Why are people compelled to write about their religious beliefs in the specific cancer forums?
Comments
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Been awhile...bluerose said:Yuppers Hondo
Sure can.
Hi Bluerose! Hope you are doing well. Did you ever move out of the place you were living at? Or did the "property managers" concede that they were being cruel?
I pray you are doing well. I have been moving forward in my journey, with "eyes wide open"! So many realizations and "aha" moments.
We are in a drought and my roses only bloomed once. Hoping fall will allow them to bloom at least one more time!
Take care, dear one.
Lucy0 -
Hey Lucy !!!!!!!!!luz del lago said:Been awhile...
Hi Bluerose! Hope you are doing well. Did you ever move out of the place you were living at? Or did the "property managers" concede that they were being cruel?
I pray you are doing well. I have been moving forward in my journey, with "eyes wide open"! So many realizations and "aha" moments.
We are in a drought and my roses only bloomed once. Hoping fall will allow them to bloom at least one more time!
Take care, dear one.
Lucy
I was wondering where you had gone to, glad to see you posting.
YES I MOVED. YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSS. Actually I got the apt I have been looking for for many years, right on the river. It is in the city but is right across the street from our big river here and each morning I wake up to the first birdy singing and then many more join in for a morning symphony. It's like waking up at a big lake everyday. lol. It's so peaceful. There is a fairly busy road infront of the river between me and the river but it's not super busy and somehow with the view of the river and rapids that I have I can't really hear the traffic and after about 8pm the traffic dies right down to almost nothing so that's good. I have a balcony and have furnished it so spending time out there, just like a backyard which is great in an apt.
I moved in mid May and I didn't realize just how much stress that last place I lived in was and the management in this new place is HUMAN. Can you imagin that? lol. Actually the people in this complex are more like a friendly community rather than an apt building. In the old building you hardly got a 'hello' in the hall but here people stop you and remember about something you had said the time before and asked about my sick cat's health and it's just lovely. It is kind of pricey though so hopefully I can stay here for the long haul, it's really wonderful. Best decision I made in a long time. Thanks for asking.
We are in the middle of a heatwave too, it gets very humid here but hopefully that will die down in a couple of weeks, I hope. I have an AC unit in my bedroom and it does a good job of making things tolerable.
Healh wise I am about the same but had a bit of a scare when I was having my breast ultrasound about a month ago. Apparently they found a lymph node in my right breast and seems that lymph nodes aren't supposed to be in your boobs. lol. However they have seen them there in other women now and again, just isn't a normal thing. So I want a needle biopsy done to make sure all is okay and they said considering my history probably not a bad plan seeing I can't have mammograms after all my treatments - nerve damage. So next week is the biopsy, ick. I postponed all of my doctor's appointments for the move as a gift to myself and wow what a vacation to not have any doctors for a whole month. Of course that lovely month is over and so I am now up to my neck in specialists, ick again. lol. Oh well, one at a time. Oh by the way all the docs said there are no markers in the lymph node to say this thing is malignant so whew, let's hope it stays that way.
My cat, the Vet thinks, has a brain tumor though, sigh. She all of a sudden just couldn't walk and her eyes were going spinny and I think she had a stroke. Sigh. Then a week later she had another one but is rallying so I guess she is a survivor too. lol. She walks very wonky and her head is tilted with after effects of the stroke perhaps, I have been playing nurse to her. The Vet said this can go on for a long time, like our tumors can. Sigh. I won't put her down though unless she is in pain or very depressed with her condition, she will let me know when it's time.
Anywho I hope you are doing well. Good to see you back. Sorry about your roses, stupid climate changes eh? lol
Take good care kid and talk to you soon.
Hugs,
Bluerose0 -
Yuppers PhilPhillieG said:HI Bluerose
That experience must have given you a great sense of peace.
That's wonderful.
-phil
Peace? Yes but more importantly confirmation that yes there is indeed something much bigger than we are helping us to stear our course in life and always there for us. I mean I believed without the healing but that was a heck of a validation. lol. I find experiences like this that come right out of the blue to people who aren't looking for them to happen (maybe talking themselves into 'experiences' like this) are the most significant. I am not a religious person at all, spiritutual though.
