Its a start:"Genetically engineered virus kills liver cancer"...plus other stuff

coloCan
coloCan Member Posts: 1,944 Member
edited February 2013 in Colorectal Cancer #1

http://medicalxpress.com/news/2013-02-genetically-virus-cancer.html

and from the same site this date:

http://medicalxpress.com/news/2013-02-tumor-blood-vessels-cancer-cells.html

 

(for a nontechnical site with info on current research, this one aint bad)

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Comments

  • manwithnoname
    manwithnoname Member Posts: 402
    Funny

    I posted months ago the use of an oncolytic virus called NDV, now over 40 years of research in all types of cancer with it including colon, the post was ridiculed by some, Pete used it in Germany. Totaly harmless for humans.

    No money to be made on NDV by big pharma funny that...how research dries up.

  • coloCan
    coloCan Member Posts: 1,944 Member

    Funny

    I posted months ago the use of an oncolytic virus called NDV, now over 40 years of research in all types of cancer with it including colon, the post was ridiculed by some, Pete used it in Germany. Totaly harmless for humans.

    No money to be made on NDV by big pharma funny that...how research dries up.

    same with any potential "natural" remedies which BigPharma

    can't patent and monopolize....In US, interlink between the industries its supposed to monitor and its own policy-making decision-makers at FDA is notorious;one example being big Agriculture in cahoots with the FDA (which it partly controls)and the unleashing of genetically modified foods which is destroying everything it comes in contact with except the insects it was supposedly created to destroy. The insects are adapting and surviving and in the near future watch how many humans and other living creatures,plant and animal.die from this....To get research to justify this poison, corporations involved are buying up research institutes to influence results-one specific example here  concerns bee colony collapse.....

  • coloCan
    coloCan Member Posts: 1,944 Member
    coloCan said:

    same with any potential "natural" remedies which BigPharma

    can't patent and monopolize....In US, interlink between the industries its supposed to monitor and its own policy-making decision-makers at FDA is notorious;one example being big Agriculture in cahoots with the FDA (which it partly controls)and the unleashing of genetically modified foods which is destroying everything it comes in contact with except the insects it was supposedly created to destroy. The insects are adapting and surviving and in the near future watch how many humans and other living creatures,plant and animal.die from this....To get research to justify this poison, corporations involved are buying up research institutes to influence results-one specific example here  concerns bee colony collapse.....

    check this approach:

    http://ecancer.org/news/3797

    or maybe this on "Compound K"

    www.mdpi.com/1422-0067/14/2/2980

     

     

  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900
    its not funny tony, this is a capital crime

    but yes it funny isn't it. i have to laugh and smile or else i get sad.

    the ndv is working in me tonight, i got my vaccine today.

    it works in this strange guy, maybe i am glad i am so different after all.

    our lives are so cheap. the implications as always profound.

    great research steve, always welcome,

    what a mess we are leaving to our children.

    hugs,

    pete

  • tachilders
    tachilders Member Posts: 313
    coloCan said:

    same with any potential "natural" remedies which BigPharma

    can't patent and monopolize....In US, interlink between the industries its supposed to monitor and its own policy-making decision-makers at FDA is notorious;one example being big Agriculture in cahoots with the FDA (which it partly controls)and the unleashing of genetically modified foods which is destroying everything it comes in contact with except the insects it was supposedly created to destroy. The insects are adapting and surviving and in the near future watch how many humans and other living creatures,plant and animal.die from this....To get research to justify this poison, corporations involved are buying up research institutes to influence results-one specific example here  concerns bee colony collapse.....

    I work for big pharma, and

    I work for big pharma, and the above just isn't the case.  Cancer vaccines can be patented, just like any other pharma product.  I am here to personally tell you that there is NO conspiracy by big pharma to kill people.  I will also freely admit that no big pharma company is going to invest millions looking into every anecdotal method out there for "curing" some disease.  These companies rely on proven research methods to decide which compounds to spend their millions in R&D budgets on.

