Five a day does not ward off cancer?
10 hours 51 mins ago
Research on almost 500,000 people found eating five portions of fruit and vegetables a day (about 400g) had little effect on cancer risk, as did eating more or fewer portions.
While there is evidence of a "small" protective effect of fruit and vegetables, the chance that a reduced risk could be caused by something else cannot be ruled out, the researchers said.
Experts analysed data from 23 centres in ten European countries who were part of the European Prospective Investigation into Cancer and Nutrition (EPIC). In the UK, centres at Cambridge and Oxford were included in the study, which looked at cancer risk between 1992 and 2000.
People's daily consumption of fruit, vegetables and fruit and vegetables combined was analysed and matched against data on the number of cancers. The results showed that regardless of which group people were in, if everyone ate an extra 200g of fruit and vegetables a day, the overall reduced risk of cancer was 3 per cent.
The findings contradict a 1997 report from the World Cancer Research Fund which said there was "convincing evidence" of a protective effect against respiratory and digestive cancers from eating large amounts of fruit and vegetables
Hehe be interesting to know what Phil, John, Emily etc think of this
Comments
-
Sonia
I'd turn this around and look at it another way.
While fruits and veggies might not prevent colon cancer, we KNOW that red meats, high dietary fats and sugars DO INCREASE the risk and risk of recurrence by huge amounts (some say 33%).Colon cancer patients who eat a diet high in red meat, fatty products, refined grains, and desserts -- a so-called "Western diet" -- may be increasing their chance of disease relapse and early death, report researchers at Dana-Farber Cancer Institute.
0 -
What do -I- Think?
It's a great lesson in semantics, and the continuing saga of
"how to fool the masses with hype".
(Or, "The Emperor has new clothes")
Please allow me to elucidate:
If you do Chemotherapy and it fails, they say:
"you put up a good fight" and "you did all there was to do".
If you do -anything- else and it fails, they say:
"you should not have fooled around with things that are not proven".
If you do Chemotherapy and live, they say:
"you owe it -all- to the chemotherapy regime", and "it has proven itself once again".
If you do -anything- else and live, they say:
"you are very, very lucky to be here", and "it's not too late to do chemotherapy too".
It's big business at it's multi-billion dollar finest. They are committed to
sell you what they have, and refuse to provide information for any other
possible therapy.
Then...... when you're sufficiently beaten into the turf, and there's nothing
else they can offer you, they will tell you about all the "tests" that are being
provided by the very same multi-billion dollar companies that have provided
the chemicals that have failed you....
What they also will tell you (if you pressure them enough), is that:
1. Chemotherapy is not guaranteed to work.
2. Chemotherapy can and does cause second cancers.
3. Chemotherapy leaves your body too weak to fight off other illnesses (including cancer).
4. Chemotherapy generally has less than a 10% chance of getting rid of all your cancer cells.
I have had too, too many family, friends, and associates die of cancer after
long sicknesses due to their "treatments". Their battle wasn't with cancer, their
battle was with the toxic chemicals that caused tremendous strain on their systems.
There are other viable ways to fight cancer; chemotherapy is not "the only way".
For any physician that has taken the Hippocratic Oath to disregard everything
else that is available, and provide to patients only what is providing great revenue,
is disingenuous at best, and an outright failure of the system at the least.
That - is my opinion.0 -
Oops...
I went a bit off topic, and addressed only the first two paragraphs
of your post!
Regardless of diet, or general conditions of life, people get cancer.
Cave men had cancer, aristocrats had cancer, the weak, poor and
degenerate had cancer, as well as the famous celebrities.
All cancer is, is a normal cell that has lost it's ability to receive
communication from the brain and body.
For whatever reason that causes our immune system to ignore
that damaged cell's continuing survival by the fermentation process,
is the real problem, not what we eat or how we live.
