Another secret cure for cancer?

PhillieG

kristasplace said:

I agree...
I can't agree more with Laurie. While doing research, i always check to see who wrote or published the information, and then i dig and see who they're in bed with. Sometimes it's very difficult to find out who is publishing what, but i can tell you that wikipedia in particular is not drawn up by any unbiased sources, and anyone can go in there and write what they want. I no longer trust or believe anything anyone says who is in bed with the AMA, or any and all pharmaceutical companies. They're the ones with a vested interest in traditional cancer treatments, and there is no money to make in apricot kernels. The FDA hasn't approved any food alternatives for a cure because no one is going to invest a billion dollars in proper research if they can't get a return on their money. My doctor told me that my cancer treatments have cost an upwards of a million dollars! Each one of us is an undisputed money pit, especially if they can string us along in treatment for years and years and years.

Listen to what other cancer patients have experienced with certain alternative treatments. That's always a seller for me. Seeing people who were "terminal" coming out better than pre-cancer many years after their doctors gave up on them. Read the studies being published by other countries who do not have big corporate businesses controlling the research. These are very hard to find, but i believe there is a study from Norway that proved apricot kernels cured cancer. I will try to find it, though i didn't hear about it online.

I will continue to post about alternative cures i come across, and i hope that many of you do the same with your own research. We all deserve to know the truth, whatever it may be.

Hugs,
Krista

Me too
I always look at the source with research. Anyone can put up a web page, it's not rocket science at all or like trying to find a cure for cancer. You can even look up to see who owns the domain name and see if they own anything else.

And it's no secret that Wikipedia is a user created online information resource that has volunteers who edit and fact check the entries. They usually do have footnotes to where they got their information.

Yes, we live in the "information age" but what does that mean? There's a saying, "believe only half of what you see, and nothing that you hear". While the idea that "they" are holding on to a cure for cancer is horrific, it certainly is possible having seen over the last decade (and longer) the way truth has a way of being hidden and how the drive behind just about everything this country and the world does is for $$$$.

Cars can be made to last forever and not be dependent on oil. Do you really think we'd be in the Middle East if it were not for oil? Solar, wind or other "free" energy sources are out there but they are FREE, that nasty 4 letter word. What about marijuana? That has many medicinal uses but big pharm squashes that.

The world is about making money, not about our best interests at all.

I think I could pretty much guarantee that you can find a study on about anything and how it cured cancer. Then you have a study that was possibly found on the internet which may or may not be true.

Too often I've heard the story of a friend of a friend who knows his sister's brother-in-law's twice removed Uncle was cured of cancer by rubbing a rutabaga on the sole of their left foot. Now I don't know the rutabaga-rubber personally, but I heard about it!

I hope we all get cured of cancer by whatever means we can but will we ever know the truth?
We can't handle the truth.
~Jack

2bhealed

PhillieG said:

Me too
I always look at the source with research. Anyone can put up a web page, it's not rocket science at all or like trying to find a cure for cancer. You can even look up to see who owns the domain name and see if they own anything else.

And it's no secret that Wikipedia is a user created online information resource that has volunteers who edit and fact check the entries. They usually do have footnotes to where they got their information.

Yes, we live in the "information age" but what does that mean? There's a saying, "believe only half of what you see, and nothing that you hear". While the idea that "they" are holding on to a cure for cancer is horrific, it certainly is possible having seen over the last decade (and longer) the way truth has a way of being hidden and how the drive behind just about everything this country and the world does is for $$$$.

Cars can be made to last forever and not be dependent on oil. Do you really think we'd be in the Middle East if it were not for oil? Solar, wind or other "free" energy sources are out there but they are FREE, that nasty 4 letter word. What about marijuana? That has many medicinal uses but big pharm squashes that.

The world is about making money, not about our best interests at all.

I think I could pretty much guarantee that you can find a study on about anything and how it cured cancer. Then you have a study that was possibly found on the internet which may or may not be true.

Too often I've heard the story of a friend of a friend who knows his sister's brother-in-law's twice removed Uncle was cured of cancer by rubbing a rutabaga on the sole of their left foot. Now I don't know the rutabaga-rubber personally, but I heard about it!

