M. D. Anderson Cancer Center transcript

John23
John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member
edited November 2011 in Colorectal Cancer #1
M. D. Anderson Cancer Center transcript

Traditional Chinese Medicine and Cancer Treatment
M. D. Anderson Cancer Center


Also:
(BIG file - 6meg download)
Herbs Therapy in Pancreatic Cancer

Be Well.

John

Comments

  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900 Member
    simply fantastic
    hi john,

    md offer all these, the only one i have not done yet is pilates.
    i did chi gong

    theay said
    "Yes, many. From yoga, Tai Chi, Chi Gong, Pilates, many movement based programs."

    This type of validates my decision about these treatment options. I would not even describe them as complementary or alternative becuase they are offered directly out of hospitals here and the us.

    hugs,
    pete
  • PhillieG
    PhillieG Member Posts: 4,866 Member
    Great!
    Thanks for posting this John. It's nice to see some more info about TCM
  • laurettas
    laurettas Member Posts: 372
    Thesis statement
    "I just want to say in general when we use Chinese medicine in China, we all face difficult cancer... always as adjuvant therapy most likely, because they can really reduce the symptoms from chemotherapy... so I would hope the Chinese medicine will eventually actually play the same role here as well for the patient benefit."
  • lisa42
    lisa42 Member Posts: 3,625 Member
    interesting
    Thanks- this was interesting!
    Although I have been seeing a naturopathic dr., I also have an appt in another week and a half with a TCM specialist, to kind of compare what he would want to do with what the naturopathic has me taking. My big issue is that I've been having a hard time with needing to swallow so many pills/capsules lately. My throat constricts and it hurts- I'm swallowing 25-30 supplement pills at times. I didn't take any yesterday to avoid that constricting problem & so I didn't take what I should be taking. I know the TCM uses teas and other liquids- thinking these might go down easier.

    Lisa
  • tanstaafl
    tanstaafl Member Posts: 1,313 Member
    lisa42 said:

    interesting
    Thanks- this was interesting!
    Although I have been seeing a naturopathic dr., I also have an appt in another week and a half with a TCM specialist, to kind of compare what he would want to do with what the naturopathic has me taking. My big issue is that I've been having a hard time with needing to swallow so many pills/capsules lately. My throat constricts and it hurts- I'm swallowing 25-30 supplement pills at times. I didn't take any yesterday to avoid that constricting problem & so I didn't take what I should be taking. I know the TCM uses teas and other liquids- thinking these might go down easier.

    Lisa

    shake
    A healthy version protein shake or smoothie is the way to go for the pills that aren't too foul tasting or absoltuely need to be on an empty stomach. We make our shakes from powder 32 oz at a shot, chilled, 16 oz a day. Much larger, pleasant doses with flavoring and fruit extract powders and stevia are possible this way.
  • John23
    John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member
    lisa42 said:

    interesting
    Thanks- this was interesting!
    Although I have been seeing a naturopathic dr., I also have an appt in another week and a half with a TCM specialist, to kind of compare what he would want to do with what the naturopathic has me taking. My big issue is that I've been having a hard time with needing to swallow so many pills/capsules lately. My throat constricts and it hurts- I'm swallowing 25-30 supplement pills at times. I didn't take any yesterday to avoid that constricting problem & so I didn't take what I should be taking. I know the TCM uses teas and other liquids- thinking these might go down easier.

    Lisa

    Lisa -

    Different TCM practitioners use different methods and practices,
    just as western medicine physicians use different medicines and
    practices. And just like we "shop around" for a qualified WM
    physician, we should not limit ourselves to the opinion of one
    TCM physician, either.

    That said..... In TCM, the herbal broths and/or treatments
    do not continue on forever, they are used until the problem
    is resolved.

    The TCM physician we use, does not believe in vitamin or
    mineral "supplements". He writes the prescription, and his
    pharmacist fills it drawing from the 300+ herbs they have
    in stock.

    Personally, I can understand the need to take a specific "supplement",
    if the body is totally unable to absorb that specific vitamin or
    mineral element naturally.... However, if that is the situation, taking
    the supplement orally will not get it into the blood stream if the
    body is unable to absorb via digestion. So why do it?

