When illnesses collide
**** The following is probably more venting than anything else so it's ok to not read further if you're feeling down yourself *****
.............................
I can think of no other area to place this in, so here goes.
I have peritoneal cancer, so far all is going very well. Still responding well to Carbo/Taxol with oncologist determining my progress each month only by my CA125 marker - oriinally 13,000+ down last time to 17. I should be rapt! And to that extent I am, but other things are equally a worry for me and choices I would like to make to be free of another life-disabling condition is stopped because my cancer is where it is.
Just when I was in hospital having been told of the cancer, I was to have seen another specialist in bariatric surgery at a different hospital. Had to cancel that appointment. Told "They're not going to operate on an area of the body where the cancer is". But binge eating is a very serious problem for me, making me so morbidly obese that I am disabled by it - not to mention the added risks to my health.
To say to me "Just stop overeating" is pointless. Binge eating disorder, like anorexia and bulimia, is a psychiatric problem and doesn't go away so easily. I've been seeing psychiatrists all my life. I've given up on being free of psychiatric problems before the cancer takes me. I just don't want my increasing morbid obesity to take from me more of my quality of life than I would have done (in time) with the cancer itself.
So, I'd like to proceed with the surgery to reduce the size of my stomach. Has anyone else at all had the experience, or know someone who has had the experience of having such surgery while having peritoneal cancer as well?? The surgery I'm talking about is not lap banding (for which I don't qualify as a binge eater) but a bypass operation which would see them cut my stomach in half essentially, making food pass through without being absorbed.
I'm terribly sorry if my words seem to fly in the face of the terrible experience of so many here for whom chemo keeps them constantly nauseous and unable to eat. I would say that I'm the only one who might have benefitted from that nausea, but I've also been told that it is not something I would want to inflict on my worst enemy.
So, I am at a loss. I'd love to know if anyone has heard of such weight loss surgery (bypass surgery) performed when they have this cancer. Surely, I can't be the only one with cancer who happens also to be morbidly obese? Since I don't experience the nausea, I've put on over 30kg since I got the cancer. And that's very typical for me. What's more, it's going up.
It really is all about quallity of life.
I'm taking Duromine to help with the bingeing. Not sue if it's helping because I somtimes forget to take it, but I have noticed that I'm not putting on weight as quickly as I was. I had previously taken Reductil. Lost 42kg. Reductil lost effect (and got banned here in Australia) and I immediately put on 32kg - of which they found 10kg was fluid (ie cancer)
I'm venting. Do you know that I've never once felt frightened by having cancer. A lifetime of mental illness has left me feeling that I can deal with anything. Of all the things I'd most not like to deal with, is disabling obesity.
If they cut my head off, they'd fix everything in one fell swoop - I'd lose weight as well as the psychological problems that reside in my head. And without a head, I wouldn't worry about the cancer either.
I keep wnting to swap my head with anyone else but so far there have been no takers.
Thanks,
AussieMaddie
Comments
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Hi
I don't have an answer to your questions, but I wanted to say hi and welcome to the board. This is a great place to rant, ask questions and get info. There a few people here with your type of cancer. I am sorry you are tormented with your situation. Just remember to stay strong. Believe in yourself, I know u can.0 -
Welcome!jbeans888 said:Hi
I don't have an answer to your questions, but I wanted to say hi and welcome to the board. This is a great place to rant, ask questions and get info. There a few people here with your type of cancer. I am sorry you are tormented with your situation. Just remember to stay strong. Believe in yourself, I know u can.
Dear AussieMaddie
Your situation is certainly unusual. I appreciate your predicament and no one else has shared such a story so I don't know if you will find any answers here.
Thank you for sharing your story. Perhaps EFT could help you. Someone recently posted info about EFT on this discussion board--it is a self-help technique for all kinds of issues maybe you can keep your head after all.
(((HUGS)))
Carolen0 -
Welcome!jbeans888 said:Hi
I don't have an answer to your questions, but I wanted to say hi and welcome to the board. This is a great place to rant, ask questions and get info. There a few people here with your type of cancer. I am sorry you are tormented with your situation. Just remember to stay strong. Believe in yourself, I know u can.
Double post, sorry!0 -
Welcome!jbeans888 said:Hi
I don't have an answer to your questions, but I wanted to say hi and welcome to the board. This is a great place to rant, ask questions and get info. There a few people here with your type of cancer. I am sorry you are tormented with your situation. Just remember to stay strong. Believe in yourself, I know u can.
Dear AussieMaddie
Double post, sorry!0 -
Aussiecarolenk said:Welcome!
Dear AussieMaddie
Your situation is certainly unusual. I appreciate your predicament and no one else has shared such a story so I don't know if you will find any answers here.
