PSA velocity in Top Gear – I’ve to cut short Drugs’ Vacations

VascodaGama
VascodaGama Member Posts: 3,513 Member
edited March 2013 in Prostate Cancer #1

 

Unfortunately my latest test results requires me to shorten my “vacations” on the hormonal treatment. The PSA came at 0.13 ng/ml and the Testosterone at 2.52 ng/ml (252 ng/dL). This is upsetting because I wished to stay off drugs for 5 years but the exponential calculations of the PSA velocity shows that I will reach the threshold limit of 2.5 ng/ml in October 2013. This is the value set by my doctor to stop the intermitent period and re-start HT. I was looking for a period of 3 years with no drugs. Frown

Today’s results have increased from;

Nov 2011: PSA=0.02, T=0.32 (last Eligard 6-month shot)
May 2012: PSA=0.02, T=<0.01 (End of Eligard’s effectiveness; Starting Off-Drugs perio
Aug 2012: PSA=0.02, T=0.11
Nov 2012: PSA=0.03, T=0.56
Jan 2013: PSA=0.13, T=2.52 (PSADT=1.96 months; PSAv=0.20 ng/ml per month)

I need some sort of alternatives to prolong this "lovely" time on normal levels of testosterone. Castration brought me numerous but mild side effects . In any case what I am now experiencing is quite different from the symptoms while on castration.
Libido and nostalgic erections are back. I got more energy, more pubic hair and harder beard. I feel an elevated lucidity and better reasoning in dealing with things. Rheumatic-like pain is gone totally.

I read that guys on intermittent hormonal therapy take maintenance drugs while on vacations from the treatment. The common practice by famous oncologists is to administer 5-ARI (such as Avodart or Proscar) continuously. A well known PCa survivor who took intermittent HT as his solo prime treatment in the past 13 years (since 1999), manages to prolong the vacation period with the use of thalidomide and vitamin B6. He just ended his third off-drug period which is quite impressive. Thalidomide "prohibits" the formation of newer blood vessels required by the cancer to survive.

The National Cancer Institute says this on the matter;
“Cancer researchers studying the conditions necessary for cancer metastasis have discovered that one of the critical events required is the growth of a new network of blood vessels. This process of forming new blood vessels is called angiogenesis.”
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/understandingcancer/angiogenesis

Thalidomide cause side effects and it may be nasty. Five alpha reductase Inhibitors (5-ARI) are easier to take and they do not lower the testosterone  (saving other possible health problems) but they also lead to lower libido.

I wonder where I am heading. My next test is in two months.

You may follow my story at; http://csn.cancer.org/node/244938

 

Best to all.

VGama  Undecided

«13

Comments

  • hopeful and optimistic
    hopeful and optimistic Member Posts: 2,333 Member
    Dear V
    I am saddened that you

    Dear V

    I am saddened that you have concerns this vacation MAY not last as long as you first expected. I hope that the you will be surprised by the next reading. I hope  the best for you.

  • ralph.townsend1
    ralph.townsend1 Member Posts: 359 Member
    I'm Sad!!!

    Your are my light in this world, I'm believer that you are going to be there!

     

    VGama, it's to early in the game!

     

    Your psa could go back down, mine when Too ??????

  • VascodaGama
    VascodaGama Member Posts: 3,513 Member

    I'm Sad!!!

    Your are my light in this world, I'm believer that you are going to be there!

     

    VGama, it's to early in the game!

     

    Your psa could go back down, mine when Too ??????

    Confirmed Top Gear velocity

    Got my results again. Unfortunatly they confirm the PSA in top gear, now at PSA=0.37 and T=3.19 (319 ng/dl).

    My next consultation is scheduled for April 2. I am eager to know my doctors opinion.

     

    Regards.

    VG  Cry

     

     

  • ralph.townsend1
    ralph.townsend1 Member Posts: 359 Member

    Confirmed Top Gear velocity

    Got my results again. Unfortunatly they confirm the PSA in top gear, now at PSA=0.37 and T=3.19 (319 ng/dl).

    My next consultation is scheduled for April 2. I am eager to know my doctors opinion.

     

    Regards.

