Link between diabeties and Ovca

poopergirl14052

Was listening to the newa and they say there may if you have dm you may very likely get ovca. I never heard of this before but it makes sense since ca. cells thrive on sugar. Are any of you diabetic, I am unfortunately. I keep my aic at 6, which is well controlled but during chemo it is high due to decadrone. I still have to be careful my sugar is under control but sometimes handling one illness at a time is all I can do....stay strong...val

anicca

All cells thrive on sugar
Glucose fuels all cells in our body. It is better for us to derive glucose from complex carbohydrates, rather than refined sugars, but in the end it's sugar that our engines need. Cancer cells use the same fuel as other cells. It is because cancer cells are so close biologically to normal cells that they are so hard to kill without killing the organism itself. When we finally fully understand the mechanisms behind cancer, we may be able to direct treatments at cancer cells that do not massacre normal cells too. There are already some drugs that do this (gleevec for some blood cancers.) Until then, while it is always a good idea to eat a healthy diet, low in simple carbs (like refined sugar, white bread, and white potatoes) there is no evidence that this will have any effect on the cancer itself, and we will just have to endure toxic treatments.

Hissy_Fitz

My glucose is fine....always
My glucose is fine....always was and OC had zero effect.

I respect your personal thoughts on the subject, but there is no evidence that cancer "thrives" on sugar, or acid, or any other nutrient. There is an equal lack of evidence regaring the many nutritional "cures" people keep sending my way.

A healthy, balanced diet is advisable for anyone, and especially cancer patients. Asparagus, mushrooms, honey. etc do not destroy cancer cells, as far as I can tell. If you know of any reliable, scientific study that shows otherwise, please post it. I would love to be wrong about this.

Carlene

nancy591

no diabetes
Actually I always have chronic low blood sugar. If I don't eat regularly I bottom out.

I dont' think it is as much about how much sugar your are ingesting more than it is how well your insulin is handling the blood sugar.

Mum2bellaandwilliam

nancy591 said:

no diabetes
Actually I always have chronic low blood sugar. If I don't eat regularly I bottom out.

I dont' think it is as much about how much sugar your are ingesting more than it is how well your insulin is handling the blood sugar.

@carlene
I am glad you posted this, you may have seen my post mums cancer is back, in fact it never went. In my desperate effort to find anything that may help her reading through all the posts about nutrition got me thinking.
Mum loves to drink wine which is acidic , so there I am thinking stop the wine, eat this and eat that , don't eat this and don't eat that, at the end of the day all of us need to enjoy the time we have, and stuff what we should and shouldn't be doing, live everyday as if it were your last.

childofthestars

Hissy_Fitz said:

My glucose is fine....always
My glucose is fine....always was and OC had zero effect.

I respect your personal thoughts on the subject, but there is no evidence that cancer "thrives" on sugar, or acid, or any other nutrient. There is an equal lack of evidence regaring the many nutritional "cures" people keep sending my way.

A healthy, balanced diet is advisable for anyone, and especially cancer patients. Asparagus, mushrooms, honey. etc do not destroy cancer cells, as far as I can tell. If you know of any reliable, scientific study that shows otherwise, please post it. I would love to be wrong about this.

Carlene

I don't suffer from
I don't suffer from diabetes.
I do agree with Carlene, I think trying to eat healthily, stay reasonably fit and active both in mind an body must count for something, I don't think there is any food or treatment out there that can precipitate a'cure'. At the end of the day though I think it's our genes that suck and no matter how 'good' we are if you're gonna get cancer you're gonna get it. Until the scientists come up with treatments that can target just cancer cells alone or some type of gene therapy we will have to stick with the toxic chemo.
It would help however if ovca was picked up earlier in most cases, the majority not being found until it's stage III or IV. I do think that there should be much more awareness of the symptoms of ovca both for women and GP's, far too many women are being fobbed off with irritable bowel or other complaints and their symptoms are not being taken seriously.
Well that's just my thoughts.
Michelle x

anicca

childofthestars said:

I don't suffer from
I don't suffer from diabetes.
I do agree with Carlene, I think trying to eat healthily, stay reasonably fit and active both in mind an body must count for something, I don't think there is any food or treatment out there that can precipitate a'cure'. At the end of the day though I think it's our genes that suck and no matter how 'good' we are if you're gonna get cancer you're gonna get it. Until the scientists come up with treatments that can target just cancer cells alone or some type of gene therapy we will have to stick with the toxic chemo.
It would help however if ovca was picked up earlier in most cases, the majority not being found until it's stage III or IV. I do think that there should be much more awareness of the symptoms of ovca both for women and GP's, far too many women are being fobbed off with irritable bowel or other complaints and their symptoms are not being taken seriously.
Well that's just my thoughts.
Michelle x

