When to use Biotene, when to use salt & soda rinse...

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spector551
spector551 Member Posts: 109
edited March 2022 in Head and Neck Cancer #1

I guess I need a little clarification from you guys that have already done it.

I am fixing to start my seventh week of treatment and I am just now getting the sore-ish throat and tongue. Really my tongue hurts more than my throat. I had stopped using the biotene a while back, because it didn't really seem to work to well - maybe because I had pretty good saliva. I'm now down to the thick saliva and mostly dry mouth. I have a thick feeling tongue and a fair amount of dryness now that seems to be worsening the condition of my mouth. Is this the time I should be using the Biotene for best results, or should I be concentrating more on the salt & soda rinse?

 

God bless,

Jamie

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  • TracyLynn72
    TracyLynn72 Member Posts: 839
    #2
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    Personally....

    I used the soda/salt/water mix all through treatments. I rinsed about every hour with the stuff! I was too chicken to try anything else!  I tried Biotene after finishing rads and it burned like fire!!  I use Act for drymouth and LOVE it.  It's been the first thing I can use that doesn't hurt and actually seems to work.  I hope you can find what works best for you.  Hang in there...you are SO close!!  

  • donfoo
    donfoo Member Posts: 1,771 Member
    #3
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    two different side effects

    Jamie,

    Two different side effects of radiation are ulcers/mouth sores and dry mouth.  Ulcers/sores are generally treated with magic mouthwash, salt/soda solution, liquid lidocaine, Nystatin(thrush)etc to assist with relief and healing. The dry mouth condition is caused by the radiation damaging the salivary glands. Things like the mints and gels and just plenty of liquid help this out. I'm sure others will chime in. Personally, I had plenty of issues with the ulcers/sores but saliva hung in there quite well. Don

  • Steve5
    Steve5 Member Posts: 147
    #4
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    Not as far along

    Hi Jamie, you know I am not as far along as you but I rinse and spit with the salt/baking soda all day if I feel like it, sometimes twice at one rinse and I gargle with it then spit out, the biotene I used a few times a day, early on I would brush my teeth with biotene paste then rinse with the mouthwash, I keep a water bottle designated for the salt/soda and use that liberally, seems to help and that was from advice from some veterans here to rinse all day if you wanted to , also the rad nurse told me rinse as often as i felt I needed with the salt/soda -

    I am the rookie here and probably don't have a place to say this but every morning when I finish the rad treatment I have to walk by the bell on the way out -there have been a few that have rung it since I started - I think of you getting close and others that I see in the morning waiting room that will finish before me - and when I see the bell think of how I look forward to ringing the dam thing so hard it rips off the wall - I mean this in a good way -  I just wanted to add this since I got some great help this weekend from everyone here and today I forced myself to eat half a McD cheeseburger, sorry to digress  - it still helps to write

     

    Thinking of you and keeping you in my prayers

    Steve

  • phrannie51
    phrannie51 Member Posts: 4,716
    #5
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    I used salt/soda for the most part....

    I also used L-glutamine powder mixed with water (which I could swallow, too.....more hydration).  I never was able to get much relief with Biotene, so gave up on it early in the game.  For the illusion of saliva, I used milk.....but I don't know what your mucous situation is, so if mucous isn't too bad , 4% milk makes your mouth feel like it's got saliva longer than water, it's got calories, and it's hydration.

    The only purchased saliva helper I used that truly worked for me was Stoppers 4 spray.  It was too stingy during adjuvant chemo, but it worked well during rads, and after all chemo was done.  I still keep it by my bedside for those times when I wake up at night with dry mouth.

    You use what is comfortable and what works....there is no "rules" in HNC for saliva illusions :).

    p

  • CivilMatt
    CivilMatt Member Posts: 4,722 Member
    #6
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    mouth aid

    Jamie,

    I used the soda & saltwater rinse (like Tracy) throughout the day and at night when I got up to pee.  I always had a pitcher mixed-up and at the ready.