     

    Tedd

  • annalexandria
    annalexandria Member Posts: 2,571

    I work for big pharma, and

    I work for big pharma, and the above just isn't the case.  Cancer vaccines can be patented, just like any other pharma product.  I am here to personally tell you that there is NO conspiracy by big pharma to kill people.  I will also freely admit that no big pharma company is going to invest millions looking into every anecdotal method out there for "curing" some disease.  These companies rely on proven research methods to decide which compounds to spend their millions in R&D budgets on.

     

    Tedd

    The voice of reason.

    Thanks, Tedd.  It's appreciated.  AA

  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900

    The voice of reason.

    Thanks, Tedd.  It's appreciated.  AA

    its just an inadvertent conspiracy

    dear friends,

    another rant, just ignore me, no harm intended.

    but big pharma i suspect has lobbied government and to some etent shaped our rules and laws and procedures.

    its happened in all western countries the same way. is my response a fluke, i say not. i am busy documenting other cases on the video blog.

    its one way to have heaps of real life anecdotes, why are anecdotes no good if its all we got.

    the effectiveness of these personalised therapies precludes the stand trial designs. which then can never be tested.

    again given our genetic variety, our tumours genetic variety and lifestyle differences is it no wonder we fail to get results.

    we have built a system where the only therapies that are sactioned by convnetional medicine are evidence based, which is trial based, which means that 

    those therapies have to be incredibly expensive to cover trial costs. now ndv cannot be patented, its a free worthwhile therapy.

    ok it think its like $300 per shot, i had two this week. it needs to be injected with hyperthermia, it synergises very well with vaccines.

    given whatever i am paying is the cost price, doc n runs the cancer program at cost for local and interntional patients. he said no money for funding a trial.

    he one the the worlds best, and earliest dendritic cell researchers. his papers have been criticised by peers for. not being standardised to get reproducable standardised results.

    so why would he, invest in a study if he could. if i raise money, i will provide for people in need to get these therapies , not spend it on a trial, that wont be accepted by authorities because of trial design.

    great points ann, ted and everyone. marie yesterday also pointed out about the legal framework and rules for medicine. 

    if our cure is outside the providence of big pharma, it will never arrive unless we develop it ourselves and change the rules so this mess does not happen again.

    i suggest this is a worthwhile activity. but i will do this in australia, why already i know i need $25 million to setup our first dendritic cell lab downunder.

    doc n will provide all the support and training and technology. the first lab in australia to help patients will be fantastic.

    the sad irony is apparently you have these labs in the usa, the best in the world, but not helping patients, doing research. because your governing rules

    and laws prohibit the use of these therapies.

    ask yourself why does doctor chang import vaccines for usa based cancer patients from doctor n. he is flying out tomorrow with another load of vaccines. these vaccines really really work. ask doctor chang.

    again you have a situation that to me seems ludicrous. this is the sort of issue the american cancer society should fix, or is this to hostile.

    i simply am calling the limitations of your systems, and making suggestions for its improvement. obama could fix this in one signature. it would reduce the cost on the health budget and improve outcomes. i think he is up for it. this is acknowledging the political realities that direct our health spending and priorities. if this is beyond whats permitted on our board for discussion i am truly sorry. as always with the best intentions and not wanting to be hostile.

    of course trial based drug based solutions are great. i completely support them, i use sorry many off label drugs. its just now it appears the west, has a medical system that only delivers drug based outcomes. there is no funding for these non profit driven therapies. the proof of that statement is the tests have not been done aleady. these are not new discoveries.

    just look at at the cimetidine and psk stuff. no profit, no trials. i suspect half of us would not be here with recurrences if we had that simple therapy in our regime during our initial care. contemplate the the reasons, that has not happened yey. why won't it happen. so we rely on a defacto info network here, where we share life saving medical advice because our doctors are not legally permitted to tell us.

    that is the clearest example of the tradegy of our medical system. sorry friends i don't mean to bager you all. i think these discussions in the light of my therapy success show us a direction forward. they paint a realistic picture of the strength and limits of our health systems. at least when we have that truth we can make the best decisions we can make. you know my choices. I pray i am not lucky pete, my success is the result of effective medicine, then my continued path to healing is more secure. i am trying to be cool, as i know my results are prelimenary ( but outstanding ).