I hope we all get cured of cancer by whatever means we can but will we ever know the truth?
We can't handle the truth.
~Jack

Dang nab it!
And all this time I've been rubbing the rutabaga on my right foot! Well, there ya go. No wonder.

snommintj

laurie83833 said:

Death by Apricot seeds?
I did a search on various terms:

Death by Apricots, Death by Apricot seeds, Murder by Apricots, Murder by Apricot seeds, Suicide by Apricot seeds, Overdose of Apricot seeds etc. All in phrases and also boliene searchs by separate words. There has not been anything even remotely on the internet about any one instance of someone dying due to an overdoes of Apricot seeds. Maybe I just didn't search correctly but even if there was a case of someone dying from an overdose of Apricot seeds it certainly is not common some may feel some side effects if they eat to many or their system does not handle the seeds well. It is said if someone has a cup or more of Apricot seeds they may feel ill or worse with side effects (so Don't test that theory out). There would literally have to be over 200 seeds at one time taken to equal 1 cp of Apricot seeds. I do not know of anyone that has even attempted to take this many nor would I suggest anyone to try to see what if it has ill effects. With that being said I know some people who have reported taken up to 40 seeds a day (not at one time) but through out the day and according to them they did not have any side effects. I myself would not digest 40 Apricot seeds in a day I think from what my research has been both by reading on the internet and speaking directly with those taking Apricot seeds daily. The average per day runs from 5 - 25 per day. I think I read somewhere that a safe amount was 1 per 10 pounds of body weight daily. My husband was just diagnosed with Colon Cancer and had surgery to remove. He has been starting to take Apricot seeds, Aloe Vera Juice, some other vitamins and also will be on more healthier diet, while these things MAY OR MAY NOT HELP in his cancer recovery - we figure it certainly cannot hurt and is better then just waiting around for the next test results to come in and doing absolutly nothing on our own. As of now The DR's have not recommended any Chemo as his stage is Stage 1-2 (in that area), they will be reviewing shortly to see if they (the Onocological board) feels adjuctant treatment would be benificial in my husbands case

Glad I found this board, but as far as Apricot seeds I suggest each do their own research and due dilligence in deciding if this is something they would like to do. Of couse Apricot seeds are not approved by the FDA (nor is most natural herbs or foods so this isn't a surprise) so is you use Apricot seeds for anything would be by your own accord and responsibilty. Be responsible, open minded and do your own research. As for us we are going to give it a try - myself included I am eating about 7 a day myself and my husband if I can get him to do about 15 (as he hates the taste) but how ever many he chooses to eat if any a day will be totally up to him.

Knowledge is power
For someone so enthusiastic about apricot seeds, I would think you would be more informed. You should do a search with three words, apricot, death, and poison. I think you'll find every reference very informative. Or you could study a little chemistry. Amygdalin is a glucoside that when mixed with your stomach contents converts directly to hydrogen cyanide. An average fatal dose of hydrogen cyanide is less than 50 mg. If you throw in a little vitamin c then the fatal dose drops by 15-20%. That means an average 4 oz bag of apricot seeds could kill 3 adults if consumed in one sitting. That could be as little as 30 seeds. Throw into the mix the varying levels within seeds and that could go up or down. Of course peoples stomach contents vary so maybe you could eat more if you take an antacid. But seriously why risk it.
Without knowing the chemistry, you could just study some history. The most common form of poisonings throughout history have been derivatives of only a few plants. Amir Timor, aka Tamerlame, perhaps the greatest conquerer of all time used a potion made of apricot seeds to wipe out entire populations. Later his grandson Uleg Beg was killed by his son in battle after being poisoned with apricot seeds.
Most recently, the KGB used a nice little mixture of cyanide and ricin to dispatch many victims. Any guesses on how you make it. Ground apricot seeds and castor beans.
So, don't tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. If I tell someone to be careful because they can overdose, bet your **** they can overdose. Don't throw your two cents in if you are uninformed especially when someone health is on the line.

laurie83833

snommintj said:

Knowledge is power
For someone so enthusiastic about apricot seeds, I would think you would be more informed. You should do a search with three words, apricot, death, and poison. I think you'll find every reference very informative. Or you could study a little chemistry. Amygdalin is a glucoside that when mixed with your stomach contents converts directly to hydrogen cyanide. An average fatal dose of hydrogen cyanide is less than 50 mg. If you throw in a little vitamin c then the fatal dose drops by 15-20%. That means an average 4 oz bag of apricot seeds could kill 3 adults if consumed in one sitting. That could be as little as 30 seeds. Throw into the mix the varying levels within seeds and that could go up or down. Of course peoples stomach contents vary so maybe you could eat more if you take an antacid. But seriously why risk it.
Without knowing the chemistry, you could just study some history. The most common form of poisonings throughout history have been derivatives of only a few plants. Amir Timor, aka Tamerlame, perhaps the greatest conquerer of all time used a potion made of apricot seeds to wipe out entire populations. Later his grandson Uleg Beg was killed by his son in battle after being poisoned with apricot seeds.
Most recently, the KGB used a nice little mixture of cyanide and ricin to dispatch many victims. Any guesses on how you make it. Ground apricot seeds and castor beans.
So, don't tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. If I tell someone to be careful because they can overdose, bet your **** they can overdose. Don't throw your two cents in if you are uninformed especially when someone health is on the line.

