good news on crc prevention for our families and friends

pete43lost_at_sea
pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900 Member
in Colorectal Cancer #1
hi all,

i have been getting back into my healthy routines regarding diet, chinese herbal medicine, supplements and meditation. did some surfing about colorectal news and found this news item with reference new crc cases and diet, it gives me hope.

Colorectal Cancer Risk Higher If You Eat Red And Processed Meat, Lower If You Eat Fiber

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/226217.php

if you read the news, you can see that extra studies since 2007 have added to the weight of evidence regarding crc and diet.

In 2007 if you followed medical consesus you lived a life with a higher crc risk, if you followed the vegetarian minority you would have been safer with regard to crc risk.

my question is do think this news is relevant to recurrance risk ?? which is risk most of us on csn are dealing with.

is crc recurrance risk different to new risk of crc with regard diet and exercise ?

if my friends ask me i tell them limit red and processed meat, eat more fibre and exercise to be a healthy weight. its simple.

for me the facts are conclusive that i follow these recommendations and are a little more extreme. i am down 35 kilograms that over 75pounds for the yanks, i still have 22 pounds to go to be lean.

just food for thought. its possible to beat the disease without following science, but i would recommend avoiding it in the first place.

you may say this news means nothing for recurrance risk, but i certainly will never take my family out for a steak bbq again.

but as always the choice is our own, and the facts and news are open to personal interpretation. just wishing us all the best of health, whatever that is for you.

hugs,
pete

Comments

  • Buckwirth
    Buckwirth Member Posts: 1,258 Member
    #2
    Staying Lean
    is the best way to prevent many, if not most, types of cancer.

    So, what is the risk? Quoting from the article mentioned:

    **************
    In short - the report states that when an individual adopts some lifestyle changes, such as eating a healthy diet with no processed meat, exercises and maintains a healthy body weight, their risk of developing colorectal cancer may be 45% lower.
    *************

    That is a huge reduction! What does it mean in terms of real overall risk? Well, according to ACS, the lifetime risk for men is 5.5% (it is 5.1% for women). For the sake of simplicity, I will use the higher number.

    If risk decreased by 45%, the odds of getting CRC would go from 5.5% to 3.8%. Not bad. The real question, how many people do you think would change their lifestyle if they thought their real risk of CRC would be reduced by 1.7 points?

    ********************
    An individual who eats 3.5 ounces of red meat each day has a 17% higher chance of developing colorectal cancer compared to somebody who never eats red meat, the authors wrote.
    ********************

    In this case, the lifetime risk goes from 5.5% to 6.4%, and real increase of just less than one point.

    ********************
    Consuming 7 ounces of red meat a day raises the risk by 34%.
    ********************

    34%, again a big number. The real change in lifetime risk? It goes from 5.5% to 7.4%, an increase of almost two points.

    When dealing with large populations the total numbers are actually quite large, 1% of the current US population is 3,118,800 people, so adjust annually, with a life expectancy of 78 years, a reduction of one point would be almost 40,000 fewer cases per year*.

    *(the use of the total population does not produce a correct number, so these are for example only and are probably a bit inflated)

    In Australia, 1% of the population is 226,676, and adjusted annually that 1 point reduction in lifetime risk would equate to 2,906 fewer cases each year.

    These lifestyle changes produce benefits far beyond lowering CRC risk, so I am not in any way belittling the reports suggestions. As someone with a bit of understanding of math, I just find twisting the percentages to make them look larger is a bit of a deceptive practice, and when used on smaller population groups can be pretty close to lying with statistics.
  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900 Member
    #3
    Buckwirth said:

    Staying Lean
    is the best way to prevent many, if not most, types of cancer.

    So, what is the risk? Quoting from the article mentioned:

    **************
    In short - the report states that when an individual adopts some lifestyle changes, such as eating a healthy diet with no processed meat, exercises and maintains a healthy body weight, their risk of developing colorectal cancer may be 45% lower.
    *************

    That is a huge reduction! What does it mean in terms of real overall risk? Well, according to ACS, the lifetime risk for men is 5.5% (it is 5.1% for women). For the sake of simplicity, I will use the higher number.

