The Recurrence of Recurrences
I had replied to Norm on Jan 8 with the comment below. There IS something missing in the way many of us are approaching our treatment.
At my last chemo two weeks ago I asked my chemo nurse if many of the folks there get CURED by chemo and she said that most do not get cured, it does buy people time. That is not to say that some people DO get cured from chemo but the majority do not.
Below is the post I made on Norm's thread:
I have found it VERY difficult at times having lived with stage IV colon cancer since Feb 2004 and a member of this forum since May 2005, reading countless times where people on here have done what's been prescribed by their oncologists as far as surgery and chemo goes and then they go back to business as usual as far as their diet and lifestyle goes. I know because that's basically what I did. Many may have a period of time where they're declared NED only to have their cancer reappear anywhere from a few months to a few years later. I certainly can't speak for everyone but I was not given much information or guidance regarding nutrition and diet after my surgeries or during my countless chemos. I'm pretty sure that if I talked it up a lot with them that they'd try to offer help or point me to the nutritionist on staff who would hopefully guide me toward a better diet. I know your (Norm's) post mentioned vitamins and supplements and how they can help in the fight against cancer but one can also get those same things from eating food that contains them.
I did juice for a while and "watched what I ate" for a little while here and there and felt GREAT while doing it but I have yet to seriously change my diet. Now here I am, close to 8 years after my dx still growing small nodes in my lungs, having an RFA every year for the past 4 years, and doing chemo every 2 weeks until further notice. My quality of life is decent but I can't seem to shake this cancer. I have to ask myself why, what's missing? Don't get me wrong, I'm very happy with my oncologist and the plan of action that we've taken. I truely believe that without her expertise and guidance I would not be here today. But I also have to look at how nutrition can play a role in this (like it does in everything) and possibly give my body the extra boost it needs to get cancer OUT of my body and keep it out.
The topic of how diet and nutrition has helped people has at times become a toxic topic for some, but I believe (and always have) that cancer is very complex and there is no one way to beat it that works for everyone. Sadly, that seems to be a tough concept for some to consider. My plan for this year is to continue with the chemo (Erbitux and Irinotecan every two weeks) and get my CT scans as usual but reintroduce juicing, cutting out much of the sugar and processed foods, and just overall read the labels and keep the crap out and see how I fare over this year. If/when I get to my goal of being cancer-free I will be happy to say that it took everything there was available to beat this cancer.
While I don't expect everyone to agree with my assessment of my situation, I do hope that people can take a look back at what they've observed and/or experienced over their time on this site and help themselves toward staying healthy.
-phil
Comments
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I agree with you Phil that
I agree with you Phil that there is something definitely missing in this whole world of nutrition as a complement to treatment options. While I have respect for and like my doctors so far, they don't seem to see beyond the standard. When I've asked about supplements and nutrition, I've gotten pretty much zilch in the way of recommendations. Even when talking with dieticians, and I don't mean to offend anyone, I haven't gotten any useful info. I have problems with maintaining weight and get handed Ensure which is often malabsorbed and is contraindicated with ileostomies anyway. That said, I have been trying to research diets and supplements. I know something in my body made it vulnerable to growing cancer and I think it wouldn't hurt to explore ways to become healthier. My diet wasn't bad to begin with but I think there is room for improvement. And like you said, you felt good when you were making a more conscious effort, juicing, etc. So that's a good thing about cleaning up the diet.
When we are treated conventionally, it is an experiment each time. Even so, I am thankful that there is treatment and surgery. But beyond it, I see no harm in experimenting with healthier habits. I'd like to see discussions about healthy habits continue on the forum with respect for one another's efforts. Thanks for bringing this up.
I applaud your strength and perseverence.
Laura0 -
mis dos centavos ?
While I would agree with the supposition that nutrition is very
important in the fight against cancer, there are more factors to
consider than just "eating well", or adding / subtracting items
from one's diet or life-style.
The problem with stifling cancer, is the confusion that's generated
by all the various "remedies" that are promoted by both the
"well-meaning", and by the commercial entities.
Alternative medicine, and the main stream (chemo / rads), are all
promoted with extreme hyperbole from their representative industry.
