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Magic Mouthwash

cadharose's picture
cadharose
Posts: 51
Joined: May 2013

I  just tried Magic Mouthwash for the first time today and I am disappointed with the results (especially for the price). It is primarily my throat and upper palate that are sore and make it difficult for me to drink things like fruit juice or V8 juice. I have twice used it as directed, gargled with it, swallowed it down slowly, and gave it a few minutes to fully kick in before drinking anything, but it only made a minor improvement.

Any thoughts on how to make it more effective?

phrannie51's picture
phrannie51
Posts: 3619
Joined: Mar 2012

have lidocaine in it?  Some recepies don't.....and the recepie you get is usually the one the pharmacist likes (there are MANY recepies for MM)......you can also ask your Onc for pure vicious )LOL..not vicious, but I can't remember the word) Lidocain....it doesn't have any of the pepto or anti-thrush stuff in it.  It's an instant numbing....it numbed me so much the first time I took it, I couldn't swallow at all for 10 minutes. 

You're doing good if you can do fruit juice, especially something as acidy as V8 or tomato juice....I still can't do them.

p

cadharose's picture
cadharose
Posts: 51
Joined: May 2013

Yes, it has lidocaine in it, but I don't know at what strength. Thanks for the tip about the pure viscous lidocaine. I might ask for that. It's funny because it totally numbed the front of my mouth but didn't seem to do as much for my upper palate and throat.

The doctors and staff tell me that drinks like Boost and Ensure have everything your body needs, but after drinking them exclusively for hours I definitely feel better when I drink V8. It's the only way I can get vegetables into me.

donfoo's picture
donfoo
Posts: 1156
Joined: Dec 2012

not sure since I don't have lidocaine in my MM formula but if it was it is likely to be watered down from the lidocaine if it is pure lidocaine. The pure stuff says lidocaine, oral toipical solution (Viscous) 2%.

I still may ask for a MM version that has lidocaine but now I can ally it separately and more directly to the sore in the mouth. Of course I can not apply directy to sore or patches on back of throat so I swish some pure stuff with head back and slowly swallow and good to go that way.

My MO specifies the ingredients in the MM. I see the pharma order and it has the specifc stuff going in. all the pharmacy does is compound it.

CivilMatt's picture
CivilMatt
Posts: 2825
Joined: May 2012

cadharose,

It may be your MM mixture.  Mine was great, so great that I went through 6 bottles of the stuff.  It helped me sleep; drink and I would take a bit in the parking lot just before rads.

So sorry it is not working for you, it is one of my top 3 things which got me through treatment side effects.

All I can say is don’t give up there are a lot of things in the H&N medicine chest.

Matt

fishmanpa's picture
fishmanpa
Posts: 1103
Joined: Jan 2013

Each pharmacy has their own method for MM. The first batch I got was a swish and spit and the 2nd batch was from Johns Hopkins and they called it Larry's Solution which was swish and swallow. Both numbed my mouth and throat. Just don't try to take pills after using it as you can't feel them in your mouth! ~lol~ 

Fortunately, as I heal, I need less and less. And you're right.. the stuff ain't cheap!

"T"

donfoo's picture
donfoo
Posts: 1156
Joined: Dec 2012

just curious guys, how much is larry making off this pink bug spit jiuce? lol LoL lOl Tongue Out

Skiffin16's picture
Skiffin16
Posts: 8057
Joined: Sep 2009

I must have had an updated version, LOL... Mine was called Larry's Solution #2...

HelenBack
Posts: 62
Joined: Jan 2013

I can certainly understand your need for veggies but perhaps you could find something that doesn't have tomatoes or citrus. Anything containing either of those ingredients burned my husband's throat but he could drink carrot, beet, celery, greens in juices. 

Helen

cadharose's picture
cadharose
Posts: 51
Joined: May 2013

Thanks for the advice. I love those veggies. I will give that a try. By the way, I never make my own juice so I don't know how. Do you cook the vegetables first before pureeing them?

HelenBack
Posts: 62
Joined: Jan 2013

If you don't already have a juicer, I'm not sure you should go through the trouble. Many people get seriously into juicing, but juicers are expensive and unless you're sure that you're up for it, and have access to fresh veggies year round, I'd just try to find an another source, something like v-8 but not tomato-y. Knudsen sells a bottled carrot juice, and, if you live in an area that has health food stores you would likely find fresh or bottled (flash-pasturized) juices with greens.

I made smoothies for my husband with bottled apple juice, yogurt, protein powder and kale. He was able to get them down for a while, but then they were too textured for him. But at least they weren't acidic.

Maybe cream of broccoli soup would satisfy your veggie cravings? That was something that he's been able to eat, off and on. Very easy to make, and you can boost calories by making sure to use butter and real cream. Or, just a veggie soup, without tomato, of course. Maybe potato, carrot, zucchini, cabbage, corn in a watery broth? Puree'd?