    If risk decreased by 45%, the odds of getting CRC would go from 5.5% to 3.8%. Not bad. The real question, how many people do you think would change their lifestyle if they thought their real risk of CRC would be reduced by 1.7 points?

    ********************
    An individual who eats 3.5 ounces of red meat each day has a 17% higher chance of developing colorectal cancer compared to somebody who never eats red meat, the authors wrote.
    ********************

    In this case, the lifetime risk goes from 5.5% to 6.4%, and real increase of just less than one point.

    ********************
    Consuming 7 ounces of red meat a day raises the risk by 34%.
    ********************

    34%, again a big number. The real change in lifetime risk? It goes from 5.5% to 7.4%, an increase of almost two points.

    When dealing with large populations the total numbers are actually quite large, 1% of the current US population is 3,118,800 people, so adjust annually, with a life expectancy of 78 years, a reduction of one point would be almost 40,000 fewer cases per year*.

    *(the use of the total population does not produce a correct number, so these are for example only and are probably a bit inflated)

    In Australia, 1% of the population is 226,676, and adjusted annually that 1 point reduction in lifetime risk would equate to 2,906 fewer cases each year.

    These lifestyle changes produce benefits far beyond lowering CRC risk, so I am not in any way belittling the reports suggestions. As someone with a bit of understanding of math, I just find twisting the percentages to make them look larger is a bit of a deceptive practice, and when used on smaller population groups can be pretty close to lying with statistics.

    thanks blake, interesting comments, you left out the vegetables
    hi blake,

    i appreciate the answer!

    your comments on stats is interesting, and how studies get publicised by news organisations is always a bit exaggerated.

    lets assume these steps can reduce new risk,

    you see i wonder if these steps can also help recurrant risk but i am not sure as i already may have circulating dormant cancer cells that are the mets we are trying to avoid or minimise.

    either way, at present in my case i have no visible cancer. now either way assuming i have all the initial crc removed every single cell. then i am in the same risk category as someone who has never had crc disease, so i should adopt these strategies unless i want go through all this again. i got no extra large bowel left so if i got crc again i'll be bagged for good. so i would be crazy in my mind not doing everything
    possible to avoid crc based on the published facts.

    the facts from the study as are be lean, exercise, eat green, limit red meat.

    the other assumption i got a few crc cells sitting around dormant, something triggers the growth ? what exactly ? what happened at 6 months or 2.3 years or 4.5 years to stimulate the crc met to grow. it does not have a brain, it simply responds to cell based triggers.

    or does it ?

    maybe its not triggers, maybe the mets have little stop watchers in side them. they are predetermined to explode and grow at the predetermined time. no influence from diet or supplements.

    maybe its a combination of the trigger and stop watch.

    i know this is simplistic, and the genetic variability of crc behavior vast, which is why the one bullet we look for has not been found, and in fact may not exist. what seems likely to me is a range of treatments based on genetic testing like wild type and erbitux.

    just trying to think these risks through and workout if i am having bacon and eggs for breakfast ?

    i decided ! today its pawpaw and blueberries with a super juice.
    and i will brew my chinese herbal tea as well.

    hugs,
    pete
  • northernlites
    northernlites Member Posts: 96
    #4
    pete43lost_at_sea said:

    thanks blake, interesting comments, you left out the vegetables
    hi blake,

    i appreciate the answer!

    your comments on stats is interesting, and how studies get publicised by news organisations is always a bit exaggerated.

    lets assume these steps can reduce new risk,

    you see i wonder if these steps can also help recurrant risk but i am not sure as i already may have circulating dormant cancer cells that are the mets we are trying to avoid or minimise.

    either way, at present in my case i have no visible cancer. now either way assuming i have all the initial crc removed every single cell. then i am in the same risk category as someone who has never had crc disease, so i should adopt these strategies unless i want go through all this again. i got no extra large bowel left so if i got crc again i'll be bagged for good. so i would be crazy in my mind not doing everything
    possible to avoid crc based on the published facts.

    the facts from the study as are be lean, exercise, eat green, limit red meat.

    the other assumption i got a few crc cells sitting around dormant, something triggers the growth ? what exactly ? what happened at 6 months or 2.3 years or 4.5 years to stimulate the crc met to grow. it does not have a brain, it simply responds to cell based triggers.

