PEG Tube 101

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soccerfreaks
soccerfreaks Member Posts: 2,788 Member
edited April 2011 in Head and Neck Cancer #1
My wife is a Wound/Ostomy/Continence Nurse (WOCN), commonly referred to in my part of the country for whatever reason as an ET nurse. My doctors knew her well preceding my introduction to them, and took her advice regarding my wound care, and expected her to continue that care when I came home.

Me, I had a PEG tube for four years. I know a little about them and would like to share that with any who is new to the tube.

1. Someone asked in a recent thread how you can continue to lose weight while on the tube. I can offer a few reasons why this may happen. The first is that we are programmed to eat three times a day, for the most part, and so do not expect to have to fill ourselves with protein four, five, maybe even six times a day. And so we don't.

The second possible reason is that there are a number of possible protein 'doses', if you will. I, for example, started out with a 1200 calorie can (two cans each 'feeding', four times daily). This proved not to be enough, so they jacked me up to 2000 calories, and then down to 1,500, which seemed to work out nicely. (My nutritionist advised that the 2000 cal can did not have the sufficient additional nutrients that the 1200 and 1500 cal cans did).

The third potential reason is that we can feel full doing the deed three times a day, for example, especially if we are also working on eating orally, and thus, again, we skip one or more of our important 'meals' on a daily basis.

2. From my reading here, there are clearly a number of different types of tubes. Mine went into my stomach, had a plastic disk at point of entry that I called a bumper, and had some toggle switches at the point of protein entry, so that I could shut it off or shuttle off the liquid into the sink, for example, if the need arose. I mention the bumper because, when my bumper was not in place (after an emergency replacement for example) my stomach would suck the tube in, to the point that it would become very painful.

3. My tube was contained by a bubble, really. When they punched their hole in my stomach, when they inserted the tube, there was an empty balloon on the end inside of the stomach. A secondary 'port' on the tube allowed them to enter saline or whatever into the balloon, filling it up so that it could not come BACK through the hole they had carefully crafted. Maybe they have better designs now. In my case, the balloon would deflate at about 12-14 months, and come out, always a surprise, especially waking in the morning and discovering that something about you was not quite the way it was the night before and that your dog was chewing on a long white tube (okay I made that up, but it could happen).

4. If your tube falls out and you need a new one, you need to go to the ER immediately, so that the stomach hole doesn't fill in, close, whatever they call it. You do not any new surgery if they can use the same perforation, and that means that you need to get there pretty quickly. I am not saying you need to break the speed limit (although it's probably a good excuse if you get pulled over), but just that you should not wait until after the weekend golf tournament.

5. ER tubes suck. As a rule. Ok, in my case, they all did. Those are the ones that my stomach swallowed causing um, some pain. You want to schedule an appointment, a surgical session, with your ENT or Gastro person at your earliest possible convenience. If the hole is still there, it is a painless if unnecessarily long procedure, and you can even watch it on the overhead ultrasound machine, if you are into that.

6. Saving the best for last, this one and the next one, that is, the place where they put a hole in your skin and into your stomach, that is called a wound. As such it requires wound care, just as the first raspberry you received falling off a bike did, just as do those wounds you acquired in that recent knife fight with a surgeon while you were sleeping. I am not a doctor, and don't even play one on TV. In my experience, though, I had a number of ointments and balms applied to the immediate area, from diaper rash ointment to anti-fungal creams, to protective skin creams (whatever that means), to any number of others you are probably familiar with. Always, of course, ask your docs before applying anything. This I would cover with a particular sort of non-stick gauze and press the bumper against it, and I never really had problems with wound issues.

7. I was instructed while in the hospital exactly how to administer my protein liquid. I had something that looked like a hypodermic needle on steroids (plastic) that I stuck into the top of my tube. I had two flasks, into each of which I was to pour a can of the life-preserving protein. I was then to pour carefully from a flask into the needle-****-funnel, and then use a plunger to push it down into my body. Friends and neighbors, this is ridiculous. Once I got home my wife showed me a better way immediately: pour the protein into each of the flasks, then fill the remainder of each flask with water, and simply let this thin-downed substance gravitate through the tube and into the body, with no need for the plunger. It works, trust me. No need to cram the plunger in, no need to pull it out with that ubiquitous POP following it: the thinned protein source will find its way on its own AND you are getting some extra hydration to boot.