    VG  Cry

     

     

    Psa

    Keep us informed, your doctor will knock it out of gear.

    Good luck

    God Bless

    Ralph

  • caseyh
    caseyh Member Posts: 63
    Caution

     

    Sorry to hear that your vacation has been cut short.  I see you as a survivor who WILL get his PSA under control. 

    Dr. Bob Leibowitz at Compassionate Oncology posted a paper in the web singing the praises of using Thalidomide/Revlimid to treat PCa.   I n 2007 I began taking Revlimid for rising PSA after a 42 month vacation from hormonal therapy. I discontinued its use 26 months later. Dosage was 15MG & 25MG for 28 day cycles. I completed 8 cycles. Some at 15MG & some at 25MG.   I would get a temporary PSA drop that would bounce back up again within 2 to 3 months.  It was difficult to assess whether the PSA drops were having an overall effect on my PSA velocity. The side effects of the drug were numerous and serious.    Most importantly, my white blood cell count dropped to dangerous levels, my platelet count dropped and remains low to this day, my creatinine level rose substantially, and I developed neuropathy in my foot. I had to stop driving because of mental confusion. In short, this is a very powerful drug that has some devastating side effects. About a year or so after I stopped using Revlimid, a clinical trial found that it was of no benefit to PCa patients. I recognize that Thalidomide & Revlimid are slightly different drugs, but they are in the same family of drugs and sometimes used interchangeably.   Based on my personal experience, I would recommend that these drugs only be used with weekly blood tests, and preferably not at all until clinical trials show a benefit for PCa patients.

  • VascodaGama
    VascodaGama Member Posts: 3,513 Member
    Caution

    Thanks Ralph for the positive comment. It is scaring to see it rising so fast. I hope my body reacts well with Eligard again. I think that the HT protocol for the next/continuing phase will be double or triple blockade, adding Casodex and Avodart to the Eligard. Unfortunately Xtandi (or Zytiga) is not available in Portugal yet, and even in other EU country, not everyone has access to them.

    Caseyh; Thanks very much for the tip. This is the first time I feel not being on the “drivers’ seat” in 13 years. I believe you too got this kind of feeling at some point in your journey. Your experience is priceless.

    I wonder if I should just let the “wave” take its course and do not try any “manipulation” to lengthen the period on vacations. Surely I will miss the libido and the “lovely” moments at closing times.
    My doctor may well accept my wishes but I would be the one confronting the symptom and risks.

    According to my findings, Thalidomide may provide a “wealthy” six-month period of low PSAs. Such would extend my vacations until the end of 2013 giving me approximately 19 months of off-drugs.
    I know that my case is incomparable to the guys taking Thalidomide because they have been on triple blockade while I was on mono blockade with Eligard alone. But their vPSA off-drugs seem to be similar to what I am experiencing of 0.20 per month.

    Avodart would give me no particular reason to try prolonging the time on vacations, apart of sparing me from the risks of bone loss and diabetes. Libido would be lost.
    Sincerely, I am confused.

    Can you list me any other medication or supplement or “method” known to help in prolonging the time on intermittent hormonal therapy?

    Is there any Antiangiogenic Cocktail by Dr. Bob (Leibowitz) proper for guys on vacation from/in intermittent protocols?

     

    Thanks in advance.

    Best wishes in your journey.

    VGama

  • caseyh
    caseyh Member Posts: 63

    Caution

    Thanks Ralph for the positive comment. It is scaring to see it rising so fast. I hope my body reacts well with Eligard again. I think that the HT protocol for the next/continuing phase will be double or triple blockade, adding Casodex and Avodart to the Eligard. Unfortunately Xtandi (or Zytiga) is not available in Portugal yet, and even in other EU country, not everyone has access to them.

    Caseyh; Thanks very much for the tip. This is the first time I feel not being on the “drivers’ seat” in 13 years. I believe you too got this kind of feeling at some point in your journey. Your experience is priceless.

    I wonder if I should just let the “wave” take its course and do not try any “manipulation” to lengthen the period on vacations. Surely I will miss the libido and the “lovely” moments at closing times.
    My doctor may well accept my wishes but I would be the one confronting the symptom and risks.