    or does it ?

    maybe its not triggers, maybe the mets have little stop watchers in side them. they are predetermined to explode and grow at the predetermined time. no influence from diet or supplements.

    maybe its a combination of the trigger and stop watch.

    i know this is simplistic, and the genetic variability of crc behavior vast, which is why the one bullet we look for has not been found, and in fact may not exist. what seems likely to me is a range of treatments based on genetic testing like wild type and erbitux.

    just trying to think these risks through and workout if i am having bacon and eggs for breakfast ?

    i decided ! today its pawpaw and blueberries with a super juice.
    and i will brew my chinese herbal tea as well.

    hugs,
    pete

    Hi Pete,
    where do you get
    Hi Pete,
    where do you get the chinese herbal tea?

    Tessa
  • Buckwirth
    Buckwirth Member Posts: 1,258 Member
    #5
    pete43lost_at_sea said:

    thanks blake, interesting comments, you left out the vegetables
    hi blake,

    i appreciate the answer!

    your comments on stats is interesting, and how studies get publicised by news organisations is always a bit exaggerated.

    lets assume these steps can reduce new risk,

    you see i wonder if these steps can also help recurrant risk but i am not sure as i already may have circulating dormant cancer cells that are the mets we are trying to avoid or minimise.

    either way, at present in my case i have no visible cancer. now either way assuming i have all the initial crc removed every single cell. then i am in the same risk category as someone who has never had crc disease, so i should adopt these strategies unless i want go through all this again. i got no extra large bowel left so if i got crc again i'll be bagged for good. so i would be crazy in my mind not doing everything
    possible to avoid crc based on the published facts.

    the facts from the study as are be lean, exercise, eat green, limit red meat.

    the other assumption i got a few crc cells sitting around dormant, something triggers the growth ? what exactly ? what happened at 6 months or 2.3 years or 4.5 years to stimulate the crc met to grow. it does not have a brain, it simply responds to cell based triggers.

    or does it ?

    maybe its not triggers, maybe the mets have little stop watchers in side them. they are predetermined to explode and grow at the predetermined time. no influence from diet or supplements.

    maybe its a combination of the trigger and stop watch.

    i know this is simplistic, and the genetic variability of crc behavior vast, which is why the one bullet we look for has not been found, and in fact may not exist. what seems likely to me is a range of treatments based on genetic testing like wild type and erbitux.

    just trying to think these risks through and workout if i am having bacon and eggs for breakfast ?

    i decided ! today its pawpaw and blueberries with a super juice.
    and i will brew my chinese herbal tea as well.

    hugs,
    pete

    Cell triggers
    are at the chromosomal level. A mutated chromosome turns off the signal to self destruct, or turns the trigger for reproduction on (and sticks the pedal down). Mostly, by the time you are fifty all of the damage has been done.

    As an example, H. pylori bacteria causes peptic ulcers, and also causes stomach cancer.

    If you get inoculated at a young age, your risk of stomach cancer goes to almost zero, but if you are fifty, and have a history of ulcers, the inoculation does nothing for your cancer risk. The damage is done, and most of the mutations have already happened.

    Same is true for smokers. A pack a day smoker who started at 14 and quit at 55 may lower his risk, but his risk is still a LOT higher than the non-smoker.

    So, I would say that a healthy diet/weight has many benefits, but if you have lived a long life abusing your body it may do nothing to stave off the big C. Remember, almost 4% of the population will get this EVEN IF they eat well and maintain their weight. Diet is a factor, not the root cause.
  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900 Member
    #6
    Buckwirth said:

    Cell triggers
    are at the chromosomal level. A mutated chromosome turns off the signal to self destruct, or turns the trigger for reproduction on (and sticks the pedal down). Mostly, by the time you are fifty all of the damage has been done.

    As an example, H. pylori bacteria causes peptic ulcers, and also causes stomach cancer.

    If you get inoculated at a young age, your risk of stomach cancer goes to almost zero, but if you are fifty, and have a history of ulcers, the inoculation does nothing for your cancer risk. The damage is done, and most of the mutations have already happened.

    Same is true for smokers. A pack a day smoker who started at 14 and quit at 55 may lower his risk, but his risk is still a LOT higher than the non-smoker.

