Confused about Pathology report

JennyDra
JennyDra Member Posts: 24
in Kidney Cancer #1

Hello everyone.....hope you are all well.

Finally got a written version of my husband's pathology reports but I am having a hard time deciphering them.

From what I can make out it says

CK7 - positive ( I definitely have no idea that is)

Cd10 - negative (no idea about that either)

PAX 2 - negative

The actual tumor was 3.5 cm in the end (smaller than the initial scans had shown)

and then it says  T1 NX MX which is confusing because when I looked it up is said that it was not able to be assesed (NX & MX that is)

I mean why was it not able to be assessed?? Anyone have any insight??

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Comments

  • Footstomper
    Footstomper Member Posts: 1,237 Member
    #2
    Sorry

    Utter gibberish to me I'm afraid. I'm sure someone more knowledgable will translate it for you. Just wanted you to know I tried

  • NewDay
    NewDay Member Posts: 272
    #3
    Footstomper said:

    Sorry

    Utter gibberish to me I'm afraid. I'm sure someone more knowledgable will translate it for you. Just wanted you to know I tried

    Excelent Report

    Jenny,

    This is excellent news!  The things you mention such as CK7 and CD10 refer to stains used on the slides to identify the type of cancer.

    The T1 says the tumor was stage 1 which is excellent.  There is very small chance of  it recurring.

    The NX says that there was no lymph node tissue provided which is why it was not assessed.  The surgeon did not remove any lymph nodes.  This is not unusual.  Often the surgeon does not remove any unless some look suspicious.

    The MX says that there was nothing in the tissue provided that indicates metastatic disease.

    I am surprised that there is no mention of the histology like "clear cell" or "chromophobe" of "papillary".

    You could not have gotten a better report (other than no cancer of course).

    Time to celebarate,

    Kathy

  • JoanneNH
    JoanneNH Member Posts: 115
    #4
    Sounds like it is clear cell

    Sounds like it is clear cell tubulopapillary renal cell.   

     

    http://surgpathcriteria.stanford.edu/kidney/renal-clear-cell-carcinoma/differential-diagnosis.html

  • sblairc
    sblairc Member Posts: 585 Member
    #5
    Yes, you are right: Cannot be assessed

    MX means that they can't assess presence of metastatic disease by pathology report. I"m not sure why exactly makes the difference between MX and M0 (cannot be assessed versus none present)

     

    I'd love to know the answer to this as well. For me, I have always assumed for my husband it was "MX" because his stage was so high they didn't want to come out and say M0. But yours is Stage 1 so that throws my theory out the window. 

     

    If anyone knows the difference for how they determing M0 and MX please share. 

  • jason.2835
    jason.2835 Member Posts: 337 Member
    #6
    Should be T1a

    Sounds a lot like my report, however I was under the impression that if the tumor was under 4 cm it's actually T1a and over 4 cm it's T1b.  Not sure if that is on the report.  Also, another important indicator is Fuhrman grade, which ranges from 1, meaning close to normal tissue, to 4, which look abnormal under low magnification... The lower the grade the better.  Mine was Grade 2.  

  • JennyDra
    JennyDra Member Posts: 24
    #7
    Thanks for the insight eveyone...

    I have spent hours trying to research these things on the internet but I don't understand some of the more technical terms on some sites.

    His surgon said that his outlook is very good and I am very happy about that. He said next set of scans in six months.

    But I think we should see an oncologist just so he can explain what all these results mean from his point of view..

    I am happy to be  getting back to normal life....even though i think it's not exactly how it was before. There are always thoughts lurking in my mind...but all in all it's nice to be moving forward. I am praying this was  just one of lifes bumps in the road. I am also praying for all of you ...having this site has made such a difference.  Hope  you are all well. You are in    my thoughts. Thanks again.

  • dhs1963
    dhs1963 Member Posts: 513
    #8
    JennyDra said:

    Thanks for the insight eveyone...

    I have spent hours trying to research these things on the internet but I don't understand some of the more technical terms on some sites.

    His surgon said that his outlook is very good and I am very happy about that. He said next set of scans in six months.

    But I think we should see an oncologist just so he can explain what all these results mean from his point of view..

    I am happy to be  getting back to normal life....even though i think it's not exactly how it was before. There are always thoughts lurking in my mind...but all in all it's nice to be moving forward. I am praying this was  just one of lifes bumps in the road. I am also praying for all of you ...having this site has made such a difference.  Hope  you are all well. You are in    my thoughts. Thanks again.