Thank you for sharing your story. Perhaps EFT could help you. Someone recently posted info about EFT on this discussion board--it is a self-help technique for all kinds of issues maybe you can keep your head after all.
(((HUGS)))
Carolen
maybe you could have your oncologist and your bariatric surgeon have a consult and see what can be done to help you. Good luck..val0 -
Thank youjbeans888 said:Hi
I don't have an answer to your questions, but I wanted to say hi and welcome to the board. This is a great place to rant, ask questions and get info. There a few people here with your type of cancer. I am sorry you are tormented with your situation. Just remember to stay strong. Believe in yourself, I know u can.
Hi jbeans, carole and poopergirl
thank you very much for responding to my unusual post. At times I really do feel like venting, and scream at the unfairness of things. But then, probably most of us do who on these boards. Mine's just a different take on things. Sometimes I worry that it leaves me less available for others here, but I do care about the pain experienced by all those who must endure the horrors of cancer and its treatments. Double double yuk!
Hugs to you all (((( ))))
AussieMaddie0 -
Hello AussieMaddie
I too have PPC. I am so sorry to read about your sadness and depression that seems to be rooted in your eating disorder. I understand how you feel about being overweight. Eventhough I am not obese myself (I am now 2 stone overweight) I have battled with my weight all of my adult life. I am now the biggest I have ever been and it makes me so upset and miserable.
My PPC has made me change my life and thus I can not do the exercise I used to enjoy that helped me to keep my weight down. Also the steroids they give with the chemo has caused me to put on the weight and I cannot lose it. I have tried to diet and after 4 weeks I had lost 2 pounds and then put it back on again.
I have also suffered with depression and to cut a long story short this has prevented me from being scared of dying through my cancer. I am able to cope with my cancer diagnosis as the thing that caused my depression is much more painful.
I know your pain and I really hope you can have your operation as this will be a start to helping you. I live in the UK & have not heard of anyone having bariatric (sp) surgery when they have our cancer.
Take care Tina xx0 -
Again, thank youTina Brown said:Hello AussieMaddie
I too have PPC. I am so sorry to read about your sadness and depression that seems to be rooted in your eating disorder. I understand how you feel about being overweight. Eventhough I am not obese myself (I am now 2 stone overweight) I have battled with my weight all of my adult life. I am now the biggest I have ever been and it makes me so upset and miserable.
My PPC has made me change my life and thus I can not do the exercise I used to enjoy that helped me to keep my weight down. Also the steroids they give with the chemo has caused me to put on the weight and I cannot lose it. I have tried to diet and after 4 weeks I had lost 2 pounds and then put it back on again.
I have also suffered with depression and to cut a long story short this has prevented me from being scared of dying through my cancer. I am able to cope with my cancer diagnosis as the thing that caused my depression is much more painful.
I know your pain and I really hope you can have your operation as this will be a start to helping you. I live in the UK & have not heard of anyone having bariatric (sp) surgery when they have our cancer.
Take care Tina xx
Tina,
your reply touches me greatly. Have you ever associated your depession with the difficulty of keeping off the weight, or have you only been overweight since being on the steroids for the cancer?
The only tablets I was given to take after chemo that put on weight was the Dexamethasone. They were to prevent nausea. I took them the first couple of times but found that I didn't need any nausea tablets as I never get nauseous.
My own battle with weight totally falls into the psych category. I've never been able to lose weight without immediately putting it back on again.
If it helps you at all, my GP as well as my oncologist said it was ok for me to take Duromine to help control my overeating - *if* that's the cause of your overweight. If it's just the steroids, I wonder if they can substitute them for a different type of medication? Just a thought.
I'm glad that you don't have such a big problem with weight as I do. When you are so big that it is disabling, it can cause one to feel terribly depressed, and unable to do simple things, even like tying one's shoelaces. (I always wear slip-ons). And socially, it's completely discriminated against. I can't change society. I can only do my best to lose weight. I will talk to both my oncologist and the weight loss specialist that I was to have seen just before I got the cancer and see if anything can be done.
I particularly like what you said in a previous post Tina - about accepting where you are at. That really rang a bell for me too
For now,
AussieMaddy0 -
Hi AussieMaddyAussieMaddie said:Again, thank you
Tina,
your reply touches me greatly. Have you ever associated your depession with the difficulty of keeping off the weight, or have you only been overweight since being on the steroids for the cancer?
The only tablets I was given to take after chemo that put on weight was the Dexamethasone. They were to prevent nausea. I took them the first couple of times but found that I didn't need any nausea tablets as I never get nauseous.
My own battle with weight totally falls into the psych category. I've never been able to lose weight without immediately putting it back on again.
