayssarahb74 said:I was told to do puzzles
My oncologist suggested I do puzzles like sudoku or word games but I don't seem to be to concentrate on them for more than a few minutes at a time. It's the only lasting side effect I've had from chemo and by far the most distressing, at least partly because it was so sudden. I used to have an exceptionally good memory, now both my memory and concentration are so poor I've had to stop working. She said it would go eventually but I'm due for another round of carbo/taxol in a few weeks so I suppose I'm stuck with it, at least for a while longer.
Like Sarah, I was always known for having a "memory like an elephant". When I was a child, I astounded my mother by proving that I remembered events that had occurred when I was less than 2 years old. I memorized whole sonnets from English Lit without breaking a (mental) sweat. I got extra credit in middle school for reciting (from memory) "Wreck of the Hesperus" in its entirety.
I was the partner everyone wanted when Trivial Pursuit was all the rage. If I had once known your birthday, or your middle name, chances were that I would still know it 20 years (or more) later. Even if we had not spoken in the interim. All that suddenly began to go out the window after my first chemo treatment.
Ten minutes after my daughter phones, my husband will ask, "What did Christa want?" and I haven't a clue. I have to stop whatever else might be going on inside my head and really, really concentrate on recalling a conversation that I just had. It drives him crazy. It drives ME crazy.
Here is what the ACS says about "chemo brain":
For many years cancer survivors have worried about, joked about, and been frustrated with the mental cloudiness they notice before, during, and after chemotherapy. Even though its exact cause isn't always known, this mental fog is commonly called "chemo brain." Patients have been aware of chemo brain for some time, but only recently have studies been done that could start to explain it.
Doctors have known for years that radiation treatment to the brain could cause problems with thinking and memory. More recently, they are finding that chemo is linked to some of the same kinds of problems. Research has begun to show that some cancer drugs can, indeed, cause certain kinds of changes in the brain. But it is also showing that chemo is not the only thing that can cause problems with thinking and memory for people with cancer.
Though the brain usually recovers over time, the sometimes vague yet distressing mental changes cancer patients notice are real, not imagined. They may last a short time, or they may go on for years. These changes can make people unable to go back to their school, work, or social activities, or make it so that it takes a lot of mental effort to do so. They affect everyday life for many people, and more research is needed to help prevent and cope with them.
What is chemo brain?
Here are just a few examples of what patients call chemo brain:
•Forgetting things that they usually have no trouble recalling -- memory lapses
•Trouble concentrating -- they can't focus on what they're doing, may "space out"
•Trouble remembering details like names, dates, and sometimes larger events
•Trouble multi-tasking, like answering the phone while cooking, without losing track of one of them -- less ability to do more than one thing at a time
•Taking longer to finish things -- disorganized, slower thinking and processing
•Trouble remembering common words -- unable to find the right words to finish a sentence
Doctors and researchers call chemo brain "mild cognitive impairment." Most define it as being unable to remember certain things and having trouble finishing tasks or learning new skills. But some doctors call it chemo brain only if it doesn't go away or get better over time. How long it lasts is a major factor in how much it affects a person's life.
For most people chemo brain effects happen quickly and only last a short time, while others have long-term mental changes. Usually the changes that patients notice are very subtle, and others around them may not even notice any changes at all. Still, the people who are having problems are well aware of the differences in their thinking. Many people do not tell their cancer care team about this problem until it affects their everyday life.
For the person who has lost some brain function, even short-term problems with thinking and memory can be scary. Some people may have trouble remembering simple things, like closing doors or turning off lights. Others may notice that their brain doesn't work as quickly as it used to. These kinds of brain problems can cause trouble at work and at home. People who notice problems with their thinking may feel even more upset if their doctors blame it on aging or act like it's nothing to worry about. It is distressing to wonder if you will ever be able to do your job again, or if you will get lost on the way to a place you've been to dozens of times.0 -
Chemo BrainHissy_Fitz said:Like Sarah, I was always
Like Sarah, I was always known for having a "memory like an elephant". When I was a child, I astounded my mother by proving that I remembered events that had occurred when I was less than 2 years old. I memorized whole sonnets from English Lit without breaking a (mental) sweat. I got extra credit in middle school for reciting (from memory) "Wreck of the Hesperus" in its entirety.
