Dear Carlene re: your response to Sarah re: antidepressants

antcat

Dear Carlene, I was so happy to hear what you wrote to Sarah re: antidepressants. I couldn't agree with you more. I've been battling this for several years and most recently the oncology nurse said to me, that I should be on antidepressants and maybe should talk to a psychiatrist. I was so furious with her because I felt she was out of place, after all she was not my doctor. I told her I was not depressed, and that even though I get anxious from time to time, who wouldn't with this type of diagnosis. I mean do they expect a person to jump for joy when each chemo treatment they give them seems to fail. I keep busy but I know I am a worrier. Everytime I have a little new pain, I think its related to the cancer.

The nurse told me "oh we have many patients on antidepressants and you'd be surprised how good they feel." We're on enough meds with chemo and everything, I certainly wouldn't add anything that was unnecessary.

I know my mental health and when a person has poor long term prognosis, how do they expect a person to feel. Especially since they keep trying different chemos after chemos and it's really only a guessing game with them. I guess I'm just venting, but it was so good to hear someone felt just like I do.

Hissy_Fitz

I hope I didn't leave the
I hope I didn't leave the impression that I believe no one should take antidepressants. Heavens above....if they help you cope, by all means, take them. I don't like the way they make me feel, but that's just me. I won't let the dentist use nitrous oxide on me, either. He says everyone else is telling him, "Turn it up, doc," and I'm pulling on the mask, saying, "Get this damn thing off me."

I do take an occassional anti-anxiety pill. I popped one of those puppies last week, right before I got the results of my CT scan. Better living thru chemistry, that's my motto.

Carlene

upsofloating

Just thought i'd add my 2
Just thought i'd add my 2 cents to the ant-depressant issues. A numberb of years ago my onc prescribed Effexor for the hot flashes I had as a side effect of tamoxifen and years later Femara as well. The comment that it was an antidepressant kind of flew past me as okay, okay, as long as it helps the flashes which were quite unpleasant and definitely problematic in the male-dominated work environment. I worked in a rather creative enviroment as head of an art and editorial dept. About a year and half ago, my Rx ran out and I was lax about getting a refill. After a week or I noticed that my flashes were diminishing (afte an uptick with stopping) and decided to forego a new Rx. After several weeks to a month, I noticed a significant resurrgence of my old creative thoughts and desires - I had majored in art. I sawmy PCP a few weeks later andsaid I felt like my emotional and creative self had become like flattened sine wave while on the Effexor. I didn'experience lows but nor did I really experience highs. My mind was now clearer and I had an improved of insight, sensitivity, and perceptions of my life and the world around me. I did not want to continue taking it which he had previously thought it to be "most beneficial considerering my circumstances (with cancer)". He noted I had an extremely accurate metaphorcal description of the effect of such medications. I now opt for the rela world with all its ups and downs over the diminished world of antidepressants. I admit to an occasional sleep aid if I'm not getting adequate rest. And love that it frequently breaks the disrpted sleep cycle without the need to repeat for weeks or months.
Sorry abot all the typos - I post from my smart phones tiny key pad, lol.
I just worry than many people accet the initial effects of these medications and like I was are unaware of the insidious progression of a flattening of the richness of their emotional potential for experiencing life. A nice glass of wine on occasion is all I do now ;-)
Annie

msfanciful

Can't imagine life without
Can't imagine life without my lexapro (10 mil.), ever since my diagnosis.

Rookerbird

upsofloating said:

Just thought i'd add my 2
Just thought i'd add my 2 cents to the ant-depressant issues. A numberb of years ago my onc prescribed Effexor for the hot flashes I had as a side effect of tamoxifen and years later Femara as well. The comment that it was an antidepressant kind of flew past me as okay, okay, as long as it helps the flashes which were quite unpleasant and definitely problematic in the male-dominated work environment. I worked in a rather creative enviroment as head of an art and editorial dept. About a year and half ago, my Rx ran out and I was lax about getting a refill. After a week or I noticed that my flashes were diminishing (afte an uptick with stopping) and decided to forego a new Rx. After several weeks to a month, I noticed a significant resurrgence of my old creative thoughts and desires - I had majored in art. I sawmy PCP a few weeks later andsaid I felt like my emotional and creative self had become like flattened sine wave while on the Effexor. I didn'experience lows but nor did I really experience highs. My mind was now clearer and I had an improved of insight, sensitivity, and perceptions of my life and the world around me. I did not want to continue taking it which he had previously thought it to be "most beneficial considerering my circumstances (with cancer)". He noted I had an extremely accurate metaphorcal description of the effect of such medications. I now opt for the rela world with all its ups and downs over the diminished world of antidepressants. I admit to an occasional sleep aid if I'm not getting adequate rest. And love that it frequently breaks the disrpted sleep cycle without the need to repeat for weeks or months.
Sorry abot all the typos - I post from my smart phones tiny key pad, lol.
I just worry than many people accet the initial effects of these medications and like I was are unaware of the insidious progression of a flattening of the richness of their emotional potential for experiencing life. A nice glass of wine on occasion is all I do now ;-)
Annie

