CSN Login
Members Online: 8

You are here

How are you guys coping with the other C word?

hewhositsoncushions
Posts: 381
Joined: Mar 2017

It is well wierd over here. Online people are bricking themselves. Outside in RL people are going alomng like nothing is happening. "Its just the flu" is all I hear.

Flyer83948
Posts: 34
Joined: May 2019

Wow. Glad that you made it through your ventilator experience OK. Yeah, I imagine the psychological stress must be pretty high for going through 16 days on one while conscious and not being able to move (or to even speak?). 

 

I had never heard of ventilators before this coronavirus outbreak, and when I did first hear of them I imagined them to be something like a scuba diver decompression or diving chamber, a rugged pressure chamber which one or more people can enter and is then pressurized with an oxygen-rich atmosphere. Thought that such an experience might not even be so bad with a good supply of books and magazines and movie videos, but apparently these medical ventilators are much different in design and operation.

Max Former Hodgkins Stage 3's picture
Max Former Hodg...
Posts: 3609
Joined: May 2012

Flyer,

You are thinking of the so-called Iron Lung, which predated development of the ventilator.  A horror experience for certain.

Clevelandguy
Posts: 658
Joined: Jun 2015

Hi All,

It seems several different places are working on vaccines along with the Pittsburgh school of medicine.  https://nypost.com/2020/04/02/scientists-believe-they-found-potential-coronavirus-vaccine/
H
opefully this Summer some company or research facility will have a route to a new vacine or cure.

Dave 3+4

VascodaGama's picture
VascodaGama
Posts: 3320
Joined: Nov 2010

 

Yes, ventilators make part in the last effort to save the life of a patient whose lungs lost the capability in supplying/filtrating oxygen to the body (sort of drowning). Too late or a shortage of the stuff leads to kidney failure and death. The most common type of ventilators is those that require inducing coma as the tube must be inserted and stay in the trachea. Old people and those with other health issues suffer and can die due to the treatment not the virus. The shortage of ventilators in the medical community is understood as it is used only in long term surgeries that require total anesthesia. Apart from that each Covid-19 patient may need the ventilator for over one week. 
Ventilators also require well educated team of specialist/physicians to operate the equipment and move/turn around the patient several times a day to avoid embolism (induced coma status). Surely this is not a practical way to treat flu and colds by coronavirus that can cause severe acute respiratory syndrome.

Vaccines are good ways to control pandemic cases from virus but these depend in singling out the type of virus (among the 200+ types) before it strikes. Once the inflammation is set in, only drugs can solve the problem. A vaccine is also sort lived (4 to 6 months of immunity) requiring earlier administration of the cold season every year.

Here is a link on the details of these sort of virus (Rhinovirus) easy to read and understand;

http://www2.hawaii.edu/~johnb/micro/m130/readings/Rhinovirus.htm

Details on the promising vaccine trial presented by Dave above are in here;

https://www.thelancet.com/action/showPdf?pii=S2352-3964%2820%2930118-3

Thanks guys. We are also heroes in this fight against the monster together with the many physicians, officials and workers doing their job on site.

Best,

VGama

 

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi all,

Some patients are having their treatments postponed. There are no prostate cancer patients in this article but patients with other types of cancer are facing delays or indefinite postponements of treatment.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/07/life-hanging-by-a-thread-f...

Best wishes,

Georges

VascodaGama's picture
VascodaGama
Posts: 3320
Joined: Nov 2010

It took the Eurogroup long hours in three days of meetings to reach to a collective understanding and agreement for delivering an economic weapon to confront together the economic crises caused by the Covid-19. The Dutch and Germany were reluctant at the beginning but after an ultimatum delivered by the Eurogroup’s president (Mr. Euro as it is called) in regards to the risk of the EU disintegration and Euro’s stability, the ministers of the 19 countries using Euro currency agreed in delivering 500 Billion Euros fund to be used by each member (at their discretion to a maximum of 2% of GDP) in their measures to fight the crises caused by the pandemic.

The Eurogroup president is the present Finance Minister of Portugal (Mario Centeno). I believe that his skills, gained in pulling out the Portuguese economy from a resection after bankruptcy in 2011, have been recognized by the EU members and his ultimatum warning about the indignation among several countries, in particular in Italy, after the negative meeting in March 24 was enough to have them agreeing. These guys saved the union and the Euro.

