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Fair balance

MrsJP
Posts: 157
Joined: Jan 2011

This was in my inbin this morning, interesting:

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Fair balance gives natural pills and supplements an advantage
by Stewart Segal, MD | in Meds | 8 responses

inShare.1The reality is that my job constantly challenges my sanity. Sometimes, I just want to scream.

Patient: ”Doc, I don’t want to put any poisons in my body! Isn’t there a ‘natural’ remedy I can take?”

Doc: “No, I want you to take my poison! I haven’t poisoned my quota of patients this month and need to reach my goal.”

Poisoning patients really isn’t good for business. Why would a patient believe that FDA approved medications are poison?

Just watch any TV advertisement. The FDA requires that all promotional pieces be balanced (the term is “fair balance”). Balance means, if you say something good, you must say something bad. So product “Y” protects you against stroke but can cause fatal bleeding. The fact that bleeds occur in only 0.001% of patients is irrelevant; the only thing the audience hears is “fatal bleeding.” So, having been scared out of taking a life saving “poison,” the patient has a massive stroke.

While your doc and pharmacist are handcuffed and gagged by fair balance, your local herbalist and vitamin purveyor (VitaHerb Central ) isn’t. I’m jealous. I recently walked into one of the VitaHerb Central stores (any national chain vitamin/herb store) and scoped out what they carried. Instead of a trained and licensed pharmacist, a young man offers advice and sells you “natural” pills in a bottle. He does not know the source of the material in the bottle. He does not know how the “natural” medicine (yes, it’s a medicine) in the bottle is absorbed and processed. He does not know if it is safe for your liver or kidneys. He does not know if it will interact with anything else you are taking.

He tells you it is good for fatigue. He tells you it will boost your immunity. He does not know your medical history. He has no idea that you have kidney disease and asthma. You don’t know you have kidney disease and asthma either. You don’t see a doctor because doctors use poison. He can tell you anything because he is not gagged and handcuffed by the FDA nor by science and a code of ethics. He’s just doing his job, hoping to finish college one day.

You start having problems breathing. Finally, you see a doctor. After a multitude of tests and introducing FDA approved “poisons” into your body, you finally admit that you are taking supplements. The doc asks you to bring them in. In the bottle is Echinacea (for your immune system) and a “respiratory rescue” herbal mix containing 15 “natural” cures, including licorice. During your initial visit, you stated that you had ragweed allergies, problems with gluten, and licorice. Case solved. You’ve been poisoning yourself with “all natural” medications, dispensed by a clerk at a vitamin/herb store. Echinacea is ragweed.

You trust the clerk while shunning my science. If you are taking a pill, any pill, it is a medication. It has potential side effects, interactions, and risks. It is processed either by your liver or your kidneys and can be toxic if you have problems with renal or hepatic metabolism. It is manufactured without government supervision.

Every bottle has the “Medical Miranda Rights” printed on it. “These statements have not been approved by the FDA. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.” My wife and I just spent five minutes looking for our magnifying glass so I could read the inscription on a bottle of cold prep a guest left at my house. The “Miranda” statement was positioned below the easily readable, miraculous claims section.

Despite the obvious fact that vitamin/herbals are manufactured pills unofficially claimed to treat a multitude of diseases and the fact that they are expensive, they outsell my “poisonous” medications.

Despite the fact that I have years of education and 28 years serving my community, the clerk at the vitamin/herbal store trumps my science. The clerk at “VitaHerb Central” trumps the pharmacist. He even trumps the FDA.

Yes, I must be crazy to come to the office every day. If I was sane, I would go to work for VitaHerb Central, sell snake oil, and be revered.

Stewart Segal is a family physician who blogs at Livewellthy.org.

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Buckwirth's picture
Buckwirth
Posts: 1272
Joined: Jun 2010

He has an interesting style, and tells some fun stories.

Here is a clickable link to the blog:

Stewart B Segal, MD

Thanks for sharing!

John23's picture
John23
Posts: 2140
Joined: Jan 2007

The article sums up the problem nicely, and is "on target".

Prior to locating our present TCM practitioner, my wife had
tried numerous Rheumatoid Arthritis remedies from quite a few
of those type stores. Nothing that they offered (and sold)
had any kind of long-lasting effect.

She no longer desired to take anything that western medicine
had to offer for RA, since the methotrexate and VIOXX
combination she had been taking for years (prescribed by
one of the best RA MDs around), no longer provided her
with any relief, and had instead, been making her feel sick.