Also it gave me the peace that as the voice said 'it wouldn't be back'. That's not to say I can't get a cancer again, PRAY THAT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN EVERYDAY, but for that cancer that time that one was indeed gone so I didn't have that constant 'what if it comes back?' never did. That's a gift all by itself.
Like i said before, I just wish everyone could have experienced what I did.
Take care Phil
Bluerose0 -
ImpressedPhillieG said:HI Bluerose
That experience must have given you a great sense of peace.
That's wonderful.
-phil
I have been a member for over a year, but I am definitely not a regular to ANY online forum, and I am sure that I have been guilty of breaking "the rules" in the past. Maybe not about a religious issue, but probably at least bad form, like completely straying from topic. (Like now, for instance.) I usually get on these forums either when I cant sleep, or when I am in "panic" mode, like right before a PET scan or a biopsy, because I think only others who have experienced it can really offer some meaningful comfort. Anyway, I have stayed up all night reading various boards and I must say, there are certainly ALOT of articulate people who post here! Whether I agree with what yall say, or disagree, I sure do admire your command of the English language, Phil and Chris, Hondo, Bluerose, and others whose names I cant remember.
I am Christian, and I live in an area where almost everyone is conservative, Protestant Christian. I remember being at church when I was first diagnosed, and one of the well-respected ladies of the church asked me what did I think God was punishing me for. I was very taken aback! It had not even occured to me that might be being PUNISHED. I see my cancer as Gods way of saving me or someone I love from an even worse fate. Maybe if I hadnt taken chemo for breast cancer, which I am surviving, I would now have a cancer with a worse prognosis or worse survival scenario. Maybe my bout with cancer will be the factor that helps my child decide to become a doctor or scientist, and thereby save MANY people from a fate worse than cancer. Anyway, I shared this to say, it takes all sorts of people to make the world go around, and even those of my own faith, in my own CHURCH, have views that vary significantly from me. I sure dont wish eternal damnation on anyone because we disagree. My idea of being Christian is to take as many people to Heaven with me as I can, even the ones I dont really like,lol! If I "preach" to anyone, its because I love almost everyone I meet, and I want them to go to Heaven some day.
I have never been offended by anything religious I have read on this or any other site, but I guess, since I am in the "majority," that just makes sense. I love reading about other religions and was glad to see this forum, and I am very impressed. Since I had chemo and lost every shred of hormones, I lost about 15 IQ points, so I am a little jealous. I sure enjoy reading the posts here. Yall are gonna have to do a whole lot worse than insult my religion every so often to get rid of me.0 -
soblest6 said:
Impressed
I have been a member for over a year, but I am definitely not a regular to ANY online forum, and I am sure that I have been guilty of breaking "the rules" in the past. Maybe not about a religious issue, but probably at least bad form, like completely straying from topic. (Like now, for instance.) I usually get on these forums either when I cant sleep, or when I am in "panic" mode, like right before a PET scan or a biopsy, because I think only others who have experienced it can really offer some meaningful comfort. Anyway, I have stayed up all night reading various boards and I must say, there are certainly ALOT of articulate people who post here! Whether I agree with what yall say, or disagree, I sure do admire your command of the English language, Phil and Chris, Hondo, Bluerose, and others whose names I cant remember.
I am Christian, and I live in an area where almost everyone is conservative, Protestant Christian. I remember being at church when I was first diagnosed, and one of the well-respected ladies of the church asked me what did I think God was punishing me for. I was very taken aback! It had not even occured to me that might be being PUNISHED. I see my cancer as Gods way of saving me or someone I love from an even worse fate. Maybe if I hadnt taken chemo for breast cancer, which I am surviving, I would now have a cancer with a worse prognosis or worse survival scenario. Maybe my bout with cancer will be the factor that helps my child decide to become a doctor or scientist, and thereby save MANY people from a fate worse than cancer. Anyway, I shared this to say, it takes all sorts of people to make the world go around, and even those of my own faith, in my own CHURCH, have views that vary significantly from me. I sure dont wish eternal damnation on anyone because we disagree. My idea of being Christian is to take as many people to Heaven with me as I can, even the ones I dont really like,lol! If I "preach" to anyone, its because I love almost everyone I meet, and I want them to go to Heaven some day.