We continually read about drinking "oxygenated water", eating
grape seeds, apricot pits, and various other odd fruit and
vegetable by-products... We're told to eliminate white sugar,
remove all red meat from the diet, stop drinking coffee and
instead pump it in our butts...... The list is near endless.
Does any of it seriously work, or even help?
I read here (as well as in publications from the medical world),
that cancer remission can be "spontaneous". The reference to
that phenomena usually accompanies references the usage of any
alternative to standard chemotherapy or radiation treatments.
I.E. The mainstream therapies carry the honor of possibly resulting
in remission, while anything else is simply a "spontaneous phenomena".
Finding the truth of what can be trusted to actually have any positive
effect, isn't easy if one takes all that's being promoted as seriously
as the amount of money the products cost.
Sometimes...... history can provide some insight; the sheer longevity
of a specific practice or science, might lead us to what may be
most beneficial, based on the "test of time".
I never changed my diet. I eat red juicy meat, add sugar to my
orally consumed coffee, and drink cheap Bourbon, beer and wine.
I gave up smoking my 3-4 packs a day long before my DX,
and did so to help encourage my wife to quit her 3 pack a day
habit, since her carotid artery stenosis could be remedied by
the simple act of not smoking.
My life-style has been terribly changed due to the surgeries involved,
adding stress to my life where no stress had been before. So the
elimination of stress, as recommended by the medical world, is
a joke at best...
I can't prove that any one thing is better to fight cancer with than
something else, or that what I've used actually did anything of value.
But.... I am here typing, and doing so against all the terrible odds
they said I had against being here now.
(I never took chemotherapy or radiation; what I did use, is listed
on my profile page.)
TCM is a science that's lasted for four thousand years, and
continues to be practiced in the finest of other nation's hospitals.
It shouldn't be tossed aside with "magnet therapy" and other
hyperbolic remedies that seem to emerge daily. TCM's a viable
science that has withstood the "test of time", unlike any other
"remedy" available.
Fighting cancer is more about the balance of one's system, and
the building of the immune system, than the simple removal of
some food products declared to be "bad".
And that, is my dos centavos!
Best of health to all!
John0 -
Complimentary Treatment at Mayo
Phil,
I found this board after completing Folfox and being told I am in the group most likely to recur. I think I have shared this before but I would like to share again. At the Mayo Clinic in Rochester the Cancer Resource Center gives patients DVD's with TAi Chi, Relaxation Response with a Spiritual Emphasis for Religious paitients, Meditation DVD's and Nutrition Classes. One does not need to go to extremes, Pepe would agree that eating the Mediterranean Diet, avoiding red meats and eating local produce with vegetables and increasing your vegetables, beans, rice, lentils, in your diet is best. Exercising at least 45 minutes and being active in walking an hour per day can reduce your risk for most cancers and heart disease.
I have been doing Tai Chi, and trying to remain active to prevent a recurrence. I also think prayer helps but relaxation response and a positive attitude can lower stress as well.
As some here have been doing I take a 81 mg daily aspirin and calcium with D3. Daily try to get outside for natural sunlight and a good walk. My goal is to try to get to the 3 hour mark of exercise and activities combined each day.
This board has been so helpful in helping me become more educated. When I read about all of you who are actively fighting the fight and still here I am inspired to do more.
Please continue these discussions because the old alternative treatments vs Chemo is not true...... We all need both conventional and complimentary treatment: surgery, chemo, radiation, nutrition, exercise and emotional-spiritual support to be successful in our journey.
NB0 -
Hey Bud
Thanks for reading my post...glad you took the time to take a look at it. I've read yours as well....agree chemo is not the cure, in certain situations it can be looked at as a cure....most of the time the cancer is too much for chemo to eradicate on its own....that's a key distinction.
And over time, chemo can become resistant and begin to fail....my onc reconfirmed all of this to me last year and I wrote about it on the "The Chemo Wars" post...
The problem with our cancer is that the "barn door is swung wide open" and when the cattle scatter in the form of mCRC cells, our battle becomes more challenging to achieve the level of victory that we hope to attain.
While anything we may or may not do may work or may not...that is our ongoing chase. The problem with any of this is that worn out line we use here everday..."We all react differently."
Of course, that is true and again what makes our challenges so individually unique as well as collectively in our community setting.
