CSN Login
Members Online: 5

Is GOD the blame?

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

Lightning hit a house the other day and the news paper reported it as an act of God. Earth quake hits somewhere and it too is called and act of God. Just about all the major insurance companies now have a Claus stating (an act of God).

What do you think? When something goes wrong why is GOD always the blame.

Marcia527's picture
Marcia527
Posts: 2731
Joined: Jul 2006

I believe it's a way for the insurance companies to get out of paying. 'Act of God' means natural occurrence which no one can be held responsible. Insurance companies won't pay for earthquake or flood damage unless you pay more for a policy. Just a term they use. They really don't blame God.

Lightning can be prevented by lightning rods which Ben Franklin invented.

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

A few years ago when Hurricane Katrina and Rata hit the Gulf Cost States there was hardly anything left standing and insurance companies were tell the people that there damage was caused by a flood not hurricane and so they refused to pay.

They must be trained very well; I was standing on the same cement slap where a house once stood and debris all around and could not tell what was flood or what was hurricane damage.

DennisR
Posts: 148
Joined: Sep 2009

I agree Hondo,
I don't know why we blame God when we all know it's all George Bush's fault.
Joking aside, Hondo..I don't believe the Media have much of a command of the English language anymore, nor do they bother to research anything before they print it. My Insurance policies refer to certain Acts of Nature, but I can't find God listed anywhere in there. I guess God is just easier to spell for some reporters.

I saw a joke the other day....seems a guy got into a car accident and called 911 reporting that a woman was seriously hurt and needed an ambulance right away at 1st and Eucalyptus Street.
The 911 operator asked him to please spell "Eucalyptus"...the man hesitated for a few minutes..then said never mind, just send the ambulance to 1st and Oak street...I'll drag her over there.

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

I do believe you are correct that the Media has a lot to do with it.

At work I always would tell the secretary to make me a Xerox of this paper, she would look at me and ask do you want me to make a copy; I would say Yes Xerox it. That is how easy it is for a trademark for a photocopying process to get lost in the meaning of words.

Thanks for your post

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

Certainly the media does not help things but "Act of God" has been around for a VERY long time. It is interesting how certain brands have taken over verbs and nouns in our language. Like XEROX and Google. Remember the old Mimeograph machines? That was too hard to say so man invented xerox!

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

I've heard it before but it's a good one!
Thanks for the chuckle

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

In general it's a method developed to explain natural events and so they can refuse to take responsibility or so they can excuse themselves from liability.

I think that the statement is just a cop-out. I do not blame God at all for anything but that is mainly because I am not a firm believer in the existence of God so it would make absolutely no sense in blaming him anymore than it would blaming the Easter Bunny for something. I do use "Thank God" at times but I do not use it in the literal sense, it's a phrase that's worked itself into our vocabulary that is usually not to be taken literally (IMO).

I have never had anyone say this to me nor do I personally know people who think this way, but I have read on the cancer site where people believe that so-and-so got cancer because they are not good (fill in the blank with any religion) or because they do not pray enough or the right way or some other bizarre reason that again puts blame on God. Similarly when doctors or other people do good, I do not think the credit should always just go to God anymore than to the Easter Bunny. The doctors did have something to do with the outcome.

(Many)People are compelled to create something that can not be held accountable or proven to explain things that "just happen because stuff happens". Mankind has been doing this since the dawn of time. We strive for answers.

Also, I think people would take offense if it was called "An Act of Satan" but to me it makes as much sense.

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

It sounds ok to me but like you said people would tend to get more offensive to it then just saying God did it.

I do agree with you point, a way of explaining something that just happens

soccerfreaks's picture
soccerfreaks
Posts: 2801
Joined: Sep 2006

If he or she is going to get the credit for touchdowns and winning the lottery, why shouldn't he or she get the blame for lightning? (Lightning rods notwithstanding :)).

Take care,

Joe

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

I have heard of this before, believe it or not you might be more correct then you think. The Bible does not give us any aspect of Gods gender just that Man and Women were created in the Image of God. Sometimes words are used as a metaphor of something that we don’t understand as it is hard to understand something with out a common frame of reference.

Thanks for your post

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

OK, so I stole an old Ad campaign from Canon Camera. Isn't it more factual that Jesus, being from the middle east was more Arabic looking in his features that a white guy with nice long brown hair. We tend to create images that we can relate to. I think if a more historically correct image of Christ was discovered, people would do a double take.

