Treatments

Kongo said:

Frustrating
Mike,

I sometimes share your frustration. As laymen we frequently look and hope for simple answers to what actually are very complex issues. While the medical community has gained a tremendous amount of knowledge about this disease there is so much we just don't know about all the factors that affect the onset and proliferation of prostate (or any other) cancer.

I wish it weren't so but I have come to believe that NOBODY has all the right answers and that the wide disparity in treatment methodologies put forth by the so-called experts are the result of good, well intentioned people doing the best they can in a very complicated area where so much is a mystery.

Then there are the financial aspects of our treatments which brings into play a whole other set of factors ...

I have come to doubt that there is such a thing as a "cure" for prostate cancer. I think there are many, many indolent cancers that never pose a threat to our health but are often over treated and the management of the side effects becomes a whole other area of study and research. I think those cancers that are not indolent will eventually kill us if something else doesn't get us first and that the whole purpose of much of the treatment today is to curb the growth of our cancers long enough that we live as full and productive lives as possible before we succumb to a more "natural" death like heart disease or a stroke or something similar.

Mortality basically sucks.

K

VascodaGama said:

My take
My take

Cynically thinking prostate cancer is not an acquired disease but a part of our aging process. To have it may be seen as normal as getting grey hair, lost of vision or skin wrinkles. In some those aspects occur earlier and decide to care for the fact and some prefer to accept it as own karma and do nothing. Treatments for PCa therefore are ways to counter the natural behaviour of our systems.

In my view all prostate cancer treatments do not address the real aspects of cure with“elimination” of cancer but as a meaning of prolonging the life of a patient. No matter if such relates to radicals or palliatives. Practically, only cases with focal cancer have a chance at that hypothetical “cure”, and these numbers are the minority if one judges the facts from the results at the ten year mark post treatment. This is the time when the majority of the cases considered as “cured”, are now confronted with recurrences.
In fact in the late 90th it was common to hear that “if recurrence has not occurred within 5 years post therapy, then the patient was cured”. Nevertheless, at present times with long term follow ups, one can see this assertion to be false but more realistic if considered in a period of ten years long.

With no defined way of cure, it is logical that treatments/modalities to deal with the problem are chosen with bases on past experiences. And those are the ones acquired by doctors in their experimental ways of applying therapies. I call it “guessing medicine”. And what has worked in some does not mean that the “guessing” will work in other.
Accordingly, doctors’ responsibility falls short to any event occurring immediately, so guaranties of cure are not required and instead recommendations with practice safeguarding in mind become the standard.
Many factors could be pointed at as the cause of any suffering one would experience later even if all converges to a cause of a treatment. Evident examples are inner strictures and cancer from radiation, or penile atrophy from surgery, or pituitary apoplexy caused by LHRG agonists, or immunodeficiency disorders caused by chemo infusions.

It is understandable therefore, that doctors tend to follow their speciality/trade association guidelines and such differ from “union to union”. We call it biased opinions but some guys got their hands tied to the standards recommended to them. The “bosses” at the hospitals also impose their view with basis on economics which may oblige doctors in prescribing cheaper medications knowing that there are other more reliable to a certain patient.
And then there is the factor with the malicious liaisons of interests by part of pharmaceuticals.

My advice as a layman is that we all should try to understand and know the causes behind any treatment and only accept it after being satisfied with an answer.
Avoiding any possibility at “cure” is an error. Only time can in fact prove any mistake of a decision but one can accept from the very begging the idea that his/her fight is against its own aging process and by such the war will lead to a defeat.

VGama

laserlight said:

cure??
Greetings, another Viet nam vet checking in with prostate cancer, My doctor explained to me when I started treatment that He could not guarantee a Cure. He also indicated that the treatment methods avail are for the most part are to extend life as much as possible. He also said that my cancer will most likely return at some point down the road.

Ralph, I know what you mean when you identify yourself as a Viet Nam vet, I have had people say that they were a vet, but I questioned it and they quickly backed down and went away, could not even say what unit they served in or where they were in country. I think that there is a collective guilt with people our age that didnot serve in the military during Viet Nam era

I do believe that this cancer had to do with my service in Viet Nam, I was there for 18 months and operated thru out the III corp area. I am 62 years old and other people around me my age donot have medical problems. You couple that in with PTSD problems all my life and high blood pressure the stage is set.

All i am doing now is taking it one day at a time and keeping an eye on this. Hang in there all of you.

Kurt

laserlight said:

bien hoa
Mike I operated out of Bien Hoa, I was with the 1st sig bgde. The microwave towers right by there by the in country processing center for the 101 st Airborne and First Cav unit was where I worked out of. This was located right in the center of the the Bien Hoa base camp. I remeber the Green Beret area. I also remeber the air force planes flying over head spraying junk and being informed to stay out of it. I was there for 18 months. This is good I also remeber the Local people spraying this junk around to control the weed growth, This was done right by the billiet areas where we slept. My blood pressure was at the 150 over 90 . The PX was right down the road. I ran into a security guard at work that was with the Seebe unit in the 1970 to 1971 time frame. Thank you for this information, I have filed a claim with the VA and am waiting now. The blood pressure is controlled to a certain point, but is still a problem, I also have problems with shortness of breath, I have to get the doctor to look into. I remeber all of these units we used to steal sandbags from the MP unit on base, It is good to connect up with another person from Bien Hoa, now I feel that I am not alone

Samsungtech1 said:

Bien Hoa
Kurt,
I was at the other end of the base. We liked it there. When the passenger planes landed the vc had a habit of throwing a few motars and rockets down there. There was no passenger center.you landed and got the hell out of there. EveryOne knew what was coming so it was in and out.

Ralph; we had two sets of 105's. They moved them all the time. They always did a cadence count before they opened up so it would warn you. Only one time did they open up without the cadence shots. I think we suffered more injuries than any real rocket attack. It was a disaster, we were in one of our old hooches. Most of the other hooches caught fire during a rocket attack so we built new ones. It was a quarter mile away. No electricity, water, etc. they forgot to tell them we were there so they just opened up. All us short timers were doing the "run like hell.". Dance. It was a massacre. I tripped over a guy who was having an epileptic fit. Stayed with him. I yelled and got a few more guys to help me. It wouldhave gone good with a few Cheech & Chong jokes in thebackground. So much for the macho vets.