Interesting Article

thready
thready Member Posts: 474
edited March 2014 in Colorectal Cancer #1
Here is link to an interesting article about getting our immune systems to fight off cancer cells that are roaming about. Find it here: http://www.cancercompass.com/cancer-news/article/33475.htm?c=NL20100519

Take care,
Jan

Comments

  • This comment has been removed by the Moderator
  • tootsie1
    tootsie1 Member Posts: 5,044 Member
    Thanks
    Sounds good!

    *Hugs*
    Gail
  • robinvan
    robinvan Member Posts: 1,012
    Thanks Jan.
    It is truly amazing what they are coming up with. I've used a couple of life saving treatments that weren't available when I was first diagnosed. I'm currently being treated with Erbitux, and it seems to be working well.

    I look forward to the next generation of cancer fighting medicine. I too hope I'm around to benefit from some of it. Better yet, I hope I'm around but cured so that I don't need them!

    TTFN... Rob; in Vancouver
  • John23
    John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member
    Oxford Biomedical's "Trovax" was designed to do what this article
    talks about. It was looking like a great thing, until a major chemotherapy
    drug manufacturer invested into it.

    The company insisted on using the Immunotherapy drug as an
    adjunct to chemo, and it failed test after test.

    And why wouldn't it fail? It was designed to use one's immune system
    to fight the cancer, and the chemo weakens or destroys the immune
    system, rendering it too weak to fight.

    Prior to that, Trovax was showing fantastic results with various types
    of cancers, but the new "testing" also included testing on cancer from
    organs it hadn't been previously tested on.

    According to this article, we'll have to wait ten years....

    Even without cancer, at my age...... I probably won't be around to
    see this anyway.

    And we call ourselves "free".

    BAH
  • zenmonk
    zenmonk Member Posts: 198
    exciting article
    but it didnt really say what it was. is it just a theory, is it some nutritional program, or is it just some medicine?
  • John23
    John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member
    zenmonk said:

    exciting article
    but it didnt really say what it was. is it just a theory, is it some nutritional program, or is it just some medicine?

    Text


    "The problem: Many tumors don't have enough antigens to trigger the immune system. When tumors are small, the immune system is not properly activated, Gilboa says.

    "Oncology knows how to get rid of big tumors you can see and surgically remove or radiate," Gilboa said. "Most patients die when the disease spreads to areas we don't know about or can't access. This is where the immune system has the advantage."

    Gilboa and his team manipulated the body's DNA and RNA to induce the cancer cells scattered through the body to "express," or produce, more antigens. It makes them easier to spot by the immune system.

    In the lab, the process eliminated tumors in rats. "


    From here: CancerCompass


    I can't for the life of me, understand why this thousands of years old
    Chinese/Asian concept has been disregarded by western medicine for so long.




    (Oh wait.... money... and greed)
  • jscho
    jscho Member Posts: 62
    John23 said:

    Text


    "The problem: Many tumors don't have enough antigens to trigger the immune system. When tumors are small, the immune system is not properly activated, Gilboa says.

    "Oncology knows how to get rid of big tumors you can see and surgically remove or radiate," Gilboa said. "Most patients die when the disease spreads to areas we don't know about or can't access. This is where the immune system has the advantage."

    Gilboa and his team manipulated the body's DNA and RNA to induce the cancer cells scattered through the body to "express," or produce, more antigens. It makes them easier to spot by the immune system.

    In the lab, the process eliminated tumors in rats. "


    From here: CancerCompass


    I can't for the life of me, understand why this thousands of years old
    Chinese/Asian concept has been disregarded by western medicine for so long.




    (Oh wait.... money... and greed)

    chinese wisdom
    "I can't for the life of me, understand why this thousands of years old Chinese/Asian concept has been disregarded by western medicine for so long."

    I didn't know that using siRNA to inhibit nonsense-mediated messenger RNA decay was an "ancient Chinese secret".

    Seriously though, there are many research groups attempting to use immunology, which is widely recognized as a promising avenue for cancer therapeutics. There are inherent difficulties with the approach that have slowed the pace of progress.