I have never been offended by anything religious I have read on this or any other site, but I guess, since I am in the "majority," that just makes sense. I love reading about other religions and was glad to see this forum, and I am very impressed. Since I had chemo and lost every shred of hormones, I lost about 15 IQ points, so I am a little jealous. I sure enjoy reading the posts here. Yall are gonna have to do a whole lot worse than insult my religion every so often to get rid of me.
Welcome aboard, sobles!
A very nice read that introduces you in a wonderful way.
Take care,
Joe0 -
?Hondo said:Hi Bluerose
Faith can move a mountain
Hondo
Can faith cut my grass?0 -
Joe,soccerfreaks said:?
Can faith cut my grass?
Pray on it a while and find out.
:Smile:
Hope you are doing well,
Blake0 -
Hi Soblestsoblest6 said:Impressed
I have been a member for over a year, but I am definitely not a regular to ANY online forum, and I am sure that I have been guilty of breaking "the rules" in the past. Maybe not about a religious issue, but probably at least bad form, like completely straying from topic. (Like now, for instance.) I usually get on these forums either when I cant sleep, or when I am in "panic" mode, like right before a PET scan or a biopsy, because I think only others who have experienced it can really offer some meaningful comfort. Anyway, I have stayed up all night reading various boards and I must say, there are certainly ALOT of articulate people who post here! Whether I agree with what yall say, or disagree, I sure do admire your command of the English language, Phil and Chris, Hondo, Bluerose, and others whose names I cant remember.
I am Christian, and I live in an area where almost everyone is conservative, Protestant Christian. I remember being at church when I was first diagnosed, and one of the well-respected ladies of the church asked me what did I think God was punishing me for. I was very taken aback! It had not even occured to me that might be being PUNISHED. I see my cancer as Gods way of saving me or someone I love from an even worse fate. Maybe if I hadnt taken chemo for breast cancer, which I am surviving, I would now have a cancer with a worse prognosis or worse survival scenario. Maybe my bout with cancer will be the factor that helps my child decide to become a doctor or scientist, and thereby save MANY people from a fate worse than cancer. Anyway, I shared this to say, it takes all sorts of people to make the world go around, and even those of my own faith, in my own CHURCH, have views that vary significantly from me. I sure dont wish eternal damnation on anyone because we disagree. My idea of being Christian is to take as many people to Heaven with me as I can, even the ones I dont really like,lol! If I "preach" to anyone, its because I love almost everyone I meet, and I want them to go to Heaven some day.
I have never been offended by anything religious I have read on this or any other site, but I guess, since I am in the "majority," that just makes sense. I love reading about other religions and was glad to see this forum, and I am very impressed. Since I had chemo and lost every shred of hormones, I lost about 15 IQ points, so I am a little jealous. I sure enjoy reading the posts here. Yall are gonna have to do a whole lot worse than insult my religion every so often to get rid of me.
It is sad to say that some people believe that wend someone gets sick it is God who is doing it. That mythology or theology goes all the back to the dark ages, we see it also in the insurance companies calling an act of nature an act of God. I can never figure out why people blame God for everything. My cancer was to be my cancer good or bad it was to be part of my life and I use it to help others who are going through cancer. Maybe in heaven someday I will know the real reason for me having cancer, but for now I can accept doing what I can to help others as my challenge in this life. And should I die and there is no life after this one, then I have lived a very good life here and I am none the worse for it.
Wishing you well
Hondo0 -
Hi HondoHondo said:Hi Soblest
It is sad to say that some people believe that wend someone gets sick it is God who is doing it. That mythology or theology goes all the back to the dark ages, we see it also in the insurance companies calling an act of nature an act of God. I can never figure out why people blame God for everything. My cancer was to be my cancer good or bad it was to be part of my life and I use it to help others who are going through cancer. Maybe in heaven someday I will know the real reason for me having cancer, but for now I can accept doing what I can to help others as my challenge in this life. And should I die and there is no life after this one, then I have lived a very good life here and I am none the worse for it.
