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Article from Dr. Lenz

lisa42's picture
lisa42
Posts: 3661
Joined: Jul 2008

Hi,

I thought you all might find this article by Dr. Lenz interesting.
Here it is:
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Why Do the New Drugs Fail in Adjuvant Chemotherapy?
Posted: 24 Mar 2011 09:50 AM PDT
Some of the most surprising data presented at the GI Symposium in January 2011 in San Francisco was the negative result of the European trial called AVANT.

Dr. HJ Lenz
In that clinical trial patients who underwent a curative resection for colon cancer received either FOLFOX or FOLFOX with Avastin® (bevacizumab) treatment after their surgery. Chemotherapy was given over 6 months, but patients who were randomly selected for Avastin received 6 months with chemotherapy and additional 6 months alone after chemotherapy ended for a total of 12 months of Avastin.
In our annual ASCO meeting in Chicago in 2009, we heard the results of an American trial (C-08) showing no benefit in patients who received Avastin in this setting, however there an interesting finding that during the 12 months Avastin was given there was a potential benefit. The European AVANT trial showed very similar results. Avastin did not improve outcome in patients who underwent a successful surgery for their colon cancer. There was again a hint of benefit during the time of Avastin therapy.
What does this all mean? After the negative data with Erbitux® and now with Avastin, we are coming to understand that drugs which work for metastatic disease may not have the same effect in patients who have only microscopic disease. The way these drugs work may be completely different if there only cells left or a tumor which has different infrastructure such as its own blood vessels and has overcome the defense of the immune system.
We need to get smarter and develop specific therapies for these patients and find out why the tumors in these patients come back. What makes colon cancer cells survive in some patients? How do some patients kill left over colon cancer cells?
We are back to the drawing board going beyond the pathology report to make treatment decisions but needing to understand the genetic make up of these cancers.

Scambuster's picture
Scambuster
Posts: 973
Joined: Nov 2009

Let me translate the first sentence in my 3rd paragraph: “I am not interested in pissing contests”.

Your stream of posts appear to be mainly that. I prefer to spend my energy in helping those who have a broader vision, and wish to take their fight for survival and recovery to a different level - and not rely only ‘what their Doctor says’. You can cut n paste and cherry pick all you want if that makes you feel good. Sorry if I am not impressed.

If you are truly interested in these questions you ask, go and search for the answers. I can tell you what I did and what worked, and what significant benefits I have gained through using diet and nutrition. As for the reactions of foods as they pass through the body being all a known thing, well the complexity of the multitude of reactions and interactions is probably like trying to make a list of every chess move ever possible and it's not 'all' done by any stretch, making it difficult to 'scientifically prove' these reactions and how such processed or metabolism is reflected in an outcome of the bodies condition.

If you see this as me simply avoiding your questions, that's OK with me.

If you haven’t yet worked out the link and importance of nutrition to our health and survival Buckwirth, I wish you the well.

Scam

Buckwirth's picture
Buckwirth
Posts: 1272
Joined: Jun 2010

Pissing contest? Really?

My questions are real, and if you are truly interested in health and diet you would balance the claims you make against the questions I asked.

The best way to avoid diet related cancers? Stay at a healthy weight, the link between obesity and cancer is very well documented. A healthy diet and regular exercise will help with that. As I have said, there is nothing wrong with promoting that.

"You can cut n paste and cherry pick all you want..." and apparently you can make spurious claims with no evidence all you want. I provide my sources, feel free to criticize and given one, but saying that I cherry pick and leaving it at that is defamatory.

Here is what I believe about you, please correct me if any of this is wrong, I have asked you before but you did not answer:

You had a stage one/two cancer of the throat. It was surgically removed and you had subsequent chemo and radiation. Based on that, there is a better than 90% chance that you were cured.

At around the same time you changed your diet and began using TCM and other alternative remedies for something you no longer had. Now you make claims that this "worked" for you. Worked how? Cured you of cancer? Prevented metastasis?

You patrol these boards and jump in with an authoritative voice and say things that some people want to hear.

You make a blanket statement about Turmeric as a booster for chemotherapy, but leave out the warning from Sloan-Kettering that it has the exact opposite effect on cyclophosphamide in treating breast cancer, could be an issue with other treatments, and a warning to not use in conjunction with chemo.

If you want to claim that a alkaline diet changes the PH in other parts of the body, you should be able to answer which parts and how it gets there.