    Hopefully something will come of this approach soon.

    I do agree with your general opinion that the body is a resilient and adaptable organism that has evolved many ways of naturally resisting disease, and that these are perhaps under-appreciated. Cancer also provides a vivid demonstration of natural selection and the role of mutations in evolution, including the way in which immunological resistance is acquired. It is a natural process.

    Best,
    Jeremy

    B
  • jscho said:

    chinese wisdom
    "I can't for the life of me, understand why this thousands of years old Chinese/Asian concept has been disregarded by western medicine for so long."

    I didn't know that using siRNA to inhibit nonsense-mediated messenger RNA decay was an "ancient Chinese secret".

    Seriously though, there are many research groups attempting to use immunology, which is widely recognized as a promising avenue for cancer therapeutics. There are inherent difficulties with the approach that have slowed the pace of progress.

    Hopefully something will come of this approach soon.

    I do agree with your general opinion that the body is a resilient and adaptable organism that has evolved many ways of naturally resisting disease, and that these are perhaps under-appreciated. Cancer also provides a vivid demonstration of natural selection and the role of mutations in evolution, including the way in which immunological resistance is acquired. It is a natural process.

    Best,
    Jeremy

    B

    This comment has been removed by the Moderator
  • coloCan
    coloCan Member Posts: 1,944 Member
    unknown said:

    This comment has been removed by the Moderator

    You gotta remember, that just as we want to live,
    so does the cancer and , like us, it will do what it takes to survive, adapting to the chemicals we use to kill it (like roaches get used to and then become immune to insecticides so others are devised)and doing what it can to defeat our immune systems and the other means of our defense. There is alot of research being done on cancer in general, CRC in particular but not nearly enough R&D money as needed; and the future will see more coming down with various types of cancer as more people live longer than ever before. Potential avenues of attack are vaccines (I believe one recently approved for another type, which I forget now, of cancer); nanotechnology-my personal favorite; immune system boosters; genetic/genome profiling, etc. Unfortunately for most of us, the time when any of this becomes readily available after being proven effective remains in the future. Much effort is devoted to find ways to attack the cancer with less collateral damage than currevtly available chemicals, the effects of which most of us have already experienced.,,,,,,steve
  • John23
    John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member
    jscho said:

    chinese wisdom
    "I can't for the life of me, understand why this thousands of years old Chinese/Asian concept has been disregarded by western medicine for so long."

    I didn't know that using siRNA to inhibit nonsense-mediated messenger RNA decay was an "ancient Chinese secret".

    Seriously though, there are many research groups attempting to use immunology, which is widely recognized as a promising avenue for cancer therapeutics. There are inherent difficulties with the approach that have slowed the pace of progress.

    Hopefully something will come of this approach soon.

    I do agree with your general opinion that the body is a resilient and adaptable organism that has evolved many ways of naturally resisting disease, and that these are perhaps under-appreciated. Cancer also provides a vivid demonstration of natural selection and the role of mutations in evolution, including the way in which immunological resistance is acquired. It is a natural process.

    Best,
    Jeremy

    B

    Jeremy -
    Actually...

    Re:
    "I didn't know that using siRNA to inhibit nonsense-mediated
    messenger RNA decay was an "ancient Chinese secret"."


    The "secret" is that the methods used in TCM can cause the
    cancer cells to release chemicals that the immune system seems
    to manage to identify as "foreign", causing the immune system to
    attack the cancer cells.

    The terminology of early TCM diagnosis and treatment do not
    include western medicine's terminology and "names" for specific
    body functions and/or health issues. That does not mean or infer
    that the early Chinese culture knew less than present day medicine
    men and their miracle drugs.

    I had been told that my Atrial Fibrillation could only be "fixed" by
    having a surgical treatment to score the inside of my arteries to dispel
    errant electrical energy.

    TCM treatment for that same malady consists of herbs and/or acupuncture
    to treat the liver for a deficiency. The deficiency causes irregular and
    sporadic heartbeats.