Meanwhile the number of infected people and deaths continue to increase in Europe without a foreseen end. There are over 550,000 active cases and 68,000 deaths in Europe. Portugal has now 14,000 confirmed cases and 400 deaths. Problems in hospitals like the one reported by Georges above are rising. The chief doctor in charge of surgeries in a major hospital in Lisbon resigned for disaccords with the hospital’s strategy in handling Covid-19 patients together with patients of other illnesses. The problem is caused by the low number of hospital beds available in Portugal. The medical community has recommended in treating Covid-19 patients at specific facilities, separating these from other sick people but the Health minister thinks otherwise. They have imposed a strategy of home confinement of Covid-19 sick people with symptoms (fever, etc) sending physicians to treating these at their home (similar to what has been done with Boris Johnson), and only taking to the hospitals those in critical conditions, to avoid havoc in the urgencies.

Accordingly, confinement of these patients in “home treatment” obliges families to reserve part of their houses (room and toilet) for the infected member, avoiding contact with him for at least two weeks after recovery. The strategy has permitted a better management of the health infrastructure but without assigning specific hospitals to treat only Covid-19 has led to the disappearance of common patients in hospital urgencies, afraid for any contagion (like me). The authorities here come to the TV alluring those with high risks diseases (heart, diabetics, renal, cancer, etc) to get to the hospital for treatment. I think that the situation (empty urgency rooms) created the opportunity of getting NHS consultations to issues that in normal times would take many months to be scheduled like cardiovascular issues.

In any case, as the coronavirus critical cases increase hospitals will need all the beds, equipment, and physicians to handle Covd-19. It will be important not to have these resources taken up by patients with common seasonal diseases like the traditional flu, screening tests or follow-up consultation for previous interventions.

I wonder the situation of the fellow members of this forum. Is everybody alright?

Let's keep in touch.

VGama

Clevelandguy
Posts: 658
Joined: Jun 2015

Hi All,

It appears social distancing, hand washing, and stay at home are starting to work in the U.S.. Hospital admissions are starting to fall in major cities and hopefully a drop in deaths to soon follow.  Can't return to normal until a drug(s) are found to heal the sick with a immunization to follow In the near future. Hope you Euro guys have better days ahead and there is hope on the horizon for ya. Stay safe and stay apart.

Dave 3+4

Max Former Hodgkins Stage 3's picture
Max Former Hodg...
Posts: 3609
Joined: May 2012

Washington State (like California) is sending its excess of ventilators to other locations, as California did earlier.  Also, Washington State is shutting down "Tent MASH Units", because they have gone unused.     US news continues to only report the worst case scenarios.  Our CDC recently changed death reporting protocols such that any person with CD19 who died for any reason is listed as a "CV-19 Death."

Austria, like Denmark before it, is saying that they are beginning partial reopening of their economy within a week.

 HIGHLIGHT, then RIGHT CLICK, the press GO TO........

https://video.foxnews.com/v/6148618131001/

 

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi there,

It is localised in France.
In Finistere we have 909,000 people, 325 cases and 7 deaths so far.
They have shipped us out some Parisians that are at death's door to fill up our ICU beds.
I am lucky insofar as I am in remission for the moment so I am keeping the local hospital and doctors at arms length.
Hopefully things will be looking better by the time I need to visit again.

Best wishes,

Georges

VascodaGama's picture
VascodaGama
Posts: 3320
Joined: Nov 2010

Here is a video about the experience of Japanese health coordinators at the start of their engagement with CoVid-19. A little old but still very informative.

This is how they successfully treated those from the Diamond Cruise.

https://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/en/ondemand/video/5001289/

 

VG

 

Clevelandguy
Posts: 658
Joined: Jun 2015
Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi there,

The good news is that our case rate is dropping fast, only three new cases yesterday.
The bad news is that we are going to remain under lock down until the 12th of May and then we will be progressively released so this is going to drag on and on.
Coronavirus is going to be with us for a long time yet.

Best wishes,

Georges

Max Former Hodgkins Stage 3's picture
Max Former Hodg...
Posts: 3609
Joined: May 2012

Frrench authorities enslaving the French people, using the German model of the 1940s

eonore
Posts: 103
Joined: Jun 2017

I have refrained from commenting on some of your earlier objectionable posts, i.e dismissing Chicago as a dump, but equating the French government's efforts to preserve life to the occupation of France by the Nazis is rabid even for you.  As per the forum's terms and conditions, I suggest you restrict yourself to cancer and health related information, and keep your objectionable political beliefs to yourself.  They have no place in the forum.

