Chemo resistant tumors

maggie_wilson

LaundryQueen said:

Immunity Therapy Center
This clinic offers stem cell therapy, hyperthermia & sonobionic therapy. I've been looking into these therapies individually and I would have to travel to China or Korea if they were not available in Mexico. The program is for 3 weeks.

I guess it is just a leap of faith for me as there are no guarantees for someone with late-stage ovarian cancer--especially with an aggressive case like mine.

LQ

laundry queen
i, too, think it's great that you're going to mexico for alternative treatment. i'm hoping it works miracles. please let us know how you are and how you're doing when you return.

best of luck,

sisterhood,
maggie

maggie_wilson

Tethys41 said:

Mexico
LQ,
I went to Tijuana for treatment. Which hospital are you considering? I went to Oasis of Hope

tethys4l
do you feel you were helped by the treatment you received at oasis of hope? do you mind saying what that treatment was? hoping for the best for you.

sisterhood,
maggie

maggie_wilson

Tethys41 said:

Doctor's consent
Maggie,
I don't know of any requirement for your oncologist to give consent for vitamin C IVs. Personally, my oncologist has tried to talk me out of it on multiple occasions and certainly never gave consent. Unless laws differ in various states, you should not need your oncologist's consent.

tethys4l
i was reading a book recommended by commonweal, cancer help program in bolinas california, where my partner and i went for a week. it was a retreat, not a treatment center, but it combined all kinds of therapy from sand tray to group therapy, yoga, massage, delicious, healthy food, etc., every day. i read in the book "i have cancer, what should i do?" written a couple of years ago, which explains cancer, nutrition, supplements, high dose vitc c,, and it was there i'd read that most places require that you sign a waiver that your doctor agrees to this treatment.

i kinda hope you're right; i don't want to have to have my doctor's consent to have any alternative treatment. i don't ask her about having acupuncture, for example, or seeing the shaman i went to several times (charismatic guy, too expensive, and too dogmatic.) i will talk to her about it, and hopefully she'll be ok with it, just because i want her to be on the same page as me. i'm determined to find out more about it, no matter what, however.

sisterhood,
maggie

carolenk

LaundryQueen said:

Immunity Therapy Center
This clinic offers stem cell therapy, hyperthermia & sonobionic therapy. I've been looking into these therapies individually and I would have to travel to China or Korea if they were not available in Mexico. The program is for 3 weeks.

I guess it is just a leap of faith for me as there are no guarantees for someone with late-stage ovarian cancer--especially with an aggressive case like mine.

LQ

Sonodynamic therapy
LQ

I couldn't find any info on sonobionic therapy--I did find info on sonodynamic therapy (used to blast malignant cells with ultrasound). Let me know if maybe it's sonodynamic therapy you are seeking.

(((hugs)))

Carolen

maggie_wilson

carolenk said:

Delayed chemo treatments
Dear Maggie

Just wanted to let you know that I had to take a couple of breaks while I was doing chemo--once was for 7 weeks after I had a bad reaction to taxol and then again for 3 weeks while my neutrophils were too low for treatment. Even though I was not doing chemo for those two breaks, the CA-125 continued to decline. I don't know if that is unusual or not.

Carolen

carolen
thanx for your comment. i too have had a couple of breaks. i developed a small intestinal blockage after my first chemo this time, and it did not resolve itself, like it did when i had this before--apparently chemo kicks this off for me! so i had to have surgery, and was away from chemo for over 3 weeks, and my ca 125 went down amazingly. so i guess taking breaks now and then doesn't affect the ca 125 that much. on the other hand, evertheoptomist on the uterine cancer site, i think, makes a good case for dose dense chemo, like with anti-biotics--she had 18 weeks of straight chemo, no breaks. her thinking was that breaks give our bodies time to recover, but also gives cancer time to regroup. still, both your ca 125 and mine declined after fairly long breaks. so, who knows?

again, thanks for your response.

sisterhood,
maggie

dreamer007

maggie_wilson said:

carolen
thanx for your comment. i too have had a couple of breaks. i developed a small intestinal blockage after my first chemo this time, and it did not resolve itself, like it did when i had this before--apparently chemo kicks this off for me! so i had to have surgery, and was away from chemo for over 3 weeks, and my ca 125 went down amazingly. so i guess taking breaks now and then doesn't affect the ca 125 that much. on the other hand, evertheoptomist on the uterine cancer site, i think, makes a good case for dose dense chemo, like with anti-biotics--she had 18 weeks of straight chemo, no breaks. her thinking was that breaks give our bodies time to recover, but also gives cancer time to regroup. still, both your ca 125 and mine declined after fairly long breaks. so, who knows?

again, thanks for your response.

sisterhood,
maggie

chemo resistant tumors
Very interesting and informative thread!

