Judge rules US family can't refuse chemo for boy
Let me know what you think
Comments
-
Oh boy!
I wish a judge didn't have to get involved.
I think it is in the child's best interest to do the chemo. His survival rate is better with chemo they say and I would agree. I would do ANYTHING to save my kids.
My opinion.
Side note: I saw a list of comments, probably on Yahoo, where so many people were saying that chemo doesn't work at all on people. I was very surprised at the comments. They didn't have any first hand experience I felt.
-phil0 -
others giving advice
Phil,
Your comments remind me of when I first was diagnosed and started chemo. I had two people- one a friend and another a cousin- who were adament that I should not take chemo, but should do all their "natural supplements" and "colon cleanses" instead. They claimed that chemo is so toxic that I could end up dying from it instead. Here I was with a large rectal tumor, 12+ tumors in my liver, and numerous tumors in both lungs. I KNOW I would have been dead by now if I had taken their advice. If I had been a stage I or II, I may have taken their advice actually, but not at the stage I was at. It's frustrating when "well meaning" people give advice and believe that they know more about all this than anyone else!
So far as the article about the boy's family not being able to refuse him chemo, it is sad that a judge has to step in, but hopefully it will save the boy's life.
Lisa0 -
Exact oppositelisa42 said:others giving advice
Phil,
Your comments remind me of when I first was diagnosed and started chemo. I had two people- one a friend and another a cousin- who were adament that I should not take chemo, but should do all their "natural supplements" and "colon cleanses" instead. They claimed that chemo is so toxic that I could end up dying from it instead. Here I was with a large rectal tumor, 12+ tumors in my liver, and numerous tumors in both lungs. I KNOW I would have been dead by now if I had taken their advice. If I had been a stage I or II, I may have taken their advice actually, but not at the stage I was at. It's frustrating when "well meaning" people give advice and believe that they know more about all this than anyone else!
So far as the article about the boy's family not being able to refuse him chemo, it is sad that a judge has to step in, but hopefully it will save the boy's life.
Lisa
I had "well-meaning" people tell me the exact opposite--that I needed to do the chemo--since I had decided not to. They didn't know the first thing about my tumor or my family history of doing chemo and dying. I KNOW I would be dead by now if I had listened to them and didn't do my alternative medicine and juicing and supplements and colon cleansings. Funny how different folks need different things.
I didn't read the article but I think it's VERY dangerous when a judge can step in and decide medical decisions. VERY DANGEROUS for our freedoms. To me it's the same as forcing a woman to have an abortion if she doesn't believe in it but it may or may not save her life.
peace, emily0 -
It's all chemistrylisa42 said:others giving advice
Phil,
Your comments remind me of when I first was diagnosed and started chemo. I had two people- one a friend and another a cousin- who were adament that I should not take chemo, but should do all their "natural supplements" and "colon cleanses" instead. They claimed that chemo is so toxic that I could end up dying from it instead. Here I was with a large rectal tumor, 12+ tumors in my liver, and numerous tumors in both lungs. I KNOW I would have been dead by now if I had taken their advice. If I had been a stage I or II, I may have taken their advice actually, but not at the stage I was at. It's frustrating when "well meaning" people give advice and believe that they know more about all this than anyone else!
So far as the article about the boy's family not being able to refuse him chemo, it is sad that a judge has to step in, but hopefully it will save the boy's life.
Lisa
This subject really chaps my ****. I get upset when people promote one avenue over the other. The bottom line is that any treatment other than doing nothing is chemotherapy. Taking a bunch of supplements is chemotherapy. Any change in diet is chemotherapy. Juicing is chemotherapy. Starting or altering meditation is chemotherapy. I chose the doctor prescribed, government mandated first line treatment of chemotherapy. I chose that because it is documented to be the most successful treatment. I don't think a child has the right to deny themselves treatment. I also think it is the parents responsibility to give their children the best chance at survival. If they deny that, then I have no problem with the state stepping in. If a medicine man had the most successful documented treatment I'de say go with the medicine man, but I haven't seen anything regarding native american cures for cancer. This is an example of extremely bad parenting where faith is overwhelming reality.