 

Eric

Flyer83948
Posts: 34
Joined: May 2019

I think that there is a valid concern that should be discussed about possible overreaching government powers versus individual liberties in a time like this or in future times of either real or fabricated crises, but I agree that equating the behavior of the current French government to the "German model" of the 1940's is unfair and unwarranted. 

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi there,

I think that until something better comes along we are going to have to accept that a measure of social isolation is going to remain one of the principle measures against COVID19.
It could  be a while before we have an effective treatment or better a vaccine  and until then allowing people to mix freely will result in a wave of acute cases that will overwhelm the hospital ICU's.
Most governments seem to be of that opinion and I agree with it.
It looks like it will be a while before café society resumes but hopefully we can go for a longer walk in a few weeks.
Luckily the COVID 19 emergency does not seem to have affected too many men who were scheduled to undergo treatment.

Best wishes,

Georges

Clevelandguy
Posts: 658
Joined: Jun 2015

Hi All,

Ya know here in Ohio we have a stay at home order but if I wish I can still go to the big box stores or supermarkets with no PPE.  I feel with the unknowns of the Corona virus and the severity of this virus I choose to cover up.  The governments are just trying to flatten the curve so we don't have gurneys out in hospital parking decks and bodies stacking up.  A lot of people see this as a reduction of personal freedoms but I see it as a way of keeping the death count and hospital loads to a minimum.  Can you imagine what we would be looking at if there were no restrictions, I don't think it would be pretty so I choose to stay at home as much as possible and wait this thing out.

Dave 3+4

VascodaGama's picture
VascodaGama
Posts: 3320
Joined: Nov 2010

The MABs are again proving its efficacy in therapies. We have seen these in action in PCa treatments and now in fighting the Covid-19. Dave (Clevelandguy) above has provided this below link to Leronlimab which may be the best in dealing with problems caused by over expressed immune system called to address the infection with sars-cov-2, inducing “cytokine storm” in the lungs. This is what we see in many Coviv-19 patients that deteriorate to a sort of pneumonia which has been caused by the activity of their immune system. Leronlimab manages to control the “storm” and balances the benefits of the immune action in the fight.

The immune system doesn't kill the virus but it kills those cells that have been infected by the virus, eliminating the infection for good. In fact, the action of the immune system in the lungs (where the SARS-cov2 is most active) can be so destructive to the extent of causing permanent scars in the lungs. Too much of the stuff can lead to cytokinesis (cytokine release syndrome) which can be fatal in serious cases. Let’s be hopeful for the success of this clinical trial. I strongly believe that one day we may have a MAB as the silver bullet to kill PCa for good.

https://www.targetedonc.com/news/leronlimab-continues-to-improve-health-in-patients-with-novel-coronavirus

Meanwhile Portugal has now 19,000 confirmed cases and 630 deaths (62 cases and 6 deaths in the municipality Albufeira where I live that has a population of 42,000).

Today, the President of Portugal has declared an extension of the Emergency State for more two weeks. The government will then define the measures to continue the fight against the crises. I think that the confinement will continue with shops, schools, etc, closed and people retrieved indoors, but some flexibility will be allowed in office business. They plan to reopen to social practices gradually in May. Thought many are already desperate to get out for a little espresso-coffee, the confinement may not be that bad to the Portuguese society in general as it promotes natality (birthrate). We are just ten million Portugueses but in 9 months we may duplicate that number. TV is boring and the bed very enticing for the young. Better to keep all those built Covid-19 field-hospitals to attend the pregnancies of December.

Best wishes to all. Remember, stay at home.

VGama 

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi all,

The big supermarkets are open and the shelves are well stocked including fresh fish and meat.
We have to queue to get in at times as they do not want too many in there at one time and we are supposed to keep a two trolley distance between shoppers.
Other shops that deal in gardening, household improvement stuff, office supplies, etc have websites where you can order and then collect the next day or have it delivered.
Walks and trips to the garden are limited but we can get enough exercise and we are eating well.
We have radio, television and our computers to amuse us and we do head off early to bed for a cuddle if we feel like it.
When this is over we will have to see which way the world goes; authoritarian government is not written into the script, hopefully when the current emergency has passed we can move forward to a better future.
Neither I nor my wife are in the best of health and we are both close to sixty but the hospital will make a decent effort to keep us alive if the worst happens and we end up close to the ICU, that is something to be happy about.

Best wishes,

Georges

Clevelandguy
Posts: 658
Joined: Jun 2015

Very well said Vasco, more babies coming?  Very funny..............