    (My colon is gone, as well as at least half of my small intestine,
    and they said that my body will no longer absorb magnesium
    or B-12. I add the magnesium to the IV hydration fluid. But
    after seeing my last CBC and the normal amount of B-12, I do
    not see any reason to add that to the hydration as they instructed.

    In fact, since my magnesium is almost normal without taking
    IV magnesium, I may eventually eliminate it from the IV fluid
    and eat more foods containing it instead).

    The TCM herbal broths can taste terrible, and some will
    gag a maggot, but it's not forever. The broths are usually taken
    three times daily, and the prescription changes as your health
    changes.

    The money you save by not buying all those supplements may
    be enough to pay for your complete TCM treatment.

    My last visit for TCM treatment was some months back. I had
    what was diagnosed by my WM GP as DVT behind my left knee.
    They wanted to give me blood thinners and set up an appointment
    to have an "umbrella" installed in the main return from the leg to the
    Heart, telling me that if I did not do that ASAP, I could die from
    a "PE" when the clot gets into the lung.

    My TCM prescribed a broth that dissolved clots, and within
    two days the pain and swelling was gone - so was the clot.
    And again, my WM physicians feel that I am just lucky.
    Lucky to be alive since 2006 with a dx of cc4, without ever
    taking the absolutely required chemo; lucky to have kidney
    stones magically disappear, lucky to have my AF a thing of
    the past without surgery or meds, lucky to have a DVT seem
    to evaporate into thin air?

    I met an awful lot of other very, very "lucky" individuals over
    the years we've visited the TCM's office for conditions and
    check-ups.

    What a bunch of lucky individuals!

    You'll do OK Lisa. Read the "blog" for what to expect on the
    first visit, and what to look for in a TCM practitioner.

    It's a difference science using very different terms and expressions.

    Let me know how you do, of if you need any info.

    Best wishes!

    John
  • lisa42
    lisa42 Member Posts: 3,625 Member
    John23 said:

    Lisa -

    Different TCM practitioners use different methods and practices,
    just as western medicine physicians use different medicines and
    practices. And just like we "shop around" for a qualified WM
    physician, we should not limit ourselves to the opinion of one
    TCM physician, either.

    That said..... In TCM, the herbal broths and/or treatments
    do not continue on forever, they are used until the problem
    is resolved.

    The TCM physician we use, does not believe in vitamin or
    mineral "supplements". He writes the prescription, and his
    pharmacist fills it drawing from the 300+ herbs they have
    in stock.

    Personally, I can understand the need to take a specific "supplement",
    if the body is totally unable to absorb that specific vitamin or
    mineral element naturally.... However, if that is the situation, taking
    the supplement orally will not get it into the blood stream if the
    body is unable to absorb via digestion. So why do it?

    (My colon is gone, as well as at least half of my small intestine,
    and they said that my body will no longer absorb magnesium
    or B-12. I add the magnesium to the IV hydration fluid. But
    after seeing my last CBC and the normal amount of B-12, I do
    not see any reason to add that to the hydration as they instructed.

    In fact, since my magnesium is almost normal without taking
    IV magnesium, I may eventually eliminate it from the IV fluid
    and eat more foods containing it instead).

    The TCM herbal broths can taste terrible, and some will
    gag a maggot, but it's not forever. The broths are usually taken
    three times daily, and the prescription changes as your health
    changes.

    The money you save by not buying all those supplements may
    be enough to pay for your complete TCM treatment.

    My last visit for TCM treatment was some months back. I had
    what was diagnosed by my WM GP as DVT behind my left knee.
    They wanted to give me blood thinners and set up an appointment
    to have an "umbrella" installed in the main return from the leg to the
    Heart, telling me that if I did not do that ASAP, I could die from
    a "PE" when the clot gets into the lung.