If it helps you at all, my GP as well as my oncologist said it was ok for me to take Duromine to help control my overeating - *if* that's the cause of your overweight. If it's just the steroids, I wonder if they can substitute them for a different type of medication? Just a thought.
I'm glad that you don't have such a big problem with weight as I do. When you are so big that it is disabling, it can cause one to feel terribly depressed, and unable to do simple things, even like tying one's shoelaces. (I always wear slip-ons). And socially, it's completely discriminated against. I can't change society. I can only do my best to lose weight. I will talk to both my oncologist and the weight loss specialist that I was to have seen just before I got the cancer and see if anything can be done.
I particularly like what you said in a previous post Tina - about accepting where you are at. That really rang a bell for me too
For now,
AussieMaddy
I've battled with my weight most of my adult life. I have only ever been 1 - 2 stone overweight, and to be honest I guess I am not particulary big, but I still don't like how I look. I went on a good controlled diet the year before I was diagnosed and got down to 9 1/2 stone which I loved. I used to run and swim and liked the way I looked. When I got cancer I became inactive and would comfort myself with wine and food as I felt bad. As you know it then became a vicious circle and now I feel that cancer has completely ruined my life and all I have now is good food and wine.
I am aware of this and have tried to return to my slimming club but the weight will not come off as it did before.
I find I am suffering with back pain, I look ghastly in my clothes, I cannot run as I get out of breath etc. I am thinking about resumming my slimming club and just sticking it out and hope that eventually I will get some weight loss.
I do accept my NEW life (I don't like it) as I have no other choice and so it is up to me to make it a good life.
Take care Love Tina xxxxx0 -
You too??Tina Brown said:Hi AussieMaddy
I've battled with my weight most of my adult life. I have only ever been 1 - 2 stone overweight, and to be honest I guess I am not particulary big, but I still don't like how I look. I went on a good controlled diet the year before I was diagnosed and got down to 9 1/2 stone which I loved. I used to run and swim and liked the way I looked. When I got cancer I became inactive and would comfort myself with wine and food as I felt bad. As you know it then became a vicious circle and now I feel that cancer has completely ruined my life and all I have now is good food and wine.
I am aware of this and have tried to return to my slimming club but the weight will not come off as it did before.
I find I am suffering with back pain, I look ghastly in my clothes, I cannot run as I get out of breath etc. I am thinking about resumming my slimming club and just sticking it out and hope that eventually I will get some weight loss.
I do accept my NEW life (I don't like it) as I have no other choice and so it is up to me to make it a good life.
Take care Love Tina xxxxx
Hi Tina,
I feel your despair. I'm so sorry. I don't have answers to help you and I wish that I did. Do you think you might come eventually to be able to look at your extra weight - and the discomfort and changes that it brings - with the sort of acceptance which you bring to your cancer? Have you ever done any kind of meditation in which you can let go of worry about your body? Often, the more we worry about eating, the more we are likely to overeat. I know that there are some very effective forms of meditation that can help one to do let go of such worry, though I cannot use them myself. The nature of my psych problem makes meditation a much harder thing, but I have achieved it in brief moments.
On re-reading your earlier post here, I don't know why I didn't pick it up sooner, but I see that your experience of depression, like my own lifelong mental illness, caused you to look at death without fear, because the depression is more painful. I was actually scared of acknowledging that in these forums because I thought that it might seem insensitive to most people who do face the prospect of death with terror. Nevertheless, I had to acknowledge that it is true. I have such deep tiredness from struggling with mental illness, never having overcome it even with the best of help, that I actually welcome the prospect of it ending. I'm not suicidal at all. I am very strongly spiritual in my belief that our life has a purpose, and that we die only when it is our right time to die - regardless of what disease we might have. Between tiredness and belief, I met my diagnosis with absolute calm (and some pleasure).
Coming to these forums, I feared that my response to my own cancer might make me less empathetic with those who hold so much fear, but that doesn't seem to have happened. Pain is pain in however it is felt, whether mental or physical. It's true that my greatest pain has been mental, but then I've led a blessed life in many ways, almost completely free of physical pain. Time will tell whether that will last since other treatments must follow the chemo.
I do think it very likely that obesity related problems could take me before the cancer does. Or a combination of both. Like you, I accept what I can't change and I count myself blessed to feel so accepting. How much harder would this part of our journey be if, like most, we were to travel it in fear. My heart goes to all our fellow travellers for whom cancer has been the cause of overwhelming pain as well as the most terrifying fear. It's impossible not to empathize with that.
((hugs))
AussieMaddy0 -
Maddie....I have some smallAussieMaddie said:You too??