    please disregard my comments if they any upset, they are just the reality as i see it. if anyone wants to help me rock the boat, pm me, somehow together we can improve our health systems. noone else will do it for us, alas. the have not so far. its our responsibility, its falls on our shoulders. yes i know at a time when most are dealing with serious health issues. maybe that why i am becoming so vocal and opinionated. i see it as a worthwhile use of the remained of my life, however long that is.

    hugs,

    pete

     

  • manwithnoname
    manwithnoname Member Posts: 402

    I work for big pharma, and

    I work for big pharma, and the above just isn't the case.  Cancer vaccines can be patented, just like any other pharma product.  I am here to personally tell you that there is NO conspiracy by big pharma to kill people.  I will also freely admit that no big pharma company is going to invest millions looking into every anecdotal method out there for "curing" some disease.  These companies rely on proven research methods to decide which compounds to spend their millions in R&D budgets on.

     

    Tedd

    Sorry Tedd

    But getting a patent on a virus (or plant) that hasn't been modified genetically can't be done, at least from my research that appears to be the case, please send me a link showing otherwise.

    No conspiracy, just cold hard economic facts. Of course there is no conspiracy to kill people there is also no desire to cure people unless there is a profit in it, or am I wrong on that?

    NDV is not 'anecdotal' look at the research from the past 40+ years, maybe even contact the researchers as I have.

    Prof. Schirmacher 

    Prof. Csatary

    Prof. Slavin

    I have read Prof. Schirrmachers response in the literature to 'new patented' oncolytic virus's being discovered and his sheer disbelief that NDV is being ignored even after proven saftey and excellent results.

    The system is flawed and driven by $$$, sad but true.

    Also isn't it true that in the last three years alone 'Big Pharma' has paid over $11,000,000,000, in fines!!! that  11 billion could have done a lot for cancer research.

    "In all, 26 companies, including eight of the 10 top players in the global industry, have been found to be acting dishonestly. The scale of the wrongdoing, revealed for the first time, has undermined public and professional trust in the industry and is holding back clinical progress, according to two papers published in today's New England Journal of Medicine. Leading lawyers have warned that the multibillion-dollar fines are not enough to change the industry's behaviour."

  • coloCan
    coloCan Member Posts: 1,944 Member

    its not funny tony, this is a capital crime

    but yes it funny isn't it. i have to laugh and smile or else i get sad.

    the ndv is working in me tonight, i got my vaccine today.

    it works in this strange guy, maybe i am glad i am so different after all.

    our lives are so cheap. the implications as always profound.

    great research steve, always welcome,

    what a mess we are leaving to our children.

    hugs,

    pete

    Don't mean to offend anyone but reality is:

    www.ironmagazine.com/2010/poor-quality-control-in-the-pharmaceutical-industry-a-report/

    www.ironmagazine.com/blog/2012/nearly-every-major-drug-company-convicted-of-criminal-behavior-in-three-year-11-billion-sweep/

     

    Dr Mercola's site and LEF both have documented other examples....Yeah, i know a business's goal is to make money but can that not be achieved ethically?

    Here's another food supply and health concern:

    www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/02/130211162236.htm

     

     

  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900
    coloCan said:

    Don't mean to offend anyone but reality is:

    www.ironmagazine.com/2010/poor-quality-control-in-the-pharmaceutical-industry-a-report/

    www.ironmagazine.com/blog/2012/nearly-every-major-drug-company-convicted-of-criminal-behavior-in-three-year-11-billion-sweep/

     

    Dr Mercola's site and LEF both have documented other examples....Yeah, i know a business's goal is to make money but can that not be achieved ethically?