I can not speak from a deep personal reference point since I have not read the bible, only parts of it but I have found that it is filled with metaphors. I know it's been interpreted as being factual, this is just my opinion on it.

Good post Hondo, thanks for starting a new thread here.

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

Most people tend to see God in there own image; I see no problems with that as the Bible does not say much about it. Maybe because God is all colors and a small aspect or characteristic of God is found in all the nations on the Earth, thus making each one different but yet one. Goes back to what Joe was saying He/She both one in God

I believe that Hollywood has done great damage in its Jesus impersonation of some tall good looking guy with long blond or dark brown hair. All someone needs to do is go to the history books and see what Jews looked like a few thousand years ago or just read Isaiah 53:2 there was no beauty that we should desire him; he was just a normal looking everyday guy.

It does make you think

Marcia527's picture
Marcia527
Posts: 2731
Joined: Jul 2006

Yes, and someone made the point that when in the garden Judas had to kiss Jesus in order for the soldiers to know which person he was. He was a normal looking guy. Even the church I grew up in had pictures of Jesus with long brown hair. They didn't believe guys should have long hair so not sure why they favored that picture.

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

Good point I missed that one about Judas having to kiss Jesus, there were 12 men standing in the garden and they all looked alike.

Thanks for you post

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

The image thing with Jesus seemed so strange during the 60's-70's. He would have appeared to be a hippie, someone that many people who were not hippies during that time frowned upon. Very anti-establishment which is also something Jesus was. Certainly during other periods of time long hair was in.
I'm not sure that most people see God in there own image though Hondo. Like you said, Hollywood has done a great disservice to that image. One thinks more of the Charlton Heston type I think.

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

I am sure if Mickey Rooney played the part of Charlton Heston in the Tem Commandment that no one would have liked it as much. Maybe that was the problem the old Jewish rabbi’s had, Jesus did not look like what they believe he should have looked like, so they X-ed him.

Then the question is if he was the son of God why did he not stop them, the answer to that question is in understanding the prophecies about His mission.

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

I don't think he could have pulled it off. I will say I loved Mel Brooks version of Moses with the Ten Commandments from the History of the World Part 1

Did you see that? He gets called to the mountain and is returning with 3 tablets and starts to say to the crowd "I give to you the 15 (then he drops one tablet) the 10 commandments". Sometimes I wonder if another 5 would not have been such a bad idea ;-)

Buzzard's picture
Buzzard
Posts: 3073
Joined: Aug 2008

So does that mean the tooth fairy is out too ????

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

I don't believe it either, it's just a nasty rumor!

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

I would hope not, Jesus once said in vain they do worship me teaching for doctrines the commandments of men. I would hope no one tries to add any, we have a hard time just keeping Ten

DennisR
Posts: 148
Joined: Sep 2009

Hondo,
Religious people tend to believe that the Bible, in spite of all of it's various interpretations, is the infallible last word in all matters and represents the infinite Will and Wisdom of the Lord for all of Mankind....it is WE who are not infallible and it's our interpretations and metaphors that seem to come into conflict more often than not.
Non Believers tend to bring the same interpretations and metaphors to the table as believers, but in an opposing point of view.
Non Believers ask, "If there IS a God....why doesn't He come down here and Prove it to ME", Believers say, "He Has, you just refuse to accept it".
For me, I guess, IF God does indeed strike a little Lightening once in a while to prove a point..the last thing I want is for Him to come down and prove it to ME.

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

I agree the infallibility is in His Word from cover to cover. Our problem is that preachers and religious leader want to tell there congregation what the Bible means. I heard a preachers saying that you can’t understand the book of Revelation but yet the very word itself mean a Revealing. God wants to make known to us what is coming upon this would so that when we see it coming we will have faith in Him. I find that the Bible does a very good job of explaining itself with our any man made interpretation or metaphors.

Like you said if God did want to through a little lighting I sure don’t want to get in the way

Very good point my friend

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

Some Non-Believers just don't believe it and do not need proof of anything. Just like a believer can not be swayed by "proof" the same holds true the other way I think. If one does not believe it is sometimes just that simple.

It really comes down to two schools of thought that believe what they believe and that is that. Of course, there are always exceptions to every statement...

