Can ascites build up in abdomen within days?

Tina Brown said:

Why don't doctors explain things to us?
I hate it when the doctors don't explain things to us. This is what happened to me:

I had exactly the same bloating as you and last year I begged for a CT scan to see if I had ascites. But like you I didn't. So I thought no more about it and as I was on chemo it went away. This year the bloating came back. It was hard and was convinced again I had ascites. I didn't as I had another scan. SO I ASKED my doctor why my stomach was bloated. He said that it was the cancer. The tiny little cancer cells line the gut - (where the food gets processed and as it passes through to the bowel) cause the whole digestion process to slow down. As it slows down it causes masses of gas / wind. It is this wind and gas that is causing the bloating. Even tiny amounts of food make the bloating worse and it is most un-comfortable.

The constipation is also linked as the large bowel is slowed up due to the activity of the cancer cells.

I too have a very small amount of fluid in my pelvis.

The fact that your CA125 is 6,000 is why you are so bloated. As you may know mine was 1,727 (the highest it has ever been) and after my first infusion the bloating in my stomach miraculously went down and my number also went down to 991. My numbers are now 327 and I am half way through and my stomach is great. No bloating at all

By the way I am on Topotecan

Hope your chemo works as well for you. Tina xxxxxx

AussieMaddie said:

On the improve
Hi Tina,

Since writing the above, I wanted to fill you in on a couple of things.

I hope this may of help to someone else: the cough wasn't allowing me to sleep (on top of the pain caused by the abdominal distension and also getting lots of cramps). Finally distressed by lack of sleep, I rang the after hours number for Palliative Care and the nurse was very helpful. She recommended that I have made up a script for OxyNorm which is mostly codeine (or like that) and, apparently, that represses a cough. Of course, it needs to be an unproductive cough as mine was, but I started to take it and staight away my sleep improved. I was later told that I could also take Pholcodeine (a cough suppressant) with the OxyNorm. Together, they repress the cough very well. As well, the OxyNorm eases the pain in my abdomen and, as codeine is known to do, it helps me to sleep. I wonder if others are familiar with OxyNorm and Pholcodeine to ease a cough.

Today, I learned that there are some brands of cough suppressant that contain different strengths of Pholcodeine, and in greater strength, costing not much more. The first brand, a chemist's generic Pholcodeine has only 5mg of Pholcodeiene in every 5ml. A different brand ("Duro-Tuss Dry Cough Liquid" - there may be others) has 15mg of Pholcodeine in every 5ml - much stronger, and also a larger bottle.

I'm glad that forums such as this can help us to put our hands on products that can be of help to each other.

Thank you Tina for the advice about giving myself the injections. As it turns out, the onclogist informed me while I was at the chemo ward that a special scan showed that I don't have clots at all, so I don't need to give myself the injections - at least for now. It might come up sometime in the future and your advice will come in very handy in that case.

I'm rapt that we can help each other with all these different pieces of advice

Take good care Tina,

AussieMaddie

xxxxx

AussieMaddie said:

Thank you both Ray and Tina
Tina, your story tallies with mine exactly. I'm *terribly* uncomfortable with the degree of distenstion. The oncologist has, to his credit, not just pushed aside my description of my discomfort etc. After taking the first set of scans, he took anothewr set a week later but still cannot see fluid in the abdomen, or in the lung = yet my cough is worse than it was when I was first diagnosed over a year ago. When both sets of scans showed no fluid, he said that he expects the chemo (Taxol/Gemzar, started last week) to ease the symptoms of bloatedness and the discomfort in the abdomen (to the point of keeping on waking me throughout the night). He also had a contrast scan done (injected me with iodine first) to see if I might possibly have small blood clots around my lungs or heart causing the constant, often painful cough. (It feels worse than when I had the ascites the first time around, when it was the fluid causing the cough). Because he can't see fluid, he wants to check other possible reasons for the cough. At present, I'm down to using Ventolin (which sometimes seems to help) and also Panadeine Forte, which has 30mg of codeine in it, which apparently is used to stop an unproductive cough. It also helps one to sleep. I read online that it takes about 45 minutes to take to work. For me, it took over two hours, but then it *did* help and I could sleep for a few hours.

I'm tired all the time because I keep waking either with discomfort around my upper abdomen or else by the cough, so I get to bed as ofte3n as I can.

I haven't been posting much in general online lately beause I havnn't been well. Hope to do so if this Taxol/Gemzar actually *does* have the effects of reducing my bloatedness.

Thank you very much for your excellent advice about the meaning of that Tina. I might show it to my onc.

For now,

Thank you both (((( )))) (And don't worry if I'm less often online at present. Want to sleep whenever I can)

AussieMaddie
xxxx

PS Meant to add that, as a precaution, he wants the nurses at the chemo ward this coming Wednesday, to help me inject myself with "low dose?" heparin, just in case the scans aren't picking up small clots which could be contributing to my cough.