    Here's another food supply and health concern:

    www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/02/130211162236.htm

     

     

    thanks steve

    always great, not offensive, but scary to some extent. i am glad we are going to make this world a better place.

    it starts with awareness. it finishes with resolve. being a non gmo vegan seemed a safer choice, if only we could avoid the pesticides.

    hugs,

    pete

  • coloCan
    coloCan Member Posts: 1,944 Member

    thanks steve

    always great, not offensive, but scary to some extent. i am glad we are going to make this world a better place.

    it starts with awareness. it finishes with resolve. being a non gmo vegan seemed a safer choice, if only we could avoid the pesticides.

    hugs,

    pete

    and this approach comes from research in India

    www.healthcanal.com/cancers/36108-Indian-plant-could-play-key-role-death-cancer-cells.html

    (no way our docs have the time to look at all the stuff being published on cancer. I've been reading up on CRC over three years now and every other day it seems i come across another gene,protein,pathway i don't recall reading about previously,such as the Enhancer of Zeste 2 (EZH2) protein,which one team of researchers asserts the depletion of which blocks the growth of colon cancer cells. Having never studied this stuff in school,its that much more difficult to comprehend most of what i read.....For instance, what the %$%#% does "Variable Clonal Repopulation Dynamics Influence Chemotherapy Response in Colorectal Cancer" mean?-and this is an easy title)read that here

    www.sciencemag.org/content/339/6119/543.short

    (Some might want to check out last article listed at bottom on off-label drug Lapatinib,)

  • manwithnoname
    manwithnoname Member Posts: 402
    coloCan said:

    and this approach comes from research in India

    www.healthcanal.com/cancers/36108-Indian-plant-could-play-key-role-death-cancer-cells.html

    (no way our docs have the time to look at all the stuff being published on cancer. I've been reading up on CRC over three years now and every other day it seems i come across another gene,protein,pathway i don't recall reading about previously,such as the Enhancer of Zeste 2 (EZH2) protein,which one team of researchers asserts the depletion of which blocks the growth of colon cancer cells. Having never studied this stuff in school,its that much more difficult to comprehend most of what i read.....For instance, what the %$%#% does "Variable Clonal Repopulation Dynamics Influence Chemotherapy Response in Colorectal Cancer" mean?-and this is an easy title)read that here

    www.sciencemag.org/content/339/6119/543.short

    (Some might want to check out last article listed at bottom on off-label drug Lapatinib,)

    Just watch

    as more and more dicoveries come out of India and China, 2 countries with an ancient history of herbal medicine and a population now getting 'western' cancers, also a poor rural population that has no insurance or any realistic chance of getting OVER PRICED chemo drugs.

    On another note, we had to beg to be given off-label Thalidomide as our insurance refused the $5000 monthly bill, of a 50 year old drug that used to cost $200 a month twenty years ago, that was until it was found to have 'action' in certain cancers and the price has been rising ever since...yeah they are really looking out for the patient...

  • coloCan
    coloCan Member Posts: 1,944 Member

    Just watch

    as more and more dicoveries come out of India and China, 2 countries with an ancient history of herbal medicine and a population now getting 'western' cancers, also a poor rural population that has no insurance or any realistic chance of getting OVER PRICED chemo drugs.

    On another note, we had to beg to be given off-label Thalidomide as our insurance refused the $5000 monthly bill, of a 50 year old drug that used to cost $200 a month twenty years ago, that was until it was found to have 'action' in certain cancers and the price has been rising ever since...yeah they are really looking out for the patient...

    but how is their "quality control"in India or China?

    From what i've read many ingredients for vitamins,supplements supposedly come from China already. A report came out yesterday questioning the potency of Vit D supplements

    http://consumer.healthday.com/Article.asp?AID=673376

     

  • manwithnoname
    manwithnoname Member Posts: 402
    coloCan said:

    but how is their "quality control"in India or China?

    From what i've read many ingredients for vitamins,supplements supposedly come from China already. A report came out yesterday questioning the potency of Vit D supplements

    http://consumer.healthday.com/Article.asp?AID=673376

     

    Im sure

    quality control will be suspect, but wasn't there aa case recentley in the US of some contaminated medicine and people died? for quality I trust the Germans and Japanese, just like for cars...

  • vinaykumar
    vinaykumar Member Posts: 66

    Just watch

    as more and more dicoveries come out of India and China, 2 countries with an ancient history of herbal medicine and a population now getting 'western' cancers, also a poor rural population that has no insurance or any realistic chance of getting OVER PRICED chemo drugs.

