When does the black cloud start to lift

soccerfreaks

SASH said:

Freaks, Soccer that is
And I'm Soccer's inspiration. I force him to tell people that. LOL

hmmm
Apparently I should have considered the internet when I got that restraining order .

Take care, my good friend,

Joe

Kent Cass

thegirlfriend said:

ok i need a new pep talk and advice.
since there is so much posted everywhere with similiar answers, i thought i would just ask one more time instead of looking thru so many pages.
Ok, today makes 6 weeks since my boyfriend finished his treatment of 6 weeks of radiation and chemo once a week. We knew once he was done, he would go back home (alone, as I live 8 hours away)and would continue to "cook" for the next 3-4 weeks at least. Is it common that he still be in pain (the soft pallet) still lots of mucous, very fatigued, still only feeding 3x a day (had to get the tube 2 weeks after treatment ended, kept losing weight)naseous as well.
Today was such a rotten day, as he could barely even get out of bed. Just to the bathroom, dont even know if he ate since he was so nauseous. Is this common or normal? Its really messing with his mind alot as he knew he had to give some time as you all told me. But its now been as long out of treatment as the actual treatment, and he still feels so awful.
only change was that his GP found a throat infection from a culture so he should now be finishing the antibiotics. He goes to all cancer related drs on Tues. I know he will tell them everything, but pls tell me this can be common. I dont want to think that there is something else wrong.

please, words of wisdom and comfort for us both?

possibility
Could be there's another issue in play- and not the cancer. Because of what the treatment does to the immune system, and the time it takes to get back up to snuff, so to speak, he couldn've been vulnerable to pick-up a virus, or some such, and that's what he's dealing with now. Primary Care physician might be the one to see- to get blood, etc., analysis.

On the last day of rad- that evening the sniffles started, and lead to a Cold that lasted the better part of a month. Was good afterwards- until I came down with another Cold of recent (8 months, now, post-treatment), but am recovering okay from that with the help of Cephalexin.

kcass

As for the black cloud syndrome- I'm 13-months post-diagnosis, and 8-months post-treatment.
During treatment I was taking two 1/2-tablets of Xanax/day, and it helped to keep the dark thoughts and clouds away. But that prescrip is long gone, along with the Vicodin and Morphine, so I don't have the attitude-helpers I had when the going was more physically rough than mental. But now, for me, is the time when the rougher going is mental...
I'll be danged if I'll go to a psychiatrist, and let him have any control over my mental well-being. I don't figure I'm different from anyone who is reading this- I can see the Reaper hovering there in the shadows of the periphery, and I now have a clue as to what the hardships of another round of treatment might bring (I salute you, Hondo, for the strength of your Spirit, which is inspiration to us all), especially in light of the somewhat-radical post-treatment condition of my mouth, and whether or not I would even be able to go thru another round of chemo/rad. And I have evaluated the ways I could die, other than what would be classified as "natural causes," and know the way I would choose- such dark thoughts I reckon have crossed all our minds, to varying degrees...The dark clouds will always be with us, as we have stared the Reaper straight in the face. Those clouds may linger close to us, or may be so far away that we just don't see them at all, but will still be there. To my way of thinking- the fact those clouds are now distant is a major victory for me, and I'll be danged if they're gonna darken my day, or night. What time I have left, or what anyone has left, is time that should be, and is, appreciated to the fullest, and witnessed with exceeding happiness. Yes, those clouds are, and always will be, there, but so long as I still breathe- I can keep those clouds in their rightful place, which is at a distance away from me, and I'll be danged if they're gonna threaten my hardfought right to enjoy the time I have left, no matter how short or long. I am still alive; and, so, those clouds are only as close to me as I let them be. As I write this, dcsecs, those clouds have grown closer to me over the past three weeks. But the fact I see this is so, and recognize such for what it is, will always keep those clouds at a distance. Yes, there is a difference between those clouds taking partial-control of one's mind, and the results of letting the dark thoughts do what they would have one do. No matter what, dcsecs, the clouds should never darken one's day. It only does if one let's it. All our days can be filled with sunshine and beauty. They truly can be.

Believe.

soccerfreaks

Kent Cass said:

possibility
Could be there's another issue in play- and not the cancer. Because of what the treatment does to the immune system, and the time it takes to get back up to snuff, so to speak, he couldn've been vulnerable to pick-up a virus, or some such, and that's what he's dealing with now. Primary Care physician might be the one to see- to get blood, etc., analysis.