8. Occasionally, of course, you do need to use the plunger to help clean out the tube, and others have described ways they've used to help with that (carbonated drinks come to mind immediately). For cleaning I would simply fill a flask with warm water, fill the funnel and use the plunger until all was gone and the tube was clean. Just one way, maybe not the best.

9. Can't believe I almost forgot this one: If you are nauseaus and on the tube, and if you hurry, you can avoiding puking (which is really rather uncomfortable, after all), and simply switch the toggle switch so that whatever is coming is coming out through the alternative opening and into, say, the sink, avoiding that nasty wretching and cleanup. Almost makes you love your tube.

Class dismissed :)

Take care, folks,

Joe

Comments

  • sweetblood22
    sweetblood22 Member Posts: 3,228
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    Thank you.
    Wow, thanks, Joe. Definitely adding this to the Superthread. Good stuff.
  • MarineE5
    MarineE5 Member Posts: 1,030 Member
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    Peg Tube
    Yes Joe, Thank you, very informative and helpful.

    I too did the gravity feeding , but the nutrition that I used seemed to work without thinning it. My Peg didn't have any shutoff valves. Mine just had a flip cap at the end and it did pop open one day after I was done feeding. So, I ended up bending the cap and a short part of the hose over and used a small rubber band wrapped over the end. That way I was sure that if the cap popped, no fluid would seep out.

    Thanks again for all the information.

    My Best to You and Everyone Here
  • buzz99
    buzz99 Member Posts: 404
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    Tubes
    Thanks for all the great info, Joe! I have a few questions: How long should a PEG remain in place before it has to be changed? We were told to come in to Interventional Radiology every three months for a tube change. The 17th is the due date but in the mean time our dietician has been working on getting a low profile tube (it is flush with the skin and does not protrude like the present one). The IR department is gearing up to do these tubes but has not done any yet. So, how long past the due day can the tube change be postponed? BTW, Buzz is no longer using the tube and is 3 months post treatment. We have been advised to keep it for 6 months post treatment. So we are thinking of removing it in three more months, or after the next clean PET.
  • sweetblood22
    sweetblood22 Member Posts: 3,228
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    buzz99 said:

    Tubes
    Thanks for all the great info, Joe! I have a few questions: How long should a PEG remain in place before it has to be changed? We were told to come in to Interventional Radiology every three months for a tube change. The 17th is the due date but in the mean time our dietician has been working on getting a low profile tube (it is flush with the skin and does not protrude like the present one). The IR department is gearing up to do these tubes but has not done any yet. So, how long past the due day can the tube change be postponed? BTW, Buzz is no longer using the tube and is 3 months post treatment. We have been advised to keep it for 6 months post treatment. So we are thinking of removing it in three more months, or after the next clean PET.

    Keeping a low profile....
    He will find the low profile tube so much more comfortable. I had a Mic-key button and it was way better than the other two I had. One time I went three weeks over when my tube needed to be changed. The balloon looked a bit discolored and a little worse than usual, but it held up.
  • bpell0402
    bpell0402 Member Posts: 61
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    Keeping a low profile....
    He will find the low profile tube so much more comfortable. I had a Mic-key button and it was way better than the other two I had. One time I went three weeks over when my tube needed to be changed. The balloon looked a bit discolored and a little worse than usual, but it held up.

    keep the info coming!
    thanks joe and sweet! just printed your post and filed it in my new binder .. i already have a PEG section created filled with care instructions and recipes.

    Sweet - my binder is filled with most of the super thread which is absolutely amazing.
  • sweetblood22
    sweetblood22 Member Posts: 3,228
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    bpell0402 said:

    keep the info coming!
    thanks joe and sweet! just printed your post and filed it in my new binder .. i already have a PEG section created filled with care instructions and recipes.

    Sweet - my binder is filled with most of the super thread which is absolutely amazing.

    Binder!
    What a great idea.

