Liver Met

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chris37
chris37 Member Posts: 18
edited March 2014 in Colorectal Cancer #1
Hello,
Im new to all of this I had left a message on the Anal Cancer board and was told to check with this group to see if anyway had any similiar type of situation. I started having issues about a month ago not feeling well sore throat, fever, constipation, and feeling full after eating small amounts of food that is also accompanied by pain on my left side in the middle. So when I went to the Dr they thought that maybe my colon was spasming when I ate. They did blood work and all came back in the normal range except for my liver enzymes which were elevated. They told me to come back in a week so they could re check liver enzymes. They also found in my blood that I had CMV virus which usually shows no symptoms. Anyways when returning back to the Dr in a week with the same complaints they set me up for an abdominal ultrasound. All organs checked out ok except for the liver the tech said their were areas that she was concerned about and said that I needed to have an MRI.

Also second round of blood work still should liver enzymes being elevated. So I had MRI done with contrast. Mri results came back that my liver was met and with an unknown primary. I was sent to a GI DR and regular Dr was also trying to get me in with an onoc Dr as well. Gi Doc didnt want to touch me until I saw onco Dr. But he did three tumor marker tests CEA, CA 19-9 and CA 125 which all came back normal.

I finally got to see onco Dr which checked all my blood work which came back normal liver enzymes were still elevated but have come down a little. Also he had tumor marker tests done the same three that I already had done plus one on the liver which all came back in normal range. Im scheduled for a PET Scan on next Tuesday and they are also wanting to do a liver biopsy as well. But radiologist wants to do scan first to see if theirs a better place to biopsy from. I guess they are looking for primary. My question is that if I have cancer that has spread to my liver I should be in like stage 3 or greater and I would think that some other blood work would be showing abnormal. Is their anyone that has heard of anything similar to my situation?? Its very nerve racking not having any idea whats going on. I have been trying to research as my info as posible. Im a 37 year old married female with 2 girls and trying to keep things as normal as possile while trying to figure out what could be going on. Everyone seems really great and understanding on all the boards. I figured maybe someone might have some information out there.

Thanks to anyone that has listened

Chris

Comments

  • Stefi
    Stefi Member Posts: 31
    #2
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    Be hopeful
    Welcome Chris! I am also pretty new to this board as my mom has recently been diagnosed with rectal cancer. They are suspecting some spots that showed up on her liver are cancer too, but we wont know until tomorrow. The one thing the dr. told us was about the CEA levels. Usually when a cancer has spread, your CEA levels are pretty high...at least with colon/rectal cancers. Do you know what your CEA levels were?

    Steph
  • dianetavegia
    dianetavegia Member Posts: 1,942 Member
    #3
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    Chris
    On the anal cancer board you mentioned melanoma. Melanoma presents on the skin, in the eye and in the colon. It would not show up on the CEA. That's probably why you saw that remark on your file.

    When cancer has spread to another organ it becomes Stage IV.

    I would do a search on melanoma, colon.
  • chris37
    chris37 Member Posts: 18
    #4
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    Stefi said:

    Be hopeful
    Welcome Chris! I am also pretty new to this board as my mom has recently been diagnosed with rectal cancer. They are suspecting some spots that showed up on her liver are cancer too, but we wont know until tomorrow. The one thing the dr. told us was about the CEA levels. Usually when a cancer has spread, your CEA levels are pretty high...at least with colon/rectal cancers. Do you know what your CEA levels were?

    Steph

    Liver Met
    Hey Steph,
    Thanks for replying I do not know what the number was they just told me over the phone that they were in normal range. I agree with you that it doesnt make since for blood counts and tumor marker tests to all be in normal range. I guess I dont understand why the MRI Dr that reviewed the MRI and wrote the report would say that I had cancer that spread to my liver. Which when I asked the onco Doc he said that they are pictures and they only real way to know for sure would be biopsy or something to stand out in the blood work. I figured if the MRI is correct that usually cancer that spreads to the liver is the colon or in that area. I know that the colon, intestines etc would not show on a MRI. Do you know if cancer is in that area would the PET Scan pick it up? I wish you and your mom well I know that waiting is horrible.


