Naturopath

jjaj133

Hi everyone, I have a question.
I am still waiting to see if the lesion on my liver is cancer. I had a biopsy Wedensday.
The first 2 times i was diagnosed, i kinda went with the flow and just figured they would cure me. Now i am learning maybe not. I am wondering about naturopaths. Do they work with the surgeon & or onc.?
Does ins. pay for them? Do you think its something i should look into?
Thanks for you help.
Judy

lisa42

my experience
Hi Judy,

I hope and pray that the lesion on your liver is benign.
As the csn moderator has admonished everyone a bit lately for "giving advice", I want to carefully word what I am saying, that this has been my experience & I'm not telling you what to do- just what I know and what I would want to know if I found myself in your position.

Now, there is a lot that can be done if this lesion is malignant. If it's just the one lesion, you could have cyberknife (an exact type of radiation that takes between 1-3 treatments, not daily for several weeks like standard radiation). You could also have it surgically removed (which they say surgery is the gold standard to get it out of there). Then of course there's always chemo. There are other things they do now for the liver like a specific type of chemo that is delivered directly to the liver lesion instead of systemically through IV. Of course, that chemo wouldn't be doing anything to any other possible cancer cells floating around in the body. Discuss all options, seek out options, and branch out and check with some additional major cancer centers as well.
Then there is naturopathic support, which you mentioned- some oncologists are open to that but many are not.

With that said, it is my experience that many naturopaths are willing to work with doctors, but it seems to usually be the case that most doctors don't want to work with the naturopaths! Now, also be aware of terminology- some practitioners called themselves naturopaths when they've had just a few courses on the whole thing. There are also naturopathic doctors, who actually have a doctor's degree- some call themselves "ND" for naturopathic doctor as opposed to "MD" for medical doctor. At the place I go (Center for Advanced Medicine in Encinitas, CA), there are several doctors there who are ND's and one is an MD, but who now practices natural medicine. There are also individuals there who give nutritional support and are called naturopathic practioners. Just wanted to point that out so you are aware of the different but similar titles.
I have been on chemo or on some kind of treatment for my stage IV rectal cancer for 3 yrs, 8 months now. It has just been in the past few months that I have looked into incorporating natural treatments/supplements in with my chemo. I vascillated for quite a while whether to stop chemo and go all natural, but I was scared- my CEA was high and I have discovered my cancer is agressive- things start happening in me (tumors start growing) even when I take just a two week break from the chemo. So... I decided to seek out and talk to different ND's to see what their thoughts, opinions were on doing both at the same time. The one I went to said he treats people for all different health disorders and of his cancer patients, some are doing only natural, some are now doing natural after stopping western conventional treatments, and some like me are incorporating the natural together with the conventional western treatments. It was his take that what he would be giving me would help enhance the effectiveness of the chemo, not undermine what the chemo does, as I was worried about. I was hesitant to contact and talk to my oncologist about all this thinking he would be against it all (many oncologists are). Surprisingly, he was open to me doing it. Not terribly excited about it, but open to it. His advice, which the ND agreed with, was to stop 24 hrs before chemo and start up the natural supplement stuff 24 hrs after getting my chemo. This was because of any possible negative effects with mixing the two together- I think this is mostly pertaining to the high antioxidants.

When I talked to my oncologist, I told him I was worried about the long term effects of so much chemo on my body (out of my 3 yrs, 8 mos since diagnosis, I have had a total of 3 yrs, 2 mos on chemo). I was getting worried that the chemo would shut my immune system down after so much & so I wanted to find something that would help boost my immune system making it stronger so I can continue chemo & hopefully also having anticancer effects itself. My bloodwork the next few weeks blew the onc and nurses away- they said "whatever you're doing, keep it up- your numbers look great!". My blood counts have continued to be good (except for one setback this past week with my white blood cell count & I am now taking shots for that to be boosted back up).
The jury is still out if the minerals, natural detox, and antioxidant supplements are hammering away at my tumors or not. My last scan had mixed results but showed a possibility that the centers of some of my lung tumors are starting to die off in the center. We'll know more on my next scan, because I hadn't been doing the natural stuff and diet change that long by the time my last scan was taken.