    So, I would say that a healthy diet/weight has many benefits, but if you have lived a long life abusing your body it may do nothing to stave off the big C. Remember, almost 4% of the population will get this EVEN IF they eat well and maintain their weight. Diet is a factor, not the root cause.

    ok so you say diet may not help crc recurrance risk
    that the risk is based on life time exposure, so my years healthy diet may mean nothing to my crc recurrance risk.

    i am going to cut down red meat for the kids as well now.

    the key point of the study is everyone should reduce risks factors if they know what they are up against, but we know the message has got no traction.

    we can always agree to disagree as in the past.

    bowel cancer australia quotes 1 in 15 odds of getting bowel cancer here. the study implies the risk can be almost halved by lifestyle changes, that huge, if we add in early detection then crc is fighting a loosing battle.

    what's best for us crc survivors is open to debate and discussion, if not here on this board then i wonder where.

    hugs to all,
    pete
  • Buckwirth
    Buckwirth Member Posts: 1,258 Member
    #7
    pete43lost_at_sea said:

    ok so you say diet may not help crc recurrance risk
    that the risk is based on life time exposure, so my years healthy diet may mean nothing to my crc recurrance risk.

    i am going to cut down red meat for the kids as well now.

    the key point of the study is everyone should reduce risks factors if they know what they are up against, but we know the message has got no traction.

    we can always agree to disagree as in the past.

    bowel cancer australia quotes 1 in 15 odds of getting bowel cancer here. the study implies the risk can be almost halved by lifestyle changes, that huge, if we add in early detection then crc is fighting a loosing battle.

    what's best for us crc survivors is open to debate and discussion, if not here on this board then i wonder where.

    hugs to all,
    pete

    1 in 15
    Is 6.7%, a little higher than the ACS number.

    Do you have any immediate family with CRC? Aunts? Uncles? My bet is you have always been healthy, and 43 is young for this disease, which would lead me to suspect genetics.

    Nothing to disagree on here btw, unless you want to be disagreeable.
  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900 Member
    #8
    northernlites said:

    Hi Pete,
    where do you get
    Hi Pete,
    where do you get the chinese herbal tea?

    Tessa

    from my local tcm doctor
    he is great

    hugs,
    pete
  • tootsie1
    tootsie1 Member Posts: 5,044 Member
    #9
    A puzzle
    I don't really know the answer. I do know my oncologist says exercise and staying slim is the best defense. Not that I'm very good at either! The other thing is that when I was diagnosed with colon cancer, it had already been about 10 years since I'd eaten red meat.

    So I don't think any of those can totally prevent cancer of any kind, but it can't hurt.

    *hugs*
    Gail
  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900 Member
    #10
    Buckwirth said:

    1 in 15
    Is 6.7%, a little higher than the ACS number.

    Do you have any immediate family with CRC? Aunts? Uncles? My bet is you have always been healthy, and 43 is young for this disease, which would lead me to suspect genetics.

    Nothing to disagree on here btw, unless you want to be disagreeable.

    2011 is my year of being agreeable
    funny you mention genetics, i was discussing that very issue with wife the other night.

    the kids are 5 and 9 so plenty of time, but now is as good a time as ever to push healthy habits.

    i always was obese the last 20 years of adult life, and i ate lots of bbq'd red meat.
    and i mean lots. meat or genetics or both.

    the big question is whats the healthiest choice for me right now and then the kids and wife with regard lifestyle and diet.
  • marqimark
    marqimark Member Posts: 242 Member
    #11
    Percents
    My mom died of CRC.

    I got checked a couple (!) of years after she passed, DUMB DUMB DUMB!!!

    And here I am in a small exclusive club no one really wants to join.

    I am going to blame my mom and keep eating Double Bacon Cheeseburgers, after all, the only thing I inherited from my mom was CRC. Thanks mom!!

    If the only thing I inherit from my dad is the Luekemia he died from(three months after my mom), I will be so pissed!!!!!!!!
  • Buckwirth
    Buckwirth Member Posts: 1,258 Member
    #12
    marqimark said:

    Percents
    My mom died of CRC.

    I got checked a couple (!) of years after she passed, DUMB DUMB DUMB!!!