In the genes
Michelle, when you say "I think it's our genes that suck and no matter how 'good' we are if you're gonna get cancer you're gonna get it," I am basically in agreement with you. There is recent research, however, in the field of epigenetics, that has shown that the expression of some genes is affected by environmental factors like diet. I always thought I might have BRCA 1 or 2, inherited from my mom, who died of breast cancer at 41. I figured that getting to 63 without cancer meant I either didn't have the gene, or somehow disabled it by eating "right." My diet was very different from the one my mom grew up on, so that could have been possible. Well, here I am now with ovarian cancer and the joke's on me. I don't have BRCA 1 or 2, but must have some as yet unknown oncogene, not affected by the huge amounts of fresh veggies that I grew up eating; or maybe I did delay the inevitable. I doubt I'll ever know for sure.

I totally agree with you that there needs to be greater awareness. I was blown off by two ob/gyn's before I was seen by my gyn/onc. I am going to go see them both with my records in hand and read them the riot act, calmly, but firmly.

anicca

Mum2bellaandwilliam said:

@carlene
I am glad you posted this, you may have seen my post mums cancer is back, in fact it never went. In my desperate effort to find anything that may help her reading through all the posts about nutrition got me thinking.
Mum loves to drink wine which is acidic , so there I am thinking stop the wine, eat this and eat that , don't eat this and don't eat that, at the end of the day all of us need to enjoy the time we have, and stuff what we should and shouldn't be doing, live everyday as if it were your last.

Enjoy - but no wine.
Yes, your mom should enjoy whatever she can, but some chemo, including carboplatin and taxol, can cause peripheral neuropathy. Alcohol greatly exacerbates the neuropathy, so if your mom has any treatment that can possibly cause neuropathy, she should not drink. I had mild neuropathy in my hands and feet. Had my last carbo/taxol treatment on 9/9, and the neuropathy was starting to clear up, when I decided to have a few glasses of wine with Christmas dinner. I woke up the next morning with superficial numbness halfway up my left shin, where it had not been before, and my left foot much more numb than just the day before. I'll put my husband's glass of beer or wine to my lips, just for the taste, but no swallowing.
The neuropathy is already better, but I'm waiting three months after all symptoms are gone before having even half a glass of wine or beer.

goatiegirl

Asked my oncologist about sugar.
She said,"I think you should have a few chocolate malts, since you really need to gain weight after all of this." I guess there really is no evidence, according to her. I'm glad, because I think desert is one of the finer things in life. Of course, you should still eat a well balanced diet.

Nan

Hissy_Fitz

Mum2bellaandwilliam said:

@carlene
I am glad you posted this, you may have seen my post mums cancer is back, in fact it never went. In my desperate effort to find anything that may help her reading through all the posts about nutrition got me thinking.
Mum loves to drink wine which is acidic , so there I am thinking stop the wine, eat this and eat that , don't eat this and don't eat that, at the end of the day all of us need to enjoy the time we have, and stuff what we should and shouldn't be doing, live everyday as if it were your last.

Wine is fine, according to my gyn/oncologist
I am a light drinker. I have a Margarita every few weeks, usually with Mexican food (I live in Texas, after all), and when my girlfriends and I get together, we whip up a batch or two of fruity, girly drinks, with rum. I also like a glass of white wine now and again. My doctor says "all things in moderation", and he specifically said a little alcohol is not harmful, and may help alleviate anxiety.

As for genetics, diet, and cancer, my grandmother (and her siblings), as well as my mom (and her 3 sisters) all lived and grew up on the family farm. My grandmother and one brother lived there until they were 92 years old. No one in my mom's family ever had cancer, except myself and one cousin (lung cancer, and she was a smoker). I am the only woman in my mom's family to ever have a hysterectomy. My great-grandmother lived to be 88, my grandmother made it to 92, and her three siblings all lived to be at least 85 years old. My aunts died at 80 and 92, and my mother was 80 when she died, as well. All these people ate whole, unpasturized milk, real butter, white bread, red meat, and they cooked with lard. Being good Southern women, they never met a chicken they didn't think would taste better fried, or a pork chop, for that matter.