    Good Luck
    Chris
  • chris37
    chris37 Member Posts: 18
    #5
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    dianetavegia said:

    Chris
    On the anal cancer board you mentioned melanoma. Melanoma presents on the skin, in the eye and in the colon. It would not show up on the CEA. That's probably why you saw that remark on your file.

    When cancer has spread to another organ it becomes Stage IV.

    I would do a search on melanoma, colon.

    Liver Met
    Thank You.
    On my MRI report it had a question does the patient have a history of melanoma. The onco Dr said that they probably were asking because of my age and all other organs looking ok. I do not have any places on my skin, moles etc that have changed. I did have a small perfectly circled flat mole that was scrapped and it came back as being abnormal but non cancerous. I know the onco said that if I did have skin cancer that the Pet Scan would pick it up. I have been researching I think everything out there trying to figure out where the primary could be. And trying to understand why all my blood work keeps coming back in the normal range if I really have liver met.


    Thank You for the information I have seen you on allot of boards.
  • Stefi
    Stefi Member Posts: 31
    #6
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    dianetavegia said:

    Chris
    On the anal cancer board you mentioned melanoma. Melanoma presents on the skin, in the eye and in the colon. It would not show up on the CEA. That's probably why you saw that remark on your file.

    When cancer has spread to another organ it becomes Stage IV.

    I would do a search on melanoma, colon.

    Not sure
    I wish I could answer more questions for you, but I am pretty new to this stuff. My mom has her first PET CT scan tomorrow and we get the results tomorrow afternoon. I also have a 30 year old friend with melanoma cancer (which was mentioned above) but she never had the same blood work my mom did. Give this post a little while and I am sure a bunch of these great supporting people will have some more answers and suggestions for you. Thanks for the well wishes and I wish them right back to you!

    Steph
  • mom_2_3
    mom_2_3 Member Posts: 953 Member
    #7
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    Chris
    I am a bit confused about this. Have you or have you not had a colonscopy? A CT scan or MRI wouldn't necessarily show a cancerous tumor in the colon.

    With respect to tumor markers and liver enzymes, they don't necessarily need to be high to indicate cancer. The most typically used marker for cancer is called the CEA (carcinoembryonic antigen). The normal ranges are 0-5, closer to 5 if one is a smoker. If the CEA is very high then more than likely that person has cancer. I have read that anything over 20 is indicative of metastatic cancer. So a high number would usually be a cause for concern. But having a low CEA number doesn't mean anything. I know people who have had metastatic cancer and who also had normal CEA numbers. For some people CEA is just not a good indicator. Also, I had 5 mets on my liver and all my liver enzymes were perfectly normal at diagnosis. So that isn't necessarily an absolute either.

    A friend of ours had lymph node mets throughout his chest and neck region and doctors couldn't figure out the origin. As it turns out he had 2 colonoscopies and neither went to the cecum (part of the colon) where the cancer was. A tech at Memorial Sloan Kettering finally figured it out and a third colonscopy confirmed it.

    Good luck to you and best wishes,
    Amy
  • tootsie1
    tootsie1 Member Posts: 5,044 Member
    #8
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    Welcome
    Chris,

    I'm sorry that I can't give you any good information, but I wanted to welcome you to the board. There are people who can give you really great info.

    *hugs*
    Gail
  • mom_2_3
    mom_2_3 Member Posts: 953 Member
    #9
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    chris37 said:

    Liver Met
    Thank You.
    On my MRI report it had a question does the patient have a history of melanoma. The onco Dr said that they probably were asking because of my age and all other organs looking ok. I do not have any places on my skin, moles etc that have changed. I did have a small perfectly circled flat mole that was scrapped and it came back as being abnormal but non cancerous. I know the onco said that if I did have skin cancer that the Pet Scan would pick it up. I have been researching I think everything out there trying to figure out where the primary could be. And trying to understand why all my blood work keeps coming back in the normal range if I really have liver met.