I was fortunate enough to learn from the folly of others. I've known two people in my life that would still be alive today if they would have taken Dr prescribed chemotherapy. But they chose to go the vitamin, supplement, diet way. Now they aren't around to promote their cause. They fell into a common trap. I hear it all the time. Rumors and first hand accounts of this person or that who survived terminal cancer by doing this or that. My mom introduced me to one last time I was at her house. She was promoting the hallelujah diet and hallelujah acres resort. The lady had told my moms church that she had survived stage 4 colon cancer simply by following this diet and had now been cancer free for 10 years. I immediately called BS. I asked her simple question about cancer. How did she know she had colon cancer, how did the doctors stage it, where else had the cancer spread, where in the colon was the tumor. Just little stuff. I basically got from the way she answered the question that she was FOS. She may have had a polyp removed during a colonoscopy 10 years ago but she wasn't a stage 4 survivor.
When people tell these stories they diminish the turmoil we cancer patients endure. If the cure was simply wishing the cancer away, or taking some vitamins, or exercising the tumors away then we would all be cancer free. Is chemo the answer, no. But everything is chemo and right now that is all we know that will work.
Now all you believers don't get all fussy. I know miracles happen. But they won't happen to all of us. If they did they wouldn't be considered miracles. They'de simply be business as usual. Give the kid chemo until something better comes along!0 -
Hmmmsnommintj said:It's all chemistry
This subject really chaps my ****. I get upset when people promote one avenue over the other. The bottom line is that any treatment other than doing nothing is chemotherapy. Taking a bunch of supplements is chemotherapy. Any change in diet is chemotherapy. Juicing is chemotherapy. Starting or altering meditation is chemotherapy. I chose the doctor prescribed, government mandated first line treatment of chemotherapy. I chose that because it is documented to be the most successful treatment. I don't think a child has the right to deny themselves treatment. I also think it is the parents responsibility to give their children the best chance at survival. If they deny that, then I have no problem with the state stepping in. If a medicine man had the most successful documented treatment I'de say go with the medicine man, but I haven't seen anything regarding native american cures for cancer. This is an example of extremely bad parenting where faith is overwhelming reality.
I was fortunate enough to learn from the folly of others. I've known two people in my life that would still be alive today if they would have taken Dr prescribed chemotherapy. But they chose to go the vitamin, supplement, diet way. Now they aren't around to promote their cause. They fell into a common trap. I hear it all the time. Rumors and first hand accounts of this person or that who survived terminal cancer by doing this or that. My mom introduced me to one last time I was at her house. She was promoting the hallelujah diet and hallelujah acres resort. The lady had told my moms church that she had survived stage 4 colon cancer simply by following this diet and had now been cancer free for 10 years. I immediately called BS. I asked her simple question about cancer. How did she know she had colon cancer, how did the doctors stage it, where else had the cancer spread, where in the colon was the tumor. Just little stuff. I basically got from the way she answered the question that she was FOS. She may have had a polyp removed during a colonoscopy 10 years ago but she wasn't a stage 4 survivor.
When people tell these stories they diminish the turmoil we cancer patients endure. If the cure was simply wishing the cancer away, or taking some vitamins, or exercising the tumors away then we would all be cancer free. Is chemo the answer, no. But everything is chemo and right now that is all we know that will work.
Now all you believers don't get all fussy. I know miracles happen. But they won't happen to all of us. If they did they wouldn't be considered miracles. They'de simply be business as usual. Give the kid chemo until something better comes along!
I wish that the govt did not have to step in to decide. Then again, I would have followed the chemo mostly likely. I disagree John that all methods of trying to heal cancer are chemo. Chemo is controlled poisoning where a change in diet (unless it's a radical one where you are consuming mass quantities of a harmful herb or something) is not the same as taking things that can kill you into your body. There could be times when time is of the essence and chemo may be faster at killing cancer cells and may increase one's chances of survival but I do not dispute at all that dietary changes can cure cancer. I also feel (some of you better sit down) that prayer and a strong believe CAN help one get through a disease. It's all positive thinking and I think that it can be as powerful as negative thinking. If you constantly think you are not going to get better, you probably won't. Now I don't think that the strongly religious who forbid blood transfusions or things of that nature are doing the "right thing" but if you have a strong belief in a power that is healing, be it God or Healing Energy or that Satan will cure you so you can spread more evil (see **** Cheney and his heart problems), then those choices can work in your favor.
One other point you state that I think is way off base is "But they chose to go the vitamin, supplement, diet way. Now they aren't around to promote their cause. They fell into a common trap". There are also plenty of people who have promoted the chemotherapy way who aren't around anymore either so to make a blanket statement like yours makes absolutely no sense to me at all. Sure, I've heard a few stories where a friend of a friend of a friend said 5 Hail Mary's and were cured or that they rubbed tree bark on them and they are cured but it's always from a 3rd or 4th person, never from the source. So I am wary of any story about anything where I do not know the person.
