Alternative Treatments.

drayco
drayco Member Posts: 3
in Anal Cancer #1

So I am a recent diagnosis of Rectal Cancer.  I did 6 weeks of chemo/radiation.  The radiation was really horrible as some of you probably know, unfortanately.  

I am currently feeling the best I've felt since I was dianosed though.  I had a tumor blocking almost 60% of my colon at the time I went to the emergency room.  The reason I got so bad was because of the military failing to diagnose me properly.  That's a another forum topic for later though.

I was really interested in knowing if anyone has experimented with any other treatments?   The only option the mainstream cancer industry is giving me, rectum removal and colostomy bad for life.  Don't plan on doing that.  I have done lots of research and have been experimenting with everyting I feel would be beneficial.  Stuff like Alluminum free sodium bicarbonate, turmeric, ginger, lemon, teas, vegan diet, juicing veggies, wheat grass shots, just to name a few.  Now I feel really good but the doctors say that is temporary,  That the tumor will not only grow back, but grow back faster because of the chemo/radiation.  I find that to be very rediculous.  How does the official billion billion dollar cancer industry treatment for cancer, cause it to grow back faster.  Something suspect about that.  Not to mention you're consider a survior in their eyes if you live 5 years after diagnosis.  So even if you die at 5 years and 3 months after diagnosis, you're still a "cancer survior".

My next alternative treatment is going to be moving to OR and getting my medical cannabis card.  Then I plan on getting high concentrated cannabis oil suppositories, ingesting the cannabis oil orally, and smoking/vaporizing it.  Everything that I've read shows this helps not only with the pain but healing your body as well.  I'm no doctor and have only read about testominials and what not but if you go to http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/cam/cannabis/healthprofessional/page4 this shows very promising studies, research, experiments in the medical cannabis field.  If you read over all the tests they do in mice and rats, it basically shows results like shrinking tumors, having cancer cells self destruct while keeping normals cells healthy, and much more.  Just have to read through it all.  

So if anyone has any experiences with any alternative treatments, please share them.  

For all the lazy people that don't like to copy and paste links, here is some info from cancer.gov in regards to cannabis oil and anti-tumor effects. 

Hope this helps.  

Please share any info you have.  

Thanks

-Will

Antitumor Effects

One study in mice and rats suggested that cannabinoids may have a protective effect against the development of certain types of tumors.[3] During this 2-year study, groups of mice and rats were given various doses of THC by gavage. A dose-related decrease in the incidence of hepatic adenoma tumors and hepatocellular carcinoma was observed in the mice. Decreased incidences of benign tumors(polyps and adenomas) in other organs (mammary gland, uterus, pituitary, testis, and pancreas) were also noted in the rats. In another study, delta-9-THC, delta-8-THC, and cannabinol were found to inhibit the growth of Lewis lung adenocarcinoma cells in vitro and in vivo .[4] In addition, other tumors have been shown to be sensitive to cannabinoid-induced growth inhibition.[5-8]

Cannabinoids may cause antitumor effects by various mechanisms, including induction of cell death, inhibition of cell growth, and inhibition of tumor angiogenesis invasion and metastasis.[9-12] One review summarizes the molecular mechanisms of action of cannabinoids as antitumor agents.[13] Cannabinoids appear to kill tumor cells but do not affect their nontransformed counterparts and may even protect them from cell death. These compounds have been shown to induce apoptosis in gliomacells in culture and induce regression of glioma tumors in mice and rats. Cannabinoids protect normal glial cells of astroglial and oligodendroglial lineages from apoptosis mediated by the CB1 receptor.[14]

The effects of delta-9-THC and a synthetic agonist of the CB2 receptor were investigated in hepatocellular carcinoma (HCC).[15] Both agents reduced the viability of hepatocellular carcinoma cellsin vitro and demonstrated antitumor effects in hepatocellular carcinoma subcutaneous xenografts in nude mice. The investigations documented that the anti-HCC effects are mediated by way of the CB2 receptor. Similar to findings in glioma cells, the cannabinoids were shown to trigger cell death through stimulation of an endoplasmic reticulum stress pathway that activates autophagy and promotes apoptosis. Other investigations have confirmed that CB1 and CB2 receptors may be potential targets innon-small cell lung carcinoma [16] and breast cancer.[17]

An in vitro study of the effect of CBD on programmed cell death in breast cancer cell lines found that CBD induced programmed cell death, independent of the CB1, CB2, or vanilloid receptors. CBD inhibited the survival of both estrogen receptor–positive and estrogen receptor–negative breast cancercell lines, inducing apoptosis in a concentration-dependent manner while having little effect on nontumorigenic, mammary cells.[18]

CBD has also been demonstrated to exert a chemopreventive effect in a mouse model of colon cancer.[19] In the experimental system, azoxymethane increased premalignant and malignant lesions in the mouse colon. Animals treated with azoxymethane and CBD concurrently were protected from developing premalignant and malignant lesions. In in vitro experiments involving colorectal cancer cell lines, the investigators found that CBD protected DNA from oxidative damage, increased endocannabinoid levels, and reduced cell proliferation.

