Spitting up blood

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arndog64
arndog64 Member Posts: 537
in Head and Neck Cancer #1
My husband was spitting up blood this weekend and all of his gums are white. Is that the mouth soares I that I have heard people talking about? Any solutions?

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  • tnsilcncer
    tnsilcncer Member Posts: 64
    #2
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    Mouth sores
    Is he currently in radiation and if so, how many has he had?
  • arndog64
    arndog64 Member Posts: 537
    #3
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    tnsilcncer said:

    Mouth sores
    Is he currently in radiation and if so, how many has he had?

    Yes, he is getting chemo and
    Yes, he is getting chemo and radiation at the same time and he has received 23 rads so far.
    Today, they decided to not give him chemo and just gave him some fluids, because he will not EAT!!!! I try to find soft foods and he will take 2-3 bites and that is it. He is drinking a carnation instant breakfast in the morning and maybe a glass or two of water, but that is it.. He is loosing weight and muscle mass.
  • tnsilcncer
    tnsilcncer Member Posts: 64
    #4
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    arndog64 said:

    Yes, he is getting chemo and
    Yes, he is getting chemo and radiation at the same time and he has received 23 rads so far.
    Today, they decided to not give him chemo and just gave him some fluids, because he will not EAT!!!! I try to find soft foods and he will take 2-3 bites and that is it. He is drinking a carnation instant breakfast in the morning and maybe a glass or two of water, but that is it.. He is loosing weight and muscle mass.

    Oh man
    I had a PEG tube put in before I even started treatment at my oncologists suggestion. I only lost 25 lbs because I had it, I'm a firm believer that that's why I survived. If he can get one, I would do it pronto! Some people don't need it, I didn't have the weight to spare so that was the first thing they did. As for the bleeding: my gums didn't turn white but my tongue did. Pure white. I did bleed from my throat, especially if I coughed (or sneezed which was the most HORRIBLE experience EVER) or after I brushed my teeth, but have your doc check it just in case anyway. Better safe than sorry. I never had any visible sores until about two weeks after I finished radiation, up to that point, it was just swollen, super red, and sore. I'm glad you found this sight, I know during treatment there's no way I would have had the energy to chat on here, but since I've started feeling better, it's been so good to talk to people going through the same thing (or that have gone through the same thing). You've come to the right place with questions. Will keep you both in my prayers!

    Hugs!

    Karen
  • Skiffin16
    Skiffin16 Member Posts: 8,305 Member
    #5
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    arndog64 said:

    Yes, he is getting chemo and
    Yes, he is getting chemo and radiation at the same time and he has received 23 rads so far.
    Today, they decided to not give him chemo and just gave him some fluids, because he will not EAT!!!! I try to find soft foods and he will take 2-3 bites and that is it. He is drinking a carnation instant breakfast in the morning and maybe a glass or two of water, but that is it.. He is loosing weight and muscle mass.

    Communication
    Just make sure he communicates with his MD's (RADS, Chemo and ENT)....

    More than likely it's the combination of treatment and isn't that uncommon at this point, but always good to have the MD's check him out.

    For me I had no PEG and at the dtage you (he) are in I only did pain meds 3 - 4 times a day with water and Ensure Plus (350 calories/can). The Ensure plus is loaded with nutrients, vitamins and minerals.

    If he can drink at least 3-4 or more (6-8) preferable each day, he'll still lose weight but get through. I also ate a few sliced DelMonty Peaches to keep the swallow muscles working good too.

    Hang in there, it'll get better in a few weeks....

    Added, I knew I had to eat, weather I wanted to, felt like it or it hurt....and fluids are essential.

    So I would prepare my stuff just before doing it. For me it was a teaspoon of the thick liquid throat numbing solution. Then a glass of water, and Ensure Plus (or two if I could squeeze it in), and a few sliced peaches. Then more water and chased with a ground up and dissolved Percocet in just enough water to wash it down. Then head for a nice warm shower....it helped, not sure why, it just did.

    You can also try rinses of a teaspoon of baking soda and a tespoon of hydrogen peroxide in about a 1/4 glass of water...swish and spit several mouthfuls...