It's all a gamble, some get healed by chemo. some don't make it. I choose that route because I felt it gave me the best chances. Time was of the essence for me and I believed in it. Where as Emily (you rebel you!) did what SHE thought was best and for her, and I think it was. There are others on this board who have done similar things as Emily and are still around so you can't poo-poo that approach (can I say poo-poo on here or is that appropriate on a colon cancer site to say poo-poo?) As far as this particular case goes, I wish a judge did not have to butt in, but if it were my child, I would have done what I felt is best and that would have been chemo.
Also, how come there are so many people with colon cancer? I think there is a direct correlation between diet and environment and cancer so if the cancer can be caused by nutritional choices (too much red meat and other food choices which I think is a fact in many cancer cases - not all) why can't changing one's diet have a positive effect?
You've done well with the choices you've made it seems, who am I to say you didn't but to say that a nutritional approach is not good (that's the impression you left with me) is well... not good.
That's my opinion on your comments.
I hope you are doing well with your current cancer situation.
-p
PS: Bag Balm might be better than chap stick.0 -
I agree with you Emily2bhealed said:Exact opposite
I had "well-meaning" people tell me the exact opposite--that I needed to do the chemo--since I had decided not to. They didn't know the first thing about my tumor or my family history of doing chemo and dying. I KNOW I would be dead by now if I had listened to them and didn't do my alternative medicine and juicing and supplements and colon cleansings. Funny how different folks need different things.
I didn't read the article but I think it's VERY dangerous when a judge can step in and decide medical decisions. VERY DANGEROUS for our freedoms. To me it's the same as forcing a woman to have an abortion if she doesn't believe in it but it may or may not save her life.
peace, emily
We are all different and react differently and have different beliefs and all. I think that you did the right thing in your case. This is one of those topics that can be discussed into the ground because if you choose one route, you don't know what would have happened if you chose the other. Based on your history, you made the right call I think. No one will ever know if chemo would have cured you but we do know that your treatment your way has kept you with us ;-)
I agree with it being VERY dangerous to have judges get involved with these types of issues. If the parents really don't want their child to get treatment, then they have to deal with the outcome. I also agree with the abortion issue. It's not my call or a judge's call or anyone's call but the woman's call. It's a decision she has to live with.
peace out
-phil0 -
I was sitting downPhillieG said:Hmmm
I wish that the govt did not have to step in to decide. Then again, I would have followed the chemo mostly likely. I disagree John that all methods of trying to heal cancer are chemo. Chemo is controlled poisoning where a change in diet (unless it's a radical one where you are consuming mass quantities of a harmful herb or something) is not the same as taking things that can kill you into your body. There could be times when time is of the essence and chemo may be faster at killing cancer cells and may increase one's chances of survival but I do not dispute at all that dietary changes can cure cancer. I also feel (some of you better sit down) that prayer and a strong believe CAN help one get through a disease. It's all positive thinking and I think that it can be as powerful as negative thinking. If you constantly think you are not going to get better, you probably won't. Now I don't think that the strongly religious who forbid blood transfusions or things of that nature are doing the "right thing" but if you have a strong belief in a power that is healing, be it God or Healing Energy or that Satan will cure you so you can spread more evil (see **** Cheney and his heart problems), then those choices can work in your favor.
One other point you state that I think is way off base is "But they chose to go the vitamin, supplement, diet way. Now they aren't around to promote their cause. They fell into a common trap". There are also plenty of people who have promoted the chemotherapy way who aren't around anymore either so to make a blanket statement like yours makes absolutely no sense to me at all. Sure, I've heard a few stories where a friend of a friend of a friend said 5 Hail Mary's and were cured or that they rubbed tree bark on them and they are cured but it's always from a 3rd or 4th person, never from the source. So I am wary of any story about anything where I do not know the person.
It's all a gamble, some get healed by chemo. some don't make it. I choose that route because I felt it gave me the best chances. Time was of the essence for me and I believed in it. Where as Emily (you rebel you!) did what SHE thought was best and for her, and I think it was. There are others on this board who have done similar things as Emily and are still around so you can't poo-poo that approach (can I say poo-poo on here or is that appropriate on a colon cancer site to say poo-poo?) As far as this particular case goes, I wish a judge did not have to butt in, but if it were my child, I would have done what I felt is best and that would have been chemo.