On the last day of rad- that evening the sniffles started, and lead to a Cold that lasted the better part of a month. Was good afterwards- until I came down with another Cold of recent (8 months, now, post-treatment), but am recovering okay from that with the help of Cephalexin.

kcass

As for the black cloud syndrome- I'm 13-months post-diagnosis, and 8-months post-treatment.
During treatment I was taking two 1/2-tablets of Xanax/day, and it helped to keep the dark thoughts and clouds away. But that prescrip is long gone, along with the Vicodin and Morphine, so I don't have the attitude-helpers I had when the going was more physically rough than mental. But now, for me, is the time when the rougher going is mental...
I'll be danged if I'll go to a psychiatrist, and let him have any control over my mental well-being. I don't figure I'm different from anyone who is reading this- I can see the Reaper hovering there in the shadows of the periphery, and I now have a clue as to what the hardships of another round of treatment might bring (I salute you, Hondo, for the strength of your Spirit, which is inspiration to us all), especially in light of the somewhat-radical post-treatment condition of my mouth, and whether or not I would even be able to go thru another round of chemo/rad. And I have evaluated the ways I could die, other than what would be classified as "natural causes," and know the way I would choose- such dark thoughts I reckon have crossed all our minds, to varying degrees...The dark clouds will always be with us, as we have stared the Reaper straight in the face. Those clouds may linger close to us, or may be so far away that we just don't see them at all, but will still be there. To my way of thinking- the fact those clouds are now distant is a major victory for me, and I'll be danged if they're gonna darken my day, or night. What time I have left, or what anyone has left, is time that should be, and is, appreciated to the fullest, and witnessed with exceeding happiness. Yes, those clouds are, and always will be, there, but so long as I still breathe- I can keep those clouds in their rightful place, which is at a distance away from me, and I'll be danged if they're gonna threaten my hardfought right to enjoy the time I have left, no matter how short or long. I am still alive; and, so, those clouds are only as close to me as I let them be. As I write this, dcsecs, those clouds have grown closer to me over the past three weeks. But the fact I see this is so, and recognize such for what it is, will always keep those clouds at a distance. Yes, there is a difference between those clouds taking partial-control of one's mind, and the results of letting the dark thoughts do what they would have one do. No matter what, dcsecs, the clouds should never darken one's day. It only does if one let's it. All our days can be filled with sunshine and beauty. They truly can be.

Believe.

Believe this
Regrettably, Kent, your response is a direct confirmation of the suggestion in my first post herein that men are genetically and/or culturally disinclined to seek professional help for depression.

Without knowing the religious disposition of the person I responded to (and more importantly, that of her husband), let me suggest to you that not all of us are believers. We do not have prophets, either Jesus or Mohammed (or whomever else is running around out there without my knowledge). Some of us are on our own and even if we ARE believers, we are perhaps not so certain as you and some others are.

I do not disparage your belief. I envy it. But I do not have it.

The reason to bring that up is to say that belief does, I know, fill some large spaces in people if given a chance. But when it is not there for us, we have to find other ways. And even some of us who HAVE faith find it useful to seek help here on earth. I think one of your religion's most useful doctrines (right after Do unto others as you would have them do unto you) is the one that says God helps those who help themselves.

If that means getting therapy, then so be it.

Some people, a LOT of people, find it useful to talk to someone other than those they know best. They find it useful somehow to talk to someone to whom, as a friend of mine put it, they can tell the truth knowing they will not be faulted for it. At least for an hour.

I could offer, as Shakespeare might, that 'methinks thou doth protest too much", but I won't. If you are good without therapy, then all the power to you, Kent.

Most of us, many of us, get by without therapy and that is good. I still insist that a psychologist, at the very least, ought to be part of every cancer team. Some day that will be true, I am convinced, as the doctors and scientists and researchers now become more and more convinced that we are sometimes casualties, if you will, of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder or something similar, among other issues that we confront.


Therapy is not for everyone, I agree, but neither is religion.

And sometimes a dose of both is the best solution.

Take care,

Joe

dcsecs

soccerfreaks said:

Believe this
Regrettably, Kent, your response is a direct confirmation of the suggestion in my first post herein that men are genetically and/or culturally disinclined to seek professional help for depression.

Without knowing the religious disposition of the person I responded to (and more importantly, that of her husband), let me suggest to you that not all of us are believers. We do not have prophets, either Jesus or Mohammed (or whomever else is running around out there without my knowledge). Some of us are on our own and even if we ARE believers, we are perhaps not so certain as you and some others are.

I do not disparage your belief. I envy it. But I do not have it.

The reason to bring that up is to say that belief does, I know, fill some large spaces in people if given a chance. But when it is not there for us, we have to find other ways. And even some of us who HAVE faith find it useful to seek help here on earth. I think one of your religion's most useful doctrines (right after Do unto others as you would have them do unto you) is the one that says God helps those who help themselves.

If that means getting therapy, then so be it.

Some people, a LOT of people, find it useful to talk to someone other than those they know best. They find it useful somehow to talk to someone to whom, as a friend of mine put it, they can tell the truth knowing they will not be faulted for it. At least for an hour.