Damaged cells occur in every living form of life, and normally the
immune system purges it from it's host, just as it does any other
thing that does not "belong" in the host. But the damaged cell
is in every other form, the same as it's surrounding cells; a colon
cancer cell looks like a cell from the colon; liver cancer cells
look like liver cells. Perhaps that is the problem with our
immune system not being totally cognizant that the cancer
cell no longer belongs inside us...?
But the overly conscientious concern regarding diet and lifestyle
matters little in the total scheme of things; there will always be
something that causes a cell to die, and the cell will always
try to continue to live by whatever process it can.
If we want to see cancer "cured", we should be donating and
encouraging the industry to explore ways to get our own immune
system to fight this dreaded disease - - not by inventing more
toxic chemicals in attempt to do what mother nature should be doing.
(Cancer vaccine)
(Trovax)0 -
Hi JohnJohn23 said:What do -I- Think?
It's a great lesson in semantics, and the continuing saga of
"how to fool the masses with hype".
(Or, "The Emperor has new clothes")
Please allow me to elucidate:
If you do Chemotherapy and it fails, they say:
"you put up a good fight" and "you did all there was to do".
If you do -anything- else and it fails, they say:
"you should not have fooled around with things that are not proven".
If you do Chemotherapy and live, they say:
"you owe it -all- to the chemotherapy regime", and "it has proven itself once again".
If you do -anything- else and live, they say:
"you are very, very lucky to be here", and "it's not too late to do chemotherapy too".
It's big business at it's multi-billion dollar finest. They are committed to
sell you what they have, and refuse to provide information for any other
possible therapy.
Then...... when you're sufficiently beaten into the turf, and there's nothing
else they can offer you, they will tell you about all the "tests" that are being
provided by the very same multi-billion dollar companies that have provided
the chemicals that have failed you....
What they also will tell you (if you pressure them enough), is that:
1. Chemotherapy is not guaranteed to work.
2. Chemotherapy can and does cause second cancers.
3. Chemotherapy leaves your body too weak to fight off other illnesses (including cancer).
4. Chemotherapy generally has less than a 10% chance of getting rid of all your cancer cells.
I have had too, too many family, friends, and associates die of cancer after
long sicknesses due to their "treatments". Their battle wasn't with cancer, their
battle was with the toxic chemicals that caused tremendous strain on their systems.
There are other viable ways to fight cancer; chemotherapy is not "the only way".
For any physician that has taken the Hippocratic Oath to disregard everything
else that is available, and provide to patients only what is providing great revenue,
is disingenuous at best, and an outright failure of the system at the least.
That - is my opinion.
So what EXACTLY is the solution that you say DOES work better than chemo? I know where you stand on western medicine and I know that you are a big proponent for TCM (and rightfully so) but I can not recall many times where you've posted just what exactly is the TCM approach to beating cancer. Could you put in examples like you did for why chemo is not good for you.
I know chemo/western medicine a big business and while TCM and Holistic are not nearly as big of a business, they are for-profit business too and from my experience the other week, they were looking for VERY much Prosperity for themselves.
Thanks
-phil0 -
Hi Sonia
While I think it's common sense that one should eat a good portion of fruits and veggies every day, I do not think that a diet of them will prevent cancer. I do think that the benefits of eating a diet as described were "understated" in this finding. While it may (or may not) help prevent cancer, overall it's just healthier for people regardless of having cancer or not.
I think moderation is underrated in all of these discussions. One can eat a diet of fruits and veggies that are not grown under good conditions and have it be not healthy for you at all. One the other hand, a diet with carefully raised cattle may provide you will healthier meat that do not have steroids and other drugs being injected into them to fatten them up sooner. Those may not cause any harm at all. Of course, too much meat is not healthy for people in general so this too falls under the part about eating a overall healthy diet.
Overall, I think that the 1997 article is closer to the truth.
-p
Nice to "see" you again Sonia!
;-)0 -
Cancer and the Immune SystemJohn23 said:Oops...