Also, how come there are so many people with colon cancer? I think there is a direct correlation between diet and environment and cancer so if the cancer can be caused by nutritional choices (too much red meat and other food choices which I think is a fact in many cancer cases - not all) why can't changing one's diet have a positive effect?
You've done well with the choices you've made it seems, who am I to say you didn't but to say that a nutritional approach is not good (that's the impression you left with me) is well... not good.
That's my opinion on your comments.
I hope you are doing well with your current cancer situation.
-p
PS: Bag Balm might be better than chap stick.
when I read that I almost laughed out loud. There's hope for you Phil. I think whatever gets us through is good. I love your posts, they are always interesting and somedays it seems like you are in more tolerable moods than others. But then aren't we all. To have been fighting this disease as long as you have and still be able to kid around and have your sense of humor, I love you for that. I have only been fighting for a few months, and sometimes I just get so tired of it, I want to think about quitting, BUT that is not an option. You hang in there and we will all get through this together. Just like any other family we may have disagreements from time to time , but we are a family of semi-colons.
Carletta0 -
Right On BroPhillieG said:I agree with you Emily
We are all different and react differently and have different beliefs and all. I think that you did the right thing in your case. This is one of those topics that can be discussed into the ground because if you choose one route, you don't know what would have happened if you chose the other. Based on your history, you made the right call I think. No one will ever know if chemo would have cured you but we do know that your treatment your way has kept you with us ;-)
I agree with it being VERY dangerous to have judges get involved with these types of issues. If the parents really don't want their child to get treatment, then they have to deal with the outcome. I also agree with the abortion issue. It's not my call or a judge's call or anyone's call but the woman's call. It's a decision she has to live with.
peace out
-phil
We'll never know and there are no guarantees. Such is life.
peace, emily0 -
Me, moody???colon2 said:I was sitting down
when I read that I almost laughed out loud. There's hope for you Phil. I think whatever gets us through is good. I love your posts, they are always interesting and somedays it seems like you are in more tolerable moods than others. But then aren't we all. To have been fighting this disease as long as you have and still be able to kid around and have your sense of humor, I love you for that. I have only been fighting for a few months, and sometimes I just get so tired of it, I want to think about quitting, BUT that is not an option. You hang in there and we will all get through this together. Just like any other family we may have disagreements from time to time , but we are a family of semi-colons.
Carletta
Hi Carletta,
I've always used humor to deal with things or to help me state a point of view. We can't ourselves too seriously. Don't give up but I know what you mean, sometimes I've had it. 5 long years is a long time but I've managed to stay ahead of it and hope to continue to stay ahead of it. We are entitled to our views and will not always agree either. I am opinionated (ya think?) and I'll speak up when I feel I need to or want to. I respect others views but sometimes I see what I think are incorrect statements and I speak out. I'm sure there will be many who disagree with me. I just want us all to get better however WE feel is the best way for US.
-phil
Glad I could get a laugh out of you, have a great day0 -
Hey!PhillieG said:Hmmm
I wish that the govt did not have to step in to decide. Then again, I would have followed the chemo mostly likely. I disagree John that all methods of trying to heal cancer are chemo. Chemo is controlled poisoning where a change in diet (unless it's a radical one where you are consuming mass quantities of a harmful herb or something) is not the same as taking things that can kill you into your body. There could be times when time is of the essence and chemo may be faster at killing cancer cells and may increase one's chances of survival but I do not dispute at all that dietary changes can cure cancer. I also feel (some of you better sit down) that prayer and a strong believe CAN help one get through a disease. It's all positive thinking and I think that it can be as powerful as negative thinking. If you constantly think you are not going to get better, you probably won't. Now I don't think that the strongly religious who forbid blood transfusions or things of that nature are doing the "right thing" but if you have a strong belief in a power that is healing, be it God or Healing Energy or that Satan will cure you so you can spread more evil (see **** Cheney and his heart problems), then those choices can work in your favor.
One other point you state that I think is way off base is "But they chose to go the vitamin, supplement, diet way. Now they aren't around to promote their cause. They fell into a common trap". There are also plenty of people who have promoted the chemotherapy way who aren't around anymore either so to make a blanket statement like yours makes absolutely no sense to me at all. Sure, I've heard a few stories where a friend of a friend of a friend said 5 Hail Mary's and were cured or that they rubbed tree bark on them and they are cured but it's always from a 3rd or 4th person, never from the source. So I am wary of any story about anything where I do not know the person.