I could offer, as Shakespeare might, that 'methinks thou doth protest too much", but I won't. If you are good without therapy, then all the power to you, Kent.

Most of us, many of us, get by without therapy and that is good. I still insist that a psychologist, at the very least, ought to be part of every cancer team. Some day that will be true, I am convinced, as the doctors and scientists and researchers now become more and more convinced that we are sometimes casualties, if you will, of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder or something similar, among other issues that we confront.


Therapy is not for everyone, I agree, but neither is religion.

And sometimes a dose of both is the best solution.

Take care,

Joe

Thanks for all your thoughts
Thanks to everyone for their thoughts on this subject. I really has helped me sort through some of these feelings. I guess I was looking for "the answer" on how to deal with all of this, and like a lot of things in life, there is no straight answer. We all have to feel our way through and figure out what works best for us. Life is a day to day struggle. Whether it is an illness or some other problem. If you find your strength from a faith in God, or faith in humanity, or simply from having faith in yourself, we have to draw on it during these times. I think there is a black cloud lurking in the distance for everyone. Life can change in an instant and we need to help ourselves accept those changes and if we are unable to do that on our own, we need to look for some assistance. I thinks soccerfreaks thoughts about a psychologist being a part of all cancer teams is a great idea. I think we would have benefited from that since my husband really doesn't know how to reach out to a mental health professional. I think he sees it as a sign of weakness. Oh well, I could go on, and on about this.

Peace and good health to all.

pattyanny

delnative said:

My cousin's thoughts
I guess I'm fortunate that my black cloud blew away pretty quickly. I think that coincided with the phone call from my lead doctor before I began treatment that my tonsil cancer (Stage III) was caused by HPV and my chances thus were much better than if it had been caused by something else. I've been upbeat ever since; I'm now 13 months out of treatment and will have a PET scan next month. Honestly, I'm not worried about it.
However, your story reminded me of something my dear cousin mentioned to me in an e-mail when I told her I had been diagnosed with cancer. She's a breast cancer survivor. Her mother survived it, but my cousin's younger sister, who also was very dear to me, died from it.
My surviving cousin told me that her experience with cancer was very much like a sentence that never ended with a period. All there was was another comma. It sounds to me like you're waiting for the period, and getting nothing but commas.
I saved my cousin's e-mail, because much of what she told me was so powerful and life-affirming that I believe it helped me get through my treatment. What follows is an excerpt from her e-mail. I hope you find it helpful.

--Jim in Delaware

She wrote:
"I thought I had been in pretty good emotional shape going into the
surgery, but hearing this news -- alone in my hospital bed -- was a real
shock. I remember lying awake for many hours, worried, scared that the
tumor, which started out too small to feel, was so aggressive that it
had already invaded many lymph nodes. Then I was overcome with the
presence of an all-powerful God. Really quite Old-Testament in the
awesome aspect of the power. And I was told that nothing, certainly not
cancer, could stand in the face of this power. Cancer disintegrates in
the face of such power. What I was left with was the call to faith: "all
shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be
well." I was left with the word that I needed to leave my healing to our
Lord, and that my job was to be about my Father's business -- loving and
serving."

Thank you!
Oh my gosh Jim! Thank you for sharing your cousins letter. I was quite moved by her powerful words, and will print it and carry it with me so I may read it over and over again when I find myself sinking into despair. God bless you both for helping so many on this forum. My prayers are with you both! Patty

Kent Cass

soccerfreaks said:

Believe this
Regrettably, Kent, your response is a direct confirmation of the suggestion in my first post herein that men are genetically and/or culturally disinclined to seek professional help for depression.

Without knowing the religious disposition of the person I responded to (and more importantly, that of her husband), let me suggest to you that not all of us are believers. We do not have prophets, either Jesus or Mohammed (or whomever else is running around out there without my knowledge). Some of us are on our own and even if we ARE believers, we are perhaps not so certain as you and some others are.

I do not disparage your belief. I envy it. But I do not have it.

The reason to bring that up is to say that belief does, I know, fill some large spaces in people if given a chance. But when it is not there for us, we have to find other ways. And even some of us who HAVE faith find it useful to seek help here on earth. I think one of your religion's most useful doctrines (right after Do unto others as you would have them do unto you) is the one that says God helps those who help themselves.

If that means getting therapy, then so be it.

Some people, a LOT of people, find it useful to talk to someone other than those they know best. They find it useful somehow to talk to someone to whom, as a friend of mine put it, they can tell the truth knowing they will not be faulted for it. At least for an hour.

I could offer, as Shakespeare might, that 'methinks thou doth protest too much", but I won't. If you are good without therapy, then all the power to you, Kent.

Most of us, many of us, get by without therapy and that is good. I still insist that a psychologist, at the very least, ought to be part of every cancer team. Some day that will be true, I am convinced, as the doctors and scientists and researchers now become more and more convinced that we are sometimes casualties, if you will, of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder or something similar, among other issues that we confront.