Hi Tina,
I feel your despair. I'm so sorry. I don't have answers to help you and I wish that I did. Do you think you might come eventually to be able to look at your extra weight - and the discomfort and changes that it brings - with the sort of acceptance which you bring to your cancer? Have you ever done any kind of meditation in which you can let go of worry about your body? Often, the more we worry about eating, the more we are likely to overeat. I know that there are some very effective forms of meditation that can help one to do let go of such worry, though I cannot use them myself. The nature of my psych problem makes meditation a much harder thing, but I have achieved it in brief moments.
On re-reading your earlier post here, I don't know why I didn't pick it up sooner, but I see that your experience of depression, like my own lifelong mental illness, caused you to look at death without fear, because the depression is more painful. I was actually scared of acknowledging that in these forums because I thought that it might seem insensitive to most people who do face the prospect of death with terror. Nevertheless, I had to acknowledge that it is true. I have such deep tiredness from struggling with mental illness, never having overcome it even with the best of help, that I actually welcome the prospect of it ending. I'm not suicidal at all. I am very strongly spiritual in my belief that our life has a purpose, and that we die only when it is our right time to die - regardless of what disease we might have. Between tiredness and belief, I met my diagnosis with absolute calm (and some pleasure).
Coming to these forums, I feared that my response to my own cancer might make me less empathetic with those who hold so much fear, but that doesn't seem to have happened. Pain is pain in however it is felt, whether mental or physical. It's true that my greatest pain has been mental, but then I've led a blessed life in many ways, almost completely free of physical pain. Time will tell whether that will last since other treatments must follow the chemo.
I do think it very likely that obesity related problems could take me before the cancer does. Or a combination of both. Like you, I accept what I can't change and I count myself blessed to feel so accepting. How much harder would this part of our journey be if, like most, we were to travel it in fear. My heart goes to all our fellow travellers for whom cancer has been the cause of overwhelming pain as well as the most terrifying fear. It's impossible not to empathize with that.
((hugs))
AussieMaddy
Maddie....I have some small bit of knowledge about bariatric surgery. My husband has had Lap Band surgery, and settled on that procedure after investigating the other possibilities (gastric sleeve, gastric by-pass, etc).
The by-pass surgery is irreversible and very invasive. Should the time come, due to the cancer, that nutrition becomes an issue for you, a by-pass patient would have 10 times the problems that anyone else would. It is entirely possible for morbidly obese people to starve to death. Your body cannot live off its own reserves indefinitely.
Lap Band, on the other hand, is reversible and the band can easily be adjusted. My husband is also a binge eater, and a Diabetic. Lab Band was suggested as the best and safest procedure for him. You CAN'T binge with a band. One of the ladies in his support group lost 180 pounds with Lap Band surgery. It doesn't come off as quickly as it does with the by-pass, but it is more permanent. There are two members of the group who had Lap Band surgery, after their by-pass ceased to work and they gained back all their weight. Their stomachs stretched and they were back where they started, within 5 years.
I think you might have a shot at getting the Lap Band, but I would be very surprised if any surgeon would do a gastric by-pass on you. What if, God forbid, your cancer came back and you didn't have enough working bowel left to do a resection? Many of us, including myself, lost part of our bowel during debulking, due to gastric mets. Ovarian cancer seems to love that part of our anatomy best - the gut and the liver.
Who was it that said, "It's not what you're eating....it's what's eating you?" I think there is a huge truth in that statement. I know you said you have had lots of really good therapy, but truly, if it was that good, you would be at least somewhat better. Finding a therapist that works for you is a lot like finding the perfect husband (or wife). Keep looking. The right one might be just around the corner. And know that we will always be here for you.
Carlene0 -
Hi MaddieAussieMaddie said:You too??
Hi Tina,
I feel your despair. I'm so sorry. I don't have answers to help you and I wish that I did. Do you think you might come eventually to be able to look at your extra weight - and the discomfort and changes that it brings - with the sort of acceptance which you bring to your cancer? Have you ever done any kind of meditation in which you can let go of worry about your body? Often, the more we worry about eating, the more we are likely to overeat. I know that there are some very effective forms of meditation that can help one to do let go of such worry, though I cannot use them myself. The nature of my psych problem makes meditation a much harder thing, but I have achieved it in brief moments.
On re-reading your earlier post here, I don't know why I didn't pick it up sooner, but I see that your experience of depression, like my own lifelong mental illness, caused you to look at death without fear, because the depression is more painful. I was actually scared of acknowledging that in these forums because I thought that it might seem insensitive to most people who do face the prospect of death with terror. Nevertheless, I had to acknowledge that it is true. I have such deep tiredness from struggling with mental illness, never having overcome it even with the best of help, that I actually welcome the prospect of it ending. I'm not suicidal at all. I am very strongly spiritual in my belief that our life has a purpose, and that we die only when it is our right time to die - regardless of what disease we might have. Between tiredness and belief, I met my diagnosis with absolute calm (and some pleasure).