My current thoughts on recurrence are...once we recur the 1st time, the likelihood that we will recur again...and again...are greatly increased. At least that's been the story for me.
Despite my own efforts and despite the successes my surgical and medical teams have done for me....I've recurred...I may go again....it would be foolish to think that I will not.
I'll know how I'm faring as scan cycle #3 is at the end of the month. In the "Chemo Wars" post, I said I gave a year and hoped to get a year - or I would know that I was beginning to slip.
This cycle will mark 8-months since treatment wrapped up...I expect to still be clear....the one in May will mark the one-year mark....and from there, who knows?
Nice seeing you and continued good luck...
-Craig0 -
JohnJohn23 said:mis dos centavos ?
While I would agree with the supposition that nutrition is very
important in the fight against cancer, there are more factors to
consider than just "eating well", or adding / subtracting items
from one's diet or life-style.
The problem with stifling cancer, is the confusion that's generated
by all the various "remedies" that are promoted by both the
"well-meaning", and by the commercial entities.
Alternative medicine, and the main stream (chemo / rads), are all
promoted with extreme hyperbole from their representative industry.
We continually read about drinking "oxygenated water", eating
grape seeds, apricot pits, and various other odd fruit and
vegetable by-products... We're told to eliminate white sugar,
remove all red meat from the diet, stop drinking coffee and
instead pump it in our butts...... The list is near endless.
Does any of it seriously work, or even help?
I read here (as well as in publications from the medical world),
that cancer remission can be "spontaneous". The reference to
that phenomena usually accompanies references the usage of any
alternative to standard chemotherapy or radiation treatments.
I.E. The mainstream therapies carry the honor of possibly resulting
in remission, while anything else is simply a "spontaneous phenomena".
Finding the truth of what can be trusted to actually have any positive
effect, isn't easy if one takes all that's being promoted as seriously
as the amount of money the products cost.
Sometimes...... history can provide some insight; the sheer longevity
of a specific practice or science, might lead us to what may be
most beneficial, based on the "test of time".
I never changed my diet. I eat red juicy meat, add sugar to my
orally consumed coffee, and drink cheap Bourbon, beer and wine.
I gave up smoking my 3-4 packs a day long before my DX,
and did so to help encourage my wife to quit her 3 pack a day
habit, since her carotid artery stenosis could be remedied by
the simple act of not smoking.
My life-style has been terribly changed due to the surgeries involved,
adding stress to my life where no stress had been before. So the
elimination of stress, as recommended by the medical world, is
a joke at best...
I can't prove that any one thing is better to fight cancer with than
something else, or that what I've used actually did anything of value.
But.... I am here typing, and doing so against all the terrible odds
they said I had against being here now.
(I never took chemotherapy or radiation; what I did use, is listed
on my profile page.)
TCM is a science that's lasted for four thousand years, and
continues to be practiced in the finest of other nation's hospitals.
It shouldn't be tossed aside with "magnet therapy" and other
hyperbolic remedies that seem to emerge daily. TCM's a viable
science that has withstood the "test of time", unlike any other
"remedy" available.
Fighting cancer is more about the balance of one's system, and
the building of the immune system, than the simple removal of
some food products declared to be "bad".
And that, is my dos centavos!
Best of health to all!
John
Do u mind clarifying, please. I'm sure I'm overlooking something.
You had colon surgery, but no surgery/procedures on liver or lungs?
The spots on lungs and liver, was that determined to be mcrc, and how was that determined?
You had distant lymph nodes that what exactly.....lit up on a PET, one PET, several PETS? What about CTs and MRI's....did you have any of those, and what did they show as to "spots" on lungs, liver? Were they definitely all mcrc spots?
Thanks..... like i said, I must be missing something......I'll even let you fill in the blank as to what that is. Be nice, now.0 -
Hey Phil...Sundanceh said:Hey Bud
Thanks for reading my post...glad you took the time to take a look at it. I've read yours as well....agree chemo is not the cure, in certain situations it can be looked at as a cure....most of the time the cancer is too much for chemo to eradicate on its own....that's a key distinction.
And over time, chemo can become resistant and begin to fail....my onc reconfirmed all of this to me last year and I wrote about it on the "The Chemo Wars" post...