Wishing you well
Hondo
I think that God gets the credit for things as often as God gets the blame. It seems to me that when something happens that they can not explain, the "it was God's will" is the answer that covers it all.
There is certainly nothing wrong with living a life helping others.
Hope all is well,
Phil0 -
Hi PhilPhillieG said:Hi Hondo
I think that God gets the credit for things as often as God gets the blame. It seems to me that when something happens that they can not explain, the "it was God's will" is the answer that covers it all.
There is certainly nothing wrong with living a life helping others.
Hope all is well,
Phil
That is because it is always easier to blame someone else. I guess you are right just saying “it was God's will" is the answer that covers it all”, in mans view of things.
Take care my friend
Hondo0 -
There is so much that wePhillieG said:Hi Hondo
I think that God gets the credit for things as often as God gets the blame. It seems to me that when something happens that they can not explain, the "it was God's will" is the answer that covers it all.
There is certainly nothing wrong with living a life helping others.
Hope all is well,
Phil
There is so much that we don't know or understand and it is convenient to believe there is something so much greater and bigger than we are that is responsible for what is going on.
I used to think n'shallah(God willing) was just a cop out, a way for people to not be held responsible for breaking their promises and engagements and some people do use it that way - 'N'shallah, I will show up at your house at 7pm', then never to arrive. However as I deepen in spiritual growth I have come to realise that even when we have honourable intention sometimes things do happen that are way out of our control and understanding, n'shallah for me has become a way to acknowledge that.0 -
In your own words, "The
In your own words, "The purpose of the forums, as I understand the Terms & Conditions, is to help others by talking about treatment and side effects and how to deal with them".
People post religous comments and scriptures because this is how 'they' "deal with" their conditions, treatments and side effects. Many feel that their faith is the biggest part of how they "deal with" all of this.
If they truly believe it helps them, just like any other helpful information, they feel compelled to share that with others.
mechelle0 -
Mechellemechellelong said:In your own words, "The
In your own words, "The purpose of the forums, as I understand the Terms & Conditions, is to help others by talking about treatment and side effects and how to deal with them".
People post religous comments and scriptures because this is how 'they' "deal with" their conditions, treatments and side effects. Many feel that their faith is the biggest part of how they "deal with" all of this.
If they truly believe it helps them, just like any other helpful information, they feel compelled to share that with others.
mechelle
Phil posted this some time ago, and we go through periods where the religious expressions cross the line into proselytizing. No one (well, almost no one) objects to an offer of prayer, or a simple god bless, however, when someone says that God has put their cancer in remission to reward their faith, it does raise the question for the faithful person whose cancer has not gone into remission, or who is of a different religious faith.
In the end, faith is a deeply personal thing, which is why a separate forum was created to allow for some sharing and an open discussion as to what it means.
Take a moment and read through this thread, and note those who sound particularly righteous in their belief and in their right to express it, then click on their user names to look up the profiles. In many cases, you will see that they are no longer members of this board, mostly because they crossed the line between expressing they had faith to saying that their idea of faith was the one and only true way.
You don't mention your cancer, but I hope you are dealing with it well whether you are a patient or a caregiver,
Blake0 -
Hi Mechellemechellelong said:In your own words, "The
In your own words, "The purpose of the forums, as I understand the Terms & Conditions, is to help others by talking about treatment and side effects and how to deal with them".
People post religous comments and scriptures because this is how 'they' "deal with" their conditions, treatments and side effects. Many feel that their faith is the biggest part of how they "deal with" all of this.
If they truly believe it helps them, just like any other helpful information, they feel compelled to share that with others.
mechelle
Welcome to CSN, I agree with some of what you are saying. I post stuff about religion and some time refer to a scripture or so if I see a person is religious and needing help both physical and spiritual . What I believe Phil is talking about is where on some of the forum boards instead of giving help some Christians go overboard, all they are doing is posting nothing but scripture. As a Christian I need the prayers of all my friends and I need to know that they care about me and at night ask God in my behalf for healing. But just posting a bunch of scriptures with no meaning kind of takes away from the work that other Christians are trying to do. As Christians we are not to be a stumbling block to others whether they are or are not of faith, we must respect everyone, but at the same time we must not be ashamed or afraid of what we believe.