Dave 3+4

VascodaGama's picture
VascodaGama
Posts: 3320
Joined: Nov 2010

 

I have been curious about the numbers reported by each country in regards to covid-19 infected cases. There is a huge discrepancy on the way each health authority manage and count the infected as well as the number of deaths caused by Coronavirus.

We have seen how badly China has reported, now untrusted and considered as manipulated with the intent of a cover-up. Everyone could now speculate that the total numbers in China near a 500% increase of what was originally reported, if that includes those who have never been to an hospital or have not submitted to testing.

However the same attitude is expected to occur in other countries as these do not follow the same standards in the prevention, in the fighting and in the reporting. WHO's recommendations always ended by telling the many to follow what they think it better for their country.

It is now said that in Europe several countries have not counted in their daily reports the number of death from nursing-homes, and that can also be judged as a cover-up with intent or purposes.

One could think that such is done to avoid panic in case the numbers increase exponentially everyday. The truth could disturb even the feelings of those in the front lines, like the doctors and nurses (the real heroes of the pandemic) as we saw happening in Italy and Spain.

In Portugal the health authorities have been transparent in informing, previously, the general folks about their strategy for the crises, but have not provided details regarding consequences or the need for a "plan B". In their system they will avoid hysteria at hospitals by keeping the majority of infected people at home and treating them at their place taking only the most critical cases while hospital beds exist. It looks nice at first sight but the system creates doubts about the way those numbers are counted and reported. If one controls the number of tests done each day then one knows what will be the increase of newer cases reported on that day. The death number follows equally. You can report that old people with other illnesses did die from other causes not from CoVid-19, shortening the numbers. This would be justified in nursing-homes, which institutions are not protected by the national health hospitals system.

The media look into the numbers to make their journalism and comment on a plateau, however, can we trust it to correspond to the reality?

Transparency may disguise a cover-up of a manipulated outcome. We see here the same daily rise of newer confirmed cases and the same rise of the number of deaths in the past week but several municipalities have claimed that the number at their districts are higher. Funeral agencies have also been reporting that they have a 50% rise in the number of dead people from other causes (not CoVid-19) which is suspicious for faking. The number of dead doesn't match the incidences rates before the pandemic. We may wonder if the numbers are that important.

One thing we aged PCa folks (70+) can expect is that if the monster strikes us, no matter in which country we live,  we should consider our selves lucky if we are taken into a well equipped facility. I will not care in which group in the report they will add me.

Remember, stay at home.

VG

 

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi Vasco,

We have had two big 'adjustments' here, once when they added in the people that were dying in retirement homes and once when they added in the cases detected in public laboratories to those being detected in private laboratories.
Counting and reporting has been a bit ad hoc as the authorities have been caught with their pants down.
I doubt the true number of cases and deaths will ever be known.
We are getting towards the end of week 5, at least the lock down is not as bad as Spain.

Best wishes,

Georges

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi All,

It is looking like if all is well then on the 12th of May we will be allowed out for unlimited time instead of for one hour only, we will be able to go up to 100 km from home, etc.
Bars, restaurants, cafés, etc will all remain closed.
We only had one new case in Finistère yesterday so maybe we can keep a lid on it with contact tracing, etc
So less than two weeks to go before we break out.

Best wishes,

Georges

eonore
Posts: 103
Joined: Jun 2017

States here in the US are beginning to lift restrictions, but I fear that not enough is known about the disease to properly inform the authorities.  I would hate to see a second wave in the fall as a result of false optimism.  We still do not have the testing and tracing capabilities to make it work.  As for me, since I am highly at risk, I plan to stay isolated until something changes in relation to the disease like effective treatments or a vaccine.

Eric

VascodaGama's picture
VascodaGama
Posts: 3320
Joined: Nov 2010

Yes, they are saying the same here. The State of Emergency ends on May 2 and is followed with a gradual relieve on restrictions but these are subjected to regulations contradicting constitutional terms on freedom and privacy. I foresee many court cases occurring against the government.

The municipality where I live (Albufeira) is the only southern region where no particular focus of the virus has been identified. This means that it has been passed from person to person. The number of confirmed cases continues increasing and the end of the confinement will lead to a high number of visitors from the north that will come to stay at their second houses by the beach. This could represent an invasion of undisciplined folks in the thousands. It is frightening to think that I have to oblige myself to obligatory confinement this Summer.