The problem with our cancer is that the "barn door is swung wide open" and when the cattle scatter in the form of mCRC cells, our battle becomes more challenging to achieve the level of victory that we hope to attain.
While anything we may or may not do may work or may not...that is our ongoing chase. The problem with any of this is that worn out line we use here everday..."We all react differently."
Of course, that is true and again what makes our challenges so individually unique as well as collectively in our community setting.
My current thoughts on recurrence are...once we recur the 1st time, the likelihood that we will recur again...and again...are greatly increased. At least that's been the story for me.
Despite my own efforts and despite the successes my surgical and medical teams have done for me....I've recurred...I may go again....it would be foolish to think that I will not.
I'll know how I'm faring as scan cycle #3 is at the end of the month. In the "Chemo Wars" post, I said I gave a year and hoped to get a year - or I would know that I was beginning to slip.
This cycle will mark 8-months since treatment wrapped up...I expect to still be clear....the one in May will mark the one-year mark....and from there, who knows?
Nice seeing you and continued good luck...
-Craig
Good post! I just wondered if your picture is an up to date one? If so, you never lost your hair from the CPT-11?
Jennie0 -
constant, coherent sources of molecules
We need molecules to fight for us. Sources are diverse, food, food concentrates, TCM herbs, and supplements. Some molecules are hard to get from more than one source. Juicing and TCM get some molecules that are not readily and cheaply available elsewhere. Supplements can sometimes allow access to quantities 1000x or more over food.
To me, for multimodal molecular targets to work, most molecules will have to be natural or nutritional (types), our bodies can't handle the toxicity of multiple denovo drugs (literally "patent medicines").
In the coming era of molecular targets, we want 90+% of our molecular "ammo" to still be available OTC or in our backyards. Not hostage to some financial terrorists with a liplock on congress. Which is what the FDA and some partisans have been been doing to alternative nutrition and natural medicines for decades.0 -
roger or kerry or 1000s of otherstanstaafl said:constant, coherent sources of molecules
We need molecules to fight for us. Sources are diverse, food, food concentrates, TCM herbs, and supplements. Some molecules are hard to get from more than one source. Juicing and TCM get some molecules that are not readily and cheaply available elsewhere. Supplements can sometimes allow access to quantities 1000x or more over food.
To me, for multimodal molecular targets to work, most molecules will have to be natural or nutritional (types), our bodies can't handle the toxicity of multiple denovo drugs (literally "patent medicines").
In the coming era of molecular targets, we want 90+% of our molecular "ammo" to still be available OTC or in our backyards. Not hostage to some financial terrorists with a liplock on congress. Which is what the FDA and some partisans have been been doing to alternative nutrition and natural medicines for decades.
this board educated me about all the very unpleasant facts of crc that wait in store.
so just do what onc's say ?
just no ffffing way am i going to go home enjoy xmass and grow a tumour somewhere.
i am likely off to germany to cook the **** tumour.
why not be the healthiest corpse in the cemetery, who knows when that day will be anyway.
living today really well is all that counts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
to each his own. if you want to be a healthy example then great phil. juice away. we need more, we lost scouty and em.
hugs,
pete
ps john23 your wrong about tcm and nutrition. they are inseparable.
no zinc, no immune system, no zinc no stomach acid, no acid no digestion.
no offence, we must give our bodies raw materials for enzymes to work.
my tcm failed me because i did not spot and fix my gut problems i think.0 -
Lets face it. we are all inpete43lost_at_sea said:roger or kerry or 1000s of others
this board educated me about all the very unpleasant facts of crc that wait in store.
so just do what onc's say ?
just no ffffing way am i going to go home enjoy xmass and grow a tumour somewhere.
i am likely off to germany to cook the **** tumour.
why not be the healthiest corpse in the cemetery, who knows when that day will be anyway.
living today really well is all that counts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
to each his own. if you want to be a healthy example then great phil. juice away. we need more, we lost scouty and em.
hugs,
pete
ps john23 your wrong about tcm and nutrition. they are inseparable.
no zinc, no immune system, no zinc no stomach acid, no acid no digestion.
no offence, we must give our bodies raw materials for enzymes to work.
my tcm failed me because i did not spot and fix my gut problems i think.