I went a bit off topic, and addressed only the first two paragraphs
of your post!
Regardless of diet, or general conditions of life, people get cancer.
Cave men had cancer, aristocrats had cancer, the weak, poor and
degenerate had cancer, as well as the famous celebrities.
All cancer is, is a normal cell that has lost it's ability to receive
communication from the brain and body.
For whatever reason that causes our immune system to ignore
that damaged cell's continuing survival by the fermentation process,
is the real problem, not what we eat or how we live.
Damaged cells occur in every living form of life, and normally the
immune system purges it from it's host, just as it does any other
thing that does not "belong" in the host. But the damaged cell
is in every other form, the same as it's surrounding cells; a colon
cancer cell looks like a cell from the colon; liver cancer cells
look like liver cells. Perhaps that is the problem with our
immune system not being totally cognizant that the cancer
cell no longer belongs inside us...?
But the overly conscientious concern regarding diet and lifestyle
matters little in the total scheme of things; there will always be
something that causes a cell to die, and the cell will always
try to continue to live by whatever process it can.
If we want to see cancer "cured", we should be donating and
encouraging the industry to explore ways to get our own immune
system to fight this dreaded disease - - not by inventing more
toxic chemicals in attempt to do what mother nature should be doing.
(Cancer vaccine)
(Trovax)
Wow, Phil
You are a mind reader! I was thinking the same thing this morning, but did not have a chance to post what you just posted...and just getting back to this.
John - it's known that you're approach is TCM. But as Phil eludes to, we have not seen any kind of TCM regimen that you've used or know about that breaks it down in detail, as many of us have done on the chemo and surgery side of the battle.
I'd like to see something like:
I took this herb @ Xmgs for a period of X and it equated to this. My side effects (if any) were this.
Or, I did this particular treatment and this is what happened to me.
That way if someone were interested to try that approach, they would have some examples to follow, that were proven by someone who did them.
When you talk in abstract or general terms, alot of folks won't be able to wrap their mind around that. Because when people are dealing with their lives, they are going to go to something in "western medicine" because they feel like that gives them the best shot at extending their lives.
To just say that TCM is the way and chemo is no good, is not the right approach. Without more information and background to refer to, folks are going to naturally shy away from this approach. They would just rather take their chances with something that is known to them. It's just basic Human Nature.
You've got a rare opportunity to enlighten all of us here with this forum - it's a big stage. I'd like to see more specifics on how the TCM battle can be won. The more specific information out there, the better that one could draw from that and make decisions on which path they feel is better for them.
I do agree that the war needs to be waged with the immune system in mind. And I agree that there is no rule for who gets cancer and who does not.
We've all seem examples of people, who eat red meat, eat fatty, sugary, and starchy foods, drink soda, drink alcohol, and smoke, and do not exercise and they might or might not get cancer.
I've also seen a very young woman, who never drank, smoked, did drugs, ate red meat, or anything bad for her. She raised her own organic vegetables and fruits, and drank only water and ended up with terminal lung cancer.
So, the age old war of diet vs getting cancer will go on long after I'm gone. It's as old as time itself. Does eating better and getting exercise help? Sure, anything we can do to be healthier definitely has a benefit.
What I think may be the even bigger questions is not that we get cancer, rather it's what we do after we get Cancer?
The real fight in my mind, would be how do we "turn off" those rogue cancer cells in our body once we've identified them without causing undue collateral damage to our internal organs and tissues. Cell receptors and what can 'enable or disable' them to do a specific routine sure appears to be a good line to draw in the sand.
Cells do go bad - how do we "turn them off" when they do if our immune system fails us, is the likely key to this fight.
In the meantime, there is WM and TCM for us to choose. You can help us be more informed if you could lay out some treatment regimen from what you've learned in your experience. Thanks in advance.
-Craig0 -
Don't eat 'em, JUICE 'em!
