Of interest ?

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Comments

  • TMac52
    TMac52 Member Posts: 352
    Making me nervous!
    3 months ago I had an abdominoperineal resection of the rectum with a permanent colostomy.
    I have had some issues but nothing compared to what john describes. I eat healthy with no resrictions other than sugar as i am also diabetic. Sometimes before a bowel movement I get serious pain that lasts about 5-10 minutes its pain that makes me double over but because its happened so many times I know it is going to pass so i hang on until it does. I havnt figured out what it is from, some one told me its just part of the colon that was repaired or stitched up and will get better with time. But now after reading everything on this post I am a bit nervous that it may be more than that. Since i have been DX'ed July 09. Doctors have not explained to me what to expect. Everything seems to be a new surprise to me. Did you guys have similar surgeries is this something I should be concerned about?
    These discussion boards help me understand alot but can also cause unesessary fear.
    Please advise,
    Tom
  • John23
    John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member

    snake oil or not?
    Hi John

    I've had one intestinal blockage so far, with a stay in the hospital and a couple days with the ng tube. not fun.

    A couple questions:

    1. When you get a blockage, do you now wait it out at home? Any effective home techniques?

    2. There is an organization (Clear Passage Physical Therapy) that advertises a physical therapy method for obstructions of the small intestine (the Wurn Technique); they claim it has been "proven successful" in eliminating or reducing adhesions. They are based in Florida, and I don't know how much it cost or if insurance covers it. More importantly, I have no idea if it really works. Do you know anything about this group?

    http://www.clearpassage.com/small-bowel-obstruction.php

    I have enjoyed and learned from your posts. Best wishes.

    Grant

    Hi Grant !
    Hi Grant !

    Re:
    "1. When you get a blockage, do you now wait it out at home?
    Any effective home techniques?"


    I don't get along with NG tubes either. I have this inherent tendency
    to swing at anyone getting too close to my nose with a rubber tube.
    (I feel the same way about my penis and rubber tubes, btw)

    I ended up in the ER three times (I think three?), and it didn't do me
    any better than if I just stayed home. The problem is, that you run
    a risk that the obstruction will perforate the intestine. If that happens,
    it's not a good thing, and being in the hospital at the time it happens
    may give you an edge. I gave up. If I'm going to lay there in pain,
    I want to be close to my bottle of Bourbon.

    I found (as some others on the board have previously suggested)
    that laying on the left side, will get things moving. That, along with
    pressing on various areas of the abdomen, seems to work for me.
    Not right away, and not always, but it helps. And, drinking as much
    of any diuretic liquid as I can, helps. Coffee, tea, white grape juice,
    all seems to help, just as plain water with a touch of lemon.

    Drinking alcohol, or anything that displaces water in your system, is
    a tragic mistake. So is carbonated beverages, or anything "gassy".
    The waste sits in one spot, and can start to decay and gas up,
    and the last thing you need is more gas.

    Re:
    "Wurn Technique and 'Clear Passage Physical Therapy'."

    Well, huh! I started to do the research, and well.....

    One of their references to substantiate their "Wurn Technique" is here:

    #3. Liakakos T, Thomakos N, Fine PM, Dervenis C, Young RL.

    Where it concludes:
    "CONCLUSIONS: Until additional information and findings from
    future clinical investigations exist, only a meticulous surgical
    technique can be advocated
    in order to reduce unnecessary
    morbidity and mortality rates from these untoward effects of surgery."


    and:
    #4. Ellis H, Moran BJ, Thompson JN, Parker MC, Wilson MS, Menzies D, McGuire A, Lower AM, Hawthorn RJ, O’Brien F, Buchan S, Crowe AM.

    "Interpretation
    Postoperative adhesions have important consequences to patients,
    surgeons, and the health system. Surgical procedures with a high
    risk of adhesion-related complications need to be identified and
    adhesion prevention carefully assessed."


    Neither of those substantiates anything the 'CPPT" center is claiming.

    And the 5,6,7 references are those of Wurn herself. Not that there's anything
    wrong with that... But I have a feeling it might be a bit skewed.