Therapy is not for everyone, I agree, but neither is religion.

And sometimes a dose of both is the best solution.

Take care,

Joe

apology
I was only talking about me, personally, Joe. And I DO AGREE that Psychologists can play an important part in someone's treatment, if the black clouds get too close. I re-read what I wrote last night, and do realize I am wrong about it- very wrong. And Lord knows how large the burden can be for us, especially at the start- SO, YES, I WOULD ENCOURAGE ANYONE WHO IS STRUGGLING WITH THEIR SITUTATION TO NOT HESITATE TO SEEK HELP FROM A PSYCHOLOGIST. Cancer brings with it a need to be strong, but a significant part of our strength is the support group who are part of our lives, which should include anyone who helps to keep the dark clouds and thoughts so far away from us that they don't bring more negatives into these trying times of our lives. And I give my deepest apology to anyone who read what I wrote, and was hurt by it- I was wrong.

I've been struggling, myself, Joe, and perhaps what I wrote is evidence of it. Just not the best of post-treatment times for me. Please understand.

kcass

Paintslinger

Black cloud? I hear ya
I just started writing on this site today at the advice of my docs. I finished my last treatment for HPV positive squamous cell carcinoma in October. I had a PET scan in April that showed no sign of cancer. I have beaten this beast (for now) and should be elated, right? Wrong. I've already heard from some people with advice about my problem on this site about my issues (see below)and I can't believe how kind and supportive some people can be towards someone they've never even met. Unbelievable. I'll pass on to you something that someone has already told me: You've come to the right place.
My life was kind of a sit-com even before my cancer diagnosis and treatment. But after the treatment (which was rough, but not as rough as some have had it)and even now seven months out I'm always depressed, bored, and just waiting for the next lightning strike.I had the support of friends and family throughout my ordeal and have a young son whom I adore so I really have nothing to complain about (other than the obvious). As I stated in an earlier comment to someone else, you can describe this experience to someone all day long but if they've never been through it they just won't get it.Your husband is very lucky to have you. You guys have been going through this for a lot longer than I have, and you both have my respect and admiration. I sincerely hope that things get better for you guys and I'm overjoyed to hear that Hubby is healthy.
Sincerely,
Paul (Paintslinger)

Paintslinger

thegirlfriend said:

ok i need a new pep talk and advice.
since there is so much posted everywhere with similiar answers, i thought i would just ask one more time instead of looking thru so many pages.
Ok, today makes 6 weeks since my boyfriend finished his treatment of 6 weeks of radiation and chemo once a week. We knew once he was done, he would go back home (alone, as I live 8 hours away)and would continue to "cook" for the next 3-4 weeks at least. Is it common that he still be in pain (the soft pallet) still lots of mucous, very fatigued, still only feeding 3x a day (had to get the tube 2 weeks after treatment ended, kept losing weight)naseous as well.
Today was such a rotten day, as he could barely even get out of bed. Just to the bathroom, dont even know if he ate since he was so nauseous. Is this common or normal? Its really messing with his mind alot as he knew he had to give some time as you all told me. But its now been as long out of treatment as the actual treatment, and he still feels so awful.
only change was that his GP found a throat infection from a culture so he should now be finishing the antibiotics. He goes to all cancer related drs on Tues. I know he will tell them everything, but pls tell me this can be common. I dont want to think that there is something else wrong.

please, words of wisdom and comfort for us both?

It gets better
Hey Girlfriend,
Let me first tell you that your boyfriend is VERY lucky to have you in his life.I just started writing on this site today at the suggestion of my docs. You have no idea how glad I am that I did. There are some truly amazing people on this site.Sounds like your boyfriend is having a rough time of it right now.I finished my last treatment for HPV positive squamous cell carcinoma (seven weeks of chemo/radiation:suffice it to say they blasted me)in October and went through a couple of really rough patches (although not nearly as rough as some have had it,e.g., The docs thought I would need a feeding tube but I didn't ),so I can relate to how your boyfriend might be feeling right now. The docs warned me going in that the treatment for my cancer would be pretty rough, but the prognosis was relatively favorable considering my age and otherwise general good health. I had three rounds of chemo, and radiation every day for seven weeks.As I said, I had some rough days (and nights)and I was fortunate--as your boyfriend is--to have my girlfriend, my son, and friends and family with me while I went through this. In fact, my girlfriend sat with me through all three chemo sessions (each of which was an all day affair).
Stay by his side (and give him his space if he needs it)and be patient with him. I can assure you that he will be eternally grateful for your efforts even if he doesn't tell you.Once things start to get better (and they will) your relationship will be that much stronger because the two of you have gone through this together.
Take care and tell him I wish him a speedy recovery...it will get better,
Paul(Paintslinger)