A measly 5 servings?? that ain't nuttin'! In one jar of my juice I have at LEAST 10 servings of veggies and 1 fruit and I get all that awesome nutrition in an easily assimilated way gaining all the benefits of the live enzymes.
That's what *I* think.
:-)
peace, emily0 -
Hi Phil !PhillieG said:Hi Sonia
While I think it's common sense that one should eat a good portion of fruits and veggies every day, I do not think that a diet of them will prevent cancer. I do think that the benefits of eating a diet as described were "understated" in this finding. While it may (or may not) help prevent cancer, overall it's just healthier for people regardless of having cancer or not.
I think moderation is underrated in all of these discussions. One can eat a diet of fruits and veggies that are not grown under good conditions and have it be not healthy for you at all. One the other hand, a diet with carefully raised cattle may provide you will healthier meat that do not have steroids and other drugs being injected into them to fatten them up sooner. Those may not cause any harm at all. Of course, too much meat is not healthy for people in general so this too falls under the part about eating a overall healthy diet.
Overall, I think that the 1997 article is closer to the truth.
-p
Nice to "see" you again Sonia!
;-)
Nice nostril shot, btw; no nose hair is a plus!)
Re:
"So what EXACTLY is the solution that you say DOES work better than chemo?"
There is no "exact solution", nor is there any "solution" at all, chemo or otherwise.
There -are- better routes, however. There are chemicals, herbs, and many
other substances, that manage to rid us of cancer cells, that do not have the
overwhelming toxic effect that present chemical therapy has.
Chemical or "chemotherapy" kills cancer cells, but at the disadvantage of
all other good cells. It comes with a degree of side effects that are often more
difficult to endure than the cancer itself. In many cases, it damages more
good cells, that it kills cancer cells.
For that reason alone Phil, any other substance that can remove cancer cells
has to be considered better.
There is no reason to use a nuclear bomb on your front lawn to remove a
patch of crabgrass....
When they can say unequivocally and totally unambiguously, that chemotherapy
kills cancer cells exclusively without causing harm to the body, I will support
it's use, and look forward to a treatment. When they can say that it will help
the immune system do the job it was intended to do, I will consider a treatment.
Until then Phil, it is not what they are saying it is; it can not do what they
suggest it can do; It's that nuclear bomb.
Yes, it can shrink a tumor; so can oxygen injections into the tumor,
microwaves injected into the tumor, or freezing solutions injected into
the tumor. All are better methods than chemo.
Yes, chemotherapy can kill cancer cells, but it just as often fails to kill
cancer cells, while still damaging good cells, and impairing healthy
immune systems.
I realize that cancer brings forth in us an overwhelming fear of dying, but too
many are allowing that fear to steer them away from things that will not do harm,
and into the arms of things that will do harm; irreparable harm, in some cases.
There is no guarantee implied or ever given, with chemotherapy;
There is no guarantee implied or ever given, with any other method, either.
We should take the time and sanity to choose what we feel is best,
and do so without the fear mongering of the corporate giants.
There -are- other ways.0 -
Craig -Sundanceh said:Cancer and the Immune System
Wow, Phil
You are a mind reader! I was thinking the same thing this morning, but did not have a chance to post what you just posted...and just getting back to this.
John - it's known that you're approach is TCM. But as Phil eludes to, we have not seen any kind of TCM regimen that you've used or know about that breaks it down in detail, as many of us have done on the chemo and surgery side of the battle.
I'd like to see something like:
I took this herb @ Xmgs for a period of X and it equated to this. My side effects (if any) were this.
Or, I did this particular treatment and this is what happened to me.
That way if someone were interested to try that approach, they would have some examples to follow, that were proven by someone who did them.
When you talk in abstract or general terms, alot of folks won't be able to wrap their mind around that. Because when people are dealing with their lives, they are going to go to something in "western medicine" because they feel like that gives them the best shot at extending their lives.