I am not advocating their diet, and especially the lard (can you even buy lard these days?), but my mother's sweet tea recipe, which I think was probably how my grandmother made it, and her grandmother before her, calls for 3 cups of sugar to one gallon of tea. I cannot imagine how much sugar my mom and her family consumed, just in sweet tea, but I know they made it every single day. And none of them had cancer. In fact, none of them had a single chronic illness, except my mom, who developed Parkinson's Disease in her 70's.

I don't remember if it was a book I read, or a TV show or movie character, but I loved this line, spoken by a woman battling Cancer, when the waiter asked if she'd like the dinner special....."No, I don't think so. These days, I'm only ordering alcohol and desserts."

Carlene

Edited to add....I have had 6 rounds of Carbo/Taxol and 12 additional doses of Taxol alone. In spite of consuming a moderate amount of alcohol throughout this regimine, I have virtually no neuropathy. I am not questioning the accuracy of your statement, but only suggesting that what you experienced is not necessarily the same thing someone else might expect.

Tethys41

No Diabeties
I did not have diabeties prior to diagnosis and still do not. I know that the issue concerning sugar is debated. I spoke to one gyn/onc in Palm Desert, prior to my surgery, and he told me that this disease is managed the same way you manage diabeties. I think he is slightly ahead of his time, but also think he is right. Yes, our cells need sugar from complex carbohydrates, but refined sugar reeks havoc on our bodies in many ways. I do believe if you are on chemo and all you can get down is food containing sugar, then go for it. I also believe that continuing to eat sugar when you are well is risky. My naturopath claims that cancer cells consume 10 to 50 times more sugar than the cells in normal tissues. I used to be so fond of desserts I could never imagine giving them up. Now, however, when I consider the risks, I feel it's just not worth it.

anicca

Hissy_Fitz said:

Wine is fine, according to my gyn/oncologist
I am a light drinker. I have a Margarita every few weeks, usually with Mexican food (I live in Texas, after all), and when my girlfriends and I get together, we whip up a batch or two of fruity, girly drinks, with rum. I also like a glass of white wine now and again. My doctor says "all things in moderation", and he specifically said a little alcohol is not harmful, and may help alleviate anxiety.

As for genetics, diet, and cancer, my grandmother (and her siblings), as well as my mom (and her 3 sisters) all lived and grew up on the family farm. My grandmother and one brother lived there until they were 92 years old. No one in my mom's family ever had cancer, except myself and one cousin (lung cancer, and she was a smoker). I am the only woman in my mom's family to ever have a hysterectomy. My great-grandmother lived to be 88, my grandmother made it to 92, and her three siblings all lived to be at least 85 years old. My aunts died at 80 and 92, and my mother was 80 when she died, as well. All these people ate whole, unpasturized milk, real butter, white bread, red meat, and they cooked with lard. Being good Southern women, they never met a chicken they didn't think would taste better fried, or a pork chop, for that matter.

I am not advocating their diet, and especially the lard (can you even buy lard these days?), but my mother's sweet tea recipe, which I think was probably how my grandmother made it, and her grandmother before her, calls for 3 cups of sugar to one gallon of tea. I cannot imagine how much sugar my mom and her family consumed, just in sweet tea, but I know they made it every single day. And none of them had cancer. In fact, none of them had a single chronic illness, except my mom, who developed Parkinson's Disease in her 70's.

I don't remember if it was a book I read, or a TV show or movie character, but I loved this line, spoken by a woman battling Cancer, when the waiter asked if she'd like the dinner special....."No, I don't think so. These days, I'm only ordering alcohol and desserts."

Carlene

Edited to add....I have had 6 rounds of Carbo/Taxol and 12 additional doses of Taxol alone. In spite of consuming a moderate amount of alcohol throughout this regimine, I have virtually no neuropathy. I am not questioning the accuracy of your statement, but only suggesting that what you experienced is not necessarily the same thing someone else might expect.

I think your story really
I think your story really emphasizes how much we don't know about biology, genetics, and cancer. Some oncogenes are inherited, and some may arise by spontaneous mutation, or from environmental damage, as in lung cancer.