In any case, we, the over 70th and cancer patients, are at increased risk for contagion due to those less civic that will not respect the new public hygiene way of living. In fact the TV has already broadcasted cases of discarded used masks and gloves at public areas, no social distancing among those walking on streets or at parks, etc. The rule imposed to the use of beaches obliges distancing by family groups of 10 meters (Probably some will have to swim at 1 Km far from the coast line. Lol). There is also that sentiment that the aged are the problem of the havoc at hospitals and the source behind the restrictions that do not allow a normal opening of the commerce and business. Younger people are less stricken by the virus effects so that they do not need to follow the rules. In some countries (for instance Sweden) the confinement of the older continues, including a fine to those that go out without convincing reason. Geo-tracking of covid-19 probabilities is now the subject of discussion around the world as many governments began to see it as a solution for allowing freedom on the movement of the masses. Surely I will drop my mobile in the trashcan if such is imposed.

After all, Sars-cov2 exists around the world and not all countries follow the same strategy in fighting it, or got conditions to do it. Without due medication or vaccine, this virus will be in the globe for a long time spreading around by contagious travelers. Either, we keep planes from flying, close the bothers and stop free movement of people to feel safe or risk going out enjoying life under the sun using masks and gloves, keeping social distancing and educated civic manners.

Let’s try to be safe.

Best,

VGama

 

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi All,

It is going to be quiet for a long time.
Only limited numbers of people are going to be allowed in a shop at one time, not more than ten people at a private meeting, no public meetings, etc.
Trains in France will be half full with all seats reserved, internal flights will be limited, international flights on verra.
We are supposed to remain in our departments unless we have a business or family reason to go outside.
Talking to people some of them seem genuinely afraid to go outside despite the fact that the risk in Finistère is very small.
My wife wants to go up to Roscoff when we are allowed, nothing will be open so we will sit on the seawall with a flask of coffee and a packet of sandwiches and biscuits.
The economy in Brittany is very dependent on tourism so we would like some visitors, on the other hand we do not want an increase in our low levels of coronavirus.
A lot of people in France have had to use their paid holidays during the confinement so they have not got any holiday for this year so they will not be going anywhere, add in the fact that a lot of people are broke so they cannot go away and it is looking like a quiet summer.

Best wishes,

Georges

Max Former Hodgkins Stage 3's picture
Max Former Hodg...
Posts: 3609
Joined: May 2012

Despite the media, which insists on hysteria and absolute worst-case-scenario reporting, we have clearly turned the corner here in the US.   About ten states are reopening important segments, noteworthy is that Georgia is dropping almost all restrictions of any kind.  Florida is close behind, and my state of SC has reopened numerous key facilities.  Even the Peoples' Republic of California is allowing some portions of the Constitution to reappear -- a rare thing even in good times.  New York is shipping the ventillators it never needed to other locations, and the Mercy Ship is departing NY Harbor.   Overflow facilities set up by the Feds in larger cities mostly went UNUSED; a few did have partial use

The death rate is almost universally reported here now as around .1 percent or less, which is what non-hysterics were saying all along.  Yes, some hot spots, like NYC, were higher, but NYC is a cesspool as regards the ability to avoid others; people crammed together in a wholly unnatural living environment.   

Currently, the death rate in the US is around 1 in 5,500     (330,000,000 divided by 60,000)   The US is just this week went equal in Corona deaths to the 2017-18 deaths from the common flu, and in those years, NOTHING CLOSED.   There was no hysteria.  No one even paid it any attention.   In 1957 in the US, a flu epidemic killed 116,000 here -- DOUBLE the current Covid death numbers, and NOTHING CLOSED, no businesses were shuttered.  On the aricraft carrier in the Far East (the Roosevelt), with a confined crew of probably at least 4,000 with no possibility of privacy, last I ckecked, there were ZERO fatalities. NONE.   On the destroyer USS Kidd, which reports about 40% of the crew infected, there have been ZERO critical cases, and no deaths.  Probably more likely to be hit by lightening or eaten by an alligator than die of Covid, unless seriously compromised, or over 85.    Definitely much more likely to die in a car crash.

This whole affair has been an exercise in psychosis.    Denmark, Austria, Switzerland are all significantly reopening.  Sweden never really closed.   This has been the latest Y2K or AIDS scare.   Crawl out from under your beds when the nice man with the rifle says you may.  Bless all, and may freedom and sanity one day return to your lands,

eonore
Posts: 103
Joined: Jun 2017

I am not going to waste time debunking all your wrong and misleading numbers, other than pointing out that the death rate from the coronavirus is approximately five percent (1154000 confirmed cases and 67000 deaths), many times higher than the flu.  And that is with significant amounts of people practicing social distancing.  I cannot understand your need to minimize something that has killed hundreds of thousands of people worldwide.  If you are so confident that the coronavirus is no big deal, why don't you help out in your community by volunteering at a soup kitchen or food bank, rather than ranting on the Internet.