I may have given you more info than you needed here, but I personally think seeking out various options is helpful, even if some of them may not be conventional. Be careful though, as all naturopaths and naturopathic doctors do not all operate the same. Go with your gut instincts, but also research everything that is being recommended to you before proceeding & always do check with your doctor/oncologist.

You're early in the game & hopefully this lesion in the liver is benign. Are you already being treated for cancer and just wondering about a new liver lesion that appeared, or do you not have a cancer diagnosis, but are waiting to see on this?

Whether this liver lesion is benign or malignant, there are always preventative things that can be taken and can be done regardless of your stage of cancer.

Do take care & let us know how things are going-

Lisa

abrub

Naturopaths...
Lisa makes some excellent points. A few I'd like to add:

The ND (Naturopathic Doctor) is a licensed degree that is not nationally recognized. I see an ND, who was licensed in California, but in NY there is no such licensing, and "ND" is not formally recognized.

Regarding oncologists and naturopathy/complementary medicine: each dr is different. However, at Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center, there is an Integrative Medicine division that advises on supplements that are safe for cancer patients, both in and out of treatment, to take. I am working with one of the specialists there. MSK also has other complementary therapies: acupuncture, massage, reiki, meditation. Thus here is a major cancer center that incorporates the complementary integrative treatments into its patient care.

Insurance pays for some types of care - you have to check with your insurer. My personal insurance pays for acupuncture, but only when performed by an MD. Other plans cover acupuncture, provided you use an in-network provider. It all depends on the way yourplan was written. If you see a naturopath/MD, you have a better likelihood of having insurance coverage.

Wishing you all the best,
Alice

jjaj133

lisa42 said:

my experience
Hi Judy,

I hope and pray that the lesion on your liver is benign.
As the csn moderator has admonished everyone a bit lately for "giving advice", I want to carefully word what I am saying, that this has been my experience & I'm not telling you what to do- just what I know and what I would want to know if I found myself in your position.

Now, there is a lot that can be done if this lesion is malignant. If it's just the one lesion, you could have cyberknife (an exact type of radiation that takes between 1-3 treatments, not daily for several weeks like standard radiation). You could also have it surgically removed (which they say surgery is the gold standard to get it out of there). Then of course there's always chemo. There are other things they do now for the liver like a specific type of chemo that is delivered directly to the liver lesion instead of systemically through IV. Of course, that chemo wouldn't be doing anything to any other possible cancer cells floating around in the body. Discuss all options, seek out options, and branch out and check with some additional major cancer centers as well.
Then there is naturopathic support, which you mentioned- some oncologists are open to that but many are not.

With that said, it is my experience that many naturopaths are willing to work with doctors, but it seems to usually be the case that most doctors don't want to work with the naturopaths! Now, also be aware of terminology- some practitioners called themselves naturopaths when they've had just a few courses on the whole thing. There are also naturopathic doctors, who actually have a doctor's degree- some call themselves "ND" for naturopathic doctor as opposed to "MD" for medical doctor. At the place I go (Center for Advanced Medicine in Encinitas, CA), there are several doctors there who are ND's and one is an MD, but who now practices natural medicine. There are also individuals there who give nutritional support and are called naturopathic practioners. Just wanted to point that out so you are aware of the different but similar titles.
I have been on chemo or on some kind of treatment for my stage IV rectal cancer for 3 yrs, 8 months now. It has just been in the past few months that I have looked into incorporating natural treatments/supplements in with my chemo. I vascillated for quite a while whether to stop chemo and go all natural, but I was scared- my CEA was high and I have discovered my cancer is agressive- things start happening in me (tumors start growing) even when I take just a two week break from the chemo. So... I decided to seek out and talk to different ND's to see what their thoughts, opinions were on doing both at the same time. The one I went to said he treats people for all different health disorders and of his cancer patients, some are doing only natural, some are now doing natural after stopping western conventional treatments, and some like me are incorporating the natural together with the conventional western treatments. It was his take that what he would be giving me would help enhance the effectiveness of the chemo, not undermine what the chemo does, as I was worried about. I was hesitant to contact and talk to my oncologist about all this thinking he would be against it all (many oncologists are). Surprisingly, he was open to me doing it. Not terribly excited about it, but open to it. His advice, which the ND agreed with, was to stop 24 hrs before chemo and start up the natural supplement stuff 24 hrs after getting my chemo. This was because of any possible negative effects with mixing the two together- I think this is mostly pertaining to the high antioxidants.