    Two of my western medicine physicians laughed at me when I
    described it, but agreed that the chemicals generated by the liver are
    indeed used by the brain to control and regulate the heart.

    My AF is totally cured, thanks to some herbs. It saved me from having
    an operation that commonly results in either an aneurysm at the point
    of scarring, or an area in that artery that blood clots habitually form.

    The nomenclature is be different, as are the methods of practice and
    the results.

    Western medicine's science dedicates itself to removing symptoms only,
    while TCM dedicates itself to removing the problem, and that in turn
    removes the symptoms of that problem.

    The options to cancer treatment remain; the alternatives to the money-mill
    are still there, just as they always have been. It only takes the courage to
    seek them out, and use them.

    I hope we all live long lives, in spite of the cancer within, and regardless
    of our paths taken.
  • jscho
    jscho Member Posts: 62
    John23 said:

    Jeremy -
    Actually...

    Re:
    "I didn't know that using siRNA to inhibit nonsense-mediated
    messenger RNA decay was an "ancient Chinese secret"."


    The "secret" is that the methods used in TCM can cause the
    cancer cells to release chemicals that the immune system seems
    to manage to identify as "foreign", causing the immune system to
    attack the cancer cells.

    The terminology of early TCM diagnosis and treatment do not
    include western medicine's terminology and "names" for specific
    body functions and/or health issues. That does not mean or infer
    that the early Chinese culture knew less than present day medicine
    men and their miracle drugs.

    I had been told that my Atrial Fibrillation could only be "fixed" by
    having a surgical treatment to score the inside of my arteries to dispel
    errant electrical energy.

    TCM treatment for that same malady consists of herbs and/or acupuncture
    to treat the liver for a deficiency. The deficiency causes irregular and
    sporadic heartbeats.

    Two of my western medicine physicians laughed at me when I
    described it, but agreed that the chemicals generated by the liver are
    indeed used by the brain to control and regulate the heart.

    My AF is totally cured, thanks to some herbs. It saved me from having
    an operation that commonly results in either an aneurysm at the point
    of scarring, or an area in that artery that blood clots habitually form.

    The nomenclature is be different, as are the methods of practice and
    the results.

    Western medicine's science dedicates itself to removing symptoms only,
    while TCM dedicates itself to removing the problem, and that in turn
    removes the symptoms of that problem.

    The options to cancer treatment remain; the alternatives to the money-mill
    are still there, just as they always have been. It only takes the courage to
    seek them out, and use them.

    I hope we all live long lives, in spite of the cancer within, and regardless
    of our paths taken.

    Interesting
    "The "secret" is that the methods used in TCM can cause the cancer cells to release chemicals that the immune system seems to manage to identify as "foreign", causing the immune system to attack the cancer cells."

    John23, this is quite interesting. Is it documented somewhere? How did you come across this information?

    I used a TCM practitioner before and throughout my chemo treatment. My practitioner was actually a cancer researcher before opening her clinic:
    http://www.xiaolanhealthcentre.com/

    Incidentally, she was fully supportive of me pursuing western treatment (i.e. chemo).

    There is lots of TCM available here in Toronto because of the large Chinese population.

    Best,
    Jeremy
  • John23
    John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member
    jscho said:

    Interesting
    "The "secret" is that the methods used in TCM can cause the cancer cells to release chemicals that the immune system seems to manage to identify as "foreign", causing the immune system to attack the cancer cells."

    John23, this is quite interesting. Is it documented somewhere? How did you come across this information?

    I used a TCM practitioner before and throughout my chemo treatment. My practitioner was actually a cancer researcher before opening her clinic:
    http://www.xiaolanhealthcentre.com/

    Incidentally, she was fully supportive of me pursuing western treatment (i.e. chemo).

    There is lots of TCM available here in Toronto because of the large Chinese population.

    Best,
    Jeremy

    Jeremy -


    There are as many different practitioners of TCM as there are of
    western medicine.

    The orthodox TCM practitioner disregards most of western medicine's
    titling of various malady, and confines belief and diagnosis to the
    most basic terms.