I was the partner everyone wanted when Trivial Pursuit was all the rage. If I had once known your birthday, or your middle name, chances were that I would still know it 20 years (or more) later. Even if we had not spoken in the interim. All that suddenly began to go out the window after my first chemo treatment.
Ten minutes after my daughter phones, my husband will ask, "What did Christa want?" and I haven't a clue. I have to stop whatever else might be going on inside my head and really, really concentrate on recalling a conversation that I just had. It drives him crazy. It drives ME crazy.
Here is what the ACS says about "chemo brain":
For many years cancer survivors have worried about, joked about, and been frustrated with the mental cloudiness they notice before, during, and after chemotherapy. Even though its exact cause isn't always known, this mental fog is commonly called "chemo brain." Patients have been aware of chemo brain for some time, but only recently have studies been done that could start to explain it.
Doctors have known for years that radiation treatment to the brain could cause problems with thinking and memory. More recently, they are finding that chemo is linked to some of the same kinds of problems. Research has begun to show that some cancer drugs can, indeed, cause certain kinds of changes in the brain. But it is also showing that chemo is not the only thing that can cause problems with thinking and memory for people with cancer.
Though the brain usually recovers over time, the sometimes vague yet distressing mental changes cancer patients notice are real, not imagined. They may last a short time, or they may go on for years. These changes can make people unable to go back to their school, work, or social activities, or make it so that it takes a lot of mental effort to do so. They affect everyday life for many people, and more research is needed to help prevent and cope with them.
What is chemo brain?
Here are just a few examples of what patients call chemo brain:
•Forgetting things that they usually have no trouble recalling -- memory lapses
•Trouble concentrating -- they can't focus on what they're doing, may "space out"
•Trouble remembering details like names, dates, and sometimes larger events
•Trouble multi-tasking, like answering the phone while cooking, without losing track of one of them -- less ability to do more than one thing at a time
•Taking longer to finish things -- disorganized, slower thinking and processing
•Trouble remembering common words -- unable to find the right words to finish a sentence
Doctors and researchers call chemo brain "mild cognitive impairment." Most define it as being unable to remember certain things and having trouble finishing tasks or learning new skills. But some doctors call it chemo brain only if it doesn't go away or get better over time. How long it lasts is a major factor in how much it affects a person's life.
For most people chemo brain effects happen quickly and only last a short time, while others have long-term mental changes. Usually the changes that patients notice are very subtle, and others around them may not even notice any changes at all. Still, the people who are having problems are well aware of the differences in their thinking. Many people do not tell their cancer care team about this problem until it affects their everyday life.
For the person who has lost some brain function, even short-term problems with thinking and memory can be scary. Some people may have trouble remembering simple things, like closing doors or turning off lights. Others may notice that their brain doesn't work as quickly as it used to. These kinds of brain problems can cause trouble at work and at home. People who notice problems with their thinking may feel even more upset if their doctors blame it on aging or act like it's nothing to worry about. It is distressing to wonder if you will ever be able to do your job again, or if you will get lost on the way to a place you've been to dozens of times.
Chemo Brain definitely happened to me, and it persists. I think it's exacerbated by my general anxiety over having cancer and the treatments. ( I just had to use a dictionary to look up "exacerbated". I initially typed "exasperated". Hah!) Fortunately I quit working a couple of years ago. I can't imagine managing an elementary classroom properly with this kind of mentality. When I'm fumbling for a word my friend or family member helps. Language and short term memory seem to be affected the most.0 -
I was doing the crosswordpattysoo said:Chemo Brain
Chemo Brain definitely happened to me, and it persists. I think it's exacerbated by my general anxiety over having cancer and the treatments. ( I just had to use a dictionary to look up "exacerbated". I initially typed "exasperated". Hah!) Fortunately I quit working a couple of years ago. I can't imagine managing an elementary classroom properly with this kind of mentality. When I'm fumbling for a word my friend or family member helps. Language and short term memory seem to be affected the most.