Did not say overdosing was impossible
Sorry didn't mean you to think I was personally attacking your statement if you felt that I do aplogize. Of couse ~ I am sure one can overdose on Apricot seeds after all they contain trace amounts of cyanide in each seed. I was simply noteing that there has been no recent news, headline in current media today of anyone that has recently overdosed on Apricot seeds and if it was a common occurance then the news surely would have hit the media. There are vituraly thousands upon thousands of people in the US today and around the world especially in China that consume Apricot seeds as part of their daily diet intake not necessarly for cancer but for other aliments also.

I wanted to be sure we were not taking a letal dose of seeds so I brought out my digital postal scale and measured out 4 ounces of Apricot seeds and the count came to 197 seeds to make 4 ounces. I could see where this could possibly be a leathal dose even if divided by 3 adults would be around 66 seeds so this is good information for people to know. Im not sure if I have heard of anyone taking more then 40 throughout the day (I would not take that many NO WAY) I think they said they broke them up into 8 differnet intervals during the day, the average what what I have read and spoken to indiviuals (adults) is between 3-15 spaced out throughout the day anyrate we only do about 7-8 per day so I think we will be safe.

Either or was just hanging on to a thread of HOPE and a posibility. I will not be posting anything about Apricot seeds on this forum or how it has or has not done in our situation.

trish07

kristasplace said:

Budwig diet
Hi Kathleen! I have not heard of the Budwig diet, but i know flax is miraculous in it's own right.

I will look it up and see what others say about it. I'm curious how the cottage cheese would work? Maybe as a fermentation agent?

Thanks for mentioning it!

Hugs,
Krista

cottage cheese..
The cottage cheese is just the best thing they have found to help diquise the fowl taste of the flaxseed oil. Also, if you are currently on chemotherapy the literature on using flaxseed oil to cure cancer says to first check with your oncologist before taking it.

snommintj

laurie83833 said:

Did not say overdosing was impossible
Sorry didn't mean you to think I was personally attacking your statement if you felt that I do aplogize. Of couse ~ I am sure one can overdose on Apricot seeds after all they contain trace amounts of cyanide in each seed. I was simply noteing that there has been no recent news, headline in current media today of anyone that has recently overdosed on Apricot seeds and if it was a common occurance then the news surely would have hit the media. There are vituraly thousands upon thousands of people in the US today and around the world especially in China that consume Apricot seeds as part of their daily diet intake not necessarly for cancer but for other aliments also.

I wanted to be sure we were not taking a letal dose of seeds so I brought out my digital postal scale and measured out 4 ounces of Apricot seeds and the count came to 197 seeds to make 4 ounces. I could see where this could possibly be a leathal dose even if divided by 3 adults would be around 66 seeds so this is good information for people to know. Im not sure if I have heard of anyone taking more then 40 throughout the day (I would not take that many NO WAY) I think they said they broke them up into 8 differnet intervals during the day, the average what what I have read and spoken to indiviuals (adults) is between 3-15 spaced out throughout the day anyrate we only do about 7-8 per day so I think we will be safe.

Either or was just hanging on to a thread of HOPE and a posibility. I will not be posting anything about Apricot seeds on this forum or how it has or has not done in our situation.

No apology necessary
I didn't feel personally attacked. I felt like you were telling everyone on the board there was no way to overdose on apricot seeds. When there is most definitely a way. I don't condemn anyone for taking them, as I said in my initial post, I take them when I get them. I take them because cyanide is the ultimate antioxidant. Nothing like a triple bonded nitrogen to strip away some wayward free radicals. But anyway, you hadn't heard of it so it mustn't have been true. Well it is, I want everyone who takes them to know that under the right circumstances an overdose is possible with a relatively small amount. If you're taking them great, just be careful and alert to how many you're eating. I have no agenda to persuade folks to start or stop using them, just be careful, that's all.

2bhealed

trish07 said:

cottage cheese..
The cottage cheese is just the best thing they have found to help diquise the fowl taste of the flaxseed oil. Also, if you are currently on chemotherapy the literature on using flaxseed oil to cure cancer says to first check with your oncologist before taking it.

Foul taste?
Wow, I drizzle flax oil on my steamed veggies, put it in my smoothies, use it as my salad dressing....I don't find the taste foul at all. Maybe different brand oils taste differently?

peace, emily

serrana

2bhealed said:

Dang nab it!
And all this time I've been rubbing the rutabaga on my right foot! Well, there ya go. No wonder.

another secret cure

I have researched much of the alt med "cures" for years and wish they were true
Maybe they are. However for now I'll agree with Phil all the way and advise extreme caution.

If the "secret cures" were cures, big pharma would have already isolated the ingredients, changed their names to something unspellable, and would be selling it in capsules or infusions to all of us at a huge price. Follow the money, if it is good, big pharma would know about it.

My son is a molecular immunologist and tells me that big pharma watches these things intensely
researches them and if in a few years the research doesn't pan out it means the compound is
not one to market or do trials on. The NCI has an entire section devoted to researching every thing imaginable in alt med.....from starfish to tree bark etc etc etc. The NIH is on this issue.