    Wind, fire, dampness, etc are all expressions of what is happening
    inside our bodies according to orthodox TCM. The inclusion of
    western medicine practices and terminology was due to the public
    demand for faster remedies and a more "professional" western medicine
    sound to their diagnosis and treatment.

    We get sick over a long period of decline of health, and expecting to
    "feel better within the hour" after years of suffering, is the western medicine
    modus operandi.

    Getting rid of symptoms is easier than fixing the actual problem,
    and fixing the actual problem can take almost as much time as it
    took to get to that sorry stage. Most people can't wait that long,
    and want to know in a word they can understand, what they have
    and how fast it can be fixed.

    That's why we have western medicine's high blood pressure pill,
    and now TCM's herbs that will do essentially the same thing.

    It's unfortunate that it gets headed in that direction, since many
    TCM practitioners are giving patients a quick cure, and the patients
    aren't sticking around for the real cure. Hey, the pain's gone,
    the BP is fine, seeya' later. For some TCM practitioners, it's
    become only a branch of western medicine.

    That said......

    I listed twice on this forum, some herbs that are well known to
    kill cancer cells. I hate to keep doing that, for fear of being tossed
    out. No, not paranoia, reality! The FDA got the FCC to penalize
    web sites that were claiming herbs would kill cancer. Numerous
    very informative web sites that were not selling a thing, are no
    longer around. Thankfully, our government has no control in
    other countries, and other informative websites are still available.

    If you do a search for the list here, I' sure you'll find it. If not, I'll
    post a link to it for you, in a PM.

    Oh wait.. here: http://csn.cancer.org/node/183225

    It has now been realized by modern science, that when cancer cells
    die, they release chemicals that aren't normally in our system in
    great abundance. Our immune system, when working properly,
    identifies the rogue dying cell, and promptly finishes it off.

    Then, remarkably, the immune system continues on, killing cells
    that have those chemicals that it has already identified as rogue.

    TCM's herbs that kill cancer cells, also help build the immune system
    to enable it to continue the fight against cancer cells.

    Is it 100%? Of course not. What in life is? Does it have side effects?
    No. Does it cause cancer? No. Does it weaken your immune system?
    silly question... no, just the opposite.

    Now, western medicine research (as indicated in some other posts)
    is headed into the direction of TCM, by attempting to formulate
    compounds that will cause a cell to die and release it's chemicals,
    allowing the immune system to do the work.

    To me, it sounds awfully familiar to what's been practiced for
    thousands of years in another culture.....

    If one has a tumor that is life endangering if not removed quickly
    (as I had), then surgery, radiation, chemo, anything that will
    fix the immediate problem, has to be the resolution. If an herb will
    work that fast, great.... but I personally don't know of any that's
    taken in a decoction, that can. There are some herbs that are
    injected into the tumor or blood system directly that might work,
    but I have no personal experience or information to share.

    Anyway, I hope I answered the question?

    Better health!

    John
  • jscho
    jscho Member Posts: 62
    John23 said:

    Jeremy -


    There are as many different practitioners of TCM as there are of
    western medicine.

    The orthodox TCM practitioner disregards most of western medicine's
    titling of various malady, and confines belief and diagnosis to the
    most basic terms.

    Wind, fire, dampness, etc are all expressions of what is happening
    inside our bodies according to orthodox TCM. The inclusion of
    western medicine practices and terminology was due to the public
    demand for faster remedies and a more "professional" western medicine
    sound to their diagnosis and treatment.

    We get sick over a long period of decline of health, and expecting to
    "feel better within the hour" after years of suffering, is the western medicine
    modus operandi.

    Getting rid of symptoms is easier than fixing the actual problem,
    and fixing the actual problem can take almost as much time as it
    took to get to that sorry stage. Most people can't wait that long,
    and want to know in a word they can understand, what they have
    and how fast it can be fixed.

    That's why we have western medicine's high blood pressure pill,
    and now TCM's herbs that will do essentially the same thing.