I hope you understand where I am coming from
Thanks
Hondo0 -
Whew!Hondo said:Hi Mechelle
Welcome to CSN, I agree with some of what you are saying. I post stuff about religion and some time refer to a scripture or so if I see a person is religious and needing help both physical and spiritual . What I believe Phil is talking about is where on some of the forum boards instead of giving help some Christians go overboard, all they are doing is posting nothing but scripture. As a Christian I need the prayers of all my friends and I need to know that they care about me and at night ask God in my behalf for healing. But just posting a bunch of scriptures with no meaning kind of takes away from the work that other Christians are trying to do. As Christians we are not to be a stumbling block to others whether they are or are not of faith, we must respect everyone, but at the same time we must not be ashamed or afraid of what we believe.
I hope you understand where I am coming from
Thanks
Hondo
Got through all the comments on this thread. Now I will throw in my two cents worth. I think that anyone who assures anyone that if they do or believe x or y that their cancer will go away, is out of line on this board. I don't care whether it is religious in nature or an alternative therapy or diet or exercise or having a "good attitude" or whatever.
I have been distressed by several of these types of posts but so far none of them have been about religion. I usually keep my opinions to myself but a couple of times when I have responded, I am not met with much understanding--especially concerning the alternative therapy/diet topics.
In my opinion those kinds of dogmatic declarations most of the time only add stress to people who are already struggling with a serious illness. None of those things have been proven to be true and one can find myriads of examples of people getting sick who did x or y perfectly.
As far as someone telling me if I don't believe a certain way, that I am going to hell, only matters if I believe in hell. If I don't believe in hell, then I should be able to just laugh and say, "Whatever"! In other words agnostics and atheists should care less about those kinds of statements but often are the ones that get most incensed. Funny since they don't even believe! And I can say that as someone who used to be an atheist. It makes no sense.0 -
Do you have to see something to believe it?
I sometimes wonder if things that I can’t see are really there. Like “Gravity” if I throw something into the air it always comes back down. “Wind” is another thing, I fly my kite and it stays up in the air and sores high above looking down on me, what is holding it up there. I can also feel the wind blowing against my face but can’t see wheaten it is coming or going.
I was told that there all are fixed Laws that govern these types of thing in our world, so I went back outside and could not see any of these Laws holding any of these things in place.
Is not Faith and belief the same thing? It does not matter if a person chooses to recognize whether something is there or not or to have faith or not to have faith. I know what, and I know why I believe, and why I have Faith. I am glad that right now this great county has Laws to stop people from forcing there views upon others, just hope it can stay that way.
Hondo0 -
"Diamond dog(ma)s"laurettas said:Whew!
Got through all the comments on this thread. Now I will throw in my two cents worth. I think that anyone who assures anyone that if they do or believe x or y that their cancer will go away, is out of line on this board. I don't care whether it is religious in nature or an alternative therapy or diet or exercise or having a "good attitude" or whatever.
I have been distressed by several of these types of posts but so far none of them have been about religion. I usually keep my opinions to myself but a couple of times when I have responded, I am not met with much understanding--especially concerning the alternative therapy/diet topics.
In my opinion those kinds of dogmatic declarations most of the time only add stress to people who are already struggling with a serious illness. None of those things have been proven to be true and one can find myriads of examples of people getting sick who did x or y perfectly.
As far as someone telling me if I don't believe a certain way, that I am going to hell, only matters if I believe in hell. If I don't believe in hell, then I should be able to just laugh and say, "Whatever"! In other words agnostics and atheists should care less about those kinds of statements but often are the ones that get most incensed. Funny since they don't even believe! And I can say that as someone who used to be an atheist. It makes no sense.