Another investigation into the antitumor effects of CBD examined the role of intercellular adhesion molecule-1 (ICAM-1).[12] ICAM-1 expression has been reported to be negatively correlated with cancermetastasis. In lung cancer cell lines, CBD upregulated ICAM-1, leading to decreased cancer cell invasiveness.

In an in vivo model using severe combined immunodeficient mice, subcutaneous tumors were generated by inoculating the animals with cells from human non-small cell lung carcinoma cell lines.[20] Tumor growth was inhibited by 60% in THC-treated mice compared with vehicle-treated control mice. Tumor specimens revealed that THC had antiangiogenic and antiproliferative effects. However, research with immunocompetent murine tumor models has demonstrated immunosuppression and enhanced tumor growth in mice treated with THC.[21,22]

In addition, both plant-derived and endogenous cannabinoids have been studied for anti-inflammatoryeffects. A mouse study demonstrated that endogenous cannabinoid system signaling is likely to provide intrinsic protection against colonic inflammation.[23] As a result, a hypothesis that phytocannabinoids and endocannabinoids may be useful in the risk reduction and treatment of colorectal cancer has been developed.[24-27]

 

 

Comments

  • mp327
    mp327 Member Posts: 4,440 Member
    #2
    Will--

    I'm sorry for all you've been through--it literally is brutal, as most of us here know.  You are correct that the only treatment offered in most cases for recurrent anal cancer is APR with permanent colostomy.  I understand your unwillingness to go through that, as I feel the same way (although I have never had to make that choice to this point).  I have not studied alternative treatments, so I really can't comment on the info you posted. 

    I wish you the very best and hope that your cancer does not return. 

  • Marynb
    Marynb Member Posts: 1,118
    #3
    Will
    Hi. I am so sorry that you were not diagnosed early. Many of us here were misdiagnosed for years. I do understand that nobody would volunteer for any of this, and that nobody would really want to have the surgery that has been suggested you have to survive.
    You are in a life and death situation. If alternative treatments actually worked, we would all be using them, of course! I am not in your shoes. The doctors feel they can save your life by performing a surgery that may alter your lifestyle. I also have a cancer for which there is no known cure at all. I just want to urge you to chose life! I have known some very good people who have lived rich and rewarding lives with a colostomy. We all get to chose when enough is enough.I will pray for you to chose to live. If you were my son, I would beg you to chose life! I could never, ever, let you go when you could be saved. Make no mistake about it, when they say there is no cure, there is no cure! Thank you for pasting all the information. Big hugs! You are in my prayers!
  • Angela_K
    Angela_K Member Posts: 374 Member
    #4
    On alternative therapy

    There are, in fact, alternative therapies that do work on some cancers on some people. The research outcomes on a grand scale just aren't there to back it all up, making alternative therapy perhaps more of a crap shoot than traditional medicine.  It is my personal belief that chemo and radiation alone do not "cure."  It is from a compromised immune system that cancer lives. A strong, clean healthy immune system is ideal in preventing recurrence as is a calm mind and spirit and a happy heart,  I would think.

    Blessings to you as you find your way, Will.  I wish I had all of the answers.  I think we just do the best we can with what we have.

    Angela

    Good reading from the Gerson Institute: http://gerson.org/gerpress/the-gerson-therapy/ (cut and paste to browser)

     

  • lavenderblossoms
    lavenderblossoms Member Posts: 1
    #5
    If you cancer is virus-driven, consider these studies:

    Hi. I am not against medical cannabis at all. But please consider this: If your rectal cancer is caused by the HPV virus, then please consider not using Cannabinoids for treatment. Instead, try Curcumin, which is more proven to kill HPV driven cancer cells. You can even use Curcumin capsules rectally. 

     

    Here's a study regarding why you should consider not using medical cannabis for virus-driven cancers. This is the most important part of the study: 

    "In all other virus infections, both in vitro and in vivo, cannabinoid treatment led to disease progression, increased pathology, and sometimes to host death. Therefore, in many clinical settings, including latent infections caused by HIV-1 or HSV-1, and persistent infection of the liver caused by HCV, cannabinoids lead to worsened disease outcome."