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

It is better interpreted as Freedom choice of I would think

Good point

mariam_11_09's picture
mariam_11_09
Posts: 693
Joined: Nov 2009

Most Qu'ran's or at least those that are translated into English indicate in the introduction that 'each generation must translate the Qu'ran in the light of it's own experience and knowledge'.

While we can discuss interpretations of the Qu'ran or the Bible do we have the right to make another right or wrong for his or her interpretations of these scriptures?

I do find it is something deeply personal especially when the translation is based in part on ones own personal experience with God. It really encourages one to seek ones own experience with God rather than be told what it 'should' be.

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

"Most Qu'ran's or at least those that are translated into English indicate in the introduction that 'each generation must translate the Qu'ran in the light of it's own experience and knowledge'."

That's so great. I think that texts that were written thousands of years ago do not hold the same relevance in today's world at all. Some of it does, but much of it does not (IMO)

"While we can discuss interpretations of the Qu'ran or the Bible do we have the right to make another right or wrong for his or her interpretations of these scriptures?"
I think that things that are open to interpretation are just waiting for conflicting views to happen. That's possibly why I tend to look toward science for my answers to things that others find in their "holy" books.

"I do find it is something deeply personal especially when the translation is based in part on ones own personal experience with God. It really encourages one to seek ones own experience with God rather than be told what it 'should' be."
I think it's FANTASTIC!
-p

lcarper2
Posts: 638
Joined: Dec 2009

That referrs to something mortal man has no control over . We can't prevent herricanes or lightening it doesn't mean God did it.It is just another way to mess with our heads...God doesn't do bad things to us. Satan gave us cancer God heals us...I for one am glad I believe in the healing powers of my God...

soccerfreaks's picture
soccerfreaks
Posts: 2801
Joined: Sep 2006

Explain Abraham. Explain Job. Or did you not get to those stories in your obviously copious study of the bible?

If you would actually read the bible, you would notice that, beginning at the very beginning, god does bad things to EVERYBODY. Not so you would notice, of course, if you didn't choose to actually read the bible.

Geez.

lcarper2
Posts: 638
Joined: Dec 2009

well I do read the bible and john 3:16 says it all. In the old testament God did bad things but in the new testament after the cross became empty he doesn't have to do bad things to us we do them our selves through sin...and I will never believe that God gives anyone cancer he allows us to get it.

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

Sometimes you can’t read you need to study the subject, God did not cause any evil or harm to Job. Satan accused God of building a hedge around Job and that was the only reason why Job served God. To prove the point God allowed Satan to afflict Job only to prove that God knew his servant Job better then Satan.

dasspears
Posts: 233
Joined: Feb 2009

Granted, we cannot prevent them but as acts of nature, and if you believe in God then you know that he created All. Lightning and hurricanes are not bad in the scheme of things. There are a part of nature, which God created. With the bad comes the good and vice versa and God creates all - or he doesn't. Pretty simple, actually.

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

Just a wild guess!
;-)

Marcia527's picture
Marcia527
Posts: 2731
Joined: Jul 2006

Phil you're a hoot! Maybe Ben Franklin invented lightning so he could invent the lightning rod and sell a bunch! You all know I'm just kidding!

RE's picture
RE
Posts: 4606
Joined: Feb 2004

To me the phrase is used far too flippantly, so much so that should something truly be An Act of God we probably would not realize it. I do not believe God or Satan gave me cancer, Epilepsy (good thing I live now and not when they thought Epileptics were witches or demon possessed)Lyphedema or any of the other things that are not so pleasant about me (yes there are plenty of other unpleasant things about me). I tend to think it is what it is and we just need to deal with it, we all have our crosses to bear so to speak.

RE

Emilyfimily's picture
Emilyfimily
Posts: 141
Joined: Jan 2010

I don't believe God *makes* bad things happen, but I believe God *allows* them to happen when He knows it will teach us something or make us stronger or help something good happen along the way that's in His big master plan - even if the good thing that happens because of it's not necessarily to us, but maybe to someone else. I believe He cries along with us when we're hurting, and probably wishes we'd have more faith in Him that he's allowing this stuff to happen for a reason, and whatever reason that is is probably way more important than me whining about blowing chunks on my toilet every 3 weeks. So I try to think of it that way. I don't know why God allowed cancer to attack me, but I do know that I'm learning a lot about myself through cancer, I'm learning to be tough as nails, I'm learning what's really important, and I'm learning how many people love and support me. And my husband and I were already super close, but it's becoming so much deeper in a way I can't even put into words. Etcetera.