    And here I am in a small exclusive club no one really wants to join.

    I am going to blame my mom and keep eating Double Bacon Cheeseburgers, after all, the only thing I inherited from my mom was CRC. Thanks mom!!

    If the only thing I inherit from my dad is the Luekemia he died from(three months after my mom), I will be so pissed!!!!!!!!

    LOL
    Thanks Mark!
  • Nana b
    Nana b Member Posts: 3,030 Member
    #13
    Buckwirth said:

    LOL
    Thanks Mark!

    Both my daughters have IBS
    Both my daughters have IBS and I tell them both to eat better, my older daughter is finally listening to me, and has cut out red meat, and she feels so much better. She had meat a few weeks ago and was sick to her stomach and threw up. The same thing happen to me when I tried to eat a bit of steak. Just like steak, nectarines tear my stomach up. We just have to listen to our body. It will tell you what it doesn't like or what it can tolerate. If you can take the time to figure the diet out, it will do you good. Double cheese burgers will kill you one day! lol... Cheese is empty calories. A hamburger was good just by itself. I do like the garden burger now, they are good and order them when I crave a burger. Sometimes I only eat one of the breads, so eat it open faced. I don't eat much bread or tortillas. I'm allergic to wheat. I am so allergic o alcohol, and that is one thing that I may have a glass of for a special occasion. But now, even those days, alcohol isn't that appealing anymore. Actually, I am allergic or have an intolerance to a lot of things. Now that I try to stay away from them, my acid reflux is gone! Not up for debate, just saying.......
  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900 Member
    #14
    marqimark said:

    Percents
    My mom died of CRC.

    I got checked a couple (!) of years after she passed, DUMB DUMB DUMB!!!

    And here I am in a small exclusive club no one really wants to join.

    I am going to blame my mom and keep eating Double Bacon Cheeseburgers, after all, the only thing I inherited from my mom was CRC. Thanks mom!!

    If the only thing I inherit from my dad is the Luekemia he died from(three months after my mom), I will be so pissed!!!!!!!!

    enjoy the burger!!!!!!!!!!
    hi mark,

    sorry about the inheritance, that sux.

    so have you done the genetic tests ? are your kids clear ?

    just curious.

    if you got a genetic disposition and as i have been advised my kids should be screen 10 years prior to my dx. ie i was 43 so the kids 33rd birthday present from dad is a FREE COLONOSCOPY.

    hugs,
    pete
  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900 Member
    #15
    Nana b said:

    Both my daughters have IBS
    Both my daughters have IBS and I tell them both to eat better, my older daughter is finally listening to me, and has cut out red meat, and she feels so much better. She had meat a few weeks ago and was sick to her stomach and threw up. The same thing happen to me when I tried to eat a bit of steak. Just like steak, nectarines tear my stomach up. We just have to listen to our body. It will tell you what it doesn't like or what it can tolerate. If you can take the time to figure the diet out, it will do you good. Double cheese burgers will kill you one day! lol... Cheese is empty calories. A hamburger was good just by itself. I do like the garden burger now, they are good and order them when I crave a burger. Sometimes I only eat one of the breads, so eat it open faced. I don't eat much bread or tortillas. I'm allergic to wheat. I am so allergic o alcohol, and that is one thing that I may have a glass of for a special occasion. But now, even those days, alcohol isn't that appealing anymore. Actually, I am allergic or have an intolerance to a lot of things. Now that I try to stay away from them, my acid reflux is gone! Not up for debate, just saying.......

    thanks raquel
    glad your kiods are listening.
    good health is the best inheritance we can give them.
    trying to be a good example is hard, but i try.

    hugs,
    pete
  • pete43lost_at_sea
    pete43lost_at_sea Member Posts: 3,900 Member
    #16
    tootsie1 said:

    A puzzle
    I don't really know the answer. I do know my oncologist says exercise and staying slim is the best defense. Not that I'm very good at either! The other thing is that when I was diagnosed with colon cancer, it had already been about 10 years since I'd eaten red meat.

    So I don't think any of those can totally prevent cancer of any kind, but it can't hurt.

    *hugs*
    Gail

    the best defense
    thanks gail,

    here's to us all staying slim.

    hugs,
    pete

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