    Thank you, I am glad it has helped you. :)
  • Dav1965
    Dav1965 Member Posts: 132
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    buzz99 said:

    Tubes
    Thanks for all the great info, Joe! I have a few questions: How long should a PEG remain in place before it has to be changed? We were told to come in to Interventional Radiology every three months for a tube change. The 17th is the due date but in the mean time our dietician has been working on getting a low profile tube (it is flush with the skin and does not protrude like the present one). The IR department is gearing up to do these tubes but has not done any yet. So, how long past the due day can the tube change be postponed? BTW, Buzz is no longer using the tube and is 3 months post treatment. We have been advised to keep it for 6 months post treatment. So we are thinking of removing it in three more months, or after the next clean PET.

    I went 7 months
    I went 7 months with mine. It seems everybody forgot about it. When i was at the doctor i told him my stomach had been hurting and he asked when i had my tube changed last. I told him never and he was shocked. He told me from now on every 3 months. David
  • soccerfreaks
    soccerfreaks Member Posts: 2,788 Member
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    buzz99 said:

    Tubes
    Thanks for all the great info, Joe! I have a few questions: How long should a PEG remain in place before it has to be changed? We were told to come in to Interventional Radiology every three months for a tube change. The 17th is the due date but in the mean time our dietician has been working on getting a low profile tube (it is flush with the skin and does not protrude like the present one). The IR department is gearing up to do these tubes but has not done any yet. So, how long past the due day can the tube change be postponed? BTW, Buzz is no longer using the tube and is 3 months post treatment. We have been advised to keep it for 6 months post treatment. So we are thinking of removing it in three more months, or after the next clean PET.

    hmmm
    I honestly do not know how long a tube should remain in place, and I wonder if they want to remove it because of external issues rather than internal (the wound issue). In my case, the PEG tube I had would stay in place until it fell out, as I indicated above, which was generally in the 12-14 month range. Wish I could provide a definitive answer, but I cannot.

    As for Buzz's success without the tube, kudos to him (and to whomever is helping him to eat without that tube :)). I like the advice you have been given about maintaining the tube for six months following treatment: it can't hurt and for some of us, losing it too soon can indeed cause problems.

    Take care,

    Joe
  • Kent Cass
    Kent Cass Member Posts: 1,898 Member
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    hmmm
    I honestly do not know how long a tube should remain in place, and I wonder if they want to remove it because of external issues rather than internal (the wound issue). In my case, the PEG tube I had would stay in place until it fell out, as I indicated above, which was generally in the 12-14 month range. Wish I could provide a definitive answer, but I cannot.

    As for Buzz's success without the tube, kudos to him (and to whomever is helping him to eat without that tube :)). I like the advice you have been given about maintaining the tube for six months following treatment: it can't hurt and for some of us, losing it too soon can indeed cause problems.

    Take care,

    Joe

    As for the internal wound thing, I had mine for over 15-months, and had a heckuva time getting the new BB to seal shut. Went for a couple months with it seaping every day at work after lunch, without failure. Surgeon ended-up trying moinstened "Skin Temp II" fiber strips to stuff in the new BB. That took care of the wound sealing shut on the outside, but I got no clue on how that affected the now-vacant tube pathway on the inside. Seems to be okay, though.

    And remember- there are a number of different types of tubes. Mine was not replaceable, and it's dome inside of my stomach measured 15/16" in diameter, and there was no way that it was gonna fall out. Surgeon told me he wished I'd gotten the "balloon" type, as they can be easily replaced every 6-plus months.

    Good thread, Joe.

    kcass
  • buzz99
    buzz99 Member Posts: 404
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    Keeping a low profile....
    He will find the low profile tube so much more comfortable. I had a Mic-key button and it was way better than the other two I had. One time I went three weeks over when my tube needed to be changed. The balloon looked a bit discolored and a little worse than usual, but it held up.

    Thanks
    Thanks, Sweet. I will try to be a bit more patient with the tube change issue. Karen
  • Una
    Una Member Posts: 12
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    Hi Joe
    Hi Joe,
    Thanks for the post. I was wondering how you were able to take out the tube after 4 years? I am writing for my Mum Una who has had peg for a year and 9 months. I would love if she could swallow
    Thanks
  • soccerfreaks
    soccerfreaks Member Posts: 2,788 Member
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    Una said:

    Hi Joe
    Hi Joe,
    Thanks for the post. I was wondering how you were able to take out the tube after 4 years? I am writing for my Mum Una who has had peg for a year and 9 months. I would love if she could swallow
    Thanks

    taking out the tube
    I never took out the tube. Each of the times it was 'removed' including the last time after four years, it fell out. The first three times, I hustled down to ER to get a 'filler' while I waited for a proper surgery to reinsert a 'good' one.