    Here's the link to the above quoted study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2903762/

     

    Here's a study about Curcumin and HPV (which can cause not only rectal cancer, but cervical and vulvar cancer as well). The most important aspect regarding this study is this: 

    "These results provide attractive data for the possible use of curcumin in the management of HPV associated tumors."

     

    Here's the link to that study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16526022

     

    If your cancer is not virus-driven, then by all means, go for some Cannabis Oil. It has impressive research for many other (non-viral) cancers.

     

    Best wishes to you!

    ~ Lav

     

     

     

     

  • Sundanceh
    Sundanceh Member Posts: 4,392 Member
    #6
    Will, I Need to Talk to You...

    My name is Craig.  I'm from the Colorectal board.  I visit here, because I know some of the folks here and like to check in with them.

    So, I see that you have rectal cancer.  I would like to encourage you to join the Colorectal Board, as there are alot of folks over there with ostomies (colo & ileo) and they would be a wealth of information that could help you in making your decision.  They have showed me (I was spared by centimeters) that a pretty normal life can be lived, despite the procedure.  It's not without its challenges, but they have really persevered and I think they would make you feel better about things if you talked to some of them.

    And the treatments and outcomes vary with colorectal cancer.  Rate of recurrence is high...and the mortality rate is high as well.  We're talking about the #2 killer cancer in the U.S. and the world.  So, this is not the time to worry about an ostomy.  I was there once and I remember the fear too...when I joined the board and read the stories, they put my mind more at ease, should that ever befall me.  It simply is another way of removing waste than the traditional method.

    And that's all...life is important to fight for...and you seem young to me, man. 

    First, I'm sorry it has happened to you.  I see you did the radiation.  I'm not sure if you have felt the sexual side effects from the treatment.  They don't happen right away...they may play themself out over time...it was a couple of years for me.

    Dysfunction might start...and then things could go dead for awhile.  If you think about a raging forest fire and it had only one way out to burn...and for a man, it is through his penis. So, everything gets burned up in there.  It could even get to be painful to urinate as the tissues try and rebuild.  Erections may be hindered, or unable to achieve.  I found it takes alot of time for that area of a man's body to heal. 

    There's always much discussion among the women, but few men want to talk about it.  That's where I come in.  If ED drugs were an option, a good one to try would be CIALIS...it lasts 36-hours and you can eat on it...and have a drink of two of alcohol without altering its effects.  And 36-hours allows things to happen at a more natural pace, than some of the other Wham-Bang drugs...and lots less face flushing too.

    This may not happen to you, but wanted to put that out there, just in case...

    Lots of alternative talk these days - and one has to run their own race with regards to what they feel is best. 

    I've had cancer 3x now...just three months shy of the 9-year mark right now...I had rectal adeocarcinoma...which spread to liver...which spread to lungs twice.  I've done 51x chemo of all kinds...55x radiation treatments...25 of them in the hips and up the tailpipe with chemo...and 30 more in my right lung with chemo...I've done Cyberknife 3x in the liver...I've had 4-major surgeries...rectal resection / liver RFA / da Vinci robot surgery on the lung (2-wedges removed) / full open throacotomy (7-wedges removed + 2 ribs sawed off).  Follow-up radiation destroyed another 10% of an already compromised lung. 

    I've been able to stay in the fight for a very long time...

    During my fight, I did supplementation...I exercised...ate healthier etc. etc.....and each time, I experienced a recurrence.  Rectal cancer has a much higher recurrence rate than Anal cancer, that's why we're #2 on the list, unfortunately. 

    I've been clear of my last treatment now almost 21-mos....and here's the thing, Will...I'm doing absolutely nothing as a preventive...and the even bigger news IS that I've gone the longest clear period of my life since Year 1....AND...I'm staying ahead of cancer in the very late stages of what has been a long cancer fight of many years...next year a decade. 

    Who's to say which approach is best. ?

    I find it interesting that sometimes doing nothing - can be something.  I'm winning now in my 8th year by just watching and waiting, than I did any of the other previous years.  My onc is in complete agreement with this approach...we believe you fight...and then you stop...especially, if there is no visible tumor. 

    Supplementing and juicing can't hurt, so that is a viable route to take. 

    As for cannabis, I will tell you right now...that you are onto something.  I've read the same research and it basically says what you said...there are ingredients in cannibis that are known cancer fighters...and that it can prevent cell death and allow the body time to repair the DNA. 

    We're going to be seeing some fascinating studies and results come cannibis in the coming years.  It was always a plant of medicinal value, despite the negative image that it connotates.  It does stimulate appetite in cancer patients, who have a hard time with nutritional intake.  It is a known pain reliever...and works as much on the body as the mind.  When chemo patients are very sick, it's more of a body high than a mental one...and allows the individual to overcome the chemo effects for short periods, where otherwise they might be too sick to sit up and have to be in bed more.