    Dr. Jacques Moritz, and Dr. Leslie Mendoza Temple, both have
    made no other comments, other than those relating to the promotion
    of a book, and a web site: "miracle-moms.com".

    I'm a cynic at heart, and when I see only two physicians being
    quoted using essentially the same dialog, I become suspicious.

    For me, my physicians have taken CT scans, and X-rays, and some
    other type of X-Ray, where the bowels are shifted around during the
    X-ray. They can't figure out where the obstruction is, or if it's from
    an adhesion or hernia.

    Maybe Dr. Wurn is a psychic?

    There are some things that TCM can do at the time of (or shortly
    after) surgery, that can help prevent and/or at least reduce the
    amount of adhesions. But there's not much that can be done, once the
    adhesion settles in; It's two pieces of skin growing into one another.
    It's part of the natural healing process, but on our insides.

    Thanks for the link and the thought! I'm always open to suggestions
    and new ideas.

    Good thoughts comin' at ya!

    John
  • PGLGreg
    PGLGreg Member Posts: 731
    The upside.
    It's a very good thing you've discovered this effect of MSG on you. I don't know whether it's the MSG or large amounts of salt, but I have always found canned soups and frozen-dinner type products rather unpleasant tasting. The food I had in the hospital tasted bad to me in this way, also. It also usually smells bad. I guess it may be a fortunate aversion that I have.

    I wonder why some surgeries cause these adhesions and others don't.

    --Greg
  • scouty
    scouty Member Posts: 1,965 Member
    I remember looking into this years ago
    John,

    I looked into this back when I was changing my diet years ago and remember it was VERY confusing to me. I remember that there were natural glutemates and man made ones so I tried to avoid the man made ones. The list of additives containing a form of MSG has grown since then but I thought I read where there were always varying amounts of the stuff in the ones that were listed back then. I listed the ones that had the most and avoided them. They were autolyzed yeast extract, soy sauce, hydrolyzed vegetable protein, and of course MSG itself.

    I also remember reading where most of the products became bothersome when raised to high heat and releasing d-glutemate as opposed to the l-glutemate normally released.

    Oh and by the way people that are sensitive to MSG are usually sensitive to parmesan cheese, tomatoes, peas, mushrooms, chicken, beef, pork and fish to name just some of the foods that emite bound and free glutemates.

    Have you tried any of the other brands of soup people have recommended or are you assuming they will bother you too? MSG has more sodium in it then the yeast extracts so as others have said it could just be the stuff in Campbells and MSG that is getting to you.

    I agree with the others that making homemade soup sounds like it is the way for you to go, you can strain it just like you did the canned goop and it freezes well. Let me know if you need any recipes.

    Also if I were you and not being able to eat a well balance diet, I would be having a serious talk with my doctor and if she/he wasn't receptive to helping me I would be finding one that was. I don't know any colotomates or ileostomates that are having the extensive issues you are. FYI, just cuz your surgeon is the lead doesn't make him the best surgeon, it just means he is the best manager who also happens to be a surgeon.

    As far as additives and perservatives go, I totally agree with you. My personal favorite high fructose corn syrup commercial is the one that says it made from corn so it can't be bad for you. My response to that is well so is moonshine but that doesn't mean it's good for you.

    Just remember you deserve to be feeling and eating better then you are!

    Lisa P.
  • thxmiker
    thxmiker Member Posts: 1,278 Member
    International Isle
    Check on your grocery store's international isle. The foods made in the USA that are of "International Styles" ie Indian, Mexican, etc... Tend to have less chemical crap in them. They allso have a lower shelf life, but whom needs a can that lasts more then a year?

    MSG is made from Cruciferous vegetables or Soy. Soy is the 8th most common allergy and hardly tested for! My wife after taking allergen shots for 10 years was retested upon our research and tested positive for soy allergy. We eat only whole foods and no chemical crap. It made her digestion better and no more allergic issues. I lost 40lbs by changing our diet. I am sure not eating fast foods helped a lot for me.