In fact, the VIOXX caused the erosion of two blood vessels
inside her head, and the aneurysm caused by the VIOXX
erosion ended up rupturing. A ruptured cerebral aneurysm
is nothing you would want to experience.

Thankfully, she had an excellent surgeon who drilled into her
skull between the frontal lobes, and placed two clips (one on
each rupture), and sealed the deadly leak of blood.

She swore from that experience, that she would never take
a physician's word for anything again. Those medications
were FDA approved; the VIOXX was used by millions of
RA sufferers, and later removed from the market by the FDA.

Exactly how many users of VIOXX were effected as severely
as my wife, is something we may never know. We do know
that the drug had caused aneurysms of the blood vessels
around the stomach for the majority of users, and there indeed
were many deaths as a consequence of that.

Not wanting to take any "FDA approved" remedy, or seeking
any advice from any more Rheumatologists, she turned to the
alternative remedies instead.

What she (we) found out over the years, is that there are
as many quacks in that industry, as any other industry.

Like the western medicine practitioners, they were basing their
treatments and suggested treatments, on what the manufacturers
of the alternative "remedies" were suggesting their product was
good for!

So yes, that article you posted is right on target! Not only for
the "alternative medicine industry", but for the entire western
medicine industry as well!

My wife read about acupuncture's value to RA sufferers,
and began down that road. After being treated by a few
different acupuncturists and getting no serious relief, her
ex-Rheumatologist's receptionist mentioned the name of a
local TCM practitioner. She said that there were many
local physicians that went to this TCM doc for many reasons,
and claimed they received relief!

I drove her to the first two appointments (6 days apart),
since she hadn't been driving due to arthritic pain. Almost
miraculously, she felt well enough to drive herself to her
third appointment! She continued to get relief through the
use of herbal broths prescribed, and within 9 months,
our TCM doc had her RA in total remission!

He said at that time, that no further treatments would be
necessary, unless a major traumatic event occurred that
would toss her system out of balance.....

I was so impressed by the results, that I inquired about
my Atrial Fibrillation. The TCM doc examined me, and
found that I had a "liver Qi deficiency". Within 9 months
of taking herbal broths, my AF was put into total remission;
something that western medicine could not do!

No further treatments were necessary beyond that, and
to this day, I have not had a attack of AF.

My neighbor had been taking medications for his AF,
and he had been on a heart transplant list. Unfortunately,
the meds took their toll on his liver. He was taken off
the heart transplant list due to his failing liver, and he could
not have a liver transplant, due to his failing heart. He died
four years ago, from renal failure from the heart meds....

So I have to agree with that article; taking advice from
"well meaning" individuals (including medical practitioners),
without studying the medicine or medical practice yourself,
can do more harm than good.

TCM has been practiced for almost four thousand years,
and continues to be practiced today. It has been "time-tested",
and provides resolution to ailments by resolving the actual
cause of the symptoms.

Western Medicine only removes the symptoms of the underlying
cause, leaving the actual cause of the symptom untreated.
Eventually, the real problem will rear it's head; the symptoms
will be much worse, and the real problem more difficult to cure.

We all have choices to make in life, and no-one should leave
those very personal choices up to someone else's opinion.

There are many ways to fight cancer; don't be misled by well
meaning individuals with prejudiced opinions.

Study the alternatives, and learn the paths available; decide for
yourself, it's your life at stake!

Stay well!

John

laurettas
Posts: 372
Joined: May 2011

My husband has had experience from both sides of this. Both of our mothers are in to natural supplements--well his mom takes everything, natural and prescribed. Anyhow, we visited my mother in law when my husband had a cold. She insisted that he take echinacea pills. He did and was down in bed sicker than he had been in years. A year or so later, same scenario, same result. After that I banned him from ever taking echinacea again. He too has a lot of hay fever issues and very possibly is allergic to ragweed.

At about the same time he was prescribed PPI's for his heartburn issues. Was assured that they were the safest thing around. Took them for years and I started noticing that he was getting sick more often and more severely. His teeth also started breaking and literally wearing away. Now the FDA has put out warnings saying that they shouldn't be taken for over three weeks a year because they deplete the body's calcium and can cause bone breakage. Other studies show that one has much more of a chance of pneumonia which my husband got also. It can also cause leaky bowel syndrome. After his cancer, I began researching and discovered that his cancer, signet ring cell, grows and possibly starts from a molecule, which is calcium dependent, not working properly. Is there a relationship between his PPI use and his cancer? I don't know but I wonder.