    So, your approach there may yield some interesting benefits....there is something there...and I think we're going to finally see it going mainstream one day as an adjuvant treatment. 

    Like anything else, no single treatment does the trick, but surgery and/or chemo + adjuvant treatments may really be of benefit.

    Here's something else I read...

    Got Milk?

    There was a study done that showed that drinking milk (dairy) also had benefits by delaying cell death to allow the body to repair the DNA of the cell.  Who knew?  Of course, not by itself, but as an adjuvant.

    I found this study very interesting...most of the rectal folks get lactose intolerant and as such, they lose the dairy angle.  And Soy or Rice milk does not provide the same benefits, according to that article.  I've always been able to drink milk....drank alot of it during my last treatment...and still do. 

    Well, I just wanted to invite you over to the Colorectal Board, if you would like to visit and introduce yourself...tell 'em Sundance sent you:)

    Great board here too, but since you are rectal cancer, perhaps you could visit both sites...rectal board would give you more information that pertains to your specific cancer...anal does lapse over with rectal and therefore, both boards may be of benefit to you.

    Just wanted to say hi this morning...I read this...and something told me to come back and talk to you today.

    Take it easy and best of luck with your fight and your treatment decisions.

    -Craig

     

  • Phoebesnow
    Phoebesnow Member Posts: 600 Member
    #7
    Sundance

    Thanks for such a wonderful post.  There have been a number of people popping in lately with serious issues.  I really wonder what happens to them.    I think sometimes they can't find the site again.  On my ataxia support site when u register u check a box that notifies u by e mail when someoneresponds to

     A thread.

     

    Im glad u r doing well!

  • Sundanceh
    Sundanceh Member Posts: 4,392 Member
    #8
    Phoebesnow said:

    Sundance

    Thanks for such a wonderful post.  There have been a number of people popping in lately with serious issues.  I really wonder what happens to them.    I think sometimes they can't find the site again.  On my ataxia support site when u register u check a box that notifies u by e mail when someoneresponds to

     A thread.

     

    Im glad u r doing well!

    Hi Phoebs:)

    I'm doing as well as I can....scan again in a couple of weeks...if clear, that will make 21 mos clear...the longest stretch of clear time in the whole 9-years...one doesn't expect to be winning the battle against cancer in the late stages of the game.

    This story will be worth watching...

    We'll just hope for now:) 

    So nice to see you...you do pop into my mind and I think where is she? LOL!

    Hope you are well, as well.

     

  • mp327
    mp327 Member Posts: 4,440 Member
    #9
    Sundanceh said:

    Will, I Need to Talk to You...

    My name is Craig.  I'm from the Colorectal board.  I visit here, because I know some of the folks here and like to check in with them.

    So, I see that you have rectal cancer.  I would like to encourage you to join the Colorectal Board, as there are alot of folks over there with ostomies (colo & ileo) and they would be a wealth of information that could help you in making your decision.  They have showed me (I was spared by centimeters) that a pretty normal life can be lived, despite the procedure.  It's not without its challenges, but they have really persevered and I think they would make you feel better about things if you talked to some of them.

    And the treatments and outcomes vary with colorectal cancer.  Rate of recurrence is high...and the mortality rate is high as well.  We're talking about the #2 killer cancer in the U.S. and the world.  So, this is not the time to worry about an ostomy.  I was there once and I remember the fear too...when I joined the board and read the stories, they put my mind more at ease, should that ever befall me.  It simply is another way of removing waste than the traditional method.

    And that's all...life is important to fight for...and you seem young to me, man. 

    First, I'm sorry it has happened to you.  I see you did the radiation.  I'm not sure if you have felt the sexual side effects from the treatment.  They don't happen right away...they may play themself out over time...it was a couple of years for me.

    Dysfunction might start...and then things could go dead for awhile.  If you think about a raging forest fire and it had only one way out to burn...and for a man, it is through his penis. So, everything gets burned up in there.  It could even get to be painful to urinate as the tissues try and rebuild.  Erections may be hindered, or unable to achieve.  I found it takes alot of time for that area of a man's body to heal. 

    There's always much discussion among the women, but few men want to talk about it.  That's where I come in.  If ED drugs were an option, a good one to try would be CIALIS...it lasts 36-hours and you can eat on it...and have a drink of two of alcohol without altering its effects.  And 36-hours allows things to happen at a more natural pace, than some of the other Wham-Bang drugs...and lots less face flushing too.