It won't be easy to do. And I'll have to ask the nurses a question that sticks out at me: I know that the injection goes only into the fatty tissue just underneath the skin, but how far below the skin is the peritoneum? Is the fat on top of it? How much so? Might not the syringe ever pass through the peritoneum?

Questions, questions...

AussieMaddie said:

Thank you LaundryQueen
You may well be right about the tumour die off (though they've not found much in the way of tumours - at last scans, the oncologist could only find very little evidence of any tumour nodules in the pelvis and on the omentum.

I wanted to express my sadness for your experience of the Gemzar. I'm now completed my first cycle of Taxol/Gemzar and I really believe that it is already lessening the distension of my abdomen and therefore the constancy of my cough. The only way I will know if that is true is when I have a blood test to check my CA125 level this week prior to getting the results from my oncologist on Saturday.

I'm so sorry that you're having a difficult time with the Gemzar. May I ask what type of symptoms? I found that after 11 cycles previously on Carbo/Taxol that I had very few symptoms. I never did get nauseous, though I did get painful mouth ulcers and cramps and I lost all my hair. Since starting on Taxol/Gemzar, one cycle only so far, I have at times felt a bit yukky and have quickly taken Pramin before it gets worse. A few times, I've started to dry-retch, but put it down to the cough which has been troubling me very much. That seems to have improved in the last day or two (though I shouldn't speak too quickly because it has started to play up just now, preventing me from going back to sleep) I don't remember how quickly it took while on Carbo/Taxol to lose my hair, but my hair isn't falling out yet. One nurse said to expect it to thin and not necessarily to lose it altogether.

One thing I find hardest is that, because my oncologist wants the Taxol/Gemzar infused very slowly, I can't get away from the chemo ward (or the chair, comfortable though it is) for *seven* hours! I have a history of mental illness of a kind that makes it difficult for me to be with other people for more than a few hours at a time, so after seven hours, I'm an emotional mess. I didn't get over that till the following day. And I look to go throught that twice a month while I'm on the Taxol/Gemzar.

I don't know how you are having your Gemzar, whether you are having it with something else, or how often, but I'm having my Taxol/Gemzar in the exact same regimen as I had the Carbo/Taxol - half the total strength on one day, then the second half of the the dose a week later. Then I have two weeks break. I see the oncologist during the off-period for him to check how the CA125 is going.

If you are having much difficulty with your Gemzar, would it help to have it as I do, half the dose in one week, then the second half dose the week after, with two weeks break. It worked very well with the Carbo/Taxol for 11 cycles, till it started to lose its effectiveness.

I seem to have so few side-effects by comparison to others here that I wish I could say something that could be of help to someone else.

Take very good care, LaundryQueen (((( ))))

AussieMaddie

AussieMaddie said:

Thank you WTGWS
The chairs in the chemo ward where I go is busy but I must say that I don't feel that the chairs are too close. No-one talks to the one next to them. The space between us seems to be enough for that. Some people have a visitor stay with them which I find nice when I see it, though I don't miss that.

My distress about spending so long in the ward comes from a problem I've had for very many years. For example, I have done voluntary work for a number of different organizations, mainly helping the elderly, but I always specify that I can't spend more than three hours with them at a time. I am happy to do work to support them when I am home alone, but cannot spend more than the three hours in company. It's always been true and comes from an abuse I experienced as a child. No-one in the chemo ward could possibly know why I becomes so stressed, probably think it's just a typical reaction to sitting for so long having chemo.

As for using the headphones, I wouldn't be without my iPhone (or another smartphone if I didn't have that). The staff let me plug it in so I don't run out of battery charge (I keep with a copy of headphones, a spare charger plug and extension to allow me to extend the iPhone to where I am seated, and the chair that I sit on really is very comfortable - about the only chair in the ward that is for me. Apart from being very big, I have severe arthritis in the bottom of the spine, so that if the weight is on that part of my spine, it hurts me a lot after a while.

I keep on the iPod on my iPhone music that calms me, some episodes of Frasier and will add later episodes of Mike and Molly. I also converted to iPhone the film "Corrina, Corrina" with Whoopi Goldberg. I love nice romances!

Take care,

AussieMaddie

Tina Brown said:

Good to hear from you
Pleased to read your reply and I am so sorry you are still uncomfortable. It is extremely frustrating to have a constant cough and no way of comfort and relief. I hope your oncologist soon gets to the bottom of it all.

Regarding the injection: I have to inject myself with a similar thing to boost my white blood cells. As long as it goes into fatty tissue it doesn't matter where abouts on your tummy it goes. When I was in the hospital last year the nurses used to inject me in different places in my tummy area. So that is what I do now.

1. Find some skin on your tummy that is a bit fatty (that is dead easy for me ha ha )
2. Pinch it
3. Stick the needle straight into it and plunge away.
4. Pull out the needle and rub where it was. This helps to take the sting away.

To be honest it doesn't really hurt and you soon get used to it. The medicine will obviously go where it needs to go.

Take care Tina xxxx