Coming to these forums, I feared that my response to my own cancer might make me less empathetic with those who hold so much fear, but that doesn't seem to have happened. Pain is pain in however it is felt, whether mental or physical. It's true that my greatest pain has been mental, but then I've led a blessed life in many ways, almost completely free of physical pain. Time will tell whether that will last since other treatments must follow the chemo.
I do think it very likely that obesity related problems could take me before the cancer does. Or a combination of both. Like you, I accept what I can't change and I count myself blessed to feel so accepting. How much harder would this part of our journey be if, like most, we were to travel it in fear. My heart goes to all our fellow travellers for whom cancer has been the cause of overwhelming pain as well as the most terrifying fear. It's impossible not to empathize with that.
((hugs))
AussieMaddy
Thank-you for your post. It is nice to find someone else who understands the fear that depression can bring. Before my diagnosis I lost a very special person who I had hoped would share my life. (He didn't die but choose not to be with me) This was the trigger for my depression and I couldn;t face life without him. Thus any fear I may face with the prospect of dying - I have already been there with the depression and knowing I can't spend my life with this man.
Mental pain, to me, is far more painful & destructive than physical pain. You can take medication to block out the physical pain, medication for mental pain doesn't quite work.
I too am very strongly spiritual and beleive that we have a pre-determined destiny or purpose in life and what happens to us is meant to be.
Im have been blessed in my life as I have 2 fantastic children with a grandchild on the way. I also have the love and support from my Dad. People are all that matter and I am also blessed with good friends.
Take care love Tina xxxxx0 -
AcceptanceHissy_Fitz said:Maddie....I have some small
Maddie....I have some small bit of knowledge about bariatric surgery. My husband has had Lap Band surgery, and settled on that procedure after investigating the other possibilities (gastric sleeve, gastric by-pass, etc).
The by-pass surgery is irreversible and very invasive. Should the time come, due to the cancer, that nutrition becomes an issue for you, a by-pass patient would have 10 times the problems that anyone else would. It is entirely possible for morbidly obese people to starve to death. Your body cannot live off its own reserves indefinitely.
Lap Band, on the other hand, is reversible and the band can easily be adjusted. My husband is also a binge eater, and a Diabetic. Lab Band was suggested as the best and safest procedure for him. You CAN'T binge with a band. One of the ladies in his support group lost 180 pounds with Lap Band surgery. It doesn't come off as quickly as it does with the by-pass, but it is more permanent. There are two members of the group who had Lap Band surgery, after their by-pass ceased to work and they gained back all their weight. Their stomachs stretched and they were back where they started, within 5 years.
I think you might have a shot at getting the Lap Band, but I would be very surprised if any surgeon would do a gastric by-pass on you. What if, God forbid, your cancer came back and you didn't have enough working bowel left to do a resection? Many of us, including myself, lost part of our bowel during debulking, due to gastric mets. Ovarian cancer seems to love that part of our anatomy best - the gut and the liver.
Who was it that said, "It's not what you're eating....it's what's eating you?" I think there is a huge truth in that statement. I know you said you have had lots of really good therapy, but truly, if it was that good, you would be at least somewhat better. Finding a therapist that works for you is a lot like finding the perfect husband (or wife). Keep looking. The right one might be just around the corner. And know that we will always be here for you.
Carlene
Dear Aussie Maddy
There's a lot to be said for accepting one's mortality. Sometimes, I think "what's my lesson to be learned from having this diagnosis?" And once I get to the place of acceptance of my own mortality, will there be ANOTHER lesson? Sigh...I feel like you that everyone's life has a purpose. I'm still figuring that out.
I admire you for being "out there" with your entire health history. I tend to agree with Carlene, that the lap band surgery sounds better for you--but did you say lap band was not an option?
(((HugS))
Carolen0 -
From my heart..Tina Brown said:Hi Maddie
Thank-you for your post. It is nice to find someone else who understands the fear that depression can bring. Before my diagnosis I lost a very special person who I had hoped would share my life. (He didn't die but choose not to be with me) This was the trigger for my depression and I couldn;t face life without him. Thus any fear I may face with the prospect of dying - I have already been there with the depression and knowing I can't spend my life with this man.
Mental pain, to me, is far more painful & destructive than physical pain. You can take medication to block out the physical pain, medication for mental pain doesn't quite work.
I too am very strongly spiritual and beleive that we have a pre-determined destiny or purpose in life and what happens to us is meant to be.