To just say that TCM is the way and chemo is no good, is not the right approach. Without more information and background to refer to, folks are going to naturally shy away from this approach. They would just rather take their chances with something that is known to them. It's just basic Human Nature.
You've got a rare opportunity to enlighten all of us here with this forum - it's a big stage. I'd like to see more specifics on how the TCM battle can be won. The more specific information out there, the better that one could draw from that and make decisions on which path they feel is better for them.
I do agree that the war needs to be waged with the immune system in mind. And I agree that there is no rule for who gets cancer and who does not.
We've all seem examples of people, who eat red meat, eat fatty, sugary, and starchy foods, drink soda, drink alcohol, and smoke, and do not exercise and they might or might not get cancer.
I've also seen a very young woman, who never drank, smoked, did drugs, ate red meat, or anything bad for her. She raised her own organic vegetables and fruits, and drank only water and ended up with terminal lung cancer.
So, the age old war of diet vs getting cancer will go on long after I'm gone. It's as old as time itself. Does eating better and getting exercise help? Sure, anything we can do to be healthier definitely has a benefit.
What I think may be the even bigger questions is not that we get cancer, rather it's what we do after we get Cancer?
The real fight in my mind, would be how do we "turn off" those rogue cancer cells in our body once we've identified them without causing undue collateral damage to our internal organs and tissues. Cell receptors and what can 'enable or disable' them to do a specific routine sure appears to be a good line to draw in the sand.
Cells do go bad - how do we "turn them off" when they do if our immune system fails us, is the likely key to this fight.
In the meantime, there is WM and TCM for us to choose. You can help us be more informed if you could lay out some treatment regimen from what you've learned in your experience. Thanks in advance.
-Craig
Re:
"John - it's known that you're approach is TCM. But as Phil eludes
to, we have not seen any kind of TCM regimen that you've used or
know about that breaks it down in detail, as many of us have done
on the chemo and surgery side of the battle. "
Unfortunately, there is no set course of treatment in TCM as far as
herbs or acupuncture, since in Traditional Chinese Medicine the
science is to treat the individual for their specific needs or deficiencies.
Each patient is accessed and diagnosed in TCM terms, and treated
accordingly. There are no generic solutions to stifle specific symptoms,
since stifling symptoms while allowing the problem to continue is
not regarded as a healthy practice.
Since one's body is looked at as a whole being, rather than pieces
and parts that are separate and non-interacting with each other,
the whole body is treated and brought into balance as it was
naturally intended to be.
That is what Traditional Chinese Medicine is all about. There are no
"pills" that will instantly take you to a healthy state. (Maybe New Jersey,
or Iowa?) Getting back to good health takes time, but once it's
attained, all odd symptoms of ill health are removed.
I posted a list of herbs that are known to kill cancer cells exclusively.
They are to be taken as part of a formula that the TCM physician
works up suited to the individual's overall needs.
I self-medicated, and it is a foolish thing to do. The herbs I posted
are powerful medicinal strength herbs, and the wrong combination
can be as harmful as any poison.
I took great time and care to work out a formula for myself, with
some assistance from my TCM doc. He was there to remedy any
problem I might have encountered; thankfully, I did not encounter any
serious problems, and the only other treatment was for what was
called a "kidney yin deficiency" that likely came from the vast amount
of herbs I took for that period of time.
Herbs and acupuncture are not given continuously for any remedy;
once the problem is gone, the treatments stop, and will not be
needed again unless a traumatic event causes a relapse.
I am over three years past my operation to remove a major
colon cancer tumor that had staged me at 3c/4. I had enough lymph
nodes involved, that my prognoses was bleak at best.
Does TCM work? Western medicine physicians tell me I'm just
lucky. There are no indications in scans or blood tests, but they suggest
I do chemo now, "just to be safe".
Fear should not cloud common sense and one's basic internal
intuition that allows us to stay alive.
We each make our choices in life; with cancer, we can't say specifically
what choice is best...... But we can and should realize what harms us
and what does not, and base our choice on that.