    To be honest, there is no reason to see an oncologist

    You can, but most oncologists that specialize in RCC will not see patients with T1a low grade, stage 1 tumors.  They just do not have the time.  That is too bad, because these people can really explain why you don't have to worry. 

     

  • Jojo61
    Jojo61 Member Posts: 1,309 Member
    #9
    dhs1963 said:

    To be honest, there is no reason to see an oncologist

    You can, but most oncologists that specialize in RCC will not see patients with T1a low grade, stage 1 tumors.  They just do not have the time.  That is too bad, because these people can really explain why you don't have to worry. 

     

    Well it looked like Greek to

    Well it looked like Greek to me, too. But judging from what other opinnions are, it is good news!

    Hurray for good news!!! Celebrate!

    Hugs

    Jojo

  • Ree_Maryland
    Ree_Maryland Member Posts: 161 Member
    #10
    dhs1963 said:

    To be honest, there is no reason to see an oncologist

    You can, but most oncologists that specialize in RCC will not see patients with T1a low grade, stage 1 tumors.  They just do not have the time.  That is too bad, because these people can really explain why you don't have to worry. 

     

    HI, I had a right neph and it

    HI, I had a right neph and it was graded 1b was is the diffence betweeen a an b? thanks hope all is well for you peoples on the journey to good health,

  • icemantoo
    icemantoo Member Posts: 3,361 Member
    #11
    Ree_Maryland said:

    HI, I had a right neph and it

    HI, I had a right neph and it was graded 1b was is the diffence betweeen a an b? thanks hope all is well for you peoples on the journey to good health,

    Sounds good to me

    But what do I know. I am an attorney, not a doctor. At 3.5cm you are going to be around for the long haul.

     

    Icemantoo

  • b1
    b1 Member Posts: 17
    #12
    t1 mx nx

    Hi im not a dr either, but from what ive read, t1 means stage 1 under 7 cm and confined to the kidney.

    Nx means Nodes unable to be assessed, this is because they wouldnt have removed any nodes to assess, they are only reporting on the bit they removed.

    MX is signs of metastasis and once again they would only be looking at the bit they removed. In order to see if it has spread they will do scans and probably blood tests to assess this.

    The good news in a sense is that they appear to have caught it early, therefor your chances of it returning are significantly less. Doesnt mean it cant return, thats why you should have a yearly check initially and of course if you start feeling unwell get things checked out. 

     

  • sblairc
    sblairc Member Posts: 585 Member
    #13
    b1 said:

    t1 mx nx

    Hi im not a dr either, but from what ive read, t1 means stage 1 under 7 cm and confined to the kidney.

    Nx means Nodes unable to be assessed, this is because they wouldnt have removed any nodes to assess, they are only reporting on the bit they removed.

    MX is signs of metastasis and once again they would only be looking at the bit they removed. In order to see if it has spread they will do scans and probably blood tests to assess this.

    The good news in a sense is that they appear to have caught it early, therefor your chances of it returning are significantly less. Doesnt mean it cant return, thats why you should have a yearly check initially and of course if you start feeling unwell get things checked out. 

     

    So, then, WHY and WHEN do they use M0??

    This is driving me nuts, I can't seem to find this on the internet. Does anyone know when and why they use this distinction? (i.e., M0 versus MX)

  • b1
    b1 Member Posts: 17
    #14
    Ree_Maryland said:

    HI, I had a right neph and it

    HI, I had a right neph and it was graded 1b was is the diffence betweeen a an b? thanks hope all is well for you peoples on the journey to good health,

    t1a vs t1b

    You may hear your doctor talk about T1a or T1b. T1a means you have a tumour that is less than 4cm across. T1b means the kidney tumour is between 4 and 7cm across.

  • b1
    b1 Member Posts: 17
    #15
    sblairc said:

    So, then, WHY and WHEN do they use M0??

    This is driving me nuts, I can't seem to find this on the internet. Does anyone know when and why they use this distinction? (i.e., M0 versus MX)

    M

    The M category tells whether there are distant metastases (spread of cancer to other parts of body).

     

    MX means metastasis can’t be evaluated.

    M0 means that no distant cancer spread was found.

    M1 means that the cancer has spread to distant organs or tissues (distant metastases were found). 