Serrana














P.S.
This doesn't mean that juicing ordinary food is in that category, food is what we are supposed to eat, in ordinary combinations not in excesses. Obviously if beets are good, too many beets may not be good.

kristasplace

The cyanide issue
I'm not an organic chemist, though i did do fairly well in my chemistry courses! I leave all the scientific nomenclature to my buddy who is an organic chemist, and works for a big pharmaceutical company here in San Diego.

I found an explanation of the metabolic reaction to apricot kernel cyanide, and chemical cyanide, and apparently they react differently with the body. I couldn't find who wrote it, so i emailed it to my chemist friend, and he said it was true. Hopefully this will end the controversy about the toxins in the kernels. Here is the article:

The purpose of this recital on the subject of cyanide is to clarify the continual misconception that laetrile contains chemical cyanide. It does not contain chemical cyanide, but it does contain cyanide ion (-CN). When laetrile is metabolized in the body it is converted to thiocyanate, a relatively non-toxic product that has inhibitory effect against cancer (Contreras, 1982).

The term "cyanide" is used to designate hydrogen cyanide (also known as hydrocyanic acid, prussic acid, or formonitrile), or cyanide salts (sodium cyanide (NaCN), potassium cyanide (KCN), or calcium cyanide (Ca(CN)2). The word "cyanide" or the symbol "CN" are commonly used to designate both hydrogen cyanide as well as the salts of cyanide. These cyanide substances are also referred to as "free cyanide." When the term "cyanide" is used, it refers to one of the above substances. This is an important fundamental point of chemistry and toxicology because on this point hinges most of the deceptions and fraudulent claims of anti-laetrilists. Most of the information provided in this presentation is taken directly from the publication of the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health (NIOSH), U.S. Department of Health, Education, and Welfare (DHEW), entitled Occupational Exposure to Hydrogen Cyanide and Cyanide Salts (NIOSH, 1976), and the Merck Index, 9th edition, 1976 and the 11th edition, 1989.

Hydrogen Cyanide (hydrocyanic acid, prussic acid, or formonitrile): Hydrogen cyanide is prepared on a large scale by the catalytic oxidation of ammonia-methane mixtures, or by the catalytic decomposition of form amide. The chemical formula is HCN. The molecular weight is 27.03. The elemental composition is C 44.44%, H 3.73%, N 51.83%. It is a colorless gas or liquid, having a penetrating characteristic odor of bitter almonds.

Sodium Cyanide: The commercial form of this compound form of this compound is 95-98% pure, and is known as cyanogran. Mixtures of sodium cyanide with sodium chloride or carbonate are marketed for various purposes. NaCN is a white crystalline solid at room temperature. The chemical formula is NaCN. The molecular weight is 49.02. The elemental composition is C 24.50%, N 28.58%, Na 48.92%. NaCN consists of either white granules or fused pieces. It is odorless when dry but emits an odor of HCN when moist. The aqueous solution is strongly alkaline. It is commercially produced from coke-oven gas by the reaction of HCN and sodium hydroxide.

Potassium Cyanide: The chemical formula is KCN. The molecular weight is 65.11. The elemental composition is C 18.440%, K 60.05%, N 21.51%. The article of commerce contains about 95% KCN. Strong solutions are can be absorbed through the skin. KCN is in the form of white granules or fused pieces which, when exposed to the air, may emit an odor of HCN. An aqueous solution is strongly alkaline. KCN is commercially produced by methods similar to NaCN.

Calcium Cyanide: The chemical formula is Ca(CN)2, commercially known as black cyanide. The molecular weight is 92.12. The elemental composition is C 26.0%, Ca 43.52%, N 30.41%. The commercial product of this compound contains 40-50% of Ca (CN)2. Ca(CN)2 consists of crystals or a powder. When moist it emits an odor of HCN. Ca(CN)2 is commercially made by heating calcium cyanamide in a electric furnace at high temperatures in the presence of sodium chloride, and then rapidly cooling it. Ca(CN)2 is used in a variety of manufacturing procedures.

Hugs,
Krista

PhillieG

2bhealed said:

Foul taste?
Wow, I drizzle flax oil on my steamed veggies, put it in my smoothies, use it as my salad dressing....I don't find the taste foul at all. Maybe different brand oils taste differently?

peace, emily

Emily
I don't think I can make it to any dinner invitation that may have been in the works!
;-)
Peace (of pie)
-phil

sfmarie

Not sure
If there are truly "secret" cures that are indeed cures and not being made available to the public. I may be naive in believing in the good of mankind, thinking that if there were a cure out there, it would be widely available. I have read about people that travelled to Mexico to a clinic claiming the apricot kernels as a treatment, where they spend thousands of dollars, and were not cured. The same article also said, however, that they felt their loved ones found peace at that clinic, for whatever reason that may be. However, everyone makes their own choices and if it works for you then great! Hugs back to you Krista. Marie

jscho

sfmarie said:

Not sure
If there are truly "secret" cures that are indeed cures and not being made available to the public. I may be naive in believing in the good of mankind, thinking that if there were a cure out there, it would be widely available. I have read about people that travelled to Mexico to a clinic claiming the apricot kernels as a treatment, where they spend thousands of dollars, and were not cured. The same article also said, however, that they felt their loved ones found peace at that clinic, for whatever reason that may be. However, everyone makes their own choices and if it works for you then great! Hugs back to you Krista. Marie

secret cures would not be secret?
I have not much faith in mankind either, but don't believe secret cures exist and are begin suppressed for financial reasons. First of all, cancer is not a single disease and I don't expect a single drug agent or therapy to cure all forms. There are simply too many ways that the biology of the cell can go wrong, and many simultaneous defects (mutations) are necessary to cause cancerous proliferation. These differences lead to a differences in response of even the same type of "garden-variety" colorectal adenocarcinoma to chemotherapy drugs.

Even if a drug is discovered that does cure a majority of cases of a certain type of cancer, it does not seem likely it would remain secret. The resulting fame and riches from such a discovery, nobel prizes and so on, would be too great for anyone working in this area to resist, whether they be in an academic environment or in the private sector. Again, human greediness would lead to its disclosure.

Just my opinion,
Jeremy

jscho

kristasplace said:

The cyanide issue
I'm not an organic chemist, though i did do fairly well in my chemistry courses! I leave all the scientific nomenclature to my buddy who is an organic chemist, and works for a big pharmaceutical company here in San Diego.

I found an explanation of the metabolic reaction to apricot kernel cyanide, and chemical cyanide, and apparently they react differently with the body. I couldn't find who wrote it, so i emailed it to my chemist friend, and he said it was true. Hopefully this will end the controversy about the toxins in the kernels. Here is the article:

The purpose of this recital on the subject of cyanide is to clarify the continual misconception that laetrile contains chemical cyanide. It does not contain chemical cyanide, but it does contain cyanide ion (-CN). When laetrile is metabolized in the body it is converted to thiocyanate, a relatively non-toxic product that has inhibitory effect against cancer (Contreras, 1982).

The term "cyanide" is used to designate hydrogen cyanide (also known as hydrocyanic acid, prussic acid, or formonitrile), or cyanide salts (sodium cyanide (NaCN), potassium cyanide (KCN), or calcium cyanide (Ca(CN)2). The word "cyanide" or the symbol "CN" are commonly used to designate both hydrogen cyanide as well as the salts of cyanide. These cyanide substances are also referred to as "free cyanide." When the term "cyanide" is used, it refers to one of the above substances. This is an important fundamental point of chemistry and toxicology because on this point hinges most of the deceptions and fraudulent claims of anti-laetrilists. Most of the information provided in this presentation is taken directly from the publication of the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health (NIOSH), U.S. Department of Health, Education, and Welfare (DHEW), entitled Occupational Exposure to Hydrogen Cyanide and Cyanide Salts (NIOSH, 1976), and the Merck Index, 9th edition, 1976 and the 11th edition, 1989.

Hydrogen Cyanide (hydrocyanic acid, prussic acid, or formonitrile): Hydrogen cyanide is prepared on a large scale by the catalytic oxidation of ammonia-methane mixtures, or by the catalytic decomposition of form amide. The chemical formula is HCN. The molecular weight is 27.03. The elemental composition is C 44.44%, H 3.73%, N 51.83%. It is a colorless gas or liquid, having a penetrating characteristic odor of bitter almonds.

Sodium Cyanide: The commercial form of this compound form of this compound is 95-98% pure, and is known as cyanogran. Mixtures of sodium cyanide with sodium chloride or carbonate are marketed for various purposes. NaCN is a white crystalline solid at room temperature. The chemical formula is NaCN. The molecular weight is 49.02. The elemental composition is C 24.50%, N 28.58%, Na 48.92%. NaCN consists of either white granules or fused pieces. It is odorless when dry but emits an odor of HCN when moist. The aqueous solution is strongly alkaline. It is commercially produced from coke-oven gas by the reaction of HCN and sodium hydroxide.

Potassium Cyanide: The chemical formula is KCN. The molecular weight is 65.11. The elemental composition is C 18.440%, K 60.05%, N 21.51%. The article of commerce contains about 95% KCN. Strong solutions are can be absorbed through the skin. KCN is in the form of white granules or fused pieces which, when exposed to the air, may emit an odor of HCN. An aqueous solution is strongly alkaline. KCN is commercially produced by methods similar to NaCN.