    According to my findings, Thalidomide may provide a “wealthy” six-month period of low PSAs. Such would extend my vacations until the end of 2013 giving me approximately 19 months of off-drugs.
    I know that my case is incomparable to the guys taking Thalidomide because they have been on triple blockade while I was on mono blockade with Eligard alone. But their vPSA off-drugs seem to be similar to what I am experiencing of 0.20 per month.

    Avodart would give me no particular reason to try prolonging the time on vacations, apart of sparing me from the risks of bone loss and diabetes. Libido would be lost.
    Sincerely, I am confused.

    Can you list me any other medication or supplement or “method” known to help in prolonging the time on intermittent hormonal therapy?

    Is there any Antiangiogenic Cocktail by Dr. Bob (Leibowitz) proper for guys on vacation from/in intermittent protocols?

     

    Thanks in advance.

    Best wishes in your journey.

    VGama

    Antiangiogenic Cocktails

    I am not a patient at Compassionate Oncology, and I am not familiar with any supplements or methods that they might use to  prolong vacation periods for intermittent hormonal therapy.  I do know that Dr. Myers used to prescribe Leukine.  I'm not sure if he still does.   After watching my numbers climb for about two years post Revlimid, I went to Sand Lake for a USPIO MRI and subsequent treatment at Datolli.  That has proven to be a very good decision on my part.  My PSA is down and holding steady for the past 16 months.

  • VascodaGama
    VascodaGama Member Posts: 3,513 Member
    caseyh said:

    Antiangiogenic Cocktails

    I am not a patient at Compassionate Oncology, and I am not familiar with any supplements or methods that they might use to  prolong vacation periods for intermittent hormonal therapy.  I do know that Dr. Myers used to prescribe Leukine.  I'm not sure if he still does.   After watching my numbers climb for about two years post Revlimid, I went to Sand Lake for a USPIO MRI and subsequent treatment at Datolli.  That has proven to be a very good decision on my part.  My PSA is down and holding steady for the past 16 months.

    Cocktails

     

    Caseyh

    Thanks for the info. I know that Myers uses/used Leukine in intermittent chemo administration (after Taxotere). He used the drug with or without Ketoconazole to trigger immune response. This is in fact his approach for the second-line HT, adding estrogen patches. The two drugs taken together may cause blood clogs so “vigilance” is required

    Probably there are other “applications” for Leukine uses but I think that my systemic status is not yet that advanced (touch wood). Image studies (traditional) have been negative (probably due to colonies of micrometastases). I am hopeful for “enjoying” still a decade on first-line hormonal drugs, but want to continue the intermittent modality. I am worried of taking continuously LHRH (over 30 months) because of the risk of permanent hypogonadism.

    The controversial Thalidomide is an anti nausea drug (infamous sleeping pill of 1950th) which has been approved in the treatment of cancer. It is not used by everyone (girls) because of its relation to cases of birth defects but it is not harmful to be taken by the “quotidian” cancer patient.

    Dr. Myers once commented about the Resveratrol in red wine that can turn tumour stem cells into “dormancy”. Well, that is not happening in my body because I drink wine everyday and the bandit is now on the driver’s seat speeding. Maybe Thalidomide would make it to fall a sleep. Just joking.


    Have you ever experienced values similar to the vPSA of mine?
    Can you tell your PSA velocity when on off-drugs?

    I appreciate your help and discussions.

    Best.

    VG

     

     

     

  • RADIATION HOPEFUL
    RADIATION HOPEFUL Member Posts: 218

    Cocktails

     

    Caseyh

    Thanks for the info. I know that Myers uses/used Leukine in intermittent chemo administration (after Taxotere). He used the drug with or without Ketoconazole to trigger immune response. This is in fact his approach for the second-line HT, adding estrogen patches. The two drugs taken together may cause blood clogs so “vigilance” is required

    Probably there are other “applications” for Leukine uses but I think that my systemic status is not yet that advanced (touch wood). Image studies (traditional) have been negative (probably due to colonies of micrometastases). I am hopeful for “enjoying” still a decade on first-line hormonal drugs, but want to continue the intermittent modality. I am worried of taking continuously LHRH (over 30 months) because of the risk of permanent hypogonadism.

