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vitamin d3 for kids and family and me

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

i am pretty convinced by the dr garland utube video, found it
by searching archives for vitamin d3.

i am really happy about vitamin d3 watched video utube , just started taking supplement.

getting blood tests monday, was thinking of doing it for the whole family.

first thanks to the posts on this site mainly lisa42 is the one i read.

so i went to naturopath a few days ago she advised d3 and many others, will document later.

did my d3 research and am pretty convinced 75% odds are incredible.

doctor garland video is impressive.

was thinking this maybe good for the whole family, especially wife who has some breast lumps getting biopsied next week as a precaution.

i know many of us are now believers, are their any non believers ?

if d3 is any near as good as its claimed, i am disappointed my onc did not advise me.

has anyones onc advised d3 ? or do we have to re invent the wheel on every diagnosis.

would you give your wife and kids d3 ?

interesteed in your opinions ?

pete

Patteee's picture
Patteee
Posts: 948
Joined: Jul 2009

my son, age 25, his doctor did a d3 test as part of a routine physical. His result was a very low number (can't remember it now) so he is on d3and calcium supplements. That was enough for my other 2, ages 23 and 20 to also go on it.

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

glad i won't be the only ones whose kids might be on this, will discuss with my onc and gp
next visit.

is anyone taking d3 and calcium while on folfox ?

thanks,

pete

LivinginNH's picture
LivinginNH
Posts: 1293
Joined: Apr 2010

Hey Pete, Yes, after meeting with the "diet doctor" Rick is now taking 2000 iu's every day, but I anticipate that his new onc. will increase the dose since he is still 10 pts. below where he should be at. The post Rick wrote last night titled "Clean scan...now what?" gives more details. His new onc., Dr. K. Ng did a research study on Vitamin D and told us that the results were very promising for colon cancer patients. (You can find a copy by doing a Google search). Hope this helps with your question. (And I'm now taking 1000iu every day now too.) Take care, Cynthia

tanstaafl's picture
tanstaafl
Posts: 959
Joined: Oct 2010

We've been maintaining wife's dose at 26-27,000 iu D3 per day for a month now, while on continuous oral chemo. Chemo reduces vitamin D3 retention in CRC, even more (2-3 papers). We try to balance the vitamin D3 with vitamin K2, both MK4 (45 mg/day in bone formula) and MK7 (100-200 mcg/day). I am expecting that the next calcidiol blood test will be up, ca 50-65 ng/mL (125-163 nmol/L). I am trawling for new papers about the 50-100 ng/mL range (125-250 nmol/L), to identify data, conditions, pros and cons, for how to decide a stopping point.

We check blood calcium every 3-8 weeks with along with one of the CBCs, it's cheap; blood calcidiol (D3 metabolite) is pricey. When we ran out of our Osteo-K bone formula, with 45 mg vitamin K2 (menaquinone-4 vitamer, MK-4) in 6 caps, also containing one gram of calcium in ca 6 grams of calcium citrate, the blood calcium levels dropped to low in the normal range, from above average calcium.

We are considering to move the MK-4 (K2) slightly higher with some straight MK4 pills (no extra calcium above 1000 mg). Nausea apparently sets the upper limits for oral vitamin K, where the Japanese have limited experience up to 60-90 mg per day with liver cancer cases. Vitamin K2 has some preclinical data that suggest that it aids apoptosis, and cartilage formation. I am hopeful that the bone formula will help protect the bones from metastases, a little, and that K2 will prevent any calcium buildup in the wrong places. I am also hopeful that this approach will avoid some of the tooth decay problems that some patients experience on chemo.

lisa42's picture
lisa42
Posts: 3663
Joined: Jul 2008

Hi Pete,

I'm glad to hear you're on the D-3 now. I've been taking 6,000 IU daily of it. When last tested a few months back, my D level was at 53, which is pretty darn good (it started at a low of 13 a couple of years ago). I just had it tested again recently & thought it might even be higher, but it was a bit lower- at 42. Anything 32 and above is "normal", but I read somewhere awhile back that cancer patients should strive to get it in the 60's or 70's. So, I'm thinking that the chemo is what keeps batting it down, or maybe the cancer itself, who knows. I will continue to take it.
I've read articles recently that talk about how kids who have optimal levels of vitamin D get less colds and flus than other kids. I would assume that would apply to everyone, this article just happened to focus on kids.
My 15 yr old recently had bloodwork done & was also found to have a very low vitamin D level. So, I have her on supplements also. The problem being, as a teenager, she never wants to take anything mom recommends. So I got some soft chewable vitamin D- comes in a bottle at Walmart. Probably full of sugar too, as it is sweet, but at least now she'll take it, wheras she wouldn't use the spray form I gave her for whatever reason. I hesitate to give my other two kids a heavy duty supplement without having their levels tested. They too, also take the chewable supplement.

Here's to your health-
Lisa

tanstaafl's picture
tanstaafl
Posts: 959
Joined: Oct 2010

Lisa, I haven't looked at Walmart items lately, but I would be surprised to see more than 400-600 iu per candy. In the winter, in most parts of the US, that simply isn't enough, according to the actual vitamin D researchers. Never mind the circus and clowns over at IOM, they were wrong at 200 iu, have been inching up about 200 iu per five years, and we are supposed think that they are correct now.