(David Bowie reference)
By the semantics I use (and those used by a number of philosophers and theologians, laurettas, there is quite a difference betwee agnostics and atheists. Atheists ARE believers: they believe that there is no deity. Agnostics are unknowers, and there is, to me, quite a difference betweeen the two. In fact, I argue that atheists are paradoxes and even hypocritical, since to KNOW that there is no god is to presume a knowledge of all that there is in this universe (or any other) and therefore makes one omniscient, a rather god-like property, I would say.
I would suggest that while atheists are aggressive (as you suggest) in their vehement defiance of religion of any kind, you are apt to find that agnostics, since they don't know, are likely to be a bit more passive of the belief of others, even if they do not like those beliefs shoved down their gullets.
Your suggestion that not believing in hell means that you can't go there is, at best, extremely weak. Just as it is absurd for someone to deny the existence of god because one has not experienced this entity, it is absurd to believe that if one refuses to believe in the existence of hell it will not exist. That is like closing my eyes and wishing away the existence of cancer: I can 'not' believe all I want but it makes it no less an existence in the world, in the universe, for that matter, cancer, that is.\
I agree with most of what you say, particularly with regard to dogma of any kind, and probably with all of what your intent was, but didn't think it would be honest to let those points I consider illogical to get by.
For what it's worth.
Take care,
Joe0 -
babylonHondo said:Do you have to see something to believe it?
I sometimes wonder if things that I can’t see are really there. Like “Gravity” if I throw something into the air it always comes back down. “Wind” is another thing, I fly my kite and it stays up in the air and sores high above looking down on me, what is holding it up there. I can also feel the wind blowing against my face but can’t see wheaten it is coming or going.
I was told that there all are fixed Laws that govern these types of thing in our world, so I went back outside and could not see any of these Laws holding any of these things in place.
Is not Faith and belief the same thing? It does not matter if a person chooses to recognize whether something is there or not or to have faith or not to have faith. I know what, and I know why I believe, and why I have Faith. I am glad that right now this great county has Laws to stop people from forcing there views upon others, just hope it can stay that way.
Hondo
Faith and belief ARE the same thing. But they are not knowledge. In defense of the scientific method, which requires that proof result from the ability to repeat an action or effect over and over given the same circumstances (to put it simply), it also recognizes that its tenets can be modified by further study, continued experimentation, sometimes dramatically.
Faith does not have this insistence. Nor does it have the tolerance for such.
But you know that.
Take care,
Joe0 -
Hi Joe,soccerfreaks said:"Diamond dog(ma)s"
(David Bowie reference)
By the semantics I use (and those used by a number of philosophers and theologians, laurettas, there is quite a difference betwee agnostics and atheists. Atheists ARE believers: they believe that there is no deity. Agnostics are unknowers, and there is, to me, quite a difference betweeen the two. In fact, I argue that atheists are paradoxes and even hypocritical, since to KNOW that there is no god is to presume a knowledge of all that there is in this universe (or any other) and therefore makes one omniscient, a rather god-like property, I would say.
I would suggest that while atheists are aggressive (as you suggest) in their vehement defiance of religion of any kind, you are apt to find that agnostics, since they don't know, are likely to be a bit more passive of the belief of others, even if they do not like those beliefs shoved down their gullets.
Your suggestion that not believing in hell means that you can't go there is, at best, extremely weak. Just as it is absurd for someone to deny the existence of god because one has not experienced this entity, it is absurd to believe that if one refuses to believe in the existence of hell it will not exist. That is like closing my eyes and wishing away the existence of cancer: I can 'not' believe all I want but it makes it no less an existence in the world, in the universe, for that matter, cancer, that is.\
I agree with most of what you say, particularly with regard to dogma of any kind, and probably with all of what your intent was, but didn't think it would be honest to let those points I consider illogical to get by.
For what it's worth.
Take care,
Joe
What I meant was that if you don't believe in something, it is rather silly to get upset if someone tells you that you will experience it. Why be upset about something that doesn't exist? That is what I meant, not that the individual won't go there but that they shouldn't be upset if someone tells them they will go there. Kind of like being scared if someone tells you the boogieman will get you if you don't believe that the boogieman exists. Does that make more sense?0
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