    The controversial Thalidomide is an anti nausea drug (infamous sleeping pill of 1950th) which has been approved in the treatment of cancer. It is not used by everyone (girls) because of its relation to cases of birth defects but it is not harmful to be taken by the “quotidian” cancer patient.

    Dr. Myers once commented about the Resveratrol in red wine that can turn tumour stem cells into “dormancy”. Well, that is not happening in my body because I drink wine everyday and the bandit is now on the driver’s seat speeding. Maybe Thalidomide would make it to fall a sleep. Just joking.


    Have you ever experienced values similar to the vPSA of mine?
    Can you tell your PSA velocity when on off-drugs?

    I appreciate your help and discussions.

    Best.

    VG

     

     

     

    SA velocity in Top Gear – I’ve to cut short Drugs’ Vacations

    Hello VGAMA

    I'm sorry to read about your situation with shorter ADT hormone drugs, this defies everything I read on the MEDSCAPE article I Posted & will be asking my urologist to possibly stop my ELIGARD injections tomorrow. Now I question the validity of the article ---- VERY CONFUSING.

    I WISH YOU THE BEST --you have always given excellent advice not only to me but everyone on this site.  I'll let you know what the doctor tells me tomorrow after I Show him the MEDSCAPE articlre. I also have to get my second PROLIA shot tomorrow along with the ELIGARD (4 month shot).

    I look forward to your reply----BLESS you & everyone who has theses prostrate problems

    CORDIALLY

    Radiation Hopeful 

     

  • ralph.townsend1
    ralph.townsend1 Member Posts: 359 Member

    SA velocity in Top Gear – I’ve to cut short Drugs’ Vacations

    Hello VGAMA

    I'm sorry to read about your situation with shorter ADT hormone drugs, this defies everything I read on the MEDSCAPE article I Posted & will be asking my urologist to possibly stop my ELIGARD injections tomorrow. Now I question the validity of the article ---- VERY CONFUSING.

    I WISH YOU THE BEST --you have always given excellent advice not only to me but everyone on this site.  I'll let you know what the doctor tells me tomorrow after I Show him the MEDSCAPE articlre. I also have to get my second PROLIA shot tomorrow along with the ELIGARD (4 month shot).

    I look forward to your reply----BLESS you & everyone who has theses prostrate problems

    CORDIALLY

    Radiation Hopeful 

     

    Eligard

    I think that your next test the psa will drop, because of the Eligard.

    As for me my psa last month went up to 0.8 and this month back down to 0.6.

    Between the lupron and Zytiga its working.

    Good news from MD Anderson, the doctor made some comment about a new drug. That is a shot to fight prostate cancer, this maybe closer to a cure or giving more time.Cool  He would not say more than that.

  • RADIATION HOPEFUL
    RADIATION HOPEFUL Member Posts: 218
    DOCTOR VISIT

    Hello VGAMA and friends

    Thanks for the replies-----Wanted to let you know what the PA. told me at my appointment today.

    First > extended my PROLIA shot another 4 months

    Second> after showing him the MEDSCAPE ARTICLE on shorter hormone injections(ELIGARD) he informed me the jury is still out on this being a viable study but if I Want to stop he will allow it, HE said he attended a urological siminar in PHiladelphia where intermittent therapy was discussed & again it's only a short vacation from the affects of the drug, if the PSA goes back up, the injection MUST be given again until it subsides.TO make a long story short, I get my next ELIGARD injection next month ( 4 month shot) today was for PROLIA only which I didn't have due to the dentist requesting it be delayed. He told me it won't hurt to extend it another 4 months. I also asked for a script to check my blood lipids & testosterone. We will review them at my next appointment in APRIL. I'm currently feeling VERY GOOD & don't want to jeopardize my progress. I don't like the fact he told me I will have to take hormone shots the rest of my life. I sure hope a cure comes out soon. I told him about the cancer breakthrough using a persons own white blood cells, modifying them them & placing them back into the body to fight the cancer cells. He told me PROVENGE & chemo works similar to this, that I Shouldn't rule it out. HE also told me the elimination or shorter ELIGARD is a THEORY ONLY --it works on some men but not all.