Calcium Cyanide: The chemical formula is Ca(CN)2, commercially known as black cyanide. The molecular weight is 92.12. The elemental composition is C 26.0%, Ca 43.52%, N 30.41%. The commercial product of this compound contains 40-50% of Ca (CN)2. Ca(CN)2 consists of crystals or a powder. When moist it emits an odor of HCN. Ca(CN)2 is commercially made by heating calcium cyanamide in a electric furnace at high temperatures in the presence of sodium chloride, and then rapidly cooling it. Ca(CN)2 is used in a variety of manufacturing procedures.

Hugs,
Krista

Link to National Cancer Institute comment on Laetrile
Hi, anyone interested in the National Cancer Institute's take on laetrile, supposedly the active ingredient in apricot kernels, can look at the link:
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/cam/laetrile/HealthProfessional/page2

The report mentions some clinical trials, and I gather toxic effects were not observed from the laetrile given intravenously. On the other hand, the outcome of the trials in humans was not good. On the other hand, there may be some toxicity in taking laetrile orally because bacteria in the intestinal tract can break down the laetrile and cause cyanide poisoning (in rats). It also seems that little of the laetrile is broken down when given intravenously, and almost all is excreted in the urine. The toxicity seems to be due to hydrogen cyanide (see above), which is produced when an enzyme (beta-glucosidase) acts on laetrile to form hydrogen cyanide, benzaldehyde, and glucose.

It also mentions several theories proposed for the mechanism of action of laetrile, none of which has much experimental support. The source Krista quoted above is a proponent of the second theory (that cancer cells contain more beta-glucosidase activity than normal cell, which break down laetrile and release cyanide into the cell). This appears to be incorrect, as beta-glucosidase has not been detected in tumor tissue.

In short, I would be worried about cyanide poisoning if eating apricot kernels based on this information.

snommintj

kristasplace said:

The cyanide issue
I'm not an organic chemist, though i did do fairly well in my chemistry courses! I leave all the scientific nomenclature to my buddy who is an organic chemist, and works for a big pharmaceutical company here in San Diego.

I found an explanation of the metabolic reaction to apricot kernel cyanide, and chemical cyanide, and apparently they react differently with the body. I couldn't find who wrote it, so i emailed it to my chemist friend, and he said it was true. Hopefully this will end the controversy about the toxins in the kernels. Here is the article:

The purpose of this recital on the subject of cyanide is to clarify the continual misconception that laetrile contains chemical cyanide. It does not contain chemical cyanide, but it does contain cyanide ion (-CN). When laetrile is metabolized in the body it is converted to thiocyanate, a relatively non-toxic product that has inhibitory effect against cancer (Contreras, 1982).

The term "cyanide" is used to designate hydrogen cyanide (also known as hydrocyanic acid, prussic acid, or formonitrile), or cyanide salts (sodium cyanide (NaCN), potassium cyanide (KCN), or calcium cyanide (Ca(CN)2). The word "cyanide" or the symbol "CN" are commonly used to designate both hydrogen cyanide as well as the salts of cyanide. These cyanide substances are also referred to as "free cyanide." When the term "cyanide" is used, it refers to one of the above substances. This is an important fundamental point of chemistry and toxicology because on this point hinges most of the deceptions and fraudulent claims of anti-laetrilists. Most of the information provided in this presentation is taken directly from the publication of the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health (NIOSH), U.S. Department of Health, Education, and Welfare (DHEW), entitled Occupational Exposure to Hydrogen Cyanide and Cyanide Salts (NIOSH, 1976), and the Merck Index, 9th edition, 1976 and the 11th edition, 1989.

Hydrogen Cyanide (hydrocyanic acid, prussic acid, or formonitrile): Hydrogen cyanide is prepared on a large scale by the catalytic oxidation of ammonia-methane mixtures, or by the catalytic decomposition of form amide. The chemical formula is HCN. The molecular weight is 27.03. The elemental composition is C 44.44%, H 3.73%, N 51.83%. It is a colorless gas or liquid, having a penetrating characteristic odor of bitter almonds.

Sodium Cyanide: The commercial form of this compound form of this compound is 95-98% pure, and is known as cyanogran. Mixtures of sodium cyanide with sodium chloride or carbonate are marketed for various purposes. NaCN is a white crystalline solid at room temperature. The chemical formula is NaCN. The molecular weight is 49.02. The elemental composition is C 24.50%, N 28.58%, Na 48.92%. NaCN consists of either white granules or fused pieces. It is odorless when dry but emits an odor of HCN when moist. The aqueous solution is strongly alkaline. It is commercially produced from coke-oven gas by the reaction of HCN and sodium hydroxide.

Potassium Cyanide: The chemical formula is KCN. The molecular weight is 65.11. The elemental composition is C 18.440%, K 60.05%, N 21.51%. The article of commerce contains about 95% KCN. Strong solutions are can be absorbed through the skin. KCN is in the form of white granules or fused pieces which, when exposed to the air, may emit an odor of HCN. An aqueous solution is strongly alkaline. KCN is commercially produced by methods similar to NaCN.