    By the time the last one fell out, I had been eating for quite some time, along with continuing to use the tube. I started off as most do with simple things, which for me included juices and tolerable protein drinks (Boost, Ensure, Muscle Milk). I would be careful about getting back on fruit drinks right away as many of them can seem either very tart or very bitter at first. Essentially, your taste buds are those of a baby again, depending on how long you have gone without eating.

    I was able to do popsicles fairly quickly and gravitated to yogurts and puddings and ice creams both on a stick and in a bowl.

    So: it was a process of evolving back into eating, one that I'm still dealing with, frankly.

    If I were mom, I would not be in such a hurry to remove the tube. As I can attest personally, and as others have indicated in this thread and others, it is a very good to be sure that you do not have any need whatsoever for the tube before getting rid of it.

    As for the swallow issue, not familiar with your mom's surgical or other treatment, but must surmise that at least some of the swallow issues have to do with treatment. In my case, much of the blame had been laid at the feet of radiation: rad scarring in the upper throat. I have a feeling that the surgery itself had a role as well.

    In my case, I went very early on to swallow specialists who did ultrasounds of my mouth and throat as I was swallowing various substances. They were able to show me what I might be doing wrong and how I might correct it. I also attended sessions with speech pathologists, which, believe it or not, helped as much with swallowing as with speaking, and I also visited a physical therapist for quite some time to work with exercising the muscles, extending limits, and so forth.

    I have also had three or four dilations of the esophagus now, and as of this last one, things have improved greatly.

    So there is much that can be done, but it takes time, which takes patience and determination.

    I wish your mom the very best as she shoots for that goal (THOSE goals, actually, as swallowing again can be, as in my case, a series of goals).

    Take care,

    Joe
  • Una
    Una Member Posts: 12
    Options

    taking out the tube
    I never took out the tube. Each of the times it was 'removed' including the last time after four years, it fell out. The first three times, I hustled down to ER to get a 'filler' while I waited for a proper surgery to reinsert a 'good' one.

    By the time the last one fell out, I had been eating for quite some time, along with continuing to use the tube. I started off as most do with simple things, which for me included juices and tolerable protein drinks (Boost, Ensure, Muscle Milk). I would be careful about getting back on fruit drinks right away as many of them can seem either very tart or very bitter at first. Essentially, your taste buds are those of a baby again, depending on how long you have gone without eating.

    I was able to do popsicles fairly quickly and gravitated to yogurts and puddings and ice creams both on a stick and in a bowl.

    So: it was a process of evolving back into eating, one that I'm still dealing with, frankly.

    If I were mom, I would not be in such a hurry to remove the tube. As I can attest personally, and as others have indicated in this thread and others, it is a very good to be sure that you do not have any need whatsoever for the tube before getting rid of it.

    As for the swallow issue, not familiar with your mom's surgical or other treatment, but must surmise that at least some of the swallow issues have to do with treatment. In my case, much of the blame had been laid at the feet of radiation: rad scarring in the upper throat. I have a feeling that the surgery itself had a role as well.

    In my case, I went very early on to swallow specialists who did ultrasounds of my mouth and throat as I was swallowing various substances. They were able to show me what I might be doing wrong and how I might correct it. I also attended sessions with speech pathologists, which, believe it or not, helped as much with swallowing as with speaking, and I also visited a physical therapist for quite some time to work with exercising the muscles, extending limits, and so forth.

    I have also had three or four dilations of the esophagus now, and as of this last one, things have improved greatly.

    So there is much that can be done, but it takes time, which takes patience and determination.

    I wish your mom the very best as she shoots for that goal (THOSE goals, actually, as swallowing again can be, as in my case, a series of goals).

    Take care,

    Joe

    Thanks Joe
    Hi Joe
    Thanks for reply. Mum had been attending speech therapist last year. When Doctor tried to dilate her oesophagus they were unable. We think Mum is able to swallow but upper stenosis in oesophagus is stopping liquids or food going down. Please God there will be a miracle. All the best,
    Thanks