    NOW I"M really confused----just passing along info I was told. I WISH everyone affected by this bandit a GOOD outcome & I for one will fight to the end. MY PSA is down to 0.27 thus the ELIGARD is working as my PSA was 0.30 last month.

    BLESS EVERYONE affected by this disease & HAPPY EASTER. (I thank you in advance for any replies) "I'll update next month"

    COrdially

    Radiation Hopeful

      

    os

     

  • Old-timer
    Old-timer Member Posts: 196
    Keep your spirits high, Vgama

    Dear Friend,

    I have not been checking the discussion board regularly, and have only now learned of your disappointing report.  I add my words of encouragemt.

    Sharing your knowledge about prostate cancer has been valueable to me and many others. Thank you.

    Best wishes and continued happy days to you, VascodaGama.

    Jerry

  • VascodaGama
    VascodaGama Member Posts: 3,513 Member
    Old-timer said:

    Keep your spirits high, Vgama

    Dear Friend,

    I have not been checking the discussion board regularly, and have only now learned of your disappointing report.  I add my words of encouragemt.

    Sharing your knowledge about prostate cancer has been valueable to me and many others. Thank you.

    Best wishes and continued happy days to you, VascodaGama.

    Jerry

    Thanks Thanks Thanks

    Thanks Old-timer. I may need your instructions on your “secret way” used for the “lovely closing times”. It seems that shortly I will have to confront again the libido-less world.

    Ralph, could you get more details on that “silver bullet” from MD Anderson. Zytiga has been so successful in your case that you may not need anything else. I wish you continuous control and hope you are doing well with the neuropathy.

    Caseyh, thanks for the mail. It seems that your PSADT after the end of effectiveness of Zoladex was above 40 days which is much much better than my rate. In any case, without testosterone tests it is difficult to compare our cases because one does not know when you reached the normal levels out of castration. I wonder why you did not indicate/get the T test?

    What can you recommend in regards to USPIO?
    The theory that PCa stays in the localised lymph nodes is a point I would like to consider. So far it is “undetectable” in traditional scans which diagnose me as systemic. However, maybe a USPIO scan could find something if I allow the PSA to get higher than 10. In any case this is a value that my doctor thinks not proper as a threshold for my case, in this first phase of IADT.
    Thanks in advance for the helpful information.

    RadHope;

    Your posts above worried me for your thinking. Please note that our cases are not comparable. You got your prostate in place and did IMRT with HT. You are now waiting for the final conclusion in regards to cure.

    In my case, I come from two failed treatments (RP and SRT) and now am in the control phase (no cure expected) with HT. In my case there will be no “short term ADT”.
    I have been put on intermittent modality of control with hormonal manipulations, thought to be right in my case. The intermittent modality has shown to be better than the continuous if done properly. Apart of controlling the progress of the cancer, it provides the patient with a relief period from the hypogonadism symptoms, allowing free flow of testosterone that is required in many dependent body functions.

    The process for intermittent modality (IADT) requires that one takes HT drugs, continuously, until one manages to accomplish a constant period of one year in remission (PSA lower than 0.05 ng/ml). After that one stops the HT and will remain off drugs allowing the PSA to rise again until it reaches a threshold limit decided by the doctor (this limit different in each case).
    In this first phase of IADT of my case it was set to be 2.5 ng/ml. From the PSA chronology (last results) I can calculate that this value will be reached sometime close to October 2013, which will be the start of the next phase on hormonal manipulations. The protocol of drugs for the next phase will then be decided according to my health status. My doctor will tell me what is reserved to me in the next consultation.

    Your view in regards to the short or long term ADT, published at Medscape, is proper to your case. You can stop HT now to get unmasked PSAs so that you can check if the serum is stable (indicating success). If recurrence becomes apparent (constant increases of PSA without the effect of Eligard) then you can start HT shots again. Nothing is loosed.

     I wonder in what basis did your doctor opinion for you to have HT shots for the rest of your life. Does he consider your treatment as failed? Is there any positive test showing metastases? What is his principle to consider cure or failure?