    It's unfortunate that it gets headed in that direction, since many
    TCM practitioners are giving patients a quick cure, and the patients
    aren't sticking around for the real cure. Hey, the pain's gone,
    the BP is fine, seeya' later. For some TCM practitioners, it's
    become only a branch of western medicine.

    That said......

    I listed twice on this forum, some herbs that are well known to
    kill cancer cells. I hate to keep doing that, for fear of being tossed
    out. No, not paranoia, reality! The FDA got the FCC to penalize
    web sites that were claiming herbs would kill cancer. Numerous
    very informative web sites that were not selling a thing, are no
    longer around. Thankfully, our government has no control in
    other countries, and other informative websites are still available.

    If you do a search for the list here, I' sure you'll find it. If not, I'll
    post a link to it for you, in a PM.

    Oh wait.. here: http://csn.cancer.org/node/183225

    It has now been realized by modern science, that when cancer cells
    die, they release chemicals that aren't normally in our system in
    great abundance. Our immune system, when working properly,
    identifies the rogue dying cell, and promptly finishes it off.

    Then, remarkably, the immune system continues on, killing cells
    that have those chemicals that it has already identified as rogue.

    TCM's herbs that kill cancer cells, also help build the immune system
    to enable it to continue the fight against cancer cells.

    Is it 100%? Of course not. What in life is? Does it have side effects?
    No. Does it cause cancer? No. Does it weaken your immune system?
    silly question... no, just the opposite.

    Now, western medicine research (as indicated in some other posts)
    is headed into the direction of TCM, by attempting to formulate
    compounds that will cause a cell to die and release it's chemicals,
    allowing the immune system to do the work.

    To me, it sounds awfully familiar to what's been practiced for
    thousands of years in another culture.....

    If one has a tumor that is life endangering if not removed quickly
    (as I had), then surgery, radiation, chemo, anything that will
    fix the immediate problem, has to be the resolution. If an herb will
    work that fast, great.... but I personally don't know of any that's
    taken in a decoction, that can. There are some herbs that are
    injected into the tumor or blood system directly that might work,
    but I have no personal experience or information to share.

    Anyway, I hope I answered the question?

    Better health!

    John

    Thanks for your
    Thanks for your clarification John. I was hoping for a more "western science" answer, as that is my background (I deal with molecular biology in my work). I thought that perhaps this connection between cell death and an immune response had been published in science journals.

    I'm not sure what "chemicals" the dying cells emit that you are referring to, but there are things like the tumor necrosis factors and particularly the Fas ligand that directly activate receptors that start cell suicide. Often dying cells trigger the death of neighboring cells using these (i.e. inter-cellular communication), but this isn't really an immune response. Immunology is incredibly complex, but usually there are antigen-detecting antibodies or receptors on T-cells and NK cells that identify foreign or "rogue" cells and become activated. This activation leads to the full panoply of immune response whereby foreign cells can be blown apart. Surviving cancer cells typically develop mechanisms of bypassing both the T-cell and NK-cell responses by producing and releasing proteins that turn off NK cells while giving T-cells lots of binding sequences by over-expressing the MHC that bring peptide fragments to the cell surface. This is one of the things that must be overcome in developing an immunological therapy.

    Can you frame your response in this kind of language to help me understand?

    Thanks for the link to the Chinese herbs. This gives me a string to tug on to find out how some of them may work from a western perspective.

    Best,
    Jeremy
  • John23
    John23 Member Posts: 2,122 Member
    jscho said:

    Thanks for your
    Thanks for your clarification John. I was hoping for a more "western science" answer, as that is my background (I deal with molecular biology in my work). I thought that perhaps this connection between cell death and an immune response had been published in science journals.