    A colon blockage is very serious! Have it checked sooner rather then later. I ended up in the hospital for 8 days due to a colon blockage. It was my lack of knowledge of not recognizing the issue. Ribbon size poop, not being able to poop, etc....

    Best Always, mike
  • John23
    John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member
    TMac52 said:

    Making me nervous!
    3 months ago I had an abdominoperineal resection of the rectum with a permanent colostomy.
    I have had some issues but nothing compared to what john describes. I eat healthy with no resrictions other than sugar as i am also diabetic. Sometimes before a bowel movement I get serious pain that lasts about 5-10 minutes its pain that makes me double over but because its happened so many times I know it is going to pass so i hang on until it does. I havnt figured out what it is from, some one told me its just part of the colon that was repaired or stitched up and will get better with time. But now after reading everything on this post I am a bit nervous that it may be more than that. Since i have been DX'ed July 09. Doctors have not explained to me what to expect. Everything seems to be a new surprise to me. Did you guys have similar surgeries is this something I should be concerned about?
    These discussion boards help me understand alot but can also cause unesessary fear.
    Please advise,
    Tom

    Tom -
    Tom -

    No need to be nervous and full of worry. You weren't nervous and full of
    worry about getting cancer before you actually had cancer, right?

    Adhesions and hernias are common after any intensive abdominal
    surgery. They told me I had many, right after the operation, but
    none bothered me. I had absolutely no problems with digestion,
    no pains, no bloating, no obstructions, not in four years - Well, until
    now, that is. I know some individuals that never had a problem
    after abdominal surgery, but are they among the "common"?

    The adhesions are varied in type, and some can grow, and shrink,
    and in the process, they mess up the intestines. The intestines
    should float free inside us, bending and moving as needed. When
    a section is restrained, it can cause it to bind, or kink, and that's
    where you can get an obstruction. A hernia can trap part of the
    intestine, and keep it from moving, just as an adhesion can. And a
    hernia can happen at any time, since the muscles have been cut,
    and moved, and weakened somewhat; It doesn't take too much.

    The bottom line Tom, is forget about it. If you get an obstruction,
    you'll know the signs, and know a little about how to deal with it.
    Most of us have learned the hard way. No doctor ever told
    me what to expect, or what to do. I guess they figure that you'll
    get into the ER and they'll do the teaching. Either that, or they didn't
    figure we'd live long enough to suffer the consequences of surgery?
    (haha, probably)

    What you appear to be suffering from, sounds more to be related
    with the type of surgical procedures involved with rectal surgery.
    You might want to sign in on the UOAA web site, and see what
    they think. It's a great forum/board for ostomates of every type,
    and intestinal operations before and after an ostomy. Most are there
    not due to cancer, but the info will be of help to you anyway!

    Greg -
    Re:
    "I wonder why some surgeries cause these adhesions and others don't."

    From my understanding, adhesions form after any surgery; most
    may not be of concern, while some will be. After four long years,
    I really didn't think I would have to be concerned; I guess I was
    wrong. As we age, things inside us settle, and with the "settling",
    comes twists and kinks that weren't there before. Muscles relax,
    and a part of an intestine can pop through. What can I say?
    I still rather get old.

    Lisa -
    Re:
    "if I were you and not being able to eat a well balance diet,
    I would be having a serious talk with my doctor "


    Yup! That's exactly what I did. I went in and told her (my gastro doc)
    what's been happening. She ordered the CT, etc immediately, along
    with a CBC, CEA, etc. When it didn't isolate anything, she gave me
    the names of three surgeons that she knows. I did the research, and
    started with the best. I'll get second opinions, of course, but I know
    what to expect, well in advance.

    This last test still didn't isolate the section or the reason, and the
    radiologist said it might take being opened up to locate it. He did
    not feel any surgeon will do so, for a partial blockage. It's just
    too risky of an operation for something not all that threatening.

    Well...maybe, but they're not the ones in pain for days, and hanging
    off the side of the toilet at 3am.