I do find it disturbing that you cannot answer simple questions.

jscho
Posts: 62
Joined: Jun 2009

Buckwirth, I don't participate much in this forum as I don't care for the general ambiance. I am a scientist, and have a difficult time not being skeptical (like you?). I have posted before on alkalinity, sugar and a number of other things that irritate me. That said, my approach to dealing with cancer has been to research options like supplements (which are not likely to ever enter clinical studies) and lifestyle changes (exercise, etc..) to see how they might impact disease. If a supplement has demonstrated some benefit in laboratory studies and is not harmful at low dosages, I'm willing to try it. Curcumin falls into that category, in spite of the warning from Sloan-Kettering. I know it does interfere with irinotecan, but research articles suggest it can enhance the effectiveness of FOLFOX chemotherapy, and, in particular, can target cancer stem cells. See

1. "Curcumin enhances the effects of 5-fluorouracil and oxaliplatin in mediating
growth inhibition of colon cancer cells by modulating EGFR and IGF-1R", Int. J. Cancer: 122, 267–273 (2008)

2. "Synergistic Role of Curcumin With Current Therapeutics in Colorectal Cancer: Minireview", Nutrition and Cancer, 61(6), 842–846 (2009)

3. "Elimination of Colon Cancer Stem–Like Cells by the Combination of Curcumin and FOLFOX1", Translational Oncology Vol. 2, No. 4, 321-328 (2009)

Best,
Jeremy

coloCan
Posts: 1956
Joined: Oct 2009

called "Life Extension", with the cover exclaiming: "How Curcumin Combats Cancer"

This pub sells sups and herbsbut the articles seem well-documented....A health food store where I live has some informative free mags tho their products are overpriced....

Just noticed a website listing:wwwlifeextensionretail.com tho i don't know if it only contains products to buy or if it includes articles and as I'm starving and need energy.....

Dr Servan- Schreiber refers to curcumin in his noted Anti-cancer book on pages 114-116 and suggests taking with pepper with it

Buckwirth's picture
Buckwirth
Posts: 1272
Joined: Jun 2010

Despite how it looks, I am not anti-supplement.

As to Turmeric, it shows great promise. Without knowing which chemotherapies it helps though (thanks for the links) advocating it's blanket use with chemo is irresponsible (in my opinion, that is what Scam did, though in another conversation).

Scouty (Lisa P.) did something that makes eminent sense: If you are on Chemo and doing supplements, supply a list of everything you are taking to your Oncologist and have them run it by their pharmacy, looking for drug interactions to your current treatment.

If it clears, have at it. No harm, no foul.

While we are barred on this forum from recommending treatment options to others, often when we discuss what methods we have used we are putting a stamp of approval that has the same effect as a recommendation. If it is something where there is firm science to show that it is ineffective (not a clinical trial, rather where the biology just does not work the way it is claimed) someone should point that out.

If I remember correctly, you are a biologist, right?

Can you answer the questions I posed to Scambuster? I would be interested in actual answers to those questions.

Thanks,

Blake

Erinb
Posts: 295
Joined: Apr 2010

When do the nutrients from the food enter the cell? Why is it when you eat certain foods and urinate you can smell the odor asap? Garlic? Asparagus? Obviously with some foods it is immediate. By the way everyone knows the stomach is acidic.
Erin

lisa42's picture
lisa42
Posts: 3661
Joined: Jul 2008

I found the acid/alkaline explanation very helpful- thank you!

Lisa

AnneCan
Posts: 3692
Joined: Oct 2009

Thanks for sharing this interesting letter. I hope they do get to the bottom of all this AND SOON!

HollyID's picture
HollyID
Posts: 951
Joined: Dec 2009

Lisa, thanks for the article!!

mom_2_3
Posts: 965
Joined: Nov 2008

Lisa,

Interesting article and subsequent discussion. When first diagnosed I did daily saliva ph tests and made a concerted effort to concentrate on more alkaline food. My ph went from about a high 5 (acidic) to a high 6. I tested it at the same time each morning after waking up and prior to brushing teeth or eating anything which impact my saliva. I drank lemon-infused water and would also use alkalinity drops when lemons weren't available. I have never been under the impression that this act would cure my Stage IV cancer but it was hard to find a negative. And if nothing else, even if I was mis-guided in my approach, I had a feeling of being proactive in my cancer battle. In addition to that I juice every day and take a number of supplements. The most important thing I do (from my perspective) is exercise. I workout 7 days per week (5 days intense cardio with interval training to elevate my heart rate constantly between 60 and 90 % of max heart rate. I do that for an hour. I also use a personal trainer the other two days of the week and do weigh training with supersets and keep my heart rate elevated to about 55% max heart rate the entire time. My doctor told me the best thing I could do to prevent recurrence was exercise. I don't take her advice lightly.