    This may not happen to you, but wanted to put that out there, just in case...

    Lots of alternative talk these days - and one has to run their own race with regards to what they feel is best. 

    I've had cancer 3x now...just three months shy of the 9-year mark right now...I had rectal adeocarcinoma...which spread to liver...which spread to lungs twice.  I've done 51x chemo of all kinds...55x radiation treatments...25 of them in the hips and up the tailpipe with chemo...and 30 more in my right lung with chemo...I've done Cyberknife 3x in the liver...I've had 4-major surgeries...rectal resection / liver RFA / da Vinci robot surgery on the lung (2-wedges removed) / full open throacotomy (7-wedges removed + 2 ribs sawed off).  Follow-up radiation destroyed another 10% of an already compromised lung. 

    I've been able to stay in the fight for a very long time...

    During my fight, I did supplementation...I exercised...ate healthier etc. etc.....and each time, I experienced a recurrence.  Rectal cancer has a much higher recurrence rate than Anal cancer, that's why we're #2 on the list, unfortunately. 

    I've been clear of my last treatment now almost 21-mos....and here's the thing, Will...I'm doing absolutely nothing as a preventive...and the even bigger news IS that I've gone the longest clear period of my life since Year 1....AND...I'm staying ahead of cancer in the very late stages of what has been a long cancer fight of many years...next year a decade. 

    Who's to say which approach is best. ?

    I find it interesting that sometimes doing nothing - can be something.  I'm winning now in my 8th year by just watching and waiting, than I did any of the other previous years.  My onc is in complete agreement with this approach...we believe you fight...and then you stop...especially, if there is no visible tumor. 

    Supplementing and juicing can't hurt, so that is a viable route to take. 

    As for cannabis, I will tell you right now...that you are onto something.  I've read the same research and it basically says what you said...there are ingredients in cannibis that are known cancer fighters...and that it can prevent cell death and allow the body time to repair the DNA. 

    We're going to be seeing some fascinating studies and results come cannibis in the coming years.  It was always a plant of medicinal value, despite the negative image that it connotates.  It does stimulate appetite in cancer patients, who have a hard time with nutritional intake.  It is a known pain reliever...and works as much on the body as the mind.  When chemo patients are very sick, it's more of a body high than a mental one...and allows the individual to overcome the chemo effects for short periods, where otherwise they might be too sick to sit up and have to be in bed more.

    So, your approach there may yield some interesting benefits....there is something there...and I think we're going to finally see it going mainstream one day as an adjuvant treatment. 

    Like anything else, no single treatment does the trick, but surgery and/or chemo + adjuvant treatments may really be of benefit.

    Here's something else I read...

    Got Milk?

    There was a study done that showed that drinking milk (dairy) also had benefits by delaying cell death to allow the body to repair the DNA of the cell.  Who knew?  Of course, not by itself, but as an adjuvant.

    I found this study very interesting...most of the rectal folks get lactose intolerant and as such, they lose the dairy angle.  And Soy or Rice milk does not provide the same benefits, according to that article.  I've always been able to drink milk....drank alot of it during my last treatment...and still do. 

    Well, I just wanted to invite you over to the Colorectal Board, if you would like to visit and introduce yourself...tell 'em Sundance sent you:)

    Great board here too, but since you are rectal cancer, perhaps you could visit both sites...rectal board would give you more information that pertains to your specific cancer...anal does lapse over with rectal and therefore, both boards may be of benefit to you.

    Just wanted to say hi this morning...I read this...and something told me to come back and talk to you today.

    Take it easy and best of luck with your fight and your treatment decisions.

    -Craig

     

    Craig--

    I just have to say that you are amazing!  And I love your ability to always turn a frown upside down, so to speak!

  • Sundanceh
    Sundanceh Member Posts: 4,392 Member
    #10
    mp327 said:

    Craig--

    I just have to say that you are amazing!  And I love your ability to always turn a frown upside down, so to speak!

    Thank U, Martha!

    From Frown   TO   Smile

    LOL!

    -Craig

  • Marynb
    Marynb Member Posts: 1,118
    #11
    Sundanceh said:

    Hi Phoebs:)

    I'm doing as well as I can....scan again in a couple of weeks...if clear, that will make 21 mos clear...the longest stretch of clear time in the whole 9-years...one doesn't expect to be winning the battle against cancer in the late stages of the game.

    This story will be worth watching...

    We'll just hope for now:) 

    So nice to see you...you do pop into my mind and I think where is she? LOL!

    Hope you are well, as well.

     

    Sundance
    Good luck with your next scan! I wish you continued good health! That was a great post. God bless you.

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