Im have been blessed in my life as I have 2 fantastic children with a grandchild on the way. I also have the love and support from my Dad. People are all that matter and I am also blessed with good friends.
Take care love Tina xxxxx
Hope that it's all right to answer all the responses in this one (when I start to answer each separately, I find that my avatar looks like it's going on forever down the page)
Oh,oh! On reviewin this post, I see that it does anyway. Oops..
Things not picked up earlier:
Carole, I meant to say to you earlier that I have tried EFT, and I thought it was helping but couldn't maintain the cost of the visits. I've tried doing the tapping myself without success. But thanks for the idea.
Poopergirl, I will mention to my oncologist about meeting the weight loss specialist, but I'm not at all confident that he will approve of such a surgery.
.........
Now, to answer to more recent replies:
Hi Carlene It's nice to finally meet. You've obviously been around the forums a great deal. We just haven't had reason to cross paths for some reason.
I did try for about six years to make myself eligible for gastric banding. At first through a public hospital, then privately, but (as you might know) it's necessary to have a psych evaluation before they will operate and I was turned down on that basis. As well, I was told by two weight loss surgeons as well as one's consulting psychiatrist, that the level of my bingeing was so great that I was likely to cause myself injury with the band too - vomiting etc
As for the problems that would almost certainly arise from having bypass surgery, I agree that the option is not ideal either. I already know that my omentum is thickened. When they finally do do the surgery for the cancer, I imagine that will be the first thing to be 'debaulked', so yes, I have thought of that too. It is just that ongoing weight increase scares me almost more than anything else. As for not seeing a better therapist, I'm quite sure I couldn't. My psychiatrist is a world expert in her field. I admire her very much. The fact that all my hard work over so many years has not freed me of the problem isn't her fault. (I had seen many other therapists and psychiatrists before I got to see her. She was the first one who made sense of all my experience. I had experienced an incident of abuse as a child which, together with other circumstances surrounding it, left an indelible imprint on my life - and all the king's horses and all the king's men couldn't put me back together again. It's no-one's fault that that childhood incident has so overwhelmed me. I'm strongly of the belief that if you do your best - in anything - to make something work, and it never does, then it was never meant to be fixed. It is in the working so hard, for so long, to fix it, that has provided some of my most valuable life lessons. For me, lessons is what life is really about, not just winning over adversity.
I take your point about combining the kinds of effects of bypass surgery with the surgery that is likely to be done on my cancer. I already know that my omentum is thickened and will likely need to be "debaulked". Maybe the cancer surgery will have the same effect on my ability to eat anyway? I may yet lose the weight. If I do, watch for the woman flying across the sky in a bright red, yellow and blue helicopter, with flags waving as they declare "I made it!"
By the way, because I can't easily see my psychiatrist since I've had the cancer (harder to catch trams and buses to travel the two hour journey), I have sought counsellors for support, so in that way, I haven't given up
Dear Carole, yes I also believe that life has a purpose. I also don't think that we are necessarily meant to know what that purpose is. It's in the experience we learn. Yes, they've ruled out lapband, and to be honest I don't think I stand a chance in hell of being accepted for the bypass either. Just want to hold onto anything really. But as I said earlier, the surgery that is due to be done for my cancer might prove to offer much the same thing anyway. We'll take it a day at a time.
Tina, when I first found these boards, it was your experience of peritoneal cancer that I found most similar to my own. I neve knew that we would prove to have so much more in common- even a shared sense of spiritual purpose. Certainly not the only ones here to feel that, but together with other life experiences, there is something that bonds me to you. Your presence makes my journey *so* much easier Tina. Thank you.
The one very noticeable difference in our experience is that you have children. I am at once heartbroken that I never had children but at the same time *so* glad that I never did. I would never want to put children through the trials I have experienced, or indeed, to leave them at all.
Thank you to you all.
My love and best wishes, and many hugs (((( hug ))))
AussieMaddie0 -
Acknowledgment takes courage
Your comments show much courage. Despite how many people view mental illness (like a condition you can just shake off) it is as real as cancer for those who face it. And those who live with those who deal with it. So expressing your opinion here and discussing the super challenge of convergent illnesses is a good thing for everyone. For you, to have a place to release some of the pent up frustration at dealing with you physical and mental illnesses. But for others too, because sometimes reading about the challenges faced by others helps you look at your own. Everyone has to use their own lens. But borrowing someone else's sometimes helps as well.0 -
Maddie....your entireAussieMaddie said:From my heart..
Hope that it's all right to answer all the responses in this one (when I start to answer each separately, I find that my avatar looks like it's going on forever down the page)
Oh,oh! On reviewin this post, I see that it does anyway. Oops..
