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PSA velocity in Top Gear – I’ve to cut short Drugs’ Vacations

VascodaGama's picture
Posts: 1871
Joined: Nov 2010


Unfortunately my latest test results requires me to shorten my “vacations” on the hormonal treatment. The PSA came at 0.13 ng/ml and the Testosterone at 2.52 ng/ml (252 ng/dL). This is upsetting because I wished to stay off drugs for 5 years but the exponential calculations of the PSA velocity shows that I will reach the threshold limit of 2.5 ng/ml in October 2013. This is the value set by my doctor to stop the intermitent period and re-start HT. I was looking for a period of 3 years with no drugs. Frown

Today’s results have increased from;

Nov 2011: PSA=0.02, T=0.32 (last Eligard 6-month shot)
May 2012: PSA=0.02, T=<0.01 (End of Eligard’s effectiveness; Starting Off-Drugs perio
Aug 2012: PSA=0.02, T=0.11
Nov 2012: PSA=0.03, T=0.56
Jan 2013: PSA=0.13, T=2.52 (PSADT=1.96 months; PSAv=0.20 ng/ml per month)

I need some sort of alternatives to prolong this "lovely" time on normal levels of testosterone. Castration brought me numerous but mild side effects . In any case what I am now experiencing is quite different from the symptoms while on castration.
Libido and nostalgic erections are back. I got more energy, more pubic hair and harder beard. I feel an elevated lucidity and better reasoning in dealing with things. Rheumatic-like pain is gone totally.

I read that guys on intermittent hormonal therapy take maintenance drugs while on vacations from the treatment. The common practice by famous oncologists is to administer 5-ARI (such as Avodart or Proscar) continuously. A well known PCa survivor who took intermittent HT as his solo prime treatment in the past 13 years (since 1999), manages to prolong the vacation period with the use of thalidomide and vitamin B6. He just ended his third off-drug period which is quite impressive. Thalidomide "prohibits" the formation of newer blood vessels required by the cancer to survive.

The National Cancer Institute says this on the matter;
“Cancer researchers studying the conditions necessary for cancer metastasis have discovered that one of the critical events required is the growth of a new network of blood vessels. This process of forming new blood vessels is called angiogenesis.”

Thalidomide cause side effects and it may be nasty. Five alpha reductase Inhibitors (5-ARI) are easier to take and they do not lower the testosterone  (saving other possible health problems) but they also lead to lower libido.

I wonder where I am heading. My next test is in two months.

You may follow my story at; http://csn.cancer.org/node/244938


Best to all.

VGama  Undecided

hopeful and opt...
Posts: 1630
Joined: Apr 2009

Tongue OutWinkWink   Always glad to read good news about you.

lewvino's picture
Posts: 1007
Joined: May 2009

Nice to hear that your doubling time is relatively slow. Best wished as you contine.


Posts: 58
Joined: May 2013

VascoDG, you're the consummate survivor. Believe this.  My DH and I had an interesting discussion with our oncologist up here in Canada. He is very well informed and keeps up with everything. He is also open-minded and encourages patients to work with naturopaths and diets, so that they can, as he puts it, "do your job better."

We asked him why, at 7 months on ADT2, my DH's PSA was at .36 and not lower and should we be on a triple blockade. He felt that there was really no advantage statistically to adding Proscar or Avodart. He also said that he had seen many people get hung up on these numbers when they mean very little. He gave an example of three patients...one whose PSA went to undetectable in four months, one that took a longer time to do so and one who stuck at 1.0. The one who went to undetectable began to rise quite significantly a short time after, the one that took a long time falling stayed fallen for two years and the one at 1.0 seems stuck there. He said that in his experience, the important thing was how long it stayed low - low being anything under 1.0.  I realize this isn't too relevant to your situation.

I'm not sure if other oncologists have made this observation, or whether they see a definite positve pattern in those who reach the lower levels faster. He was not referring to those who couldn't get their PSA low. I realize the difference between .36 and .036 is huge in terms of pp.

Re Artemisinen. My DH was on it. It was being sold in his naturopath's office. However, when I advised the naturopath in an email that he was taking it, he wrote back that he shouldn't be. That he should come off it right away (plus, it was no longer in his store). As soon as we meet with him, I will ask what he saw to make him change his mind.

Here is what he wrote: I do not recommend artemesinin at all, but if you have added it for some reason, it should not be used on an ongoing basis but rather cycled on and off…. I have seen some nasty side effects to artemesinin, and no benefit in prostate cancer at all.  I would urge it be discontinued.

I responded with "Why?" and he came back with this: Don't mind at all…. I know of the in vitro evidence for artemesinin…. other than in liver cancer (HCC) there is not really any good human evidence. I also have experience with over 8500 patients before in which I have used artemesinin - doesn't work.

I will ask how he knew it didn't work.


Edited to add. We are setting up an appt with Dr. Scholz or Lee.