    On another note, we had to beg to be given off-label Thalidomide as our insurance refused the $5000 monthly bill, of a 50 year old drug that used to cost $200 a month twenty years ago, that was until it was found to have 'action' in certain cancers and the price has been rising ever since...yeah they are really looking out for the patient...

    there are quite a few

    there are quite a few ayurvedic (ancient indian system of medicine stil being practiced)  remedies which are being used . 

    i am also following an ayurveda  protocol for my dad which supposedly helps with chemo side effects and also helps with treatment

    below link is the protocol we are  following....it costs abt $50 / month ....

    http://www.divyayoga.com/component/kunena/10-ask-vaidya/36-cancer.html

    there is lack of structured testing and quality controls in india so such treatments take a lot of time to be verified......i dont have time but i faith that  this will help and tahts why i am doing this for my dad 

  • coloCan
    coloCan Member Posts: 1,944 Member

    there are quite a few

    there are quite a few ayurvedic (ancient indian system of medicine stil being practiced)  remedies which are being used . 

    i am also following an ayurveda  protocol for my dad which supposedly helps with chemo side effects and also helps with treatment

    below link is the protocol we are  following....it costs abt $50 / month ....

    http://www.divyayoga.com/component/kunena/10-ask-vaidya/36-cancer.html

    there is lack of structured testing and quality controls in india so such treatments take a lot of time to be verified......i dont have time but i faith that  this will help and tahts why i am doing this for my dad 

    and here's another thing that one day might be applied to

    signaling in cancer,maybe

    http://news.rpi.edu/update.do

     

  • tachilders
    tachilders Member Posts: 313

    Sorry Tedd

    But getting a patent on a virus (or plant) that hasn't been modified genetically can't be done, at least from my research that appears to be the case, please send me a link showing otherwise.

    No conspiracy, just cold hard economic facts. Of course there is no conspiracy to kill people there is also no desire to cure people unless there is a profit in it, or am I wrong on that?

    NDV is not 'anecdotal' look at the research from the past 40+ years, maybe even contact the researchers as I have.

    Prof. Schirmacher 

    Prof. Csatary

    Prof. Slavin

    I have read Prof. Schirrmachers response in the literature to 'new patented' oncolytic virus's being discovered and his sheer disbelief that NDV is being ignored even after proven saftey and excellent results.

    The system is flawed and driven by $$$, sad but true.

    Also isn't it true that in the last three years alone 'Big Pharma' has paid over $11,000,000,000, in fines!!! that  11 billion could have done a lot for cancer research.

    "In all, 26 companies, including eight of the 10 top players in the global industry, have been found to be acting dishonestly. The scale of the wrongdoing, revealed for the first time, has undermined public and professional trust in the industry and is holding back clinical progress, according to two papers published in today's New England Journal of Medicine. Leading lawyers have warned that the multibillion-dollar fines are not enough to change the industry's behaviour."

    The NDV virus could, and

    The NDV virus could, and likely would, have to be genetically modified to get maximum efficacy, and thus would be patentable.  I will freely admit that the system is flawed and driven by money, but that is a combination of pharma, government, and attorneys that are causing this.  The FDA "approves" medicines for use, but takes no responsibility if they later prove to have safety problems in wider use.  How many commercials do you see everyday promoting a lawsuit against one pharma company or the next?  My company spends hundreds of millions, if not billions a year on R&D, yet 90% or more of that money is spent on compounds that never make it to market.  As long as the medical industry, including hospitals, pharmacies, pharma companies, insurance companies, etc... is FOR PROFIT, we will have these same problems.  I take avastin, which costs my insurance company neerly $100k/year, but I can tell you from experience it likely costs less than $10k to make that amount of drug.  The problem is, the company that developed it had 9 other drugs that failed at some point, so they have to make that money back on the ONE that succeeded.  That's the current business model in pharma....  It is also true that big pharma won't spend millions developing treatments that they will lose money on (i.e not patentable).  These companies are all publicly traded, so they have a fiduciary reponsibility to their shareholders, and could get sued by them if they started spending millions or more on products that don't make money.  I don't like the system, but blaming the pharma companies alone and ignoring the other parties that are as responsible is short-sighted and unfair. 