MK1965
Posts: 215
Joined: Jun 2016

Eonore,

I don't agree with you. This year everything is added together: apples, oranges, pears etc. Every death is assuming to be covid-19 death.

Those numbers are misleading and purpose of it is to cause panic and hysteria. What happened to numbe of flu deaths, pneumonia deaths, MI, stroke deaths etc. Whoever passed away is counted as covid19 death.

i see something else in the background of CNN, MSNBC and other stations reporting and that is politics.

I totally agree with Max whatever he wrote in his post.

MK

eonore
Posts: 103
Joined: Jun 2017

You are welcome to disagree, but facts are facts.  If anything, coronavirus deaths are vastly undercounted.  You can believe whatever floats your boat, but directing your anger at the media, the scientists, the doctors and the governors who are trying to keep us safe, speaks of your worldview and politics and nothing else.

 

Eric

xNTP
Posts: 35
Joined: Oct 2016

In the US there appears to be some Medicare re-imbursement practices and political efforts to overcount other deaths as primarily caused bu CV19. 

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi all,

I have a feeling that we are far from out of the woods yet.
If you are in one of the vulnerable groups then catching COVID-19 has a good chance of being the end, we have seen this from the way it has affected care homes, etc.
I suspect that because of the lockdown, the vast majority of the population has not been exposed to the virus.
We have 577 cases in my area which has 909,000 inhabitants, so I reckon most of the population has not been exposed including large numbers of people with underlying health problems that make them vulnerable.
As we move out of the isolation it is possible that if we do not put measures in place to maintain social distancing, etc the disease will come back to bite us in the rear end.
Flu is well understood and we know its limitations, COVID-19 is the exact opposite, it is a new kid on the block that is very unknown.

Best wishes,

Georges

eonore
Posts: 103
Joined: Jun 2017

Well stated, Georges.

hewhositsoncushions
Posts: 381
Joined: Mar 2017

30,000 deaths in the UK as a minimum so far. At least four times the average flu death rate in a far smaller time window and hitting disproportionaly older and vulnerable people a lot harder.

Significanly higher effective R0 number leading to massive case rise.

The US has a stupid anount more cases and deaths than elsewhere in the world and it is going to worsen.

EDIT: Apparantly the US has 4% of the worlds populace and 265 of the deaths to date

Europe is starting to get it under control slowly.

To those who say the fact that numbers are under control in Europe proves it is no big deal, consider that we have no polio because we have vaccines. The rates are going down BECAUSE of the lockdown.

Not having a lockdown or removing it too early will cause a huge second wave.

History tells us to take pandemics seriously.

Lets not be like the mayor in "Jaws".

Grinder
Posts: 472
Joined: Mar 2017

Here in the States, it's bad enough that we have to take all the same precautions to slow the spread of Covid and protect the most vulnerable of the population...

But the political war going on is compromising national policy on effective measures to deal with the virus.

One party is desperate to watch the nation flounder so it can retake control of the executive branch of government this November. That is the political atmosphere Max was trying to describe, in which deaths from comorbidities are attributed to Covid and reported as such.

On the other hand, the other party wants to stem the economic catastrophe looming as businesses have begun to go bankrupt. The roaring "economy" was their selling point before Covid, but now they have lost the feather in their cap, as Covid brings our economic activity to a grinding halt. So now we are pumping 2 trillion dollars of borrowed money into the economy... financing such pork as 24 million in stimulus for the Kennedy Center of Performing Arts. 

It's a shame that political parties are vested in the failure of our response to the pandemic, and are using the pandemic to further political ambitions... but it is what it is. Hopefully by the Grace of God we will survive both the pandemic and the political warring factions.

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi All,

I suspect that I and my wife will continue doing what we have been doing for the last eight weeks.
Shopping, walking, gardening, etc.
Things are going to reopen slowly and we will be at the back of the queue to go to restaurants or be in relatively crowded public spaces.
Peoples behaviour round here will take some time to change, a lot of people live in the countryside so they are pretty isolated anyway.
I have followed US politics more or less since Spiro Agnew got the chop for tax evasion and in my opinion it is not a pretty sight.
Without doubt it has deteriorated, with the problems now far outweighing the strengths of the system, how it can be changed to overcome these faults and return to some sort of normal service is a conundrum.