    Prolia is for your osteopenia problem, not cancer. It is given to guys on hormonal treatment because it is known that hypogonadism leads to deterioration of the bone.

    I am glad to know about your low PSA result but you need to get such results from unmasked tests. You need to get the courage to stop HT for a period.

    I want to thank you for inquiring with your doctor about the intermittent option. I know you did it for me and I am very grateful for your concern.

    Happy Holiday season.

     

    VGama

  • texhutch5
    texhutch5 Member Posts: 4
    Supplement for angiogenisis

    My nutritional oncologist recommended a supplement called Artemisinin to inhibit angiogenisis or the formation on new blood vessels. It is generally used for malaria, but is showing good results for cancer. No side effects with this stuff. Just quit taking it if you are going to have surgery. I am on my sixth month on HT vacation, and PSA is still undetectable.

    Here is a link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artemisinin

  • RADIATION HOPEFUL
    RADIATION HOPEFUL Member Posts: 218

    Thanks Thanks Thanks

    Thanks Old-timer. I may need your instructions on your “secret way” used for the “lovely closing times”. It seems that shortly I will have to confront again the libido-less world.

    Ralph, could you get more details on that “silver bullet” from MD Anderson. Zytiga has been so successful in your case that you may not need anything else. I wish you continuous control and hope you are doing well with the neuropathy.

    Caseyh, thanks for the mail. It seems that your PSADT after the end of effectiveness of Zoladex was above 40 days which is much much better than my rate. In any case, without testosterone tests it is difficult to compare our cases because one does not know when you reached the normal levels out of castration. I wonder why you did not indicate/get the T test?

    What can you recommend in regards to USPIO?
    The theory that PCa stays in the localised lymph nodes is a point I would like to consider. So far it is “undetectable” in traditional scans which diagnose me as systemic. However, maybe a USPIO scan could find something if I allow the PSA to get higher than 10. In any case this is a value that my doctor thinks not proper as a threshold for my case, in this first phase of IADT.
    Thanks in advance for the helpful information.

    RadHope;

    Your posts above worried me for your thinking. Please note that our cases are not comparable. You got your prostate in place and did IMRT with HT. You are now waiting for the final conclusion in regards to cure.

    In my case, I come from two failed treatments (RP and SRT) and now am in the control phase (no cure expected) with HT. In my case there will be no “short term ADT”.
    I have been put on intermittent modality of control with hormonal manipulations, thought to be right in my case. The intermittent modality has shown to be better than the continuous if done properly. Apart of controlling the progress of the cancer, it provides the patient with a relief period from the hypogonadism symptoms, allowing free flow of testosterone that is required in many dependent body functions.

    The process for intermittent modality (IADT) requires that one takes HT drugs, continuously, until one manages to accomplish a constant period of one year in remission (PSA lower than 0.05 ng/ml). After that one stops the HT and will remain off drugs allowing the PSA to rise again until it reaches a threshold limit decided by the doctor (this limit different in each case).
    In this first phase of IADT of my case it was set to be 2.5 ng/ml. From the PSA chronology (last results) I can calculate that this value will be reached sometime close to October 2013, which will be the start of the next phase on hormonal manipulations. The protocol of drugs for the next phase will then be decided according to my health status. My doctor will tell me what is reserved to me in the next consultation.

    Your view in regards to the short or long term ADT, published at Medscape, is proper to your case. You can stop HT now to get unmasked PSAs so that you can check if the serum is stable (indicating success). If recurrence becomes apparent (constant increases of PSA without the effect of Eligard) then you can start HT shots again. Nothing is loosed.

     I wonder in what basis did your doctor opinion for you to have HT shots for the rest of your life. Does he consider your treatment as failed? Is there any positive test showing metastases? What is his principle to consider cure or failure?

    Prolia is for your osteopenia problem, not cancer. It is given to guys on hormonal treatment because it is known that hypogonadism leads to deterioration of the bone.

    I am glad to know about your low PSA result but you need to get such results from unmasked tests. You need to get the courage to stop HT for a period.

    I want to thank you for inquiring with your doctor about the intermittent option. I know you did it for me and I am very grateful for your concern.

    Happy Holiday season.