     

    Here's another question.  If, for example,  NDV works so well, why doesn't a university or the CDC or some other group work on getting it approved for use?  Why does big pharma need to be involved at all?  Also, there are places that will use NDV (like Hallwang), so why don't we all just go there for treatment, or why aren't clinics in the US using NDV?  It's because the insurance companies won't pay for it, and that has NOTHING to do with big pharma.  Insurance companies won't pay for experimental or off-label use of drugs.  Why not, if they work and will save money in the long run?  I'm sure my insurance company would rather pay $300/dose for NDV rather than $4000/dose for avastin, but they won't.  Why not?  Big pharma doesn't control the insurance companies, and in fact, it is almost the other way around.  If a pharma company can't get their drugs on an approved formulary (that the insurance company creates), they lose billions in revenue.

    Tedd 

  • manwithnoname
    manwithnoname Member Posts: 402

    The NDV virus could, and

    The NDV virus could, and likely would, have to be genetically modified to get maximum efficacy, and thus would be patentable.  I will freely admit that the system is flawed and driven by money, but that is a combination of pharma, government, and attorneys that are causing this.  The FDA "approves" medicines for use, but takes no responsibility if they later prove to have safety problems in wider use.  How many commercials do you see everyday promoting a lawsuit against one pharma company or the next?  My company spends hundreds of millions, if not billions a year on R&D, yet 90% or more of that money is spent on compounds that never make it to market.  As long as the medical industry, including hospitals, pharmacies, pharma companies, insurance companies, etc... is FOR PROFIT, we will have these same problems.  I take avastin, which costs my insurance company neerly $100k/year, but I can tell you from experience it likely costs less than $10k to make that amount of drug.  The problem is, the company that developed it had 9 other drugs that failed at some point, so they have to make that money back on the ONE that succeeded.  That's the current business model in pharma....  It is also true that big pharma won't spend millions developing treatments that they will lose money on (i.e not patentable).  These companies are all publicly traded, so they have a fiduciary reponsibility to their shareholders, and could get sued by them if they started spending millions or more on products that don't make money.  I don't like the system, but blaming the pharma companies alone and ignoring the other parties that are as responsible is short-sighted and unfair. 

     

    Here's another question.  If, for example,  NDV works so well, why doesn't a university or the CDC or some other group work on getting it approved for use?  Why does big pharma need to be involved at all?  Also, there are places that will use NDV (like Hallwang), so why don't we all just go there for treatment, or why aren't clinics in the US using NDV?  It's because the insurance companies won't pay for it, and that has NOTHING to do with big pharma.  Insurance companies won't pay for experimental or off-label use of drugs.  Why not, if they work and will save money in the long run?  I'm sure my insurance company would rather pay $300/dose for NDV rather than $4000/dose for avastin, but they won't.  Why not?  Big pharma doesn't control the insurance companies, and in fact, it is almost the other way around.  If a pharma company can't get their drugs on an approved formulary (that the insurance company creates), they lose billions in revenue.

    Tedd 

    Im not blaming only

    Big Pharma, the whole system is flawed as I said previously, from companies like yours chasing money all the way down to Dr's taking kickback's to promote (push) certain drugs.

    The government did not take those $11 billion in fines and give it to non-profits/universities for research, where did it go? no one's asking and that is also part of the problem, our collective indifference.

    There will be no 'cure' for cancer if this system continues, only the very slow progression of a new drug being only slightly better than an old drug and getting approved.

    Cancer I believe needs a global effort, a "Manhatten Project" effort, money can not be the thing that defines health and who lives or dies.

    As for R&D is it not true that certain Drug companies actually spend more on advertising? at least that's what the internet says...

    As for NDV, I know for at least 20 years it has been modified from the original strain, there are many variants now, NONE are approved, but 20 years have been wasted where people could have been prescribed the non-toxic original version that has proven to regress cancer and give very long remissions. And NDV is only one story of many.