Best wishes,

Georges

Clevelandguy
Posts: 658
Joined: Jun 2015

Hi All,

What do they say, "Figures lie and liars figure"  or something like that.  All I know is I'm doing the Georges guidelines by wearing my mask and staying away from crowds.  It seems that this virus can take on many different faces from almost no symptoms to being put on a ventilator.  I don't want to be the one on the ventilator. Things are starting to open up here in Ohio so we will see if there are any large spikes in cases.  Looks like progress on treatment drugs and a later vacine will help as long as the virus does not mutate.  The politicians are having a field day with this along with the doom and gloom media.  It's really a shame if either political party uses this for political or economic gains. The government is letting some criminals out of jail so they either don't get the virus or to get treament which just adds another bad angle to the mix in my opinion. Everyone stay safe and wash your hands, wear your mask.

Dave 3+4

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi there,

I doubt the real totals of those that died of coronavirus will ever be known.
In the case of care homes there are a lot of ill people that are hanging on by their fingers, if they get the coronavirus and that pushes them over the edge what does the doctor declare the death as?
This is an interesting article from The Guardian on UK care homes, in parts of France where there has been a lot of coronavirus there have been similar situations, I suspect the same has happened everywhere.
Basically we would expect people in care homes to die at a statistically predictable rate but since the advent of the coronavirus there has been a huge spike in deaths.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/13/coronavirus-real-care-home...

Best wishes,

Georges

VascodaGama's picture
VascodaGama
Posts: 3320
Joined: Nov 2010

According to researchers, Sars-cov2 has over 150 mutations since leaving China in December 2019. In each mutation it got the ability for being more effective in infecting several types of cells. In other words, it can travel from organ to organ limiting the immune system’s capability in fighting the foreigner. As much longer as it spreads, more mutations will occur making it still more difficult in eliminating it.
Sars-cov2 could become a virus living among the human as the HIV.

Many try to figure out if his country has done well in regards to the means applied to counter the pandemic but one never gets there by simply comparing the numbers of death in each country. After all any one is subjected to contagious so that with the borders closed down, the number of the population becomes the target for comparison. In Portugal they count with 1,190 dead cases and 28,500 confirmed positive cases. Probably we could double these results to be closer to the real numbers. However, even if there were 2,000 deaths the percentage in regards to the total population of the country would get us 200 dead and 2,700 infected per 1,000,000 people.
This sets Portuguese health authorities system at the 10th place, to control the pandemic. The number of deaths was small but the control wasn’t that efficient. And now they have announced the end of confinement, starting Monday, which surely will raise the number of contagious. Particularly at my area near the sea and beaches places the regulations were set without any particular means that would assure proper control. They calculated 10m2 of area per person using the beach and plan to install poles with red lights to inform the people that the beach is full. I expect to see many blind visitors to the beach this year. As we say, “The only thing worse than being blind is having sight but no vision”.

Best,

VG

hewhositsoncushions
Posts: 381
Joined: Mar 2017

The usual trend when a disease increase the R0 factor is for IFR to go down because a highly lethal disease is less likely to spread quickly. Ebola has a fairly low R0 (1.5 to 1.9) and measles has an R0 of 15.

In the UK the madman Boris is letting the gates open even though the R0 has gone back to near 1 because he places money for the rich over the lives of the poor. It will be interesting to see how that plays out.

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi there,

The coronavirus is mutating but most of these mutations are copying errors.
They do not affect the behaviour of the virus making it more or less infective or deadly.
The difficult thing is keeping a sense of proportion when it seems that many in the media and politicians are either talking nonsense or distorting the truth for their own ends.
Coronavirus is bad but it is nothing in comparison with the Spanish Flu.
My wife and I are lucky insofar as we do not have to work os we can social distance to our hearts' content
The sun is out, off for another walk in the country this afternoon.

Best wishes,

Georges

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi there,

So it will be less lockdown from Tuesday, people will be able to travel freely in France, bars and cafes will open, etc.
Round here we have around two new cases per day in an area that is home to 909,000 but in Paris and a few other places it is a lot higher.
The big question is what will happen when people start to circulate freely again?
At the moment it is very warm and the air is dry, not good conditions for a circulating virus.
A tiny droplet with millions of virus can fall on a hard surface, within seconds it has dried out. The water molecules that kept the delicate lattice of its RNA safe are gone and the UV rays are knocking holes in it.
Come October it will be cooler and the air will be moist, CV-19 could easily shoot away again.
I am not sure that anyone is making the in depth preparations that will be needed to control a second wave.