When I talked to my oncologist, I told him I was worried about the long term effects of so much chemo on my body (out of my 3 yrs, 8 mos since diagnosis, I have had a total of 3 yrs, 2 mos on chemo). I was getting worried that the chemo would shut my immune system down after so much & so I wanted to find something that would help boost my immune system making it stronger so I can continue chemo & hopefully also having anticancer effects itself. My bloodwork the next few weeks blew the onc and nurses away- they said "whatever you're doing, keep it up- your numbers look great!". My blood counts have continued to be good (except for one setback this past week with my white blood cell count & I am now taking shots for that to be boosted back up).
The jury is still out if the minerals, natural detox, and antioxidant supplements are hammering away at my tumors or not. My last scan had mixed results but showed a possibility that the centers of some of my lung tumors are starting to die off in the center. We'll know more on my next scan, because I hadn't been doing the natural stuff and diet change that long by the time my last scan was taken.

I may have given you more info than you needed here, but I personally think seeking out various options is helpful, even if some of them may not be conventional. Be careful though, as all naturopaths and naturopathic doctors do not all operate the same. Go with your gut instincts, but also research everything that is being recommended to you before proceeding & always do check with your doctor/oncologist.

You're early in the game & hopefully this lesion in the liver is benign. Are you already being treated for cancer and just wondering about a new liver lesion that appeared, or do you not have a cancer diagnosis, but are waiting to see on this?

Whether this liver lesion is benign or malignant, there are always preventative things that can be taken and can be done regardless of your stage of cancer.

Do take care & let us know how things are going-

Lisa

Thank you for sharing that
Thank you for sharing that information.
I had colon cancer in 04, had 1/3 taken out and was told they got it all. no onc/chemo needed. 5 yrs later it came back in the liver. Had chem/resection then 6 months more of chemo. i finished in feb. 2010. I just had the port taken out, blood work perfect. Then I felt pain. I still think its the hernia. But the dr. said one more ct for the road. It showed a lesion, small , thank goodness. So i wait. (I never knew you could be on chemo for years!) they keep telling me, boy we got it early, you are so lucky.
I am, others have had a much tougher journey. I blamed the first mets on not having chemo. So I was positive that this time would be different. Of course, I was positive that I would never be overweight too!!!!
Again, thank you, Now I know how to do my research.
Judy

jjaj133

abrub said:

Naturopaths...
Lisa makes some excellent points. A few I'd like to add:

The ND (Naturopathic Doctor) is a licensed degree that is not nationally recognized. I see an ND, who was licensed in California, but in NY there is no such licensing, and "ND" is not formally recognized.

Regarding oncologists and naturopathy/complementary medicine: each dr is different. However, at Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center, there is an Integrative Medicine division that advises on supplements that are safe for cancer patients, both in and out of treatment, to take. I am working with one of the specialists there. MSK also has other complementary therapies: acupuncture, massage, reiki, meditation. Thus here is a major cancer center that incorporates the complementary integrative treatments into its patient care.

Insurance pays for some types of care - you have to check with your insurer. My personal insurance pays for acupuncture, but only when performed by an MD. Other plans cover acupuncture, provided you use an in-network provider. It all depends on the way yourplan was written. If you see a naturopath/MD, you have a better likelihood of having insurance coverage.

Wishing you all the best,
Alice

Thank you Alice. You are all
Thank you Alice. You are all a wealth of information. I really appreciate your responses.
I will check my policy and Moffitt Cancer to see if they have a dept.
My onc.dr. at Univ. of Penna. was invited to practice at Sloan. I wish i was closer.
But Moffitt ( i am in fl. now)is supposed to be one of the best.
I will let you all know when i get the results back,
The best to you also.
Judy