One has to wonder what the underlying diet, manufacture, malabsorption, metabolism issues are in CRC patients, and potentially our kids, in order to optimize vitamin D3. We've considered three supplemention routes:
1. Daily caps, the current means with 5,000 iu caps (wife).
2. Direct incorporation into a nutrient fortified shake, in progress.
3. Weekly caps. Not advised for those needing high potency supplementation, as above. However, for my kids, I might consider trying 10,000 iu caps on Sundays to overcome the daily grind.

Some fairly high dose D3 patients use the 50,000 iu caps weekly.

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

will wait for my blood test results before hitting 10,000iu a day. wow.

cannot wait to get my results.

am actually going to try and do a few more midday swims for 30 mins.

the sun feels great.

I'll worry about skin in post 2020.

My wife who I am fighting with tonight except she asleep now watched the video yesterday and was impressed as well, it takes alot to impress her. not me at present.

anyway I have actually emailed all my bowel cancer buddies here about d3 and referred them to our wonderful life saving forum.

pretty keen on the drops myself, where do you get them ?

thanks, thanks, thanks,

Pete ( shoudl have just said many thanks )

ps I might keep bumping this up asking more questions so that we make sure all the
new club members are aware and basically watch the video and hopefully get impressed or make an informed decision against. still no naysayers yet! but I'll give it time.
We need some passionate debate here not just silent opposition. I am a bit of a stirrer sometimes.

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

All my bloods were great also got d3 result fast.

My D3 was 99nmol/L which is between 75-200 nmol/L - Optimal per previous post.
Garland suggests 100-150nmol/L So my target is 150, an increase of 50nmol/L
My D3 plan Going to stick to 2 x 1000UI morning and 3x 1000UI night. total daily d3 is 5 tablets.

Based on this cool paper
http://www.vrp.com/bone-and-joint/vitamin-d3-higher-doses-reduce-risk-of-common-health-concerns

key points
The researchers point out that supplemental intake of 400 IU per day barely raises blood concentrations of 25(OH)D, which is the circulating Vitamin D metabolite that serves as the most frequently measured indicator of Vitamin D status.

Based on even cooler slider show
http://www.slideshare.net/TedHutchinson/dr-garlands-dinomit-model-vitamin-d-for-cancer-prevention Look for slide re upper limits 16/24
To raise 25(OH)D from 50 to 80 nmol/L requires an additional intake of 1,700 IU Vitamin D per day. SO 45nmol/L GAIN NEEDS 3 x 1700UI = 5100UI approximately 5 x 1000UI.

Now my target is of around 150nmol/L which is garlands upper limmit.

Hope this makes some sense. Any comments ?

Pete

tanstaafl's picture
tanstaafl
Posts: 959
Joined: Oct 2010

Vitamin D3 beyond 150nmol/L(=60 ng/mL) is certainly time to consider nutrient balances, and look around for research papers that might help address an optimum calcidiol blood level for CRC. We also consider magnesium, calcium, vitamin K2 and D3 intakes as a whole. I consider the 65-90 ng/mL (168-237 nmol/L) range the most critical area of research.

For colon cancer, and especially on chemo, we can't rely on population average dose - responses to precisely predict vitamin D3 blood level changes.

We're taking it slow, planning to measure more blood results, especially calcium, and look for more CRC research on all four nutrients over the next few months.

coloCan
Posts: 1845
Joined: Oct 2009

of coloncancer.about.com

A magazine distributed by health food store by me,"Better Nutrition", Feb 2011, page 22 recommends 1,000 to 2,000 of cholecalciferol, D3, a day, "maybe more".......

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

Good site, read heaps thanks.

http://coloncancer.about.com/b/2010/07/05/higher-blood-vitamin-d-levels-better-survival-after-colon-cancer.htm
of dx GI cancer only 3% had good levels of D, that pretty damming, no wonder so many recurrences.

My good result was to do with goodluck and diet and all my other crazy complementary things. I am still pissed that I pay my $150 a visit every 2 weeks and I have to get the best advice here. Gee I am a bit angry, but it will pass into disappointment. I already know the reason for the onc cautious approach. but I don't give a
sh it about triple blind studies run over a decade, or of profit margins.

I am rambling but everyday that goes by I get more critical of big business and our health.

I made some jokes weeks ago about a post re nude bathing. We already had the absolutely free method of saving our lives and boosting vitamin D.

are you measuring your vitamin, whats your take after being aware of these reports ?
just interested ?

This forum is so valuable.

cheers,

Pete

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

from one chemo brain to another
this report made sense and I am on cloud 9 with dex and threst of the drugs today.

New Vitamin D Recommendations Reignite Controversy
http://coloncancer.about.com/b/2010/12/01/new-vitamin-d-recommendations-reignite-controversy.htm

is that 66ng or 66nmol/L ? one would be ok and one low

its is all so complex but least now we have clear as mud guidelines.

my main strategy is to test every fortnight, its for free here and they can do it with my blood for chemo.

the cream sounds like to much hard work.

god bless,
Pete

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

Kathy and anyone else keen on a target,

See who gets to target range first, mine is 140-150.