Lets face it. we are all in the same battle. Some do it this way, others follow another way.
Who knows who is wrong and who is right.
we all were Dx with the same words... you have cancer....
We all can hear the same words again and again.
What we do here is to support each other and inform each other what works for us.
There is NO guarantee in any of the roads we are following, being it TCM, coffee enema's
eating raw foods etc etc.
we will never agree on this topic.
What is important is to SUPPORT each other and enjoy each day with our loved ones to the fullest.
My prayers are with all of you everyday,
Hugs, Marjan0 -
Molecular Targets --- Managing Our Internal Biochemistrytanstaafl said:constant, coherent sources of molecules
We need molecules to fight for us. Sources are diverse, food, food concentrates, TCM herbs, and supplements. Some molecules are hard to get from more than one source. Juicing and TCM get some molecules that are not readily and cheaply available elsewhere. Supplements can sometimes allow access to quantities 1000x or more over food.
To me, for multimodal molecular targets to work, most molecules will have to be natural or nutritional (types), our bodies can't handle the toxicity of multiple denovo drugs (literally "patent medicines").
In the coming era of molecular targets, we want 90+% of our molecular "ammo" to still be available OTC or in our backyards. Not hostage to some financial terrorists with a liplock on congress. Which is what the FDA and some partisans have been been doing to alternative nutrition and natural medicines for decades.
Thanks again for keeping this discussion going. Education, enlightening, whatever.... how to support each other... Molecular targetting... that is where this is heading. Every day there are new abstracts published...> "...this or that tumor has been determined to be actually TWO different tumor types...> need $$$ and years to undertake research to see what this new info means...."
I have been lurking on the site for a number of months. Started reading the discussion when a good friend was diagnosed with colon cancer. Then my brother was diagnosed with prostate and a bit later pancreatic cancers. I am a retired environmental chemist. I am doing my best to follow your writings on other approaches to provide moities into the biochemical processes.
You... this wonderful group here on the colon cancer discussion board... you are sharing what YOU are personally doing at the cutting edge of it all. 2 years... 6 years... 8 years..amazing!!!! Maggie0 -
Phil, you're the bomb!
You do give me hope and I FINALLY found an Interventional Radiologist that will use cyberknife on 2 of my lung mets but not all of them. I don't know if this information has been posted before, because I'm a slacker on this discussion board, however, my girlfriend got me interested in Doug Kaufmann (Know the Cause?) tying cancer to fungal infections. His book on cancer is VERY interesting and he asks how many cancer patients were diagnosed shortly after a bout with antibiotics or exposure to mold or mildew. He has an anti-fungal diet in his book. You might want to take a peek at his work. Myself, I'm trying to be good but starting my 6th year of chemo sucks. I'm so tired of this ride.0 -
WenchieWenchie said:Phil, you're the bomb!
You do give me hope and I FINALLY found an Interventional Radiologist that will use cyberknife on 2 of my lung mets but not all of them. I don't know if this information has been posted before, because I'm a slacker on this discussion board, however, my girlfriend got me interested in Doug Kaufmann (Know the Cause?) tying cancer to fungal infections. His book on cancer is VERY interesting and he asks how many cancer patients were diagnosed shortly after a bout with antibiotics or exposure to mold or mildew. He has an anti-fungal diet in his book. You might want to take a peek at his work. Myself, I'm trying to be good but starting my 6th year of chemo sucks. I'm so tired of this ride.
Interesting. My cancer was diagnosed after contacting a rare deadly fungi called rose gardners disease. I was diagnosed 3 years after initialally contacting the disease. It is dormant now, but prods me now and again that it is still here. I always made the connection between the two. I had anal cancer finished tx 12/8/10. I self dxed the fungi, fought with dr until she concurred. Did the research myself. At first they treated me with antibiotics, but there was no response. When it spread to my eyes, I brought in the hard copies of my research. Tx took a long time. I would like to know more about this research about the relationship between cancer and fungus. I am a landscape designer specializing in roses.0 -
Phoeb'sPhoebesnow said:Wenchie
Interesting. My cancer was diagnosed after contacting a rare deadly fungi called rose gardners disease. I was diagnosed 3 years after initialally contacting the disease. It is dormant now, but prods me now and again that it is still here. I always made the connection between the two. I had anal cancer finished tx 12/8/10. I self dxed the fungi, fought with dr until she concurred. Did the research myself. At first they treated me with antibiotics, but there was no response. When it spread to my eyes, I brought in the hard copies of my research. Tx took a long time. I would like to know more about this research about the relationship between cancer and fungus. I am a landscape designer specializing in roses.