As far as AF, both of our mothers developed it at about the same time. My mother because she won't take any meds to help with her congestive heart failure and my Mother in law because she allowed a surgeon talk her into back-to-back joint surgeries that she didn't need. My mother's AF corrected itself after a trip to the hospital and one round of medication. My mother in law has to take medication for it but it is much more stable than it was initially.

So, as you can see, I have gripes with both types of "medicine", natural and western.

John23's picture
John23
Posts: 2140
Joined: Jan 2007

Please keep in mind, that your experiences were not a the
hands of a qualified and experienced TCM physician.

There's a big difference between self-medicating; taking
across-the-counter pseudo-remedies, and the 4,000 year
old science that's provided from a qualified TCM practitioner.

My wife's neurologist was treated by our TCM doc, for
asthma; he said it cured him!

TCM works, and I wish I could help convince individuals to
try it when they get sick and tired of western medicine's
propaganda. There's little to lose, and so much to gain!

By the way... To date, there is no known "cure" for cancer.
Attempting to "find proof" of anything working better than
the other, is a great lesson in utter frustration.

Some of us didn't look for a "positive cure"; some of us
simply looked harder for something that wasn't as damaging.

There -are- options; valid, workable and very viable options.

My very best to you and yours!

John

laurettas
Posts: 372
Joined: May 2011

As I have said before, I have only my experience and the experience of those I know personally. I know no one whose cancer went away from natural means while I know of several whose cancer never returned after surgery, etc. So, from my experience, the proof lies more on the side of western medicine than natural means.

I keep looking for examples of natural cures but no one has shown me one yet that I would consider valid. This is a matter of life and death for my husband so I am not going to go on hearsay or examples that I believe can be explained by other means. Any stage 1-3 cancer that has been treated by surgery and or chemo/radiation and THEN people began using natural means cannot be an example for me. The prior treatment could have cured the cancer. I want to be shown an example of someone who used natural means only and their cancer went away. Or any other means. There is research being done now on genetically modifying a person's own T cells and having them attack the cancer. Sounds wonderful and I am hopeful they develop this quickly because it sounds quite promising.

Again I will put out the plea, show me an example of someone's cancer being cured by a natural means. I will gladly look into it, and pursue it if it seems pertinent to my husband's situation.

John23's picture
John23
Posts: 2140
Joined: Jan 2007

Re:
"Again I will put out the plea, show me an example of someone's
cancer being cured by a natural means. I will gladly look into
it, and pursue it if it seems pertinent to my husband's situation"

Gee, I hate to drag this out, especially since you sound like you've
already made up your mind! However.......

First of all, there is -no cure-, and finding an "example" of someone
being "cured" is going to be a challenge for you, since anyone
that claims to be "cured" should be rejected as far as their honesty.

Secondly.... In 2006, I had one oncologist telling me I was a "3c",
while the radiologist, surgeon and a second oncologist claimed
I was a stage 4. My tumor grew in one section of colon, and
out and into the traverse section, causing two blockages. 7 out
of 28 nodes were involved, and they said I had spots in both
my lungs that can be considered cancer. My liver also had what
they said was a massive area. no biops were taken, everything
beyond the colon and nodes were pure speculation (in my opinion).

I had surgery to remove 4 foot of colon, and after three subsequent
surgeries to repair damage caused by surgeries, I ended up with
about a foot of colon, and an Ileostomy.

It took over six months for my surgical wound to heal.

The"medical team" insisted that I start chemo as soon as possible,
and with chemo, I may live another two years. If I chose not
to do chemo, my chances of staying alive would be nil.

After much soul-searching, and study of both chemotherapy
and the alternatives, and with my nothing but good experiences
using Traditional Chinese Medicine, I chose to use Imported
Medicinal Strength Chinese Herbs.

That my dear, was starting in 2006. All but two of the spots
in my lungs are gone, and the remaining two have been stated
to be granuloma they were there (same size) since the 90's.

My liver remains clean, albeit a fatty liver. There are no other
signs of "new cancer" to date. I -do not- consider myself "cured".
I may be in some sort of temporary remission, but I refuse
to consider myself "cured". I feel comfortable to assume that
I will eventually will die from cancer.