Yours was 130-140.

Lets say the winner is three blood tests in the range. I actually think this should be pretty tricky achieve, but at least it will be interesting to see how we all go.

Nana b's picture
Nana b
Posts: 2859
Joined: May 2009

I have been on Vitamin D3 for over a year. You need to take it with calcium supplements to get the full benefit. I have my Mom on them too. I take 6000 units and I was still low.

Selenium is good too.

I take Tumeric also. the other is Milk Thistle.

I have a colonoscopy coming up on the 8th, we shall see!!!

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

for the last 3 weeks been on 3000 ui morning and 2000 ui evenings with calcium.

thought this would increase my vit d level.

it did not ? I have actually gone down. its still sunny.

been thinking of upping the doasage to 10,000 daily

I scene a really good naturopath, who is just finalising my new and improved and refined supplement schedule. she pretty much liked what i was doing already, with some reservations.

any suggestions and thoughts about why d3 fell while i added these d3 supplements ?

coloCan
Posts: 1845
Joined: Oct 2009

manufactured,etc? Ive often wondered how reliable the dosage and ingredients listed on labels are, where the ingredients actully come from, how reliable, etc......

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

purchased from top quality vitamin shop, not over net or in supermarket.
maybe i will goto the d3 drops.

same pills the who;e 3 weeks

tanstaafl's picture
tanstaafl
Posts: 959
Joined: Oct 2010

Chemo or increases in inflammation (including other illness) can substantially reduce D3 levels. We track inflammation with ESR, others may use CRP or another test.

Of course, the are changes in sun exposure quality, diet, and test scatter, too. Same lab?

Re: Quality assurance question above, I doubt anyone intentionally cheats on vitamin D content. The wholesale cost of vitamin D3 content in a 50,000 iu cap is something under 1/2 cent per cap.

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

thanks tanstaafl and colocan

this d3 stuff is really important to my regime, ok i meditate and jiucer and exercise,
none offer 75% odds i like with d3, my naturopaths are actively solving this while my onc focuses on chemo

different lab used

cannot pick big change sun or diet, will obviously try to get more.

i was expecting some improvement inn d3 level, its a good real life example i am going to eat more oil fish and do the whole nude bathing thing, a beach is at my backyard. i actually live in paradise with a sandy beach on the bay, i'll get my 30 min in midday sun each day for next week and up dose to 10000 a day.

next chemo and vita d test only 6 days

thanks heaps pete

coloCan
Posts: 1845
Joined: Oct 2009

esciencenews.com/topics/health.medicine

"higher vitamin D intake reduced cancer risk"

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

i hope everyone who desires high vitamin d levels can achieve them

cheers

pete

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

hi graci,

I will try and chew the next fews days doses, I hope your right and they don't taste bad.

i will go the liquid and let the family finish off the d3 remaining pills.
I am so frustrated that my first naturopath sold me a heaps of the d3 pills and they made no difference. I am seeing naturopath number 4 in a few days , naturopath 2 and 3 were also interesting, trying to decide on the best. all my naturopathic balls are up in the air.

I am curious where they will land. effective d3 advice I see as crucial. none coming so far from any face to face meetings, only this forum and my own research. just bloody dissappointing to be honest.

thanks,
Pete

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

hi graci,

I will try and chew the next fews days doses, I hope your right and they don't taste bad.

i will go the liquid and let the family finish off the d3 remaining pills.
I am so frustrated that my first naturopath sold me a heaps of the d3 pills and they made no difference. I am seeing naturopath number 4 in a few days , naturopath 2 and 3 were also interesting, trying to decide on the best. all my naturopathic balls are up in the air.

I am curious where they will land. effective d3 advice I see as crucial. none coming so far from any face to face meetings, only this forum and my own research. just bloody dissappointing to be honest.

thanks,
Pete

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

hi graci,

I will try and chew the next fews days doses, I hope your right and they don't taste bad.

i will go the liquid and let the family finish off the d3 remaining pills.
I am so frustrated that my first naturopath sold me a heaps of the d3 pills and they made no difference. I am seeing naturopath number 4 in a few days , naturopath 2 and 3 were also interesting, trying to decide on the best. all my naturopathic balls are up in the air.

I am curious where they will land. effective d3 advice I see as crucial. none coming so far from any face to face meetings, only this forum and my own research. just bloody dissappointing to be honest.

thanks,
Pete

mommyof2kds's picture
mommyof2kds
Posts: 522
Joined: Mar 2009

my doc checked my vit D when I was diangnosed and it was very low, I have been taking supplements ever since..

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

hope its ok to ask ?

what dosage did you try ?
whats your current level ?

just interested in comparing.

Pete

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

hope its ok to ask ?

what dosage did you try ?
whats your current level ?

just interested in comparing.

Pete

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

I really appreciate your comments as always.

I just find being healthy ain't that easy, we've got to be experts on everything and when you relax and have faith in some adviser you get scre!!!!.

Pete

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