Here is the website https://www.retail.bookstore-knowthecause.com/products.asp
I bought "The Germ That Causes Cancer". I'm not sure I truly believe that cancer is a fungus, however, I have an inkling that we get fungus' and while our immune system is fighting off the fungus, cancer cells are able to take over. I don't know but after 8 months on antibiotics and a mildew-ridden office at Home Depot, something's up!0 -
WenchieWenchie said:Phoeb's
Here is the website https://www.retail.bookstore-knowthecause.com/products.asp
I bought "The Germ That Causes Cancer". I'm not sure I truly believe that cancer is a fungus, however, I have an inkling that we get fungus' and while our immune system is fighting off the fungus, cancer cells are able to take over. I don't know but after 8 months on antibiotics and a mildew-ridden office at Home Depot, something's up!
That is what I believe too, that these cells slipped by when i was trying to fight the fungus. I am a Gardner, I believe in cause and effect.0 -
Sorry about that Toots(ie) ;-)tootsie1 said:Whew!
Whew! I agree with what you're doing, but the subject on that post gave me heart failure. I was afraid of what I was going to read.
*hugs*
Gail
I didn't mean to give you a scare if I did...
It's difficult for me* to be at this for close to 8 years and see how I've gotten just so far but not over the "hump" with cancer. I may never, I'm doing well and most likely beat the odds, my quality of life is good but could be better. I've done a hell of a lot of chemo. I can't even count how many times I've read the "Yea, I'm NED - Bummer, the cancer's back" posts within 12-18 months. TOO MANY TIMES.
Surgery is often needed, that's hard to argue with especially at Stage IV
What to choose next is up to you. Doctors sell cars, they're not going to try to sell you a bicycle.
I've found chemo's done an incredibly good job for me* and I'm happy with my choices.
But it may, or may not, get rid of all of the cancer. Even if it does I would be very cautious.
(Good) Nutrition certainly makes sense, cancer or no cancer, and I believe* that it could help me to get rid of these annoying lung nodes that pop up yearly. Maybe it won't. Then the downside is that I may lose some weight and overall be healthier. Not a bad "risk".
I* don't have the chut-spa to forgo chemo altogether and just go with the diet/nutrition route.
There is plenty of room in this town for all treatment options and none are guaranteed.
The fighting (not the discussions or debating that goes on) about what the RIGHT way to approach cancer is BS at best. The discussions should go on*, that's how one gets educated.
-phil
* this notates that this is just my opinion.
I wish I didn't need to do that but the written word is often not interpreted as it was meant to be* (again)0 -
PhilPhillieG said:Sorry about that Toots(ie) ;-)
I didn't mean to give you a scare if I did...
It's difficult for me* to be at this for close to 8 years and see how I've gotten just so far but not over the "hump" with cancer. I may never, I'm doing well and most likely beat the odds, my quality of life is good but could be better. I've done a hell of a lot of chemo. I can't even count how many times I've read the "Yea, I'm NED - Bummer, the cancer's back" posts within 12-18 months. TOO MANY TIMES.
Surgery is often needed, that's hard to argue with especially at Stage IV
What to choose next is up to you. Doctors sell cars, they're not going to try to sell you a bicycle.
I've found chemo's done an incredibly good job for me* and I'm happy with my choices.
But it may, or may not, get rid of all of the cancer. Even if it does I would be very cautious.
(Good) Nutrition certainly makes sense, cancer or no cancer, and I believe* that it could help me to get rid of these annoying lung nodes that pop up yearly. Maybe it won't. Then the downside is that I may lose some weight and overall be healthier. Not a bad "risk".
I* don't have the chut-spa to forgo chemo altogether and just go with the diet/nutrition route.
There is plenty of room in this town for all treatment options and none are guaranteed.
The fighting (not the discussions or debating that goes on) about what the RIGHT way to approach cancer is BS at best. The discussions should go on*, that's how one gets educated.