I was doing the crossword puzzle this AM, and the clue was "green gem stone". I sat there looking at the emerald ring on my finger for what seemed like HOURS, but was only minutes, I'm sure. I was so upset because I could not remember the word - a word I knew absolutely that I SHOULD know - and finally I had to just get up and walk away. It eventually came to me, of course, but it took a long time. Way longer than it should have. This frightens me almost as much as the cancer. I hope it goes away, or at least gets better.
Carlene0 -
chemo brainHissy_Fitz said:I was doing the crossword
I was doing the crossword puzzle this AM, and the clue was "green gem stone". I sat there looking at the emerald ring on my finger for what seemed like HOURS, but was only minutes, I'm sure. I was so upset because I could not remember the word - a word I knew absolutely that I SHOULD know - and finally I had to just get up and walk away. It eventually came to me, of course, but it took a long time. Way longer than it should have. This frightens me almost as much as the cancer. I hope it goes away, or at least gets better.
Carlene
I notice that I have trouble spelling commonplace words and that sometimes I'll think of something and an entirely different word will come out of my mouth! It's very frustrating, but does get better as you recover from the chemo treatments.
(((HUGS))) Maria0 -
I can relate.
I am a teacher, and I can't seem to get the words out sometimes. I think chemo definitely takes a toll on the old cognition. Hang in there! We will think clearly again.
Goatiegirl (Nan)0 -
It's real for megoatiegirl said:I can relate.
I am a teacher, and I can't seem to get the words out sometimes. I think chemo definitely takes a toll on the old cognition. Hang in there! We will think clearly again.
Goatiegirl (Nan)
I find that something I know this minute, I will not be able to recall in the next. I have been joking that I can't chew gum and walk at the same time. But it seems true. If I am doing something, say playing a game on the computer and someone asks me a question, I have to stop playing the game to focus on the question. I laugh about it because if it is chemo brain, I have hopes that it will go away in time.
Karen0 -
I have noticed this with me as wellgoatiegirl said:I can relate.
I am a teacher, and I can't seem to get the words out sometimes. I think chemo definitely takes a toll on the old cognition. Hang in there! We will think clearly again.
Goatiegirl (Nan)
I get up to do something and I forget what I was going to do but them remember quickly. It's the same with words or names but not all the time. I got a food delivery the other day and wanted to give the guy a 2.00 tip so that would have brought the total to 16.00 and I gave him a 20.00 but it took me forever to figure out that he should give me 4.00 back! There does not seem to be a pattern but it is certainly there. I met one of my other chemo friends for a drink and she knows some of my other friends that there as well. When she left, she put on one of my friends coats and left hers and didn't even notice the differnce and she wasn't even drunk. We had a lot laughs over that one. I live in NYC so nothing is wierd here. I blend!0 -
I have good laugh with youjloe said:I have noticed this with me as well
I get up to do something and I forget what I was going to do but them remember quickly. It's the same with words or names but not all the time. I got a food delivery the other day and wanted to give the guy a 2.00 tip so that would have brought the total to 16.00 and I gave him a 20.00 but it took me forever to figure out that he should give me 4.00 back! There does not seem to be a pattern but it is certainly there. I met one of my other chemo friends for a drink and she knows some of my other friends that there as well. When she left, she put on one of my friends coats and left hers and didn't even notice the differnce and she wasn't even drunk. We had a lot laughs over that one. I live in NYC so nothing is wierd here. I blend!
I have good laugh with you from your second half of the post. Thanks, Zina.
0
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