    I'm not sure what "chemicals" the dying cells emit that you are referring to, but there are things like the tumor necrosis factors and particularly the Fas ligand that directly activate receptors that start cell suicide. Often dying cells trigger the death of neighboring cells using these (i.e. inter-cellular communication), but this isn't really an immune response. Immunology is incredibly complex, but usually there are antigen-detecting antibodies or receptors on T-cells and NK cells that identify foreign or "rogue" cells and become activated. This activation leads to the full panoply of immune response whereby foreign cells can be blown apart. Surviving cancer cells typically develop mechanisms of bypassing both the T-cell and NK-cell responses by producing and releasing proteins that turn off NK cells while giving T-cells lots of binding sequences by over-expressing the MHC that bring peptide fragments to the cell surface. This is one of the things that must be overcome in developing an immunological therapy.

    Can you frame your response in this kind of language to help me understand?

    Thanks for the link to the Chinese herbs. This gives me a string to tug on to find out how some of them may work from a western perspective.

    Best,
    Jeremy

    I'm sorry I missed my last Mensa meeting....


    Re:
    "there are antigen-detecting antibodies or receptors on T-cells
    and NK cells that identify foreign or "rogue" cells and become
    activated. This activation leads to the full panoply of immune
    response whereby foreign cells can be blown apart. Surviving
    cancer cells typically develop mechanisms of bypassing both the
    T-cell and NK-cell responses by producing and releasing proteins
    that turn off NK cells while giving T-cells lots of binding sequences
    by over-expressing the MHC that bring peptide fragments to the cell surface.

    Can you frame your response in this kind of language to help me understand?"


    Yes. In fact, I'll type it exactly the way I read yours:

    有抗原檢測抗體或受體的T細胞和NK細胞識別外來或“無賴”,成為激活細胞。
    這充分活化導致的免疫反應,使一整套外來細胞可以被吹除。癌症存活下來
    的細胞通常都繞過發展機制的T細胞和NK細胞產生和釋放的回應蛋白質關閉
    NK細胞,同時給予 T細胞大量的結合序列過度表達的MHC是帶來肽片段到細胞表面。
    (Seriously.... you're kidding, right?)

    Here's a few that might interest you:
    http://www.nature.com/cdd/journal/v15/n1/full/4402267a.html
    http://www.lef.org/protocols/cancer/cancer_vaccines_01.htm
    http://www.cbcrp.org/research/PageGrant.asp?grant_id=2646

    Your comment:
    "I thought that perhaps this connection between cell death and an
    immune response had been published in science journals."


    The topic of cell death and immune response is in many journals, but
    we're talking about the death of a cancer cell, and how the chemicals
    of that cell can energize the immune response.

    That concept is in the journals as well....

    It's accepted that the cancer cell releases CEA when it dies,
    hence the rise in CEA during chemotherapy or radiation treatments.
    Other products are also released, and those, like CEA, are not
    usually normal to our system. So the concept is, that once the
    immune system "sees" these chemicals, it attacks the source, and
    in this case, the source is cancer cells.

    Why the immune system doesn't "see" those products prior to the
    cancer cell dying, might be due to the low level of chemicals that
    the cancer cell is giving off while it is staying alive via fermentation.
    The increased amount that's released when it expires, may be what's
    providing a clearer signal to the immune system.

    "Teaching" the immune system to attack isn't a new concept,
    or a rare concept; Immunotherapy is based on that concept.

    By the way, it might interest you to know that Merck has been
    experimenting with one of those herbs on my list with hopes of
    synthesizing it.

    Their problem will be in finding the exact component that actually
    kills cancer cells, since the one herb alone will not do it; the herb
    must be used with a second herb to accomplish the action.

    It's not unusual to find a major chemotherapy company investing
    millions into something that is destined to fail with their testing.

    We once called incidents like that "job security".

    It's about the money, Jeremy; I truly believe that.


    Stay well, my friend.
  • jscho
    jscho Member Posts: 62
    John23 said:

    I'm sorry I missed my last Mensa meeting....


    Re:
    "there are antigen-detecting antibodies or receptors on T-cells
    and NK cells that identify foreign or "rogue" cells and become
    activated. This activation leads to the full panoply of immune
    response whereby foreign cells can be blown apart. Surviving
    cancer cells typically develop mechanisms of bypassing both the
    T-cell and NK-cell responses by producing and releasing proteins
    that turn off NK cells while giving T-cells lots of binding sequences
    by over-expressing the MHC that bring peptide fragments to the cell surface.