Things not picked up earlier:
Carole, I meant to say to you earlier that I have tried EFT, and I thought it was helping but couldn't maintain the cost of the visits. I've tried doing the tapping myself without success. But thanks for the idea.
Poopergirl, I will mention to my oncologist about meeting the weight loss specialist, but I'm not at all confident that he will approve of such a surgery.
.........
Now, to answer to more recent replies:
Hi Carlene It's nice to finally meet. You've obviously been around the forums a great deal. We just haven't had reason to cross paths for some reason.
I did try for about six years to make myself eligible for gastric banding. At first through a public hospital, then privately, but (as you might know) it's necessary to have a psych evaluation before they will operate and I was turned down on that basis. As well, I was told by two weight loss surgeons as well as one's consulting psychiatrist, that the level of my bingeing was so great that I was likely to cause myself injury with the band too - vomiting etc
As for the problems that would almost certainly arise from having bypass surgery, I agree that the option is not ideal either. I already know that my omentum is thickened. When they finally do do the surgery for the cancer, I imagine that will be the first thing to be 'debaulked', so yes, I have thought of that too. It is just that ongoing weight increase scares me almost more than anything else. As for not seeing a better therapist, I'm quite sure I couldn't. My psychiatrist is a world expert in her field. I admire her very much. The fact that all my hard work over so many years has not freed me of the problem isn't her fault. (I had seen many other therapists and psychiatrists before I got to see her. She was the first one who made sense of all my experience. I had experienced an incident of abuse as a child which, together with other circumstances surrounding it, left an indelible imprint on my life - and all the king's horses and all the king's men couldn't put me back together again. It's no-one's fault that that childhood incident has so overwhelmed me. I'm strongly of the belief that if you do your best - in anything - to make something work, and it never does, then it was never meant to be fixed. It is in the working so hard, for so long, to fix it, that has provided some of my most valuable life lessons. For me, lessons is what life is really about, not just winning over adversity.
I take your point about combining the kinds of effects of bypass surgery with the surgery that is likely to be done on my cancer. I already know that my omentum is thickened and will likely need to be "debaulked". Maybe the cancer surgery will have the same effect on my ability to eat anyway? I may yet lose the weight. If I do, watch for the woman flying across the sky in a bright red, yellow and blue helicopter, with flags waving as they declare "I made it!"
By the way, because I can't easily see my psychiatrist since I've had the cancer (harder to catch trams and buses to travel the two hour journey), I have sought counsellors for support, so in that way, I haven't given up
Dear Carole, yes I also believe that life has a purpose. I also don't think that we are necessarily meant to know what that purpose is. It's in the experience we learn. Yes, they've ruled out lapband, and to be honest I don't think I stand a chance in hell of being accepted for the bypass either. Just want to hold onto anything really. But as I said earlier, the surgery that is due to be done for my cancer might prove to offer much the same thing anyway. We'll take it a day at a time.
Tina, when I first found these boards, it was your experience of peritoneal cancer that I found most similar to my own. I neve knew that we would prove to have so much more in common- even a shared sense of spiritual purpose. Certainly not the only ones here to feel that, but together with other life experiences, there is something that bonds me to you. Your presence makes my journey *so* much easier Tina. Thank you.
The one very noticeable difference in our experience is that you have children. I am at once heartbroken that I never had children but at the same time *so* glad that I never did. I would never want to put children through the trials I have experienced, or indeed, to leave them at all.
Thank you to you all.
My love and best wishes, and many hugs (((( hug ))))
AussieMaddie
Maddie....your entire Omentum will likely be removed. Mine was, and I think most of the other ladies here. I also had to have a bowel re-section (6-8 inches), due to mets in my bowel. Again, very common with OC, both initially and down the road. The bowel is one of the beast's favorite places to set up a "second home."
Carlene0 -
Oh oh!Hissy_Fitz said:Maddie....your entire
Maddie....your entire Omentum will likely be removed. Mine was, and I think most of the other ladies here. I also had to have a bowel re-section (6-8 inches), due to mets in my bowel. Again, very common with OC, both initially and down the road. The bowel is one of the beast's favorite places to set up a "second home."
Carlene
Not sure how much my surgical experience will follow along the same lines as yours, Carlene - except for the omentum part. I don't have ovarian cancer. They decided I have peritoneal cancer from a sample of the fluid that they took from my distended abdomen. CT results showed nothing.
That it might go to the bowel is a concern as bowel cancer runs very strongly in our family. Will have to wait and see.
How are you doing at present?