Good health!
John0 -
I had to PhotoShop them out!John23 said:Hi Phil !
Nice nostril shot, btw; no nose hair is a plus!)
Re:
"So what EXACTLY is the solution that you say DOES work better than chemo?"
There is no "exact solution", nor is there any "solution" at all, chemo or otherwise.
There -are- better routes, however. There are chemicals, herbs, and many
other substances, that manage to rid us of cancer cells, that do not have the
overwhelming toxic effect that present chemical therapy has.
Chemical or "chemotherapy" kills cancer cells, but at the disadvantage of
all other good cells. It comes with a degree of side effects that are often more
difficult to endure than the cancer itself. In many cases, it damages more
good cells, that it kills cancer cells.
For that reason alone Phil, any other substance that can remove cancer cells
has to be considered better.
There is no reason to use a nuclear bomb on your front lawn to remove a
patch of crabgrass....
When they can say unequivocally and totally unambiguously, that chemotherapy
kills cancer cells exclusively without causing harm to the body, I will support
it's use, and look forward to a treatment. When they can say that it will help
the immune system do the job it was intended to do, I will consider a treatment.
Until then Phil, it is not what they are saying it is; it can not do what they
suggest it can do; It's that nuclear bomb.
Yes, it can shrink a tumor; so can oxygen injections into the tumor,
microwaves injected into the tumor, or freezing solutions injected into
the tumor. All are better methods than chemo.
Yes, chemotherapy can kill cancer cells, but it just as often fails to kill
cancer cells, while still damaging good cells, and impairing healthy
immune systems.
I realize that cancer brings forth in us an overwhelming fear of dying, but too
many are allowing that fear to steer them away from things that will not do harm,
and into the arms of things that will do harm; irreparable harm, in some cases.
There is no guarantee implied or ever given, with chemotherapy;
There is no guarantee implied or ever given, with any other method, either.
We should take the time and sanity to choose what we feel is best,
and do so without the fear mongering of the corporate giants.
There -are- other ways.
or braid them ;-)
You DO revisit themes that I think may be hitting close to home for you John, just as I do I suspect... You have a comment near the bottom of your post where to say that cancer brings forth in us an overwhelming fear of dying.
What I want to post is that THIS more than likely plays an even bigger role in many of the cancers that we face. Yes, diet makes a difference too, garbage in - garbage out as the say but the way we pollute our planet it is no wonder (to me) that SO many people have cancer.
TCM must also kill cancer cells too John, I doubt it asks them to politely leave. I would imagine it's less toxic and I am by no means saying that chemo is the ONLY way or that it's the best thing in the world and everyone should take it. Have the pharmaceutical companies become these enormous $$ machines? Most certainly they have. But, it has also helped VERY many people get through their cancer and I imagine that over the past 5 years that it's toxicity has been reduced. It's far from perfect but one has to also remember that taking chemo doesn't always kill you either. Sometimes it actually cures people.
-phil
This is like taking about religion, there are many paths to heaven (if you believe in all of that stuff) or the "is there life after death" question, etc.0 -
Garden of Eden2bhealed said:Don't eat 'em, JUICE 'em!
A measly 5 servings?? that ain't nuttin'! In one jar of my juice I have at LEAST 10 servings of veggies and 1 fruit and I get all that awesome nutrition in an easily assimilated way gaining all the benefits of the live enzymes.
That's what *I* think.
:-)
peace, emily
Prior to the fall of man and sin entering the Garden of Eden, every man, woman, child and behemoth ate the grasses, veggies and fruits. NO meats. There was no illness until after the fall of man and meat eating began.☺
0 -
Study is irrelevant
The study is irrelevant. I don't eat fruits and vegetables to prevent recurrence. I eat them to make my body healthier overall and meet mineral/vitamin needs. If one isn't eating at least 5 servings of fruits/veggies a day to meet caloric requirements then what is being eaten in their place?0 -
Be careful what you read
Interesting article just 2 weeks after another "European study showed 40% of breast cancer was avoidable with lifestyle changes".