Struck a Chord
Annie, I needed this input.

When I saw my oncologist on April 12, we discussed my extreme fatigue. I've had five chemo treatments in five months, so that's obviously a cause. My RBC is low, but not as low as it was with prior chemos. I was teary and sad during my appointment, because "word got out" in the waiting room that he was running really late due to a patient whose OVCA has metastasized to the brain. Anyway...

He said chemo is a sure cause of my fatigue, but he wondered if it might also be compounded by depression. He wrote me a prescription for Effexor. I told him I was really reluctant to add any non-essential meds to my system. He supported my decision to take it, or not take it, but wanted me to have it on hand. So...

The Effexor prescription has been filled and is sitting in my basket of meds. I look at it every morning, and just haven't been able to get started. I hate feeling so wiped out, yet...it's a "real" feeling, and I worry about "muffling" my real feelings. Even though the cancer is attacking my body, my personality and spirit are unchanged. (Or so friends and family say.)

Part of me says...just take the pills and feel better! And part of me says...WHAT's better?...Lows/highs/rough edges or smoothness?

Your perspective is very helpful.

-Kathy

LaundryQueen

msfanciful said:

Can't imagine life without
Can't imagine life without my lexapro (10 mil.), ever since my diagnosis.

Neurotransmitters out of whack
Fatigue is a symptom of depression.

Serotonin is one of the brain chemicals (neurotransmitter) that is low in depression.

The platinum chemo drugs deplete serotonin (you pee it out).

Norepinephrine is a neurotransmitter depleted when there is stress.

A symptom of low serotonin & low norepinephrine is fatigue.

Effexor prevents the low serotonin & epinephrine levels from being removed from the circulation (aka: serum serotonin/norepinephrine re-uptake inhibitor or SSNRI).

I have serious reservations about giving an SSNRI to someone who is suicidal.

There is a higher risk of suicide/death as the person's energy may improve before the depression does--now they have the energy to carry out their plan of suicide.

srwruns

My frame of reference
My frame of reference regarding antidepressants and other prescribed mood alters (is that even a word?) is that they are a means to an end...the end being a healthy mind and body. We take antibiotics when we have an infection...and do so until we are healthy or our body is robust enough to stem the return of the infection. We take pain medication when we are in pain so the stressor of the pain is alleviated so that we can heal. Some people need stronger antibiotics than others, same with pain medications. Same with chemo...we do chemo when we have to, we don't do it when our body is healthy enough to function on its own. Just as antibiotics and medications have side effects we don't like, often time some antidepressants/anti anxiety will have side effects we don't like "I feel flat" or can't "drive or operate heavy machinery" while on them. But the purpose is to allow the body and mind to regain enough health and robustness to work well on its own. Just as we would not over indulge in antibiotics, chemo or pain medication, the same is true of mood altering meds. And like some diseases or illness, such as diabetes, high blood pressure, etc etc, one may be on medication for a very long time, or even forever. Most people want to be strong and healthy enough to manage their lives. My belief is that legit mood altering meds are no different than the chemo we take or the bazillion of other meds we take during chemo. You take them while they serve the purpose of becoming healthy enough again to not need them. For some that may be short term, for others it may be years...same as for chemo, some do their first line treatment and it's all done, others are off and on and on chemo for very long periods of time, same with mood altering meds. Overwhelming stressors severely limit the ability to get "well". Just my thoughts.

Carlene, I know the dentist thing about nitrous, absolutely freaked me out!

MK_4Dani

msfanciful said:

Can't imagine life without
Can't imagine life without my lexapro (10 mil.), ever since my diagnosis.