I started out my chemo treatments with taxol/carbo, but after the 4th one, the tumors
became resistant to taxol. The doctor switched to gemzar/carbo for the rest of the
way, and got me to remission. I just got checked out in July with a CT, which showed
no masses.

I have a very funky "intestinal fortitude", so the chemo was difficult from the beginning.
Took the usual zofran, marinol, promethazine for nausea, which helped, esp with
chemo #2 and 3. After chemo #4, I had a serious case of indigestion, which landed
me in the hospital again ( had to go for two day hospital stay after the first one, too ).
Not being able to eat much or even drink water, plus the spewing is why I had to be
admitted. I needed IVs and some pain meds, potassium. And BTW, if anyone has
had potassium IV, that hurts like HELL!!!
They tried to get me to swallow a huge potassium pill, which i knew was going to
start me spewing, but I tried it anyway. BIG mistake. After that last hospital stay,
I knew it was better I avoid that, due to them not understanding my digestive problems
that are not related to having cancer.

Both times I was hospitalized, I ended up going home with a serious migraine, which
kept coming back for 4 days. My migraines are primarily due to food sensitivities/allergies.
Sorry I am digressing here a bit.
I was a little surprised that I got a doozy migraine, right before my endoscopy procedure,
which I had in February. I did not take any of my meds or herbs, because I figured that
fasting is fasting. Never will do that again!!!!!

I have taken a 1000mg Vit C capsule for 30+ years, and wonder if that has helped me
get to a good point= remission. I guess it doesnt hurt, but there are so many other
factors, I do not believe it is the only thing. Could be wrong, but ....

One more thing. When they switched my chemo to gemzar, I had to have blood transfusions
over two days, approximately two weeks after chemo. I got used to it, and at that point
is when my WARRIOR part kicked in. I think most people who go thru cancer become
Warriors. We have to!!!!

dreamer

Tethys41

maggie_wilson said:

tethys4l
i was reading a book recommended by commonweal, cancer help program in bolinas california, where my partner and i went for a week. it was a retreat, not a treatment center, but it combined all kinds of therapy from sand tray to group therapy, yoga, massage, delicious, healthy food, etc., every day. i read in the book "i have cancer, what should i do?" written a couple of years ago, which explains cancer, nutrition, supplements, high dose vitc c,, and it was there i'd read that most places require that you sign a waiver that your doctor agrees to this treatment.

i kinda hope you're right; i don't want to have to have my doctor's consent to have any alternative treatment. i don't ask her about having acupuncture, for example, or seeing the shaman i went to several times (charismatic guy, too expensive, and too dogmatic.) i will talk to her about it, and hopefully she'll be ok with it, just because i want her to be on the same page as me. i'm determined to find out more about it, no matter what, however.

sisterhood,
maggie

Vitamin C
Maggie,
Do I remember you saying you're in California? I had my surgery and started chemo in CA. I worked with a naturopath near Palm Springs and she was able to administer the IVC without doctor's consent. Additionally, naturopaths in CA are licensed and are therefore authorized to write prescriptions and order tests and procedures.

Tethys41

maggie_wilson said:

tethys4l
do you feel you were helped by the treatment you received at oasis of hope? do you mind saying what that treatment was? hoping for the best for you.

sisterhood,
maggie

Mexico
I definitely feel the treatments in Mexico helped. I have learned since then that I could receive most of the treatments I received there, here in the U.S. I had numerous IVs (4 to 6 daily), IV vitamin C, IV vitamin K, nutritional IVs, ozone therapy, UV therapy, a drug (unavailable in the U.S.) called Perftec, and leatril. Not to mention a smorgasboard of supplements. If I had had all the time in the world, I may have been able to compile most of these and done these treatments domestically, but I would not have known what combinatin of treatments would best help me, and they would not have been administered at such a intensity as they were there. The program I did was one they recommend to an ovarian cancer patient who is undergoing chemo. They are able to treat many cancers at that hospital without chemo, but they said their experience with OVCA has shwn better results if chemo is incorporated in the treatment program.

dreamer007

maggie_wilson said:

carolen
thanx for your comment. i too have had a couple of breaks. i developed a small intestinal blockage after my first chemo this time, and it did not resolve itself, like it did when i had this before--apparently chemo kicks this off for me! so i had to have surgery, and was away from chemo for over 3 weeks, and my ca 125 went down amazingly. so i guess taking breaks now and then doesn't affect the ca 125 that much. on the other hand, evertheoptomist on the uterine cancer site, i think, makes a good case for dose dense chemo, like with anti-biotics--she had 18 weeks of straight chemo, no breaks. her thinking was that breaks give our bodies time to recover, but also gives cancer time to regroup. still, both your ca 125 and mine declined after fairly long breaks. so, who knows?

again, thanks for your response.

sisterhood,
maggie

chemo resistant tumors
oops, double posting
had to delete

LaundryQueen

dreamer007 said:

chemo resistant tumors
Very interesting and informative thread!