    Best,
    John
  • arndog64
    arndog64 Member Posts: 537
    #6
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    tnsilcncer said:

    Oh man
    I had a PEG tube put in before I even started treatment at my oncologists suggestion. I only lost 25 lbs because I had it, I'm a firm believer that that's why I survived. If he can get one, I would do it pronto! Some people don't need it, I didn't have the weight to spare so that was the first thing they did. As for the bleeding: my gums didn't turn white but my tongue did. Pure white. I did bleed from my throat, especially if I coughed (or sneezed which was the most HORRIBLE experience EVER) or after I brushed my teeth, but have your doc check it just in case anyway. Better safe than sorry. I never had any visible sores until about two weeks after I finished radiation, up to that point, it was just swollen, super red, and sore. I'm glad you found this sight, I know during treatment there's no way I would have had the energy to chat on here, but since I've started feeling better, it's been so good to talk to people going through the same thing (or that have gone through the same thing). You've come to the right place with questions. Will keep you both in my prayers!

    Hugs!

    Karen

    He was never offered the
    He was never offered the feeding tube beacause he was overweight going in. I think he needs one now. He has made it very clear to me that he does not want a feeding tube.
    That's fine with me, but he need to make an effort to get some nutrition..I know he feels horrible and his mouth is fried and suffering from mucositis.. But, he has got to fight back.
  • Hondo
    Hondo Member Posts: 6,636 Member
    #7
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    Skiffin16 said:

    Communication
    Just make sure he communicates with his MD's (RADS, Chemo and ENT)....

    More than likely it's the combination of treatment and isn't that uncommon at this point, but always good to have the MD's check him out.

    For me I had no PEG and at the dtage you (he) are in I only did pain meds 3 - 4 times a day with water and Ensure Plus (350 calories/can). The Ensure plus is loaded with nutrients, vitamins and minerals.

    If he can drink at least 3-4 or more (6-8) preferable each day, he'll still lose weight but get through. I also ate a few sliced DelMonty Peaches to keep the swallow muscles working good too.

    Hang in there, it'll get better in a few weeks....

    Added, I knew I had to eat, weather I wanted to, felt like it or it hurt....and fluids are essential.

    So I would prepare my stuff just before doing it. For me it was a teaspoon of the thick liquid throat numbing solution. Then a glass of water, and Ensure Plus (or two if I could squeeze it in), and a few sliced peaches. Then more water and chased with a ground up and dissolved Percocet in just enough water to wash it down. Then head for a nice warm shower....it helped, not sure why, it just did.

    You can also try rinses of a teaspoon of baking soda and a tespoon of hydrogen peroxide in about a 1/4 glass of water...swish and spit several mouthfuls...

    Best,
    John

    Bleeding

    I too had some issues with bleeding but for me it was mostly after the treatment stopped and even then for years after and for no reason. The radiation will sometimes make small blood veins start to bleed, just make sure his doctors are aware of it and are checking him regular.

    All the best
    Hondo
  • Skiffin16
    Skiffin16 Member Posts: 8,305 Member
    #8
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    arndog64 said:

    He was never offered the
    He was never offered the feeding tube beacause he was overweight going in. I think he needs one now. He has made it very clear to me that he does not want a feeding tube.
    That's fine with me, but he need to make an effort to get some nutrition..I know he feels horrible and his mouth is fried and suffering from mucositis.. But, he has got to fight back.

    PEG
    At the point he's at in his treatment, I'm sure he can more than likely have his way and stick it out without getting the PEG at this point.

    But yes, you are correct, he does need to make the effort and he does have to take in nutrients....

    You might want to give it to him where it hurts, LOL....

    No food or supplemental drinks, you're getting the PEG buddy...

    Of course, it's the MD's that make the real decisions, not me...

    JG
  • arndog64
    arndog64 Member Posts: 537
    #9
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    Skiffin16 said:

    PEG
    At the point he's at in his treatment, I'm sure he can more than likely have his way and stick it out without getting the PEG at this point.

    But yes, you are correct, he does need to make the effort and he does have to take in nutrients....

    You might want to give it to him where it hurts, LOL....

    No food or supplemental drinks, you're getting the PEG buddy...

    Of course, it's the MD's that make the real decisions, not me...