AussieMaddie0 -
Thank youlindachris said:Acknowledgment takes courage
Your comments show much courage. Despite how many people view mental illness (like a condition you can just shake off) it is as real as cancer for those who face it. And those who live with those who deal with it. So expressing your opinion here and discussing the super challenge of convergent illnesses is a good thing for everyone. For you, to have a place to release some of the pent up frustration at dealing with you physical and mental illnesses. But for others too, because sometimes reading about the challenges faced by others helps you look at your own. Everyone has to use their own lens. But borrowing someone else's sometimes helps as well.
It very rare for anyone to have one's experience of mental illness acknowledged, much less respected. I know that I was concerned about joining these forums because it affects how I look upon my cancer. As I speak, I'm aware (happily) of still being free of the side-effects of the chemo, even after 9 cycles, but I'm also aware of being mentally troubled. Having cancer doesn't change that.
Thank you for your kind words
AussieMaddie0 -
Bad memoriesAussieMaddie said:Thank you
It very rare for anyone to have one's experience of mental illness acknowledged, much less respected. I know that I was concerned about joining these forums because it affects how I look upon my cancer. As I speak, I'm aware (happily) of still being free of the side-effects of the chemo, even after 9 cycles, but I'm also aware of being mentally troubled. Having cancer doesn't change that.
Thank you for your kind words
AussieMaddie
Dear AussieMaddie
I appreciate the perspective that you bring to the forum. Imagine someone who isn't afraid of big, bad cancer! You are not alone with your history of a troubled childhood (OK, I know that's euphemism) but a lot of us don't talk about it.
I'm glad that you are doing well on chemo--I was thinking that maybe the "chemo brain" phenomenon would kick in and do you a favor. But chemo brain only messes up the short-term memory. What you need is help to forget the bad memories of the past. The only therapy that I know of that helps erase painful memories is electroconvulsive therapy (ECT) aka shock therapy.
In the US, ECT is considered standard of care for severe depression. I don't if the health service in Australia offers ECT and I imagine that someone would have offered it to you by now if it was an option. I heard Carrie Fisher (the actress who was Princess Lela in the first trilogy of Star Wars films) speak about her experience with ECT on a "talk TV" program and she felt that it made a world of difference in her life. Her memory for the past is greatly diminished and I think that is how the therapy helps.
Somewhere I read that people with poorer long-term memories tend to score higher on the "happiness scale" than people with excellent long-term memories. I guess the people with the poor long-term memories can't remember who they were pissed off at or who betrayed them, you know where I am going with this. Anyway, just some thoughts on your situation.
(((hugs for the brave survivor that you are)))
Carolen0 -
Dear Carolencarolenk said:Bad memories
Dear AussieMaddie
I appreciate the perspective that you bring to the forum. Imagine someone who isn't afraid of big, bad cancer! You are not alone with your history of a troubled childhood (OK, I know that's euphemism) but a lot of us don't talk about it.
I'm glad that you are doing well on chemo--I was thinking that maybe the "chemo brain" phenomenon would kick in and do you a favor. But chemo brain only messes up the short-term memory. What you need is help to forget the bad memories of the past. The only therapy that I know of that helps erase painful memories is electroconvulsive therapy (ECT) aka shock therapy.
In the US, ECT is considered standard of care for severe depression. I don't if the health service in Australia offers ECT and I imagine that someone would have offered it to you by now if it was an option. I heard Carrie Fisher (the actress who was Princess Lela in the first trilogy of Star Wars films) speak about her experience with ECT on a "talk TV" program and she felt that it made a world of difference in her life. Her memory for the past is greatly diminished and I think that is how the therapy helps.
Somewhere I read that people with poorer long-term memories tend to score higher on the "happiness scale" than people with excellent long-term memories. I guess the people with the poor long-term memories can't remember who they were pissed off at or who betrayed them, you know where I am going with this. Anyway, just some thoughts on your situation.
(((hugs for the brave survivor that you are)))
Carolen
"that maybe the "chemo brain" phenomenon would kick in and do you a favor"
ECT is also used here for depression, I believe with good results often. As you say, it's known to cause memory loss. I thought it was supposed to be only short-term memory loss?
As I understand it, Carrie Fisher has Bipolar Disorder (formerly called Manic Depression) and ECT is often used where somone does experience such severe depression. I think it was her depression that it helped, not so much her memories. It's never been an option for me because I have a different diagnosis.
"I read that people with poorer long-term memories tend to score higher on the "happiness scale" than people with excellent long-term memories. I guess the people with the poor long-term memories can't remember who they were pissed off at or who betrayed them"
Trouble is that forgetting actually doesn't help, so I found. I had forgotten what had happened to me for many years but my reactions and social interactions still carried the scars. It is as if the body holds memories as well as the brain. So maybe swapping heads with someone else wouldn't help so much anyway
((( hugs )))
AussieMaddie0
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