     

    Reading this, if it is mx as opposed to m0 i can only assume the pathologist did not have a scan or report in front of them that tells them whether it has spread. Apart from obviously having extra parts cut out of you, i dont think they can tell if its spread from just looking at the kidney bit they cut out, unless for example parts of other organs are also in front of them. I could of couse be wrong and maybe they can tell, but i dont think so. 

     

     

  • sblairc
    sblairc Member Posts: 585 Member
    #16
    b1 said:

    M

    The M category tells whether there are distant metastases (spread of cancer to other parts of body).

     

    MX means metastasis can’t be evaluated.

    M0 means that no distant cancer spread was found.

    M1 means that the cancer has spread to distant organs or tissues (distant metastases were found). 

     

    Reading this, if it is mx as opposed to m0 i can only assume the pathologist did not have a scan or report in front of them that tells them whether it has spread. Apart from obviously having extra parts cut out of you, i dont think they can tell if its spread from just looking at the kidney bit they cut out, unless for example parts of other organs are also in front of them. I could of couse be wrong and maybe they can tell, but i dont think so. 

     

     

    I think this has to be it.

    And they are probably covering their **** with "MX" versus "MO" so they don't get sued if the cancer comes back which as we know it can and does!

  • Jmat23
    Jmat23 Member Posts: 23
    #17
    sblairc said:

    I think this has to be it.

    And they are probably covering their **** with "MX" versus "MO" so they don't get sued if the cancer comes back which as we know it can and does!

    MX and other pathology info

    Yes I believe they use MX when they cannot determine metastasis to distant sites microscopically. You'd think this would be in the majority of cases so I'm not sure when M0 would be used.

    This is a low stage tumour so perhaps they don't look at these things but the following have been put forward as independant prognostic factors or adverse characteristics (ie can inpact on disease free survival (DFS) or cancer specific survival. For this reason some pathology reports will include this information. I believe these may be related to clear cell type and it sounds like her husbands may be a different type.

    * Lymphovasular invasion 

    * Invasion of the intrarenal veins

    * Tumour necrosis

    * Sarcomatoid change

    * Renal sinus involvement

     

  • Ree_Maryland
    Ree_Maryland Member Posts: 161 Member
    #18
    b1 said:

    t1a vs t1b

    You may hear your doctor talk about T1a or T1b. T1a means you have a tumour that is less than 4cm across. T1b means the kidney tumour is between 4 and 7cm across.

    b1

    Thanks to the folks on here who got ti through my thick head what the A an B means on a scale of RCC , I had a tumor grade1b ,furmor 1

  • JennyDra
    JennyDra Member Posts: 24
    #19
    Jmat23 said:

    MX and other pathology info

    Yes I believe they use MX when they cannot determine metastasis to distant sites microscopically. You'd think this would be in the majority of cases so I'm not sure when M0 would be used.

    This is a low stage tumour so perhaps they don't look at these things but the following have been put forward as independant prognostic factors or adverse characteristics (ie can inpact on disease free survival (DFS) or cancer specific survival. For this reason some pathology reports will include this information. I believe these may be related to clear cell type and it sounds like her husbands may be a different type.

    * Lymphovasular invasion 

    * Invasion of the intrarenal veins

    * Tumour necrosis

    * Sarcomatoid change

    * Renal sinus involvement

     

    Jmat....

    As far as I have read It says that it is chromophobe.  It also says that the fatty tissue inside the kidney was unaffected.  I am just a bit worried of possible reoccurrence. We will eventually go too the oncologist but I have been really sick with a cold and the weather hasn't been great either. Thanks for the info.

  • gingersnaps
    gingersnaps Member Posts: 67 Member
    #20
    JennyDra said:

    Jmat....

    As far as I have read It says that it is chromophobe.  It also says that the fatty tissue inside the kidney was unaffected.  I am just a bit worried of possible reoccurrence. We will eventually go too the oncologist but I have been really sick with a cold and the weather hasn't been great either. Thanks for the info.

    grade

    Did they give you a grade? Some chromophobe are not graded. My son's was grade 3.

  • sblairc
    sblairc Member Posts: 585 Member
    #21
    gingersnaps said:

    grade

    Did they give you a grade? Some chromophobe are not graded. My son's was grade 3.

    Grade in chromophobe may not matter.

    Just as an FYI. I've heard (think I read here) that with Chromophobe a "Grade" is really not a clinical indicator of aggressiveness. Not getting a "Grade" would be logical since it may not be significant FOR CHROMOPHOBE RCC. Other RCC's, it's important. If anyone has anything to add or to this comment, please do so. 

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