    Thank You for the information I have seen you on allot of boards.

    Chris
    Not to worry you anymore than you are already worried but my sister's BIL was diagnosed with metastatic melanoma. As it turns out one doesn't need a skin lesion or mole to get melanoma. He told me that he was part of the 15% that have melanoma without a skin indicator. You're having a biopsy of the liver met?
  • chris37
    chris37 Member Posts: 18
    #10
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    mom_2_3 said:

    Chris
    I am a bit confused about this. Have you or have you not had a colonscopy? A CT scan or MRI wouldn't necessarily show a cancerous tumor in the colon.

    With respect to tumor markers and liver enzymes, they don't necessarily need to be high to indicate cancer. The most typically used marker for cancer is called the CEA (carcinoembryonic antigen). The normal ranges are 0-5, closer to 5 if one is a smoker. If the CEA is very high then more than likely that person has cancer. I have read that anything over 20 is indicative of metastatic cancer. So a high number would usually be a cause for concern. But having a low CEA number doesn't mean anything. I know people who have had metastatic cancer and who also had normal CEA numbers. For some people CEA is just not a good indicator. Also, I had 5 mets on my liver and all my liver enzymes were perfectly normal at diagnosis. So that isn't necessarily an absolute either.

    A friend of ours had lymph node mets throughout his chest and neck region and doctors couldn't figure out the origin. As it turns out he had 2 colonoscopies and neither went to the cecum (part of the colon) where the cancer was. A tech at Memorial Sloan Kettering finally figured it out and a third colonscopy confirmed it.

    Good luck to you and best wishes,
    Amy

    Liver Met
    Hey Amy,
    Thank you for the information. I have not had a colonoscopy. My oncologist is having me do a Pet Scan on next Tuesday and they are also wanting to biopsy the liver as well. I think they are as confused as I am. Im not sure what my CEA numbers were except for when I talked to the nurse she said that they were all in the normal range. My MRI report had on in in numberable nodules that were metastized in both the left and right lobes. I was just trying to find out info since the most common cancers that spread to the liver are colon. I didnt know if the Pet Scan would show anything in that area or if a colonoscpy would need to be done to rule that out. I have a brother 3 years younger that was diganoised with Chrones a couple of years ago. Im just worried and scarred not knowing for sure. If it is liver met that would mean whatever I have would be stage 3 or above and not sure where that leaves me. Thank you for the info and listening to me ramble.

    Chris
  • chris37
    chris37 Member Posts: 18
    #11
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    tootsie1 said:

    Welcome
    Chris,

    I'm sorry that I can't give you any good information, but I wanted to welcome you to the board. There are people who can give you really great info.

    *hugs*
    Gail

    Thank You!
    Hey Gail,
    Thank you for the hugs. Everyone here has been very helpful with information and support and everyone seems really nice.






    Thank You
    Chris
  • mom_2_3
    mom_2_3 Member Posts: 953 Member
    #12
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    chris37 said:

    Liver Met
    Hey Amy,
    Thank you for the information. I have not had a colonoscopy. My oncologist is having me do a Pet Scan on next Tuesday and they are also wanting to biopsy the liver as well. I think they are as confused as I am. Im not sure what my CEA numbers were except for when I talked to the nurse she said that they were all in the normal range. My MRI report had on in in numberable nodules that were metastized in both the left and right lobes. I was just trying to find out info since the most common cancers that spread to the liver are colon. I didnt know if the Pet Scan would show anything in that area or if a colonoscpy would need to be done to rule that out. I have a brother 3 years younger that was diganoised with Chrones a couple of years ago. Im just worried and scarred not knowing for sure. If it is liver met that would mean whatever I have would be stage 3 or above and not sure where that leaves me. Thank you for the info and listening to me ramble.

    Chris

    Don't get too far ahead of yourself
    Chris,

    I know it can be worrisome as you deal with this but don't get too far ahead of yourself worrying about things that have not yet/may not be confirmed. I had 5 liver mets when diagnosed and my last CT scan in February was clear. So I have been NED (remission) for 1 year so far. There are others on this board that have been clear of their liver mets for years and years and years.