Calcium Cyanide: The chemical formula is Ca(CN)2, commercially known as black cyanide. The molecular weight is 92.12. The elemental composition is C 26.0%, Ca 43.52%, N 30.41%. The commercial product of this compound contains 40-50% of Ca (CN)2. Ca(CN)2 consists of crystals or a powder. When moist it emits an odor of HCN. Ca(CN)2 is commercially made by heating calcium cyanamide in a electric furnace at high temperatures in the presence of sodium chloride, and then rapidly cooling it. Ca(CN)2 is used in a variety of manufacturing procedures.

Hugs,
Krista

I can't take this anymore...
Your first mistake is that you should never ask an organic chemist anything about inorganic chemistry. Your second is that you're not completing the equation.
What do you think that "ion of cyanide" is going to do when introduced to your very acidic stomach environment. I tell you what it's going to do. It's going to find the first available proton H+ and bind it. At which point you're going to have Hydrogen Cyanide. You mention how hydrogen cyanide is made commercially. Yes it is made that way because it is the most cost effective. It is not the only way to make it. In fact, you will spontaneously make gaseous HCN by introducing any cyanide salt to an acidic environment, the truth is you will make small amounts of it even in basic solutions. CN- and HCN are at equilibrium at around ph of 9.5. In chemistry labs all around the world, if you make a cyanide solution of any type you have to do it under a hood and the first thing you do is bring the pH up to above 12 (extremely basic) to keep CN- in solution. Since most stomachs run around a pH of 2 that means that almost 99% of "ion of cyanide" will be bound to a hydrogen atom which is the not so good HCN. There is no way around this. There is nothing you or anyone else can say to dispute this.
Your third mistake is confusing laetril with amygdalin. They are not the same. Amygdalin is found in apricot seeds, there is no laetril. Laetril is an artificially synthesized derivative of amygdalin. The only way to get laetril is buy buying laetril. Either way, both decompose in acidic solution into prunasin, benzaldehyde, and hydrogen cyanide.
So there you have it. You can argue that it's not the gun that kills you, it's the bullet. Or you an argue that it's not the bullet it's the shooter all you want. To the victim it's all the same. The bottom line is. The moment you consume apricot seeds, whether directly or indirectly, you have introduced hydrogen cyanide into your system. A small portion of which you can handle quite easily. But too much will kill you.

2bhealed

PhillieG said:

Emily
I don't think I can make it to any dinner invitation that may have been in the works!
;-)
Peace (of pie)
-phil

Oh haha!
Dang, so much for the prime rib, baked potato drowned with sour cream, salad swimming in croutons and thousand island dressing, hot fudge brownie sundae I was going to serve you (this would have been my dream meal way back when).

I just made myself really hungry. durn it.

peace (of pecan pie--my favorite years ago....sigh....those days are over) emily the reformed

kristasplace

New development on apricot kernels
My friend just told me our local coop is selling apricot kernels out of the bins for the first time! This is amazing, because the last i heard it wasn't legal to sell them. Greg mentioned they were illegal because of the "alleged" cyanide toxicity, but if a store is selling them (i get mine from a friend), then it must not be so illegal anymore. There are no warning labels (i haven't seen any warning labels on the ones i buy, either). So i'm going to go there and ask the manager why they're suddenly selling them? I'm hoping he'll tell me they're legal now because there is proof they're not toxic. The coop has a board of directors, and nothing is sold there that isn't researched and approved. I'm sure they know what's going on as far as the controversy goes.

I promise to keep everyone posted on this new development, and hopefully i'll be able to put this controversy to it's tireless end. Of course this won't prove apricot kernels cure cancer, but at least it will rest our minds that we're not being poisoned by eating them.

Hugs,
Krista

PhillieG

kristasplace said:

New development on apricot kernels
My friend just told me our local coop is selling apricot kernels out of the bins for the first time! This is amazing, because the last i heard it wasn't legal to sell them. Greg mentioned they were illegal because of the "alleged" cyanide toxicity, but if a store is selling them (i get mine from a friend), then it must not be so illegal anymore. There are no warning labels (i haven't seen any warning labels on the ones i buy, either). So i'm going to go there and ask the manager why they're suddenly selling them? I'm hoping he'll tell me they're legal now because there is proof they're not toxic. The coop has a board of directors, and nothing is sold there that isn't researched and approved. I'm sure they know what's going on as far as the controversy goes.

I promise to keep everyone posted on this new development, and hopefully i'll be able to put this controversy to it's tireless end. Of course this won't prove apricot kernels cure cancer, but at least it will rest our minds that we're not being poisoned by eating them.