    Plenty of nourishment can be had from soup, as well as foods
    without fiber. And eating meat doesn't seem to present a problem.
    It's anything that doesn't dissolve, that's a problem. So figuring
    out a diet to work around this mess, is the present goal.

    ---

    What I'm going through is a very, very minor thing, compared
    to Winter-Marie, John, Craig, Buzz, and everyone else! Mine is
    just a surgical mess, and it can be fixed..... so please guys.....

    Let's pour our hopes and prayers to the guys that really need them.

    I'll do fine!

    Thanks for caring. I really do appreciate it!

    John
  • tootsie1
    tootsie1 Member Posts: 5,044 Member
    Oh, dear.
    Hey, John.

    I didn't realize you were having so much trouble. I'm so sorry! Hope you find a good solution soon!

    And thanks for the info.

    *hugs*
    Gail
  • John23
    John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member
    plh4gail said:

    Feel better
    I, too am sorry to hear you are having the pain and symptoms you are going through. I hope I'm not making a fool of myself for saying this. I haven't been on here long, but from the time I have been, I have always thought you offer your support and great advice as such a strong, strong person. Now I feel a touch of pain and guilt for not realizing you are like the rest of us. You have your rough times and challenges too. How else could you possibly be able to respond to posts the way you do. Now I see your knowledge and information is encorporated with "been there's" and "I understand's".

    I hope this all gets better for you soon and I'm glad you have your wife to help you with it.

    Gail

    Gail -
    Gail -

    One thing I've learned from this board, is that we're all in this
    together; Cancer is the common denominator. We have all
    experienced the overwhelming feeling of our naked mortality
    at a time we thought we were immortal. That is what cancer
    does - it wakes us up and let's us know it's time to stay awake.

    Phil once asked for people's ideas of "good" that's come from
    their cancer diagnosis. I guess "waking up" is about the best
    thing I could have offered.

    But ya' know? After a few months, or years..... people around
    you still see you walking around, and they treat you like they
    did before. You still regain the sense of your naked mortality,
    but they see you as fully dressed, alive and well, and going to
    live forever. So they'll say HI, or Thanks, or Seeya, some other
    time, because they're too busy right now. Cancer hasn't taught
    them a thing, but it continues to teach you everything.

    Thanks for the note! I am thrilled that you read my posts.
    Don't take 'em too seriously, though, OK? I've been known
    to drive people insane.

    Stay well!!

    John
  • TMac52
    TMac52 Member Posts: 352
    John23 said:

    Tom -
    Tom -

    No need to be nervous and full of worry. You weren't nervous and full of
    worry about getting cancer before you actually had cancer, right?

    Adhesions and hernias are common after any intensive abdominal
    surgery. They told me I had many, right after the operation, but
    none bothered me. I had absolutely no problems with digestion,
    no pains, no bloating, no obstructions, not in four years - Well, until
    now, that is. I know some individuals that never had a problem
    after abdominal surgery, but are they among the "common"?

    The adhesions are varied in type, and some can grow, and shrink,
    and in the process, they mess up the intestines. The intestines
    should float free inside us, bending and moving as needed. When
    a section is restrained, it can cause it to bind, or kink, and that's
    where you can get an obstruction. A hernia can trap part of the
    intestine, and keep it from moving, just as an adhesion can. And a
    hernia can happen at any time, since the muscles have been cut,
    and moved, and weakened somewhat; It doesn't take too much.

    The bottom line Tom, is forget about it. If you get an obstruction,
    you'll know the signs, and know a little about how to deal with it.
    Most of us have learned the hard way. No doctor ever told
    me what to expect, or what to do. I guess they figure that you'll
    get into the ER and they'll do the teaching. Either that, or they didn't
    figure we'd live long enough to suffer the consequences of surgery?
    (haha, probably)

    What you appear to be suffering from, sounds more to be related
    with the type of surgical procedures involved with rectal surgery.
    You might want to sign in on the UOAA web site, and see what
    they think. It's a great forum/board for ostomates of every type,
    and intestinal operations before and after an ostomy. Most are there
    not due to cancer, but the info will be of help to you anyway!