    Can you frame your response in this kind of language to help me understand?"


    Yes. In fact, I'll type it exactly the way I read yours:

    有抗原檢測抗體或受體的T細胞和NK細胞識別外來或“無賴”,成為激活細胞。
    這充分活化導致的免疫反應,使一整套外來細胞可以被吹除。癌症存活下來
    的細胞通常都繞過發展機制的T細胞和NK細胞產生和釋放的回應蛋白質關閉
    NK細胞,同時給予 T細胞大量的結合序列過度表達的MHC是帶來肽片段到細胞表面。
    (Seriously.... you're kidding, right?)

    Here's a few that might interest you:
    http://www.nature.com/cdd/journal/v15/n1/full/4402267a.html
    http://www.lef.org/protocols/cancer/cancer_vaccines_01.htm
    http://www.cbcrp.org/research/PageGrant.asp?grant_id=2646

    Your comment:
    "I thought that perhaps this connection between cell death and an
    immune response had been published in science journals."


    The topic of cell death and immune response is in many journals, but
    we're talking about the death of a cancer cell, and how the chemicals
    of that cell can energize the immune response.

    That concept is in the journals as well....

    It's accepted that the cancer cell releases CEA when it dies,
    hence the rise in CEA during chemotherapy or radiation treatments.
    Other products are also released, and those, like CEA, are not
    usually normal to our system. So the concept is, that once the
    immune system "sees" these chemicals, it attacks the source, and
    in this case, the source is cancer cells.

    Why the immune system doesn't "see" those products prior to the
    cancer cell dying, might be due to the low level of chemicals that
    the cancer cell is giving off while it is staying alive via fermentation.
    The increased amount that's released when it expires, may be what's
    providing a clearer signal to the immune system.

    "Teaching" the immune system to attack isn't a new concept,
    or a rare concept; Immunotherapy is based on that concept.

    By the way, it might interest you to know that Merck has been
    experimenting with one of those herbs on my list with hopes of
    synthesizing it.

    Their problem will be in finding the exact component that actually
    kills cancer cells, since the one herb alone will not do it; the herb
    must be used with a second herb to accomplish the action.

    It's not unusual to find a major chemotherapy company investing
    millions into something that is destined to fail with their testing.

    We once called incidents like that "job security".

    It's about the money, Jeremy; I truly believe that.


    Stay well, my friend.

    Thanks for the links
    "有抗原檢測抗體或受體的T細胞和NK細胞識別外來或“無賴”,成為激活細胞。
    這充分活化導致的免疫反應,使一整套外來細胞可以被吹除。癌症存活下來
    的細胞通常都繞過發展機制的T細胞和NK細胞產生和釋放的回應蛋白質關閉
    NK細胞,同時給予 T細胞大量的結合序列過度表達的MHC是帶來肽片段到細胞表面。
    (Seriously.... you're kidding, right?)"

    Ha! That was funny. How do you get those characters to appear? It is a translation of my text, right?

    "Here's a few that might interest you:
    http://www.nature.com/cdd/journal/v15/n1/full/4402267a.html
    http://www.lef.org/protocols/cancer/cancer_vaccines_01.htm
    http://www.cbcrp.org/research/PageGrant.asp?grant_id=2646"

    Thanks for these!

    "Why the immune system doesn't "see" those products prior to the
    cancer cell dying, might be due to the low level of chemicals that
    the cancer cell is giving off while it is staying alive via fermentation.
    The increased amount that's released when it expires, may be what's
    providing a clearer signal to the immune system."

    I rather doubt this is important, as the immune system can respond and amplify a response to small concentrations of pathogens. I think many other hypotheses are analyzed in the links you posted, which I'll look at.

    "It's about the money, Jeremy; I truly believe that."

    I know you have stated this before. Although I don't post much here, we've had that conversation!

    "Stay well, my friend."

    Thanks! Best wishes to you as well.
    Jeremy