    I am not sure why your DR hasn't suggested a colonscopy, especially with the bowel and abdominal problems you described. I am not positive, as my DR doesn't do PET scans, but I don't know if a PET would see something in the colon. You should ask him/her about that.

    There is always someone here if you need to chat. Just post and invariably someone will answer or respond to your message. If you ever want to talk to me, send me an email and I will give you my contact info.

    Let us know how Tuesday goes.

    Also, where are you located?
  • chris37
    chris37 Member Posts: 18
    #13
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    mom_2_3 said:

    Don't get too far ahead of yourself
    Chris,

    I know it can be worrisome as you deal with this but don't get too far ahead of yourself worrying about things that have not yet/may not be confirmed. I had 5 liver mets when diagnosed and my last CT scan in February was clear. So I have been NED (remission) for 1 year so far. There are others on this board that have been clear of their liver mets for years and years and years.

    I am not sure why your DR hasn't suggested a colonscopy, especially with the bowel and abdominal problems you described. I am not positive, as my DR doesn't do PET scans, but I don't know if a PET would see something in the colon. You should ask him/her about that.

    There is always someone here if you need to chat. Just post and invariably someone will answer or respond to your message. If you ever want to talk to me, send me an email and I will give you my contact info.

    Let us know how Tuesday goes.

    Also, where are you located?

    Greensboro NC
    Hey,
    I live in Greensboro NC. I will let you know what the scan shows. My reg Doc did set me up with the Gi DR to do a colonscopy. The GI Dr said he didnt want to put me through any tests that might not be needed and wanted me to meet with oncologist first. I think the onco DR feels like if their is anything else out there that it should show on the Pet scan and then they can decide to biopsy from somewhere else if they feel like they found a primary. I forget to ask them if the colon and intestines would show in a Pet Scan. I will ask them on Tues. Im having one from head to toe as he called it. Anyways thank you for being an ear. I feel like I should be doing something like trying to help to figure out whats wrong. Theirs not a whole lot of discussions going on in the Melonoma board. So I appreciate everyone here talking to me.
  • msccolon
    msccolon Member Posts: 1,917 Member
    #14
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    welcome
    Hope your stay is temporary and you find out some benign reason for your issues. That said, be assertive! Because you are young, your docs may be having a hard time wrapping their mind around the possibility of colon/rectal cancer as a primary. Definitely insist on a colonoscopy to rule that out. Too many docs out there STILL think that this is an old person's disease but I and lots more on this board will assure you, it's not. Especially if you are a young female, you have to be insistent when you are having bowel issues. As far as your tumor markers, I don't know about uterine cancer or whatever marker the CA 19-9 is for, but CEA, which is a tumor marker for colon cancer, is notoriously inaccurate, and thus unreliable, for a large number of people. It happens to be an accurate marker for me, but it isn't for quite a few people. We will all be looking for an update from you when you know more! Take a deep breath, and keep looking and fighting for an answer!
    mary
  • chris37
    chris37 Member Posts: 18
    #15
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    msccolon said:

    welcome
    Hope your stay is temporary and you find out some benign reason for your issues. That said, be assertive! Because you are young, your docs may be having a hard time wrapping their mind around the possibility of colon/rectal cancer as a primary. Definitely insist on a colonoscopy to rule that out. Too many docs out there STILL think that this is an old person's disease but I and lots more on this board will assure you, it's not. Especially if you are a young female, you have to be insistent when you are having bowel issues. As far as your tumor markers, I don't know about uterine cancer or whatever marker the CA 19-9 is for, but CEA, which is a tumor marker for colon cancer, is notoriously inaccurate, and thus unreliable, for a large number of people. It happens to be an accurate marker for me, but it isn't for quite a few people. We will all be looking for an update from you when you know more! Take a deep breath, and keep looking and fighting for an answer!
    mary

    Thank You!
    Hello Mary,
    Thank you for replying. I will let you guys know what comes from the Pet Scan. And then the biopsy. You all have been so nice.

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