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

Are you familiar with Joseph Campbell at all? He did a TV show on PBS with Bill Moyers called "The Power of Myth". They rerun it sometimes plus it's out in book form too. He talks about many different faiths and the universal themes that run through them. It's very good in my opinion.

I consider myself an agnostic but I relate the closest to the Native American outlook on life I feel. We are lucky to have Nature and Mother Earth but what we mostly do is abuse her. The didn't waste like we do. Yes, they fought amongst other groups. They ARE human after all. I wonder how many of their wars were based on a difference in faith and how many were just over greed.

Sounds like a challenging upbringing. I just had to deal with Nuns.
I enjoy your posts Gracie.
-phil

mariam_11_09's picture
mariam_11_09
Posts: 693
Joined: Nov 2009

Seems to be an awful amount of duality here, good and bad, right and wrong .... what if there is no right or wrong or good or bad and nothing to blame? Why does anything need to be blamed for what happens? Isn't it just the nature of reality and God is reality?

If we say something is bad then we experience it in an unpleasant way. Similarly if we say something is good then it alters our experience of it. However if we do not label something as good or bad then our experience of it is not altered and we have a very naked experience, we experience reality more fully hence we experience God more fully.

Marcia527's picture
Marcia527
Posts: 2731
Joined: Jul 2006

I think I understand what mariam is saying. Sometimes we 'label' things right or wrong or good or bad when it depends on where you are standing and experiences in life. The same issue could be labeled both ways. Sometimes you change your mind also after learning more. Everything isn't black or white. There is a lot of shades of gray.

dasspears
Posts: 233
Joined: Feb 2009

the earthquake and the lightning? If it's an act of nature, who created nature. It seems as though it all goes back to one source. I don't think it's necessarily good or bad - it is what it is. I don't think lightning striking an object or an earthquake occurring is bad. Had it not been for lightning, electricity would not have been discovered. Insurance is a totally different issue. I love a good lightning storm - it reminds me of how wonderful the earth is.

Marcia527's picture
Marcia527
Posts: 2731
Joined: Jul 2006

I read or got it in my head somewhere that lightning cleans the air with the static charge. Sometimes it just gets out of hand and hits down and we get in the way.

I thought earthquakes were just the surface moving (the plates). What would happen if they didn't? I'll have to see if I can find that out.

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

I think we as Humans tend to blame God out of convenience or just lack of understanding the reason why something happens. Rather then trying to investigate the matter most of the time it is cheaper to just say it was an act of God.

Dasspears: you raise something very interesting to me, loving to be in a good lightning storm. I am an old Seaman I have sailed for many years, I have road out many hurricanes in the open water with the swells above 45ft. I have always been amazed by the force of the Sea, I can’t understand why I love it so much, there is just something about the oceans and the waves that are mystifying to me.

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

One could also say that man created God "out of convenience or just lack of understanding the reason why something happens".

Just my point of view, I certainly do not expect everyone to agree with me...

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

The only way to really know is to die, and I am not ready for that just yet. I am sure that one day we will know so for now just will me one of your Guitars in case you go before me and Ill remember you every time I play it. Just joking Phill

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
Posts: 4659
Joined: May 2005

Just promise me you won't play Kumbaya!

All these questions in life, about life, etc.
I feel if I live a good honest life and try to help others then I will be OK whatever happens.

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

No Kumbaya it will be hard but OK….. lol

Marcia527's picture
Marcia527
Posts: 2731
Joined: Jul 2006

How about Spirit In The Sky? That is a great song!

I could listen to that song every morning! What a sound!

Hondo's picture
Hondo
Posts: 5635
Joined: Apr 2009

Recorded by Norman Greenbaun back in 1969, now that was the days, I was a long haired hippy back then. Thanks for the memory

Subscribe with RSS
About Cancer Society

The content on this site is for informational purposes only. It is not a substitute for professional medical advice. Do not use this information to diagnose or treat a health problem or disease without consulting with a qualified healthcare provider. Please consult your healthcare provider with any questions or concerns you may have regarding your condition. Use of this online service is subject to the disclaimer and the terms and conditions.

Copyright 2000-2014 © Cancer Survivors Network