    Greg -
    Re:
    "I wonder why some surgeries cause these adhesions and others don't."

    From my understanding, adhesions form after any surgery; most
    may not be of concern, while some will be. After four long years,
    I really didn't think I would have to be concerned; I guess I was
    wrong. As we age, things inside us settle, and with the "settling",
    comes twists and kinks that weren't there before. Muscles relax,
    and a part of an intestine can pop through. What can I say?
    I still rather get old.

    Lisa -
    Re:
    "if I were you and not being able to eat a well balance diet,
    I would be having a serious talk with my doctor "


    Yup! That's exactly what I did. I went in and told her (my gastro doc)
    what's been happening. She ordered the CT, etc immediately, along
    with a CBC, CEA, etc. When it didn't isolate anything, she gave me
    the names of three surgeons that she knows. I did the research, and
    started with the best. I'll get second opinions, of course, but I know
    what to expect, well in advance.

    This last test still didn't isolate the section or the reason, and the
    radiologist said it might take being opened up to locate it. He did
    not feel any surgeon will do so, for a partial blockage. It's just
    too risky of an operation for something not all that threatening.

    Well...maybe, but they're not the ones in pain for days, and hanging
    off the side of the toilet at 3am.

    Plenty of nourishment can be had from soup, as well as foods
    without fiber. And eating meat doesn't seem to present a problem.
    It's anything that doesn't dissolve, that's a problem. So figuring
    out a diet to work around this mess, is the present goal.

    ---

    What I'm going through is a very, very minor thing, compared
    to Winter-Marie, John, Craig, Buzz, and everyone else! Mine is
    just a surgical mess, and it can be fixed..... so please guys.....

    Let's pour our hopes and prayers to the guys that really need them.

    I'll do fine!

    Thanks for caring. I really do appreciate it!

    John

    Thanks
    Thanks so much John. I'm kinda sick of worrying anyway!!!
  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900 Member
    the devil is in the detail. I hate the fine print
    John

    the devil is in the detail. I hate the fine print.
    we never really get told the full details in a meaningful way and the fine print is really really small.

    this is another post I will lock away and treasure. all these little time bombs, waiting to go off. the hernia, blockages, depression, dehydration won't kill us hopefully , just make life hell for a bit.

    it makes the good weeks more precious.

    so main hay while the sun shines, for when it rains it poors and you may drown.
    I hope this is not to abstract.

    my onc prescribed me some antidepressants so I to worried about side effects. fun i thought. I was worried about being to positive.

    I hope you got some healthy soup. Did you see my post about slippery elm for relieving blockages and helping diarrhea.

    all the best,

    Pete
  • dasspears
    dasspears Member Posts: 227
    John23 said:

    Tom -
    Tom -

    No need to be nervous and full of worry. You weren't nervous and full of
    worry about getting cancer before you actually had cancer, right?

    Adhesions and hernias are common after any intensive abdominal
    surgery. They told me I had many, right after the operation, but
    none bothered me. I had absolutely no problems with digestion,
    no pains, no bloating, no obstructions, not in four years - Well, until
    now, that is. I know some individuals that never had a problem
    after abdominal surgery, but are they among the "common"?

    The adhesions are varied in type, and some can grow, and shrink,
    and in the process, they mess up the intestines. The intestines
    should float free inside us, bending and moving as needed. When
    a section is restrained, it can cause it to bind, or kink, and that's
    where you can get an obstruction. A hernia can trap part of the
    intestine, and keep it from moving, just as an adhesion can. And a
    hernia can happen at any time, since the muscles have been cut,
    and moved, and weakened somewhat; It doesn't take too much.

    The bottom line Tom, is forget about it. If you get an obstruction,
    you'll know the signs, and know a little about how to deal with it.
    Most of us have learned the hard way. No doctor ever told
    me what to expect, or what to do. I guess they figure that you'll
    get into the ER and they'll do the teaching. Either that, or they didn't
    figure we'd live long enough to suffer the consequences of surgery?
    (haha, probably)

    What you appear to be suffering from, sounds more to be related
    with the type of surgical procedures involved with rectal surgery.
    You might want to sign in on the UOAA web site, and see what
    they think. It's a great forum/board for ostomates of every type,
    and intestinal operations before and after an ostomy. Most are there
    not due to cancer, but the info will be of help to you anyway!