When I started researching the benefits of dietary and other changes in my life there was one thing that stood out to me and that was to never just read a synopsis of a study but to get to the entire write-up. I remember one study that was all over the news about how St Johns Wort was not being effective in treating depression. I looked up the entire study and found that the study had so few participants it wasn't even statistically valid AND that it was a toe to toe with Prozac (the most popular and profitable anti-depressant at the time) that showed neither as being effective!!!! Oddly enough I never heard a word about the Prozac not being effective but every news outlet out there had the bit about St John Wort. Also find out who funded the study, pencil whipping is alive and well especially if there is profit or profitable loss in it.
I'd have to question what cancers were involved, how they picked the participants, all the demographics involved and lots of other things too. Europe has HALF the colorectal incidence rate of the US to start so that 3% could be much higher here. I know lots of people that chose to do chemo for a 2.5% better chance of not having a recurrance.
I think that there is so much more to preventing cancer then just eating a few fruits and veggies a day. There is no magic pill or bullet, there are many many ways one can do it but it takes time and effort and so many choose to just keep on keeping on hoping and praying it doesn't find them. I can't tell you the number of people I have met on this board who didn't change anything about their lives after getting a non genetic form of colorectal cancer especially a few years ago. People do seem to be getting the message that they can help themselves. I look forward to where we will be in 5 years with hope it helps prevent more semi-colons along with better survival rates for those that do join us.
Lisa P.0 -
9 out of 10
9 out of 10 dentists prefer patients who chew sugary gum (the 10th was retiring)0 -
Did we forgetRickMurtagh said:9 out of 10
9 out of 10 dentists prefer patients who chew sugary gum (the 10th was retiring)
First figures lie and lairs figure. Next have we forgotten that we are dealing with the "practice" of medicine, they have not quite gotten it right yet. Also no matter who or what you follow in the quest to rid ones self from cancer there is profit, the TMC practitioner, the onc, the drug company or the company that made my juicer all benefit from my disease.
So I am wondering what did the study use as a serving of veggies. Were the people in the study given "normal" servings, and for school aged kids that is a leaf of lettuce and a thinly sliced tomato. Were they given "roudup ready" sprayed veggies? Did they look at other factors, the mind body thing, genetics, environmental issues or were they just testing if iceberg lettuce and celery would prevent cancer. (On a trip to France the only veggies on many menus were "green salads" and that consisted of iceberg lettuce with a bit of leaf lettuce.)
I echo the words of Julia Childs, everything in moderation even moderation.
Enough from me!
Jan0 -
Hehethready said:Did we forget
First figures lie and lairs figure. Next have we forgotten that we are dealing with the "practice" of medicine, they have not quite gotten it right yet. Also no matter who or what you follow in the quest to rid ones self from cancer there is profit, the TMC practitioner, the onc, the drug company or the company that made my juicer all benefit from my disease.
So I am wondering what did the study use as a serving of veggies. Were the people in the study given "normal" servings, and for school aged kids that is a leaf of lettuce and a thinly sliced tomato. Were they given "roudup ready" sprayed veggies? Did they look at other factors, the mind body thing, genetics, environmental issues or were they just testing if iceberg lettuce and celery would prevent cancer. (On a trip to France the only veggies on many menus were "green salads" and that consisted of iceberg lettuce with a bit of leaf lettuce.)
I echo the words of Julia Childs, everything in moderation even moderation.
Enough from me!
