IV Vitamin C

tanstaafl

Kathryn_in_MN said:

Thanks
Thanks Kathy - I did already share that with my nurse navigator.

I don't think I can get anyone to agree with Vit K for me, due to my tendency to blood clots while on chemo with a port (NO past issues whatsoever, and I'm fine when I'm not on chemo and don't have a port in). I'm getting another port Monday and suspect I'll have to go back on Coumadin. This means my Vit K intake has to be very steady day to day. I am going to ask about an alternative to Coumadin (but not Lovenox shots). I'm interested in seeing if Plavix may be an option for me.

special K
This means my Vit K intake has to be very steady day to day.
At low levels of vitamin K, this true. Since vitamin K's clotting effect is supposed to be an effect that can be saturated, the question is whether there is any important difference at higher, therapeutic levels whether 30-45-60 mg per day for the particular form of vit K is used, above "saturation". It will be important to hear if they can offer an acceptable thinner.

I am not sure whether you object to the injections, the costs or something else on Lovenox. This port discussion goes beyond my wife's experience because her only IV treatment (arms, ankles) is IV vitamin C so far, everything else is oral.

peterz54

steved said:

Self promotion
I am sorry but I don't think this is an appropriate site for self promotion and advertisement of your products. It may be well intended, but as a support site I am not sure simply promoting your book and protocol is appropriate.

steve

Sparseness of evidence
I have to agree with steved at this point

I've spent several days part time going over published reports on IV vitamin C usage. I've seen the original Pauling comparison from 1976 which inidicated that Vitamin C pateints lived longer, but haven't had time to search out critiques to find out if there were flaws.

The most recent work I found was a McGill U phase I study which was done to recommend dosage for phase II, but they also observed no effect on the tumors. This cold be tdue to the study time being too short, not sure. Also, not sure if anyone ever followed the patients beyond the time they were on IV C for the study.


Am I missing something? I see anecdotal evidence on this site. I see suggestive clinical observations in the literature, but nothing at all in the way of controlled studies beyond the mCGill 2008 study. I have found a nearby clinic which will provide IV C and will address these concerns withem as well.

I have emailed the Rirdan clinic about their view of the McGill study but no response yet.

If anyone here can point to controlled studies which show longevity enhancements or tumor regession, due to IV C please post.

thanks,

peter

tanstaafl

Michael J said:

IV Vitamin C
Dear Friends:
There is a protocol published in Pubmed by our group. Also please check Gonzalez MJ et al and Vitamin C in pubmed. There is also a book "I have cancer what should I do?", available at Amazon.com

clarification and context
"Our group" I believe is the Riordan Clinic in Wichita Kansas, previously known as The Center for the Improvement of Human Functioning or the Brightspot Clinic, which begat the University of Kansas trials and similar IV C protocol. These protocols more explicitly test G6PD upfront, include magnesium, and work up to full dosage over several infusions, and are the closest to a formally accepted IV vitamin C protocol developed for the general population with safety features for even the rare population segments with potential for adverse effects.

Drs Robert Cathcart and Robert Levy are other major transmitters of IV vitamin C administration technology without extras like Myer or Manner. I don't know the provenance of the German derived protocol that Kathy (LuvinLife2) mentioned earlier

tanstaafl

peterz54 said:

Sparseness of evidence
I have to agree with steved at this point

I've spent several days part time going over published reports on IV vitamin C usage. I've seen the original Pauling comparison from 1976 which inidicated that Vitamin C pateints lived longer, but haven't had time to search out critiques to find out if there were flaws.

The most recent work I found was a McGill U phase I study which was done to recommend dosage for phase II, but they also observed no effect on the tumors. This cold be tdue to the study time being too short, not sure. Also, not sure if anyone ever followed the patients beyond the time they were on IV C for the study.


Am I missing something? I see anecdotal evidence on this site. I see suggestive clinical observations in the literature, but nothing at all in the way of controlled studies beyond the mCGill 2008 study. I have found a nearby clinic which will provide IV C and will address these concerns withem as well.

I have emailed the Rirdan clinic about their view of the McGill study but no response yet.

If anyone here can point to controlled studies which show longevity enhancements or tumor regession, due to IV C please post.

thanks,

peter

sparse
IV vitamin C development is primarily observational and clinical in nature under adverse conditions. The whole area was pointedly ignored or dismissed out of hand since at least the 1950s without any support for clinical tests until U Kansas, ca 2006. The 1930s if you count the Jungeblut-Sabin episode. The Mayo-Moertel trials extended this lack of investigation record to trial subversion and open attack.

It should be noted that there are several kinds of IV vitamin C solutions that have distinct physiological differences. Sodium ascorbate, pH~7.4, seems to be preferred to (highly) buffered ascorbic, pH~7, for comfort and vein preservation. Included magnesium salts are important for comfort and vein preservation. Preservatives are an important area of note and clinical impact for injectables made from commercial liquid sources, whether sulfites in older conventional ampules or other redox poising agents that maintain a lack of color and may interfere therapeutically. The dehydroxy C content, noticeable yellow to brown colors with content increased by oxygen contact and aging of pure ascrobate solutions, may be important. Dehydroxy C appears more toxic to cancer cells but has fundamental application limits for quantity.

lepperl

Iv vitamin C
I did it but have tapered off. I will start again if I am ever NED to try to keep the cancer away. After being on it several months I think it is more preventative than curative. But I do feel great and some people swear by it. I am doing apatone instead but I think you already know this from the colon club. I know unfortunatly that is not an option for you. The university of Kansas department of oncology is doing a study on vitamin C right now. My integrative Dr. gave me lots of good info on it. I don't know how to forward it to youat this site but if you have an email address I can forward you the email she sent me. It has the protocol in it for the study in Kansas so if you take a copy to your Dr.you can do it without going to kansas.

luvinlife2

tanstaafl said:

Thanks for sharing that,
Thanks for sharing that, Kathy. The irinotecan report is especially important. I assume that "Vitamin K" is menadione (K3) or menadiol (K4) for water solubility, used in the 30-90 mg range, although K1 is possible. Can you tell us more specifics?

..lot of US clients that fly to Canada for treatments at my little clinic
The US FDA has made IV vitamin C harder to get by interfering with previously nationally distributed liquid ascorbate supplies, by intimidating manufacturers to stop with aggressive (abusive) claims of authority. The FDA's first strike doubled the price of ascorbate solution and probably more than halved its market, I'm not sure where things are now.

K3
Sorry for the delayed response. I'm not here that often and I forget a lot. Finally did remember though

Kathy