I agree 100%
I am also taking Lexapro and I am NED. When I tried to go off them my anxiety went thru the roof along with high blood pressure. I have to say to folks who may be wondering how it will effect their lives or make them feel: they have not change my personality, they don't make me tired or feel "doped" up. They give me about 10 seconds to rationalize my feelings before the anxiety/stress can take control. It is a feeling that I am in total control of my emotions.
When I tried to go off them: I started thinking about my dx and the thoughts spiraled out of control. One passing thought of a funeral and I was planning the details of my funeral....every little detail...in my mind I knew it was silly but I couldn't grasp control.
Now the Lexapro lets me check those silly thoughts before the spiral of what-if scenarios. They help me silence my mind.
Give them (or any type) a try....you can always stop taking them.
I also have Xanax on hand for really bad days.....NOW they make you not care about anything...the last time I took one I purchased a Coach handbag ($300 on sale)...take these puppies with care and stay out of the mall.
My two sense worth,
Mary

kikz

srwruns said:

My frame of reference
My frame of reference regarding antidepressants and other prescribed mood alters (is that even a word?) is that they are a means to an end...the end being a healthy mind and body. We take antibiotics when we have an infection...and do so until we are healthy or our body is robust enough to stem the return of the infection. We take pain medication when we are in pain so the stressor of the pain is alleviated so that we can heal. Some people need stronger antibiotics than others, same with pain medications. Same with chemo...we do chemo when we have to, we don't do it when our body is healthy enough to function on its own. Just as antibiotics and medications have side effects we don't like, often time some antidepressants/anti anxiety will have side effects we don't like "I feel flat" or can't "drive or operate heavy machinery" while on them. But the purpose is to allow the body and mind to regain enough health and robustness to work well on its own. Just as we would not over indulge in antibiotics, chemo or pain medication, the same is true of mood altering meds. And like some diseases or illness, such as diabetes, high blood pressure, etc etc, one may be on medication for a very long time, or even forever. Most people want to be strong and healthy enough to manage their lives. My belief is that legit mood altering meds are no different than the chemo we take or the bazillion of other meds we take during chemo. You take them while they serve the purpose of becoming healthy enough again to not need them. For some that may be short term, for others it may be years...same as for chemo, some do their first line treatment and it's all done, others are off and on and on chemo for very long periods of time, same with mood altering meds. Overwhelming stressors severely limit the ability to get "well". Just my thoughts.

Carlene, I know the dentist thing about nitrous, absolutely freaked me out!

To drug or not to drug
as with anything in life is specific to each individual. I have mentioned the break-up of my 27-year relationship many times. It took such a toll on me that I saw a shrink for almost two years. I was devastated and so hurt that the pain was physical at times. But I maintained through it all that I was not depressed and my shrink agreed with me; saying she was watching for signs. She said I was facing my problems and the feelings I had were all part of that. On 3/16/2010 after my primary gave me my diagnosis of ov/ca over the phone, she told me I could come in to the office to talk. As people started arriving at the house, I began to have difficulty walking around. I would take a few steps and have to sit down. My two friends took me to see my primary and when she saw my condition, she immediately diagnosed anxiety and gave me a prescription for xanax. I went home and then the primary called me and said if I had problems of any kind I should go to the emergency. My family and friends decided I should do just that. So we made the 30-mile trip to the ER where it was determined my heart was out of rhythm. I never took a xanax. After treatment when I read it might be difficult to deal with fear of the cancer returning I again went to see my shrink. I had 6 free visits from my employer and since I was planning to retire I figured I would use them. Once again I was not depressed but asked her how it was that I did not get depressed with everything that had been going on for the last few years. She said some people just don't get depressed. I am happy about that and I apologize for being so long winded. I guess what I am trying to say is that if a person needs to take meds for anxiety or depression, I am all for it but in my case I was given the xanax when I had a physical problem that needed attention. I think doctors sometimes give those type of drugs out too easily. I have never taken one of the xanax.

Karen

leesag

My 2 cents:
Better living through chemistry! The Celexa (Low Dose) not only keeps me stable, but also prevents hot flashes. Additionally, although the Ativan usually hangs out in my medicine cabinet, I've been very grateful for it this past month.

(Let's not discount the + factor of chocolate, wine and lots and lots of loving family and friends!)

Hugs,

Leesa