The physicians all feel that I am just incredibly lucky to have
survived this long. If I had used chemo, they would of course,
attribute it to the use of chemo. But since I used herbs, they
consider me "just lucky".

And to tell you the truth..... perhaps that's all it is, is "luck".

Perhaps those herbs, that are noted for their cancer-killing ability,
had absolutely nothing to do with my survival.

One thing is for certain, however...... The chemo dosages they
were suggesting to use, would have left me with an unknown
amount of neurological problems, some permanent, or so they
said at the time. And I would have been prone to the second
cancers that those drugs were well known to cause.

Yup.... I guess I'm just one helluva' lucky guy.

Through my years, one thing that I have learned well, is that
some individuals will reject concepts, and some won't.

Trying to convince the latter is like trying to nail a roof down
using a marshmallow for a hammer.......

There are choices to be made, and options that should be
considered. If you allow fear to guide you, you're likely to
wish you hadn't.

Chemo works for some....messes up others...... Radiation
kills cells. Period. If nothing else, know the pitfalls, regardless
if the procedure works or not.

Getting cancer under control is great, as long as the side effects
aren't worse than the cancer.

I sincerely wish you both the very best!

Take care,

John

laurettas
Posts: 372
Joined: May 2011

for sharing your story with me. Anyone who survives a cancer as advanced as yours is truly blessed--my father was similar to you but has a few more years of being cancer free.

I know from experience how uncertain tests and scans can be. My husband, at the end of his chemo 34 years ago had many tests performed to see if the cancer was gone. One test showed that he was full of cancer still. The others did not detect any cancer. Turns out the one test was totally wrong. He had no signs of cancer for 34 years without doing anything after his initial ten months of chemo.

This time we are dealing with a few unknowns as well. Don't know if the innumerable spots in his lungs are cancer or not. No biopsy has been done. Even if they disappear after the chemo we still won't know for sure. They could have been an infection or any number of things.

We would love to just take a few herbs and pills and eat a certain way to make his cancer either go away or not progress. We don't know tho if he can even take those things. I know he can't take echinacea. And at this point I haven't seen the numbers to give me the confidence to go that direction. With the cancer that my husband has, two months can bring about cancer growth sufficient to kill him. We don't have the time to try something to see if it works.

I hate chemo and what it does to him but at this point the tumors are shrinking and his CEA is going down. I am looking every day for something that looks like it might be helpful for him. The research done using T cells looks very promising but who knows if it will progress in time to help my husband. These things are notoriously slow as we all know.

We'll keep looking and praying for something that can slow this monster down that is trying to take my husband down.

John23's picture
John23
Posts: 2140
Joined: Jan 2007

Re:
"I hate chemo and what it does to him but at this point the tumors
are shrinking and his CEA is going down."

One thing that I try to stress, is that if something is working,
keep with it. It doesn't matter if it's chemo, juicing, TCM or
M&Ms, if it is working, it's working! Leave it be.

If I find that TCM and/or herbal treatments are failing me,
I'll move to something else. To stay alive, we have to keep
an open mind to any and all options! I may hate chemo,
but if that's all that would help, I would seriously consider it.

TCM can and is used along with western medicine. The combination
of both can work wonders! TCM is not a fly-by-night science, it's
been used for thousands of years for billions upon billions of people.

It -is not- "quack medicine". There are many claiming to be
TCM practitioners, that are not following the basic science of
TCM. It's as difficult to find a good TCM practitioner, as it
is to find a good surgeon, GP, or oncologist..... or auto mechanic...

There are TCM prescriptions that will lesson the side effects
of the toxic chemicals used for chemo. That alone is well
worth looking into if your spouse is having a difficult time
with chemo.

You have time to do the research, but if you're demanding
statistics and numbers, you'll end up overlooking a lot of
things that can be greatly beneficial.

There are no numbers for "juicing", but many here and on
other forums have had great success using juicing.

No "alternative remedy" should cost a lot of money. If it does,
I would walk away from it. The herbs that I've used ran about
$5.00 per pound. A pound is enough for over a month's worth
of treatment. I used a total of eight different herbs in the decoction
I made.

That's a far cry from the thousands of dollars some pay for
over-hyped worthless remedies, and no comparison to the
hundreds of thousands of dollars western medicine charges
for chemical therapy that al too often does not work at all.
Nothing carries a guarantee... Nothing.