As far as food, I am a careful shopper and bring into our home foods with minimal processing and the fewest ingredients. This does not mean our household is deprived. I love steak and my husband is a mean griller. So we have steak every three weeks. I love ice cream. We take the kids out for burritos and ice cream every Friday, but I only have ice cream every 4th time and even then I share with my littlest one. I do not feel deprived and I would be hard-pressed to listen to anyone that said what I was doing was silly. If all this doesn't help me battle cancer, it is hardly a destructive or deprived lifestyle.

I find it interesting that some of our friends will put anything in their bodies, without a thought to the ingredients or processing method of that food. Then, they will turn around and buy high test or 93 octane fuel for their cars "cause it keeps gunk out of the engine and the car works better." Their words, not mine. They will rotate their tires on a regular basis, get their oil changed regularly, keep their fluids tapped off, keep their tires properly inflated, etc. And then they turn around and completely ignore their body's maintenance and well-being. If these weren't friends I cared about I would find it almost comical. But I do care about them so when I have opportunity I share with them the things I am doing and if they are "lucky" to be with me when I am juicing, they get a 20oz glass, on the house.

Amy

Buckwirth's picture
Buckwirth
Posts: 1272
Joined: Jun 2010

Juicing is a great (and sometimes fun) way to get essential nutrients! And there are great studies that show a huge benefit of exercise for those in remission. For my part I fully support anyone who adds these things to their daily routine, cancer or no.

It also sounds like you have a sensible diet plan to go with it.

Keep it up!

It's great to see that you are NED! May you stay that way forever!

Tricia02's picture
Tricia02
Posts: 130
Joined: Mar 2009

I have just spent such a long time reading this thread, I am now knackered! It's 12.30 am in London so I will be brief here as I need my beauty sleep. I agree with everything Blake has said, as he understands the subject so well. I have no desire to get into a peeing contest! But I really think some of you miss the point entirely. And I am not going to try where Blake failed. I do not agree with quakery of any description and trust the science myself. I was diagnosed with stage 2 nasal septum carcinoma. I did "dip" into some research about various dietary changes. Luckily I live with a man who is somewhat the mad scientist! He helped me through treatment and life after treatment. He helped me maintain a sensible way of thinking and not get carried away with all the quakery that one reads about alternative cancer treatment. I had a very good eating regime for many years prior to being diagnosed with cancer, plenty of exercise and a healthy slim physique. I ate loads of curcumin and other Indian spices, but still got cancer! The problem is this, as I see it, lots of people seem to make weird claims of diet and the fact their cancer has gone, and give very little creedance to the conventional medicine. I applaud my MDT and the treatment I received. I do not attribute my recovery to the litre of gorgeous blended fruit etc I drank everyday. For me the conventional treatment worked, I am today cured. What I would say is during treatment I wasn't just fighting cancer I had to stay fit enough to endure the treatment, which is often very punishing emotionally and physically and supplementing my diet to ensure I had adequate vitamins and minerals was constructive to give me the best possible chance for the conventional medicine to work. I cannot say whether or not I would have been able to respond as well to treatment if I had not worked at giving my body the best chance for staying strong, during this chemical physical and psychological onslaught that conventional treatment can often be. Being overweight is one of the major contributory factors in being diagnosed with cancer. Therefore, it is isn't rocket science to avail oneself of a sensible and balanced diet and lifestyle, simple changes is at that's required nothing radical. I ensure I eat 2/3 fresh vegetables daily with my meals, together with a couple pieces of fruit, so no hardship there lol. I love chocolate and have learnt to modify that. All this mumbo jumbo about foods and changing alkaline/acid levels is in my opinion nonsense Put simple, the body takes in raw materials as food, extracts vitamins/minerals as required and dumps the rest. Acid and alkaine levels throughout your body are maintained by your metabolism and not based on what you consume. I have not seen evidence here of Blake personally attacking anyone or guilty of any of the things that have been slung at him. It does seem that certain people just want to shoot the messenger though. So that's it from me. Conventional medicine, and I had loads of it, saved my life and I shall be eternally grateful. Love reading your posts Blake, keep em coming. Apologies for rambling, as I started off by saying I am very tired and just bashed this reply really fast.

Rewriter's picture
Rewriter
Posts: 497
Joined: Dec 2009

http://realbalance.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=134&Itemid=999

John23's picture
John23
Posts: 2140
Joined: Jan 2007

Report on Carcinogens

Report on Carcinogens

Facts on Drugs Used in Chemotherapy

Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center

Which anticancer drugs cause cancer?

So many people try to eat well, steer clear of all normally used
products that are said to be contributing causes for cancer.....
and in an effort to kill cancer within their body, have well known
carcinogenic chemicals pumped directly into their blood stream.

Is that really the answer?

(gotta' ask!)

Be well.

John

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