    JG

    That's Right Buddy!!! LOL

    That's Right Buddy!!! LOL
  • sweetblood22
    sweetblood22 Member Posts: 3,228
    #10
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    Hondo said:

    Bleeding

    I too had some issues with bleeding but for me it was mostly after the treatment stopped and even then for years after and for no reason. The radiation will sometimes make small blood veins start to bleed, just make sure his doctors are aware of it and are checking him regular.

    All the best
    Hondo

    There was a point where my
    There was a point where my mouth bled constantly. My mouth was full of sores and my tongue was like a greyish color. I was coming home from radiation and the roof of my mouth slagged off in one big sheet and was caught in my teeth. It was incredibly painful and I could neither eat nor drink, but I had a peg tube. That was honestly the worst thing about radiation for me. I used the magic mouthwash constantly and was on 75 mcgs of fentanyl, but the pain in my mouth was still unbearable.
  • arndog64
    arndog64 Member Posts: 537
    #11
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    sweetblood22 said:

    There was a point where my
    There was a point where my mouth bled constantly. My mouth was full of sores and my tongue was like a greyish color. I was coming home from radiation and the roof of my mouth slagged off in one big sheet and was caught in my teeth. It was incredibly painful and I could neither eat nor drink, but I had a peg tube. That was honestly the worst thing about radiation for me. I used the magic mouthwash constantly and was on 75 mcgs of fentanyl, but the pain in my mouth was still unbearable.

    OMG That sounds so scarry..
    OMG That sounds so scarry.. He was spitting up a little blood, then he had a mouthfull. But since then he said it hasn't been to bad. They prescribed some meds for his mouth. Not sure what they gave him, I am still at work. They also postponed his chemo for a week to give his mouth time to heal and take the meds. I want the peg because he sleeps all day and night and will not eat. He refuses to get the peg. None of the doctors has suggested anything at this time. I am sure if they tell him he nees one he will follow doctors orders. I have been waiting for you to chime in. Thanks Sweetblood.
  • Skiffin16
    Skiffin16 Member Posts: 8,305 Member
    #12
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    arndog64 said:

    OMG That sounds so scarry..
    OMG That sounds so scarry.. He was spitting up a little blood, then he had a mouthfull. But since then he said it hasn't been to bad. They prescribed some meds for his mouth. Not sure what they gave him, I am still at work. They also postponed his chemo for a week to give his mouth time to heal and take the meds. I want the peg because he sleeps all day and night and will not eat. He refuses to get the peg. None of the doctors has suggested anything at this time. I am sure if they tell him he nees one he will follow doctors orders. I have been waiting for you to chime in. Thanks Sweetblood.

    Radiation & Hydration & Tenting
    The radiation more than likely is what's causing the raw throat and mouth and bleeding, more so than the chemo.

    Are you sure he's getting enough hydration...that'll cause him to wanna sleep all of the time and just keep getting more sick until he goes in the hospital.

    Practice the tenting method...

    Lift the skin on the backs of his hands, slightly pinch it and pull it up. If it stays up for long like a tent, he needs fluids. If it's subtle and returns to normal shape pretty much immediately (like yours should) he's doing good on fluids...

    My wife would do it to me all of the time...drove me nuts when I was trying to rest or sleep...

    JG
  • adventurebob
    adventurebob Member Posts: 691
    #13
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    arndog64 said:

    OMG That sounds so scarry..
    OMG That sounds so scarry.. He was spitting up a little blood, then he had a mouthfull. But since then he said it hasn't been to bad. They prescribed some meds for his mouth. Not sure what they gave him, I am still at work. They also postponed his chemo for a week to give his mouth time to heal and take the meds. I want the peg because he sleeps all day and night and will not eat. He refuses to get the peg. None of the doctors has suggested anything at this time. I am sure if they tell him he nees one he will follow doctors orders. I have been waiting for you to chime in. Thanks Sweetblood.

    nutrition
    Not getting enough nutrition WILL slow down healing and cause more sores and can prevent completion of treatment. That is the reason for the PEG. Delaying or not completing treatment is not a good thing. He needs the constant calories or it will get worse. You might have to play badass caregiver for awhile but really his docs should be the ones doing that. If he gets more calories in he will feel better; at least his body will. Sorry you're having to go through this. Don't stop climbing now. You're almost at the top of the hill.

    Bob

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