    I used the magic mouth wash and liquid lidocaine (like Don) on an as-needed schecule for mouth, tongue and throat discomfort.  I used the magic mouth wash just prior to rads and bed time (to buy me a window of comfort).  Magic mouth wash was  one of my weapons of choice to fight discomfort (I went through 6 bottles and swallowed every drop).

    When I used Biotene it was just after mouth rinsing and magic mouth wash application.  Most mouth rinses were overwhelming to my mouth.  Some things I could handle some I could not.

    Today, I use Xylimelts at bedtime and anytime I want to set my water bottle down.  The dry mouth condition is  no longer front and center, but still very, very present.

    Good luck,

    Matt

  • fishmanpa
    fishmanpa Member Posts: 1,227 Member
    #7
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    Biotene Products

    I, like most used the a salt and baking soda solution. I added glutamine which helped. Of course Magic Mouthwash as well. The only Biotene products I used were the toothpaste which thank goodness didn't burn the heck out of my mouth and the Oral Balance gel which helped with dry mouth when I went to sleep. 

    Keep in mind that Biotene's formulas changed recently, foregoing much of the beneficial ingrediants for the sake of the all mighty dollar. Personally I would stick with the tried and true basic OTC remedy.

    Positive thoughts

    "T"

  • boardwalkgirl
    boardwalkgirl Member Posts: 269
    #8
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    I used so many things but for

    I used so many things but for the thick saliva I used meat tenderizer (Like Adolfs) mixed in water and it seemed to cut the thickness. I used salt and baking soda as a preventative rinse and when I got sores I used the magic mouthwash.

  • mbelon
    mbelon Member Posts: 2 Member
    #9
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    Would someone please define “magic mouthwash”? Is there a brand name or good location to buy it?

  • Stephie75
    Stephie75 Member Posts: 185 Member
    #10
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    Try getting the Magic Mouthwash as @mbelon mentioned. Also Lidocaine Viscious. They both numb your entire mouth, however, you can take a q-tip and put the medicine just on the sores to help when not numbing your whole mouth/throat. If they are all over, just swish for comfort, and see your dentist for a good mouth spray and a mouth wash. I use CTX 4 products and MI Paste Plus (it's a flouride paste I put all over my teeth. I hear the fluoride trays burn people)

    Take care,

    Steph

  • CivilMatt
    CivilMatt Member Posts: 4,722 Member
    #11
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    mbelon,

    At one time (not so long ago) I was and I still am a BIG proponent of the Magic Mouthwash. I do not want to define it for you, it is what your doctor says it is (or as Stephie75 defined it, she sounds good). The vintage I used was whipped up by my local compounding pharmacy. You can Google magic mouthwash to find alternate names but, the important thing is, does it work for you. Mine did, I really loved it. It made my life with the side effects of cancer radiation treatments bearable.

    If you wish, I would like to swing on by your place and have a shot of magic mouthwash together, for old times sake.

    Bye,

    CivilMatt

  • mbelon
    mbelon Member Posts: 2 Member
    #12
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    Thanks Matt and Steph. I wasn’t sure it was an actual product, or a generic term like “Kleenex”. I get it! I’ll have to experiment with a few different products. Thanks for your help. These mouth sores are really tough. I actually had a mouth full of them by the end of my second week! 😔

  • CivilMatt
    CivilMatt Member Posts: 4,722 Member
    #13
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    mbelon,

    It was even easier than that for me. I told my rad onc about my ‘mouth condition’ and she called in the prescription to the local compounding pharmacy and I was on my way to one more problem solved. For me, no shopping around, I hit a home run (or at least a triple) my first time at bat.

    CivilMatt 

  • Stephie75
    Stephie75 Member Posts: 185 Member
    #14
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    Matt,

    Ha! Yep, I forgot about that. I drove across the street to the hospital pharmacy to get my 1st script due to the fact they did compounds. CVS in this town does not. There are only a few pharmacies that actually do. So, I opted to go the safe route and head across the street to the hospital. Expensive stuff per shot! My insurance did not cover it for some reason or another and I have great insurance. Well, that's always relative, now isn't it?

    I still have some left. I'll raise a shot out of my plastic measuring cup to you both!

    Ulcers be gone!

    -Steph

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