Jan
Awww I love you guys and gals, especially when John and Phil get together on a debate ;-) I think this study is a bit embrassing for the UK government as this was highly publicised and advertised, five day helps ward off cancer. But as we are all saying you need more them five a day, heck exrecise, juicing, vitamins, green teas, mind over matter, TCM for some. So what I'm saying as you have all proved five a day is not enough, far from it. And John, I love your posts, but pleaseeee stop saying that your diagnosis was bleak at your stage 3/4, I'm a stage 3er in remission for now (touch wood my forehead), 10/11 lymph nodes infected and loads of others have had infected lymph nodes, or are stage 4 and are still around. You chose TCM, which is great, but some feel safer with Chemo and that's their choice, I chose both alternative and chemo. Anyway my point, your still around whether with TCM or chemo be happy!
Hugs Sonia0 -
Don't know how any one expects to eat uncomtaminated foods orSonia32 said:Hehe
Awww I love you guys and gals, especially when John and Phil get together on a debate ;-) I think this study is a bit embrassing for the UK government as this was highly publicised and advertised, five day helps ward off cancer. But as we are all saying you need more them five a day, heck exrecise, juicing, vitamins, green teas, mind over matter, TCM for some. So what I'm saying as you have all proved five a day is not enough, far from it. And John, I love your posts, but pleaseeee stop saying that your diagnosis was bleak at your stage 3/4, I'm a stage 3er in remission for now (touch wood my forehead), 10/11 lymph nodes infected and loads of others have had infected lymph nodes, or are stage 4 and are still around. You chose TCM, which is great, but some feel safer with Chemo and that's their choice, I chose both alternative and chemo. Anyway my point, your still around whether with TCM or chemo be happy!
Hugs Sonia
drink "natural" water that doesnot contain toxins when there is no "pure" anything left anywhere on this planet. The extent of pollution we are ingesting, inhaling varies geographically, of course, dependenent of industry, farm runoff, etc. How many people flush their meds down toilet? Where do you think that stuff goes? Fish is one answer.....Sorry for being depressive but we;ve known since way before Rachel Carson that if you are what you eat, we better do something about the environment...Kinda late now....
By the way, this study,was done on Europeans, whose diet and environmrental factors are surely different than Americans'......Happt eating...steve0 -
The UK GovernmentSonia32 said:Hehe
Awww I love you guys and gals, especially when John and Phil get together on a debate ;-) I think this study is a bit embrassing for the UK government as this was highly publicised and advertised, five day helps ward off cancer. But as we are all saying you need more them five a day, heck exrecise, juicing, vitamins, green teas, mind over matter, TCM for some. So what I'm saying as you have all proved five a day is not enough, far from it. And John, I love your posts, but pleaseeee stop saying that your diagnosis was bleak at your stage 3/4, I'm a stage 3er in remission for now (touch wood my forehead), 10/11 lymph nodes infected and loads of others have had infected lymph nodes, or are stage 4 and are still around. You chose TCM, which is great, but some feel safer with Chemo and that's their choice, I chose both alternative and chemo. Anyway my point, your still around whether with TCM or chemo be happy!
Hugs Sonia
also said that there was no benefit to brushing teeth either...
;-)
-p
Nice to see you posting Sonia0 -
Franken-foodscoloCan said:Don't know how any one expects to eat uncomtaminated foods or
drink "natural" water that doesnot contain toxins when there is no "pure" anything left anywhere on this planet. The extent of pollution we are ingesting, inhaling varies geographically, of course, dependenent of industry, farm runoff, etc. How many people flush their meds down toilet? Where do you think that stuff goes? Fish is one answer.....Sorry for being depressive but we;ve known since way before Rachel Carson that if you are what you eat, we better do something about the environment...Kinda late now....
By the way, this study,was done on Europeans, whose diet and environmrental factors are surely different than Americans'......Happt eating...steve
You've got that right Steve. Many foods are either loaded with pesticides or genetically "engineered" so who even knows the side effects down the road with that stuff. I try to get my organic veggies locally from the CSA I belong too. Plus I have the seedings started inside for getting ready for the great outdoors.
I did see an article IN TIME this past week about how many meds are flushed or thrown in landfills. They also had a good piece (which I believe I posted) on plastics and how they can mess you up too.0
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