Of course, my experience is not common to all. I just wanted to give a heads-up to the possibility of problems with alcohol during chemo. Sorry if I sounded alarmist. You are very lucky not to have had any neuropathy. It gets about 60% of us. I was really hoping to be in the 40%, but that's not what happened. I am surprised that your doctor allowed alcohol, as I received a diet guidelines booklet before starting chemo, that said no alcohol. More power to you for being able to get away with it. I love martinis and a beer around the campfire or with Mexican food, but it's out of the question for me. Desserts, on the other hand.... I think that line about only ordering alcohol & desserts may be from the TV series "Weeds," spoken by Celia Hodes, who has breast cancer. Does that ring a bell?

childofthestars

anicca said:

In the genes
Michelle, when you say "I think it's our genes that suck and no matter how 'good' we are if you're gonna get cancer you're gonna get it," I am basically in agreement with you. There is recent research, however, in the field of epigenetics, that has shown that the expression of some genes is affected by environmental factors like diet. I always thought I might have BRCA 1 or 2, inherited from my mom, who died of breast cancer at 41. I figured that getting to 63 without cancer meant I either didn't have the gene, or somehow disabled it by eating "right." My diet was very different from the one my mom grew up on, so that could have been possible. Well, here I am now with ovarian cancer and the joke's on me. I don't have BRCA 1 or 2, but must have some as yet unknown oncogene, not affected by the huge amounts of fresh veggies that I grew up eating; or maybe I did delay the inevitable. I doubt I'll ever know for sure.

I totally agree with you that there needs to be greater awareness. I was blown off by two ob/gyn's before I was seen by my gyn/onc. I am going to go see them both with my records in hand and read them the riot act, calmly, but firmly.

In the genes
Anicca
I'm currently waiting for the results of my BRCA results although the geneticist I saw says that if I don't show positive for BRCA 1,2 or (3?) they will continue to look down the chromosome to see if there is any other gene they can identify as I have such a strong history of familial cancer. But I do agree with you regarding environmental factors and I also believe social factors such as the stresses that our modern society puts on us that most of us live with in our day to day lives plays a huge part in disease especially cancers.
I hope both the ob/gyn's who dismissed your symptoms are truly shamefaced when you confront them and you never know that your actions may save another woman having to go through what we have!
Bright blessings
Michelle x

leesag

anicca said:

Enjoy - but no wine.
Yes, your mom should enjoy whatever she can, but some chemo, including carboplatin and taxol, can cause peripheral neuropathy. Alcohol greatly exacerbates the neuropathy, so if your mom has any treatment that can possibly cause neuropathy, she should not drink. I had mild neuropathy in my hands and feet. Had my last carbo/taxol treatment on 9/9, and the neuropathy was starting to clear up, when I decided to have a few glasses of wine with Christmas dinner. I woke up the next morning with superficial numbness halfway up my left shin, where it had not been before, and my left foot much more numb than just the day before. I'll put my husband's glass of beer or wine to my lips, just for the taste, but no swallowing.
The neuropathy is already better, but I'm waiting three months after all symptoms are gone before having even half a glass of wine or beer.

Wine Lover
I am a wine lover and a glass of red wine each night is something I have always looked forward to! When I was diagnosed, one of my first questions to both my gyn/onc and my oncologist was whether or not I could stay indulge. The answer was "Absolutely! Just don't overindulge." So, I continued my nightly wine throughout my six treatments of carbo/taxol. I think I abstained from wine for the first three or four days after my chemo treatments, just to give my body a chance to process the chemo.

I seem to recall reading some threads when I was first diagnosed that actually seemed to suggest that red wine improved the effectiveness of Avastin. Not sure how accurate those were, but since I like red wine and I'm not fond of mushrooms, I totally bought into that and told my husband that I was fighting cancer by indulging in my nightcap!

Cheers!

Leesa

(PS: I tend to look for wines from specific areas rather than specific brands...my new favorite is a New Zealand Pinot Noir from Marlborough

nancy591

anicca said:

I think your story really
I think your story really emphasizes how much we don't know about biology, genetics, and cancer. Some oncogenes are inherited, and some may arise by spontaneous mutation, or from environmental damage, as in lung cancer.

Of course, my experience is not common to all. I just wanted to give a heads-up to the possibility of problems with alcohol during chemo. Sorry if I sounded alarmist. You are very lucky not to have had any neuropathy. It gets about 60% of us. I was really hoping to be in the 40%, but that's not what happened. I am surprised that your doctor allowed alcohol, as I received a diet guidelines booklet before starting chemo, that said no alcohol. More power to you for being able to get away with it. I love martinis and a beer around the campfire or with Mexican food, but it's out of the question for me. Desserts, on the other hand.... I think that line about only ordering alcohol & desserts may be from the TV series "Weeds," spoken by Celia Hodes, who has breast cancer. Does that ring a bell?

'The Big C'
That line is from the new series The Big C on showtime. The woman has skin cancer.