It's all a gamble, some get healed by chemo. some don't make it. I choose that route because I felt it gave me the best chances. Time was of the essence for me and I believed in it. Where as Emily (you rebel you!) did what SHE thought was best and for her, and I think it was. There are others on this board who have done similar things as Emily and are still around so you can't poo-poo that approach (can I say poo-poo on here or is that appropriate on a colon cancer site to say poo-poo?) As far as this particular case goes, I wish a judge did not have to butt in, but if it were my child, I would have done what I felt is best and that would have been chemo.
Also, how come there are so many people with colon cancer? I think there is a direct correlation between diet and environment and cancer so if the cancer can be caused by nutritional choices (too much red meat and other food choices which I think is a fact in many cancer cases - not all) why can't changing one's diet have a positive effect?
You've done well with the choices you've made it seems, who am I to say you didn't but to say that a nutritional approach is not good (that's the impression you left with me) is well... not good.
That's my opinion on your comments.
I hope you are doing well with your current cancer situation.
-p
PS: Bag Balm might be better than chap stick.
Don't knock the tree bark rub....or wait...maybe I drank the tree bark....Pau D'Arco, oh duh....that's right. I DRANK the tree bark.
I heard Lance used Bag Balm for his, um, testicular cancer cure.
peace, emily0 -
Well...2bhealed said:Hey!
Don't knock the tree bark rub....or wait...maybe I drank the tree bark....Pau D'Arco, oh duh....that's right. I DRANK the tree bark.
I heard Lance used Bag Balm for his, um, testicular cancer cure.
peace, emily
That makes sense with the name then.
Just don't drink the Koolaide or eat the brown acid.
-p0 -
I drank tree bark too2bhealed said:Hey!
Don't knock the tree bark rub....or wait...maybe I drank the tree bark....Pau D'Arco, oh duh....that's right. I DRANK the tree bark.
I heard Lance used Bag Balm for his, um, testicular cancer cure.
peace, emily
I think a couple of kinds make up Essaic tea which I drank twice daily after chosing to stop chemo. I agree with Phil that god made and natural things are NOTHING like chemotheraphy, cancer treatment yes but not chemo.
I also agree with Emily that I don't like government getting this involved. Didn't the parents say they were against the chemo because of religious beliefs? I do not believe government has any business telling me who and what to believe in unlike some of our politicians and this judge do.
Lisa P. whose is very glad she had a choice in her decisions and was prepared for whatever outcome she encountered.0 -
I like the Graviola tree....
Its great in a smoothy... besides it said to be 10,000 times more powerful than chemotherapy! I have trouble getting the whole tree into the blender, though.
Seriously, body chemestry varys from individual to individual. I believe in, and support alternative therapies over chemotherapy and radiation. It worked for me. But understand one thing, when the bodies under stress,especially after leaving the oncologist's office, the body chemistry is always in question. Being emotionally upset and under stress can cause an inbalance in body chemistry and a loss of minerals that are needed in proper portion for the absorbation of nutrients and supplements you may be taking. I believe its important to be monitored by an licensed, experenced, naturopathic or hoemopathic doctor, other then an oncologist, if alternative therapies in the form of diet changes, herbs and vitamin therapies are part of treatment protocols. Often times patients in stage 4 after chemo and radiation treatments will need 1 to 2 IV bags of minerals after careful evaluation, for alternative therapies to take hold. Than stand back and watch the body heal itself! This is the real science behind healing cancer, not the one fits all, conventional treatments. I'm all in favor of healing cancer from inside out.. like the DVD suggests.
Is cancer really a disease? This summary will give you a new and refreshing insight on how maybe cancer is manifested. You be the judge.... maybe the judge that ruled against the 13 year old boy, and cast his lot with conventional treatment should read this! comments anyone..... The book, Cancer is Not a Disease by Andreas Moritz, is an informative read that explores an alternative viewpoint on how cancer is caused. You need an open mind!
http://www.HealthBookSummaries.com/Browse.asp?Member=PDF0 -
Hodgkins Survivortiny one said:decision
It just angers me that a Judge should be able to possibly force a child to endure chemo when the parents don't want it. Who will pay for this, the Judge, I think not. Chemo works for some but not others.
My understanding is that this young person has Hodgkins. One of the most treatable cancers there is. Depending on the stage, a 90% + cure rate. I had Hodgkins 20 years ago and the chemo saved my life.
Cheers, Lance0
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