I started out my chemo treatments with taxol/carbo, but after the 4th one, the tumors
became resistant to taxol. The doctor switched to gemzar/carbo for the rest of the
way, and got me to remission. I just got checked out in July with a CT, which showed
no masses.

I have a very funky "intestinal fortitude", so the chemo was difficult from the beginning.
Took the usual zofran, marinol, promethazine for nausea, which helped, esp with
chemo #2 and 3. After chemo #4, I had a serious case of indigestion, which landed
me in the hospital again ( had to go for two day hospital stay after the first one, too ).
Not being able to eat much or even drink water, plus the spewing is why I had to be
admitted. I needed IVs and some pain meds, potassium. And BTW, if anyone has
had potassium IV, that hurts like HELL!!!
They tried to get me to swallow a huge potassium pill, which i knew was going to
start me spewing, but I tried it anyway. BIG mistake. After that last hospital stay,
I knew it was better I avoid that, due to them not understanding my digestive problems
that are not related to having cancer.

Both times I was hospitalized, I ended up going home with a serious migraine, which
kept coming back for 4 days. My migraines are primarily due to food sensitivities/allergies.
Sorry I am digressing here a bit.
I was a little surprised that I got a doozy migraine, right before my endoscopy procedure,
which I had in February. I did not take any of my meds or herbs, because I figured that
fasting is fasting. Never will do that again!!!!!

I have taken a 1000mg Vit C capsule for 30+ years, and wonder if that has helped me
get to a good point= remission. I guess it doesnt hurt, but there are so many other
factors, I do not believe it is the only thing. Could be wrong, but ....

One more thing. When they switched my chemo to gemzar, I had to have blood transfusions
over two days, approximately two weeks after chemo. I got used to it, and at that point
is when my WARRIOR part kicked in. I think most people who go thru cancer become
Warriors. We have to!!!!

dreamer

Taxol resistance
dreamer: When you are being given 2 chemo drugs, how can the doctor tell WHICH one is not working?

I must be lacking in Warrior energy as my cancer likes me too much to leave me.

LQ

Tethys41

LaundryQueen said:

Taxol resistance
dreamer: When you are being given 2 chemo drugs, how can the doctor tell WHICH one is not working?

I must be lacking in Warrior energy as my cancer likes me too much to leave me.

LQ

Warrior
LQ,
You just need to hit it when it's not looking.

LaundryQueen

carolenk said:

Sonodynamic therapy
LQ

I couldn't find any info on sonobionic therapy--I did find info on sonodynamic therapy (used to blast malignant cells with ultrasound). Let me know if maybe it's sonodynamic therapy you are seeking.

(((hugs)))

Carolen

SDT & PDT
@Carolen: Yes, yes (you gotta make sure I get the story straight, don't ya?) the therapy IS called "sonodynamic" and the other, similar therapy is "photodynamic therapy" where, instead of using ultrasound, light/laser is used to react wtih the sensitizer to disintegrate the malignant cells. Light only penetrates to a certain depth in the body so I'll be better off with the SDT. I found out the CT scan of my brain reported that I have "mild, diffuse atrophy" but I do alright most of the time--all things considered.

@Tethys: Yes, I will have to whack that cancer when it isn't looking...I'll just tell it we're all going down to have a good time at a "health retreat" in Mexico...hahahahaha!

LQ

LaundryQueen

Tethys41 said:

Mexico
I definitely feel the treatments in Mexico helped. I have learned since then that I could receive most of the treatments I received there, here in the U.S. I had numerous IVs (4 to 6 daily), IV vitamin C, IV vitamin K, nutritional IVs, ozone therapy, UV therapy, a drug (unavailable in the U.S.) called Perftec, and leatril. Not to mention a smorgasboard of supplements. If I had had all the time in the world, I may have been able to compile most of these and done these treatments domestically, but I would not have known what combinatin of treatments would best help me, and they would not have been administered at such a intensity as they were there. The program I did was one they recommend to an ovarian cancer patient who is undergoing chemo. They are able to treat many cancers at that hospital without chemo, but they said their experience with OVCA has shwn better results if chemo is incorporated in the treatment program.