     

    VGama

    VGAMA

    THANK YOU ----Once again I received words of wisdom from you. The PA doctor never said I had failure but did tell me I would have hormone shots for life. This was the PA not the oncologist doctor. I VALUE YOUR INPUT--- you should have been a doctor. NOW I ust muster up the courage to stop the hormone shots & see what happens. THANK YOU AGAIN FOR YOUR REPLY, IT's BETTER THAN THE DOCTOR. YOU ARE A INSPIRATION TO MANY ON THIS SITE. I Will keep you updated as time passes.

    Radiation Hopeful                      Happy Holiday season

  • caseyh
    caseyh Member Posts: 63
    The best answers I have

    T tests
    Yes they were done, however, I do not have copies of those labs.  The lab reports are on file in the doctor's office, and not easily accessible to me.

    Currently, USPIO scans for PCa are only available at Sand Lake Imaging, Orlando, and only by referral from Dr. Myers or the Datolli Cancer Center.  You can contact Datolli via there website, forward your records, and have a free no obligation telephone consultation.  Based on your consultation, if you wish, Datolli will make arrangements with Sand Lake for the scans.  Sand Lake will send you detailed reports of the results.  You can then decide if you wish to proceed with treatment.  If you elect to radiate lymph nodes/tumors found, It would very very advantageous to do it at Datolli because of their experience.   As you well know, I hold both Datolli & Sand Lake in very high esteem.  I believe that USPIO scans probably offer the best chance for locating your disease.  This is a big committment.  Fly to Orlando for the scans (3 to 4 days), and then spend an additional 10 weeks in Sarasota.  I believe it was well worth it for me.  I wish you success whatever you choose.

  • VascodaGama
    VascodaGama Member Posts: 3,513 Member
    caseyh said:

    The best answers I have

    T tests
    Yes they were done, however, I do not have copies of those labs.  The lab reports are on file in the doctor's office, and not easily accessible to me.

    Currently, USPIO scans for PCa are only available at Sand Lake Imaging, Orlando, and only by referral from Dr. Myers or the Datolli Cancer Center.  You can contact Datolli via there website, forward your records, and have a free no obligation telephone consultation.  Based on your consultation, if you wish, Datolli will make arrangements with Sand Lake for the scans.  Sand Lake will send you detailed reports of the results.  You can then decide if you wish to proceed with treatment.  If you elect to radiate lymph nodes/tumors found, It would very very advantageous to do it at Datolli because of their experience.   As you well know, I hold both Datolli & Sand Lake in very high esteem.  I believe that USPIO scans probably offer the best chance for locating your disease.  This is a big committment.  Fly to Orlando for the scans (3 to 4 days), and then spend an additional 10 weeks in Sarasota.  I believe it was well worth it for me.  I wish you success whatever you choose.

    Artemisinin; another weapon for PCa !!!

    Texhutch5

    Thank you for sharing your experience. I never heard of Artemisinin in the “weaponry” lot of ways to combat prostate cancer. Your suggestion is very welcome and I would appreciate if you share details of your experience with the drug and about your case.

    Can you tell how you got it and how is it administered.
    Is there any restriction due to interaction with other drugs or food?
    What was your HT protocol before starting Artemisinin?
    Do you know if there is any sequential (after HT but before chemo, etc) to take the drug?
    Can you list the PSA chronology of your treatment?
    Were have you been treated?

    I found a paper (Pubmed) on the drug as a benefit to control angiogenesis and its ability against  cancer. In the article they say this;

    “ …artemisinin and its derivatives have been shown to induce growth arrest and apoptosis (79), as well as inhibit angiogenesis by down-regulation of the vascular endothelial growth factor vascular epidermal growth factor and its cellular receptor KDR/flk-1…”

    “…the highly stable artemisinin-derived trioxane dimmers was shown to inhibit the growth of and selectively kill several human cancer cell lines without inducing cytotoxic effects on normal neighboring cells…”
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2629082/

     

    Mark Moyad has no reference on the drug in his book (promoting Wellness BHT) which is probably the best collective data on drugs as options for prostate cancer treatments. Maybe we should invite him in adding Artemisinin to his list.