Hugs,
Krista

Not saying they are...
...not saying they aren't but just because someone is selling something does not always make it safe. Remember Fen-Phen? It was on the market until people starting dropping like flies.
Herbal Does Not Mean Safe:
Most combinations of herbal "fen-phen" are a mixture of the mood-enhancing herb Saint John's Wort and a stimulant called Ma Huang, whose effective ingredient is ephedra. While herbal "fen-phen" provides between 40 and 60 mg of ephedrine per day, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration warns that more than 24 mg taken for longer than a week can cause serious health risks.

I would also think that the manager would tell you anything to move a product unless that person was a very close personal friend. Very close...
This is a billion dollar industry by both big pharm and snake oil salesmen so "Caveat emptor"
(let the buyer beware) and PT Barnum's quote are both to be considered.
No offense Krista but I doubt this will put anything to rest and hopefully nobody to rest.
-phil

PGLGreg

PhillieG said:

Not saying they are...
...not saying they aren't but just because someone is selling something does not always make it safe. Remember Fen-Phen? It was on the market until people starting dropping like flies.
Herbal Does Not Mean Safe:
Most combinations of herbal "fen-phen" are a mixture of the mood-enhancing herb Saint John's Wort and a stimulant called Ma Huang, whose effective ingredient is ephedra. While herbal "fen-phen" provides between 40 and 60 mg of ephedrine per day, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration warns that more than 24 mg taken for longer than a week can cause serious health risks.

I would also think that the manager would tell you anything to move a product unless that person was a very close personal friend. Very close...
This is a billion dollar industry by both big pharm and snake oil salesmen so "Caveat emptor"
(let the buyer beware) and PT Barnum's quote are both to be considered.
No offense Krista but I doubt this will put anything to rest and hopefully nobody to rest.
-phil

Phil says: "I would also
Phil says: "I would also think that the manager would tell you anything to move a product ..."

Tsk, tsk. How cynical. It's a health food store, for heaven's sake.

kristasplace

PhillieG said:

Not saying they are...
...not saying they aren't but just because someone is selling something does not always make it safe. Remember Fen-Phen? It was on the market until people starting dropping like flies.
Herbal Does Not Mean Safe:
Most combinations of herbal "fen-phen" are a mixture of the mood-enhancing herb Saint John's Wort and a stimulant called Ma Huang, whose effective ingredient is ephedra. While herbal "fen-phen" provides between 40 and 60 mg of ephedrine per day, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration warns that more than 24 mg taken for longer than a week can cause serious health risks.

I would also think that the manager would tell you anything to move a product unless that person was a very close personal friend. Very close...
This is a billion dollar industry by both big pharm and snake oil salesmen so "Caveat emptor"
(let the buyer beware) and PT Barnum's quote are both to be considered.
No offense Krista but I doubt this will put anything to rest and hopefully nobody to rest.
-phil

I remember...
Boy, do i remember Fen-Phen!! My girlfriend looked like mrs. skelator after taking that!

You're absolutely right that FDA approval, and mass production of something does not mean it's safe, at all. I'm hopeful about the kernels because they were already illegal, and now something must have changed if the co-op is selling them. What i mean is, the co-op isn't going to put something on the shelves that could potential shut them down. Unless (and this is a big guess), they don't know it's illegal. I haven't looked to see if there really is a law, so i'm not even certain about that. This is a double edged sword because if they never were illegal, does that mean they aren't really poisoning people who overdose? And if they were illegal, does that mean they have been proven to be safe, and the cyanide scare was a lie?

I suppose in the long run it doesn't matter. I'll continue to take them in small doses, and if my cancer disappears magically someday, we'll never know if it was the kernels, the juicing, or the overall effect of a strict raw diet. And if it doesn't disappear...Well, i won't go there, because it will!! lol!

Hugs!
Krista

PhillieG

kristasplace said:

I remember...
Boy, do i remember Fen-Phen!! My girlfriend looked like mrs. skelator after taking that!

You're absolutely right that FDA approval, and mass production of something does not mean it's safe, at all. I'm hopeful about the kernels because they were already illegal, and now something must have changed if the co-op is selling them. What i mean is, the co-op isn't going to put something on the shelves that could potential shut them down. Unless (and this is a big guess), they don't know it's illegal. I haven't looked to see if there really is a law, so i'm not even certain about that. This is a double edged sword because if they never were illegal, does that mean they aren't really poisoning people who overdose? And if they were illegal, does that mean they have been proven to be safe, and the cyanide scare was a lie?

I suppose in the long run it doesn't matter. I'll continue to take them in small doses, and if my cancer disappears magically someday, we'll never know if it was the kernels, the juicing, or the overall effect of a strict raw diet. And if it doesn't disappear...Well, i won't go there, because it will!! lol!

Hugs!
Krista

Use Common Sense
That's all, just because it's "organic" or in a "health store" does not always mean it's safe. Uranium is organic but I wouldn't digest it. People may do things in good faith but without knowing all side effects.

I hope it works out well for you Krista.
-phil