-phil
* this notates that this is just my opinion.
I wish I didn't need to do that but the written word is often not interpreted as it was meant to be* (again)
I haven't looked in to it yet (been meaning to), but I think that the integrative specialists at S-K recommend the mushroom extract (the one that is spelled something like "corelis". And I've been meaning to check for sure (i think i heard this on a video of theirs), that it definitely is ok to take while on chemo. Tansflaa (sp- sorry), and Pete, and others talked about it.
Can't hurt to slowly introduce things that ya know are ok.....that, and juicing. At least it's a start and then maybe something else down the road. Someone in the waiting room at s-k said they take Bell's super immunity supplement (has that corelis mushroom extract in it), and that they had the ok from the oncologist (not sure which oncologist). I haven't even looked at that LEF site yet that Tansflaa references, but I sure plan to. Just thought I'd mention that extract.....0 -
I have been doing thePhillieG said:Sorry about that Toots(ie) ;-)
I didn't mean to give you a scare if I did...
It's difficult for me* to be at this for close to 8 years and see how I've gotten just so far but not over the "hump" with cancer. I may never, I'm doing well and most likely beat the odds, my quality of life is good but could be better. I've done a hell of a lot of chemo. I can't even count how many times I've read the "Yea, I'm NED - Bummer, the cancer's back" posts within 12-18 months. TOO MANY TIMES.
Surgery is often needed, that's hard to argue with especially at Stage IV
What to choose next is up to you. Doctors sell cars, they're not going to try to sell you a bicycle.
I've found chemo's done an incredibly good job for me* and I'm happy with my choices.
But it may, or may not, get rid of all of the cancer. Even if it does I would be very cautious.
(Good) Nutrition certainly makes sense, cancer or no cancer, and I believe* that it could help me to get rid of these annoying lung nodes that pop up yearly. Maybe it won't. Then the downside is that I may lose some weight and overall be healthier. Not a bad "risk".
I* don't have the chut-spa to forgo chemo altogether and just go with the diet/nutrition route.
There is plenty of room in this town for all treatment options and none are guaranteed.
The fighting (not the discussions or debating that goes on) about what the RIGHT way to approach cancer is BS at best. The discussions should go on*, that's how one gets educated.
-phil
* this notates that this is just my opinion.
I wish I didn't need to do that but the written word is often not interpreted as it was meant to be* (again)
I have been doing the nutrition thing as well as the chemo and multilple surgeries for over 6 years now. I very hardcore with the nutrition since my most recent recurrence/surgery. I am mostly vegetarian (I have to have meat sometimes, I want to live but I have to live some to) and eat mostly organic foods and juice twice a day. I am also very fit. I mountain bike and kayak. I figure none of the exercise and diet can hurt and it can only help. I have read countless websites on the cancer fighting properties of tumeric including research being done at MD Anderson. There must be something to it if the cancer centers are researching it. It can also help the effect of 5FU (We all know what that wonderful drug is LOL)0 -
(immuno)chemo forever, or to reach the 100% wipe
One of the fundamental problems is that wiping out the last 0.1%-1% of cancer cells, perhaps cancer stem cells, might take much more time on treatment, or different treatment. The current conventional chemo treatments exhaust patients' ability to take more, and force patients off treatment, ready or not, with damaged immune systems.
The strategy we've adopted is to try to keep new mets from forming, to try to kill the micromets or smaller with immunochemo and molecularly targeted nutrients, and then to cut out any residual macromets, like lung thingies, that grow larger or persist years too long. My wife is almost 22 months on continuous immunotherapy + supplements that wiped out at least one set of mets and shrank the primary tumor. Over 18 months straight lower dose chemotherapy + alternative adjuvants appear to have prevented further metastasis from a large cluster of para-aortic nodes.
One problem I grapple with is how to measure a safe place to stop the chemotherapy, if ever - to avoid the common 3-6-9 month recurrence problem after chemo stops. Even low dose chemo has a downside, long term wear and tear on the body and brain, or possible escalation of dosage for a given level of effectiveness. I am hopeful that we have preserved or augmented enough of her immune function to eventually dissolve the "thingies" and "cysts" - 2 down, 2-3 to go.0
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