    In another link there is a video introducing this drug used by the Chinese for the past 2000 years. The late discovery is about its benefits in the treatment of malaria.


     

    I think that many in our boat will like to know about the drug. I thank you in advance for your info.

    Best wishes for your improvements and continuing remission.

    VGama

  • Samsungtech1
    Samsungtech1 Member Posts: 351
    Health

    Vasco,

    Sorry to hear this.  Beem going through a rough spot myself.  I really hope you get a rally going.  There were 2 scientists working with CBD1 or CBD2.  Anyhow they have killed cancer in all mice tested.  They just got approved for human tests.  I think Europe is ahead of. Us, except for this.  We are becoming experts atmarijuana.  Hell of a drug.  I use it every day.  Matter of fact have beeN using it since 1966.  

    Good luck, my friend,  

    Love,

    Mike

  • VascodaGama
    VascodaGama Member Posts: 3,513 Member

    Health

    Vasco,

    Sorry to hear this.  Beem going through a rough spot myself.  I really hope you get a rally going.  There were 2 scientists working with CBD1 or CBD2.  Anyhow they have killed cancer in all mice tested.  They just got approved for human tests.  I think Europe is ahead of. Us, except for this.  We are becoming experts atmarijuana.  Hell of a drug.  I use it every day.  Matter of fact have beeN using it since 1966.  

    Good luck, my friend,  

    Love,

    Mike

    Unsatisfactory consultation

    In continuing my saga of increasing PSA, I report here the meeting with my uro-oncologist;

    The consultation was not without surprises. According to my doctor, the worrying PSA velocity is OK because I am on complete drug’s free period (no maintenance medication). I was looking for a much longer period of vacations but he pointed out that I am a systemic patient. I will need “constant” control to pin down the bandit. His words; “Try learning to enjoy the moments without medication to the fullest. Think of it as a gift”
    Well ! I did not like that comment.

    My professional life involved numbers and calculations and I would think that I am right to think that the IADT threshold limit of 2.5 ng/ml of my increasing PSA (established by my doctor previously) will be reached in July of this year, but he wants me to restart IADT in September. This is according to my exponential numbers a level of 10. Did he changed his mind?

    Regarding the protocol, he recommends me to continue with Eligard 6-month shot preceded by two weeks on Bicalutamide, and continue with the antiandrogen daily (50 mg). This is the typical IADT2. I question about adding Avodart but he said that the biggest volume of DHT (dihydrotestosterone) is synsitized at the prostate gland, which is none existent in my case. A small portion is converted in the adrenal gland and testes; however, he wants to see if we manage to get “control” with lesser drugs. He also commented about the usefulness in future of alpha blockers.
    I was eager to listen about drugs to avoid angiogenesis such as Thalidomide but he become silent.

    Next meeting is scheduled for May 2014. I will continue periodical PSA and T tests, as well as the Dexa, ECG and lipids. He does not see it necessary to have additional Bone scans or MRI for the moment. (I am not so sure about that.)

    In conclusion; I am sceptical that this doctor is proper to continue assisting my progressive case. I know he is giving preferences to quality of life more than being more aggressive, but he seems to be too conservative and not in touch with the newer ways of seeing hormonal treatments.
    I am not aware of any beneficial principle of using a PSA=10 as a threshold in IADT for guys with no prostate, particularly if the protocol is just double blockade. No comments about supplements or other means of added control.

    I am not satisfied. What do my comrades think about the above?

    It may be time to sail to other waters and look for a better oncologist. Maybe restart the time of the Discoveries as did Vasco da Gama in the old times.

    Regards to all.

    VG  Frown

  • Samsungtech1
    Samsungtech1 Member Posts: 351
    Doctors

    Vasco,

    you loose confidence in someone then you need to replace him.  Otherwise you will be second guessing his every mood.  Interesting news, there is another team of scientists who are getting ready to start trials on another drug.  I believe you should check on these trials.  There are two really good ones coming up.  Being a numbers man you should know that as you go on the odds stack against you.  Something radical is probably called for.  Certain trials have better chances of working than others.  

    PI wish you well.  Please check on trials.

     

    Mike