Insulin-potentiated chemo
@Tethys: If the doctor at the Immunity Therapy Center decides that I need chemo, it will be the insulin-potentiated (IPT) chemo that uses one tenth of the dose of the usual chemo. IPT is tricky to administer and requires the doctor to be on site while the patient is being treated. I am already still carrying a lot of platinum in my body and would like to add as little as possible to that burden.

I am hoping to have my T-cells "re-educated" at this clinic as I am not responding to the dendritic cell vaccine that I've been taking. Hopefully, when I return, I can resume the vaccine with a better response.

LQ

dreamer007

LaundryQueen said:

Taxol resistance
dreamer: When you are being given 2 chemo drugs, how can the doctor tell WHICH one is not working?

I must be lacking in Warrior energy as my cancer likes me too much to leave me.

LQ

chemo resistant tumors
Hey LQ,

you got me thinking about how the onc docs figure out what chemo meds to
use, so i did a little research, and found this link

http://globaloptimalhealth.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=150:cancer-chemotherapy&catid=1:cancer&Itemid=32

i am going to ask some of the onc nurses about how the docs figure chemo meds out,
next time i go for a lab draw/port flush...i think its a very good question!

as far as being a warrior, i think you probably are one, cuz you are still fighting
and still kicking it around!!!!
i think almost every cancer patient thinks that "this is it", i cant go on with this crap,
and i surely did think that a few times, while doing chemo.... its like that saying:
"its not how many times you fall down, its how many times you get up"

for the most part, i never really thought i was not going to beat this stuff... just a feeling,
or hunch, or maybe just a fighting spirit.... i had to tell myself on several occasions that
there was a short window of opportunity to get this under control, when i wanted to take
a LONG break from chemo... just sort of rationalized things

dreamer

LaundryQueen

dreamer007 said:

chemo resistant tumors
Hey LQ,

you got me thinking about how the onc docs figure out what chemo meds to
use, so i did a little research, and found this link

http://globaloptimalhealth.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=150:cancer-chemotherapy&catid=1:cancer&Itemid=32

i am going to ask some of the onc nurses about how the docs figure chemo meds out,
next time i go for a lab draw/port flush...i think its a very good question!

as far as being a warrior, i think you probably are one, cuz you are still fighting
and still kicking it around!!!!
i think almost every cancer patient thinks that "this is it", i cant go on with this crap,
and i surely did think that a few times, while doing chemo.... its like that saying:
"its not how many times you fall down, its how many times you get up"

for the most part, i never really thought i was not going to beat this stuff... just a feeling,
or hunch, or maybe just a fighting spirit.... i had to tell myself on several occasions that
there was a short window of opportunity to get this under control, when i wanted to take
a LONG break from chemo... just sort of rationalized things

dreamer

That link is amazing!
Dreamer: Thanks for sharing that link! That site has almost too much information for me but it was very interesting. I would love to take a long break from chemo, too.

LQ

gdpawel

Platinum Resistance
Tethys

Platinum resistance is just a clinical term applied to those who relapse within 6 months of platinum-based therapy, based on some population based studies. Even in those patients who relapse within 6 months, platinum-based combinations may prove effective if they play upon the "resistance" mechanisms deemed operative.

For example: Gemzar (gemcitabine) and gemcitabine-based combinations, including gemcitabine + platinum combinations can circumvent tumor cell resistance to platinum in some cases by preventing the tumor cells from repairing platinum-induced DNA damage.

Not all patients derive benefit from gemcitabine + platinum administered on an empiric basis, because it only works against some tumors. But when it works, it often works very well.

Tethys41

gdpawel said:

Platinum Resistance
Tethys

Platinum resistance is just a clinical term applied to those who relapse within 6 months of platinum-based therapy, based on some population based studies. Even in those patients who relapse within 6 months, platinum-based combinations may prove effective if they play upon the "resistance" mechanisms deemed operative.

For example: Gemzar (gemcitabine) and gemcitabine-based combinations, including gemcitabine + platinum combinations can circumvent tumor cell resistance to platinum in some cases by preventing the tumor cells from repairing platinum-induced DNA damage.

Not all patients derive benefit from gemcitabine + platinum administered on an empiric basis, because it only works against some tumors. But when it works, it often works very well.

Thanks
Thanks for the clarification gd.