    My TCM prescribed a broth that dissolved clots, and within
    two days the pain and swelling was gone - so was the clot.
    And again, my WM physicians feel that I am just lucky.
    Lucky to be alive since 2006 with a dx of cc4, without ever
    taking the absolutely required chemo; lucky to have kidney
    stones magically disappear, lucky to have my AF a thing of
    the past without surgery or meds, lucky to have a DVT seem
    to evaporate into thin air?

    I met an awful lot of other very, very "lucky" individuals over
    the years we've visited the TCM's office for conditions and
    check-ups.

    What a bunch of lucky individuals!

    You'll do OK Lisa. Read the "blog" for what to expect on the
    first visit, and what to look for in a TCM practitioner.

    It's a difference science using very different terms and expressions.

    Let me know how you do, of if you need any info.

    Best wishes!

    John

    Thanks John
    Thanks for the thorough reply- it is helpful to me to know what to expect. It still really baffles me how those western med drs just blow off your continued good results through TCM to just "good luck". If I were a doctor and saw patients getting well from other ways than how I was treating them, you bet I'd look into it and find out more about what they were doing. I just don't get the "bury your head in the sand" approach that so many of them still seem to take.

    I'll let you know how my visit at the TCM office goes after I have my appointment.

    Lisa
  • tanstaafl
    tanstaafl Member Posts: 1,313 Member
    lisa42 said:

    Thanks John
    Thanks for the thorough reply- it is helpful to me to know what to expect. It still really baffles me how those western med drs just blow off your continued good results through TCM to just "good luck". If I were a doctor and saw patients getting well from other ways than how I was treating them, you bet I'd look into it and find out more about what they were doing. I just don't get the "bury your head in the sand" approach that so many of them still seem to take.

    I'll let you know how my visit at the TCM office goes after I have my appointment.

    Lisa

    ebm
    It's about "Evidence Based Medicine", or at least a perversion of it. To the less talented, informed or uninfluenced doctors, John is "just an anecdote". They want "proof", in the form multiple randomized, controlled tests (RCT), published in a pharm rag, and blessed by NCI, FDA, ASCO, and at least one pharmaceutical sponsor.

    Papers preferably presented in a 5 star hotel or on a cruise at 44 knots, between the filet mignon washed down by a Bordeaux with an Appellation d'Origine Contrôlée (AOC), and white wines, AOC or mit Prädikat, with lots of eye candy, and a nice financial hook.
  • John23
    John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member
    lisa42 said:

    Thanks John
    Thanks for the thorough reply- it is helpful to me to know what to expect. It still really baffles me how those western med drs just blow off your continued good results through TCM to just "good luck". If I were a doctor and saw patients getting well from other ways than how I was treating them, you bet I'd look into it and find out more about what they were doing. I just don't get the "bury your head in the sand" approach that so many of them still seem to take.

    I'll let you know how my visit at the TCM office goes after I have my appointment.

    Lisa

    Lisa -

    Just to let you know that all of life isn't terrible....

    There are several (more than several, actually) local WM physicians
    that have been treated for various illnesses by our TCM practitioner.

    My wife's Neurologist's asthma was cured by our TCM doc.
    He was amazed, and had recently employed an acupuncturist
    at his office to help treat difficult cases. For herbal treatments,
    he sends the patient to our TCM practitioner.

    From my understanding from other sources, there are two
    local oncologists that send late term patients, and/or patients
    that are not responding to chemo, to our TCM doc.

    So don't feel that all WM physicians are against other alternatives,
    many, many are turning to the alternatives (TCM) out of sheer
    disappointment of the industry's lack of progress.

    Let's face it... if the source of revenue is still high from products
    they've already invested in, why change?

    If and when people stop reinforcing the industry's hype by
    contributing to their cause, perhaps we'll see some improvement.

    Personally, I'd rather die than run a marathon to give more money
    to the CEOs that only spend it in the Bahamas...

    Best wishes.....

    John


    OH.....by the way Lisa....
    If your first impression with the TCM doc, is that the examination
    is akin to a WM doc's, walk in another direction.

    Do not be afraid to "shop around".
  • plh4gail
    plh4gail Member Posts: 1,238 Member
    Thank you John :)
    Love, Gail

    Thank you John :)

    Love, Gail