    The FDA, insurance companies, Government, and the Public are all guilty in letting this travesty continue, I'm not just blaming drug companies, we created a flawed system and there is no hurry to over-haul it.

    Who pays the $xxx,xxx,xxx to get something approved Tedd? universities? private institutions? 

  • tachilders
    tachilders Member Posts: 313

    Im not blaming only

    Big Pharma, the whole system is flawed as I said previously, from companies like yours chasing money all the way down to Dr's taking kickback's to promote (push) certain drugs.

    The government did not take those $11 billion in fines and give it to non-profits/universities for research, where did it go? no one's asking and that is also part of the problem, our collective indifference.

    There will be no 'cure' for cancer if this system continues, only the very slow progression of a new drug being only slightly better than an old drug and getting approved.

    Cancer I believe needs a global effort, a "Manhatten Project" effort, money can not be the thing that defines health and who lives or dies.

    As for R&D is it not true that certain Drug companies actually spend more on advertising? at least that's what the internet says...

    As for NDV, I know for at least 20 years it has been modified from the original strain, there are many variants now, NONE are approved, but 20 years have been wasted where people could have been prescribed the non-toxic original version that has proven to regress cancer and give very long remissions. And NDV is only one story of many.

    The FDA, insurance companies, Government, and the Public are all guilty in letting this travesty continue, I'm not just blaming drug companies, we created a flawed system and there is no hurry to over-haul it.

    Who pays the $xxx,xxx,xxx to get something approved Tedd? universities? private institutions? 

    I'm starting to think the

    I'm starting to think the entire medical industry (pharma, insurance, hospitals, doctors, etc...) has to become a not for profit industry to REALLY change things.  You will likely take a hit on innovation initially, but long term you would actually get more innovation as non-profitable treatments could be tested.  Also agree we need a "Manhattan Project" approach to tackling cancer.  The current system is broken, unfortunately like so many other systems it seems, and fixing it will take real leadership, but I don't think that exists anymore (at least in politics). 

    To address your questions specifically, yes pharma companies do spend as much or more on advertising as they do on R&D, but that is because research and experience has proven that advertising leads to a better return on investment than research does.  With regard to who pays for the clinical trials, it is the company/entity that is trying to get the drug approved.

    Tedd

  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900

    Just watch

    as more and more dicoveries come out of India and China, 2 countries with an ancient history of herbal medicine and a population now getting 'western' cancers, also a poor rural population that has no insurance or any realistic chance of getting OVER PRICED chemo drugs.

    On another note, we had to beg to be given off-label Thalidomide as our insurance refused the $5000 monthly bill, of a 50 year old drug that used to cost $200 a month twenty years ago, that was until it was found to have 'action' in certain cancers and the price has been rising ever since...yeah they are really looking out for the patient...

    give them a break tony

    only joking, but they have to put gas in the corporate jet and for all the conferences in exostic locations.

    in big pharma defence, they do have a heart, they gave me $26000 worth of folfox for free on compassionate grounds early on when it was not covered by national health.

    not sure if thats good or bad.

     

    i have this love hate relationship with big pharma, i love the off label drugs the design so we can use them. that takes cash, researchers, testing etc etc.

    i hate all the bad things they do.

    i personally skip the big pharma issue and focus on my key care objectives, big pharma is a difficult target, dc vaccines are an easy medical product to implement i think.

    its not a drug, its a therapy, so it does not really interfere with big pharma.

    i can see a day, when all resections get a vaccine shot or shots, then if you recurr well it might be another vaccine, when that therapy is exhuasted if it fails, you may well progress to chemo folfox etc etc. its possible to change the mix of these therapies. it just makes so much sense to try immunotherapy as a 1st line not a last resort as you are accessing the immune system before its damaged.

    hugs,

    pete

    ps i wonder why the american cancer society does not take a leadership role in this area, are we members of the society, are they obliged to listen to our concerns as members, do we have a vote, a voice as a community ? i wonder. no pressure, no hostility, just curious.