I would not knock myself out looking for a guarantee, or
numbers to support any specific treatment. If it appears to
make sense, and won't break the bank..... try it.

Good luck and best of health!

John

northernlites
Posts: 96
Joined: Jun 2011

Hi John,
could you share what kind of herbal remedies you are on and where I can get them. Please e-mail me @reeseinal@yahoo.com. Thank you

tessa

John23's picture
John23
Posts: 2140
Joined: Jan 2007

The information you're requesting has all been posted in the "blog"
section here; just click on my name to get to the "personal page"
and the "blog". Once there, remember to click on the ""read more"
button to see all of the blog!

What I feel has worked for me, may not work for anyone else,
and that same idea can be attributed to chemo as well. We see
so many individuals get so sick from heavy doses of toxic chemicals,
only to get recurrences, or eventually weaken from the harsh
treatments to the point of death.

While there is no guarantee that anything will save a cancer victim,
there are many things that will not cause neurological problems,
or "second cancers" in the process of taking them.

The herbs I have used are known to address cancer specifically, and
are used for that. They are not however, commonly used in the
more orthodox tradition of true TCM. These herbs are "dose dependant",
whereas they work only when you are taking them. With true TCM,
the concept is to address the reason cancer is allowed to inside your
body, and repair that fault. In turn your own body will fight the cancer.

So these herbs work as chemo would work; they are "dose dependant".
The big difference, is that they will help build the immune system, rather
than ruin it, as chemo does, and there are no known side effects
when proper doses are taken.

Will they work for you? There are absolutely no guarantees; chemo
carries no guarantees either. You can use the herbs along with chemo
treatments, but you should check with your onc first, and you -will-
need to have a qualified TCM practitioner, or herbalist to refer to.

Let me know if you need more info.

Best hopes for you,

John

2bhealed's picture
2bhealed
Posts: 2085
Joined: Dec 2001

Hi Laurettas,

You may want to check out Kris Carr's book and blog. She's just the person you're looking for in someone that has kept her cancer in check from the get go.

If you expand your options to those who were sent home after exhausting western medicine's treatments, then Anne Frahm is your gal. She wrote A Cancer Battle Plan and her husband wrote the companion how to--A Cancer Battle Plan Sourcebook.

If you can find Your Child Doesn't Have to Die by Leanne Sorteberg then I recommend that one as well. I know her personally and her story of saving her son's life is every bit true.

I know you don't want to hear my anecdotal story of success, but maybe Scouty's is more to your liking....read her personal webpage on here. She did not have surgery but did do some chemo before embarking on her natural healing path. She is a wealth of knowledge. She was Stage IV.

Hope this helps.

peace, emily

laurettas
Posts: 372
Joined: May 2011

Thank you, Emily, for all of your recommendations. Sounds like I have a lot to read! I do have a question and it would probably be more for Scouty than for you. I just read through Scouty's story quickly but it seemed that she went to someone who got her started on her plan for trying to overcome cancer. Does this person have a list of the people who followed this plan that have had their cancer disappear as well? I would assume that if it is something that worked for Scouty, lots of other people would have gone to this person and had the same results. Could she tell us who that person is so we can consult with him/her? I live in a rural area and don't know how many qualified people might be in this area.

laurettas
Posts: 372
Joined: May 2011

Thank you, Emily, for all of your recommendations. Sounds like I have a lot to read! I do have a question and it would probably be more for Scouty than for you. I just read through Scouty's story quickly but it seemed that she went to someone who got her started on her plan for trying to overcome cancer. Does this person have a list of the people who followed this plan that have had their cancer disappear as well? I would assume that if it is something that worked for Scouty, lots of other people would have gone to this person and had the same results. Could she tell us who that person is so we can consult with him/her? I live in a rural area and don't know how many qualified people might be in this area.

laurettas
Posts: 372
Joined: May 2011

Thank you, Emily, for all of your recommendations. Sounds like I have a lot to read! I do have a question and it would probably be more for Scouty than for you. I just read through Scouty's story quickly but it seemed that she went to someone who got her started on her plan for trying to overcome cancer. Does this person have a list of the people who followed this plan that have had their cancer disappear as well? I would assume that if it is something that worked for Scouty, lots of other people would have gone to this person and had the same results. Could she tell us who that person is so we can consult with him/her? I live in a rural area and don't know how many qualified people might be in this area.

laurettas
Posts: 372
Joined: May 2011

the three posts. Sorry!

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