    Greg -
    Re:
    "I wonder why some surgeries cause these adhesions and others don't."

    From my understanding, adhesions form after any surgery; most
    may not be of concern, while some will be. After four long years,
    I really didn't think I would have to be concerned; I guess I was
    wrong. As we age, things inside us settle, and with the "settling",
    comes twists and kinks that weren't there before. Muscles relax,
    and a part of an intestine can pop through. What can I say?
    I still rather get old.

    Lisa -
    Re:
    "if I were you and not being able to eat a well balance diet,
    I would be having a serious talk with my doctor "


    Yup! That's exactly what I did. I went in and told her (my gastro doc)
    what's been happening. She ordered the CT, etc immediately, along
    with a CBC, CEA, etc. When it didn't isolate anything, she gave me
    the names of three surgeons that she knows. I did the research, and
    started with the best. I'll get second opinions, of course, but I know
    what to expect, well in advance.

    This last test still didn't isolate the section or the reason, and the
    radiologist said it might take being opened up to locate it. He did
    not feel any surgeon will do so, for a partial blockage. It's just
    too risky of an operation for something not all that threatening.

    Well...maybe, but they're not the ones in pain for days, and hanging
    off the side of the toilet at 3am.

    Plenty of nourishment can be had from soup, as well as foods
    without fiber. And eating meat doesn't seem to present a problem.
    It's anything that doesn't dissolve, that's a problem. So figuring
    out a diet to work around this mess, is the present goal.

    ---

    What I'm going through is a very, very minor thing, compared
    to Winter-Marie, John, Craig, Buzz, and everyone else! Mine is
    just a surgical mess, and it can be fixed..... so please guys.....

    Let's pour our hopes and prayers to the guys that really need them.

    I'll do fine!

    Thanks for caring. I really do appreciate it!

    John

    alcohol and carbonated beverages....
    Your comment is very interesting. Occasionally, I enjoy a glass or two of wine or beer and inevitably end up with gas. I don't drink carbonated beverages - maybe a cherry Coke once every 2-3 months. I now understand why alcohol bothers me. I think I'll read more about this issue. Thanks!
  • Erinb
    Erinb Member Posts: 293
    It takes many people years
    It takes many people years (or never) to find out what is causing their sensitivities, depression, mental fogginess, rash...whatever it may be. Good for you to catch it almost immediately. No more MSG.

    What about GMO foods: corn oil, rapeseed oil? What is left to eat?
    I don't know what 'healthy eating' is anymore. Now I am drinking raw milk, mostly local organic foods. Have you ever heard of Kombucha? I like it for its flavor since I have given up pop, but it may have health benefits.

    I hope you feel better!
    Erin
  • John23
    John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member
    Erinb said:

    It takes many people years
    It takes many people years (or never) to find out what is causing their sensitivities, depression, mental fogginess, rash...whatever it may be. Good for you to catch it almost immediately. No more MSG.

    What about GMO foods: corn oil, rapeseed oil? What is left to eat?
    I don't know what 'healthy eating' is anymore. Now I am drinking raw milk, mostly local organic foods. Have you ever heard of Kombucha? I like it for its flavor since I have given up pop, but it may have health benefits.

    I hope you feel better!
    Erin

    Erin -
    Oh good, I was hoping we'd get back to the topic of MSG, etc..

    A bunch of years ago, I was doing some telecommunications work
    at an apple farm in Massachusetts. The owner was showing me around,
    and we were talking about crops, and marketing, etc.

    Well.. the only difference between the regular apples and the
    high-priced organic ones, where the worms. With the organic,
    you got the worms; organic buyers like to see life in their food.