Best wishes,

Georges

hewhositsoncushions
Posts: 381
Joined: Mar 2017

They are putting profit over lives. We just need to protect ourselves and those we care about. There will be a reckoning when this is all over, even if just at the ballot box.

Clevelandguy
Posts: 658
Joined: Jun 2015

Hi All,

Sounds like people(mostly young adults) are throwing caution to the wind here in the states and gathering in large groups with no protection or distancing to party. Not too smart in my opinion but we will see if it kicks us into a 2nd wave. Some people still believe this is all made up by the government to supress us and take away our freedom.  With all the body bags in New York city and hospital overload within the last few weeks I don't see their logic.  Hopefully people will wise up until a vaccine is found.

Dave 3+4

Georges Calvez
Posts: 503
Joined: Sep 2018

Hi there,

I went to take a look at my favourite beach yesterday afternoon, it is a holiday weekend and very warm but it was covered.
Coronavirus seems to fallen off a cliff round here so it has become a case of out of sight out of mind.
The French are going to holiday in France this year, they do not have much choice really, so I suspect that they are going to party like 1999.
The good thing is it is not coronavirus weather, around 30 C in the late afternoon and very dry so the virus has not got good conditions for propagating.

Best wishes,

Georges

VascodaGama's picture
VascodaGama
Posts: 3320
Joined: Nov 2010

Yes.  The behavior of the young population here is not trusted too. In fact there are signs that these are the ones that will start the second wave of the contagious. Portugal has shown beautiful numbers of low infected cases and death numbers but “R0” is not equally distributed throughout the country. Lisbon region has shown recently an increase in the number of contagious when compared to other regions, exactly as it deconfined faster taking high number of people to the streets and to the beach sites. Night coffee shops and small bars also opened unchecked by the authorities. The R0 seems to have increased over 1.
The most contagious so far are the 20 to 59 years old and the number of deaths start at the ages of 80+ decreasing considerably to those in the age of 40. My group of 70th are second in the line of death.

In the south we can see a higher number of arrivals of people from the north but not in a huge number as it was expected. Probably the economics took many to drive to closer places. In any case, the local Faro airport will open to tourists from other countries starting July 1st and doing so without any restriction in regards to the need of quarantine. I wonder if the problem can be pointed to the younger or to the fault by the authorities in being more exigent in controlling the virus. In Madeira Island the local authorities allow free-pass to visitors that have been tested within 72 hours previous of arrival. Others will have to stay at their hotels in 15 days quarantine.

Let’s be more careful.

VG

hopeful and opt...
Posts: 2303
Joined: Apr 2009

Here in the USA, unfortunately the pandemic has taken second place to the black live movement. That is what is on the news programs. 

Those protesting, without masks and enough social distancing,  can create seeds of future infecition. Various stores in my area have been looted to include drug stores. There is a CVS very close to where I live that has been looted. They also had a Covid19 testing center. This is the worst possible time for these protests.

I live in a senior community in California and go for walks. I notice that several of the seniors that I see do not wear masks, more than I previously noted.

I have a brother who lives in New Jersey; the county he lives in, is very close to New York City and has the most cases in New Jersey. It is an epicenter. He sees the same; lots of risky behaviors.

As many of you are aware, there is an emphasis on economic recovery in the united states, with much disregard for scientific evidence for social distancing . The white house task and other federal goverment agencies, have for the most part been silenced, and has not been publisizing the importance of safe practices to limit corona virus spread, and many here, really think that now the virus will not spread as before, and I see all kinds of risky behavior. 

As  long as I'm ranting, I want to mention something that will offend some who read this. I am upset with President Trump with regard to the the poor example that he presents to the people. I realize that he is not a doctor, but how can he refuse to wear a mask. (Wearing a mask helps to prevent spread to others) He was exposed to the disease, and still he does not wear a mask. He has no regard for the safety of others who come in his contact. He is not setting an example for others, and many emulate his behavior, thus spreading the disease. ......I think that he does not wear a mask, ( and vice president pence) because they want to present an image that it's okay for the average joe to go out to work and not be concerned about scientific studies that indicate safe practices......I really believe that there will be a lots of extra deaths here.

 

CSN_Elena's picture
CSN_Elena
Posts: 17
Joined: Jan 2019

This discussion has provided valuable information about COVID-19, however it has also pushed the boundaries of our Terms & Conditions regarding the expression of political views. We have decided to close this discussion to further comments. We respect everyone's individual views, but CSN is not the right forum for political discussions.  

 

Thank you,

Elena 

CSN Support Team 

Pages

Subscribe to Comments for "How are you guys coping with the other C word?"