    I had to laugh back then, because it wasn't the only farm that I
    heard that story at. String beans, potatoes, lettuce... it didn't matter.
    It all came out of the same soil that'd been saturated with chemicals
    for years and years. And the manure that's spread to feed the
    plants, all come from the same cows and chickens, that are all
    fed the same hormones and antibiotics.

    Now, a manufacturer only has to list the chemicals they add,
    but not the chemicals in all the "food products" they buy to put
    in their product. The imported garbage can come from countries
    where there are no rules at all, and those products do not have
    to reveal what's in them. So your favorite brand can say
    "no hormones or chemicals added", but it can still be in the
    product anyway; they're not lying, because -they- didn't add it.

    You mentioned depression.... In Traditional Chinese Medicine,
    if a patient claims they feel depressed, anxious, or has symptoms
    of anger, etc, it points to what is called a "liver deficiency". The
    TCM physician will treat the patient for that liver deficiency, and
    the problem is usually remedied within a few treatments.

    In western medicine, they prescribe chemicals, ignoring that the
    liver will have to work harder to get the chemicals out, and the
    patient usually ends up having to take anti-depressant medications
    for their entire life. Have you ever noticed that they always warn
    of "liver problems" with those meds?

    If you've read at any of those links regarding MSG, you can also
    see the damage it does to the liver... always interesting stuff out there!

    My wife noticed today, while shopping for treats for our friend's
    pets, that dog treats are now carrying the term "corn sugar" as
    one of the main ingredients. That's the new FDA approved term
    for "High Fructose Corn Syrup".

    We can't even eat dog food now.....

    (what am I going to serve the guests?)

    Best wishes,

    John
  • AnneCan
    AnneCan Member Posts: 3,673 Member
    John23 said:

    Erin -
    Oh good, I was hoping we'd get back to the topic of MSG, etc..

    A bunch of years ago, I was doing some telecommunications work
    at an apple farm in Massachusetts. The owner was showing me around,
    and we were talking about crops, and marketing, etc.

    Well.. the only difference between the regular apples and the
    high-priced organic ones, where the worms. With the organic,
    you got the worms; organic buyers like to see life in their food.

    I had to laugh back then, because it wasn't the only farm that I
    heard that story at. String beans, potatoes, lettuce... it didn't matter.
    It all came out of the same soil that'd been saturated with chemicals
    for years and years. And the manure that's spread to feed the
    plants, all come from the same cows and chickens, that are all
    fed the same hormones and antibiotics.

    Now, a manufacturer only has to list the chemicals they add,
    but not the chemicals in all the "food products" they buy to put
    in their product. The imported garbage can come from countries
    where there are no rules at all, and those products do not have
    to reveal what's in them. So your favorite brand can say
    "no hormones or chemicals added", but it can still be in the
    product anyway; they're not lying, because -they- didn't add it.

    You mentioned depression.... In Traditional Chinese Medicine,
    if a patient claims they feel depressed, anxious, or has symptoms
    of anger, etc, it points to what is called a "liver deficiency". The
    TCM physician will treat the patient for that liver deficiency, and
    the problem is usually remedied within a few treatments.

    In western medicine, they prescribe chemicals, ignoring that the
    liver will have to work harder to get the chemicals out, and the
    patient usually ends up having to take anti-depressant medications
    for their entire life. Have you ever noticed that they always warn
    of "liver problems" with those meds?

    If you've read at any of those links regarding MSG, you can also
    see the damage it does to the liver... always interesting stuff out there!

    My wife noticed today, while shopping for treats for our friend's
    pets, that dog treats are now carrying the term "corn sugar" as
    one of the main ingredients. That's the new FDA approved term
    for "High Fructose Corn Syrup".

    We can't even eat dog food now.....

    (what am I going to serve the guests?)

    Best wishes,

    John

    John
    I like your sense of humour; even when talking serious stuff you lighten it up.
  • plh4gail
    plh4gail Member Posts: 1,238 Member
    AnneCan said:

    John
    I like your sense of humour; even when talking serious stuff you lighten it up.

    John and Anne
    I second that emotion :)