We love our veggies too,

Helen

hwt's picture
hwt
Posts: 1832
Joined: Jun 2012

My last large bottle (480ML) was $25. I think I paid $20 while I was in tx. I'm a year out of tx and still use it periodically. Still not so good with fruit but did enjoy some watermelon last week with no issues. I use it more now when I have a real dry spell, it helps relieve the discomfort,

cadharose's picture
cadharose
Posts: 51
Joined: May 2013

You're right. Those buggers are expensive. I just looked at them at amazon.com. Maybe I'll try making soup and drinking it at room temp instead. I like your recipe with the beets; some folks don't like them, but I sure do :)

donfoo's picture
donfoo
Posts: 1156
Joined: Dec 2012

"Magic Mouthwash" as I use the term is a compounded prescription of several drugs specified either by the phramacist or the prescribing doctor. AFAIK Amazon does not sell prescription drugs, so are we talking about different things?

 

Also, maybe we are a short hop from Tokyo where a small cup of coffe is 25 bucks and a "coffin" hotel room runs a hundred bucks, but out here skipping rocks off the Pacfic 25 bucks for a compounded prescription seems really cheap. I mean the pharmacists actually has to mix something rather than count pills. Now if the PC want to bust my chops for that let's have a go. .o. lolll lol Lol LO LOL LOL. Ah, practicing my LOL skills.   lol

I just post this given the comment is we are amonst some of the most elite when it comes to ringing the register at the pharmacy. I hear those little plastic bags dispensed by the clinic/hospital pharmacy can be THOUSANDS of $$$ each, so 25 bucks is like bandaids in comparison.

btw - Matt is my new hero and mentor for the month of June. Congratsulations! 

CivilMatt's picture
CivilMatt
Posts: 2825
Joined: May 2012

Don,

I don’t know whether to trust you or taze you, but I’ll say 25 bucks is far less than I paid and I bought lots.  I still have a bottle of Oregon vintage pink.  I can’t believe I loved the stuff it tastes so bad now.  Score one point for losing my taste buds.

There seems to be an infinite number of mixtures.  I don’t know what was in mine; there was nothing on the label.  Maybe, it truly is a secret recipe.

Matt

PS I do not own a tazer.

donfoo's picture
donfoo
Posts: 1156
Joined: Dec 2012

clarification new to me about Magic Mouthwash. I was under the impression that my MO was indicating what ne wanted in the MM, thus supportin the allusion that MM has many variants. It does but maybe for other reasons, steeped in MM lore and tradition.

I spoke with my MO this morning and asked him to add lidocaine to my MM as I wanted something more soothing and the current MM stinks my tongue a bit. He proceeds to tell me he does NOT specify what goes in, he just selects one of the predefined formulations that are in their system. So, at least inh my case, the physician does NOT specify what goes into MM. And maybe the pharmacist also is then just following prescribing order and does not specify what goes in. so do ask how these formulas get designed and into the various pharma systems. too early for this. LOL

 

HelenBack
Posts: 62
Joined: Jan 2013

is made from lidocaine, benadryl, and mylanta I think one part each. I'm sure there's no harm in asking for a tad more lidocaine. We had another formula that was nystatin and benadryl in case my husband started developing thrush, but he never did.

 

 

hwt's picture
hwt
Posts: 1832
Joined: Jun 2012

Happy to say mine is the real deal including lidocaine filled at the cancer center pharmacy where I had my rads and chemo. When everyone started talking about how expensive it was, I was surprised. I know they do honor my pharmacy benefit that comes with my health insurance, Express Scripts.   The last time it was $25 and I thought it had been $20 in the past. Sounds like I should consider myself lucky even at $25.

donfoo's picture
donfoo
Posts: 1156
Joined: Dec 2012

During one my pickups of MM, there was mess up on the prescription authoriztion and they said you can pay cash - like $85. I said NOTHANS. I can wait a day - go get the prescrsdiption authorized the proper way you ninkumpoops.

TracyLynn72's picture
TracyLynn72
Posts: 642
Joined: May 2013

 

Mine is $45 each time I refill.  I called in a refill today and it will be my third (and hopefully last) bottle of MM. I'm self pay, so that's with no insurance or discount plan. 

donfoo's picture
donfoo
Posts: 1156
Joined: Dec 2012

I would be VERY interested to hear how they handle a request to change the compounding formula. If they are accomdative of it, who can authorize such a change in formulation. My doctor apparently can not change the ingredients and I am sure can not change the formulation in any manner as he stated he just order stock unit 9489x2 or whatever, no options.

janetluvsron's picture
janetluvsron
Posts: 108
Joined: May 2013

hey don

we talked to rons onc and he wrote "mm" on a script, when I dropped it off I asked if it would have lidocaine, the pharmacist had to look up the doctors formula, and his does not come with lidocaine. I asked her to call the dr to add lidocaine. When I picked up the script later in the day i had a second bottle, it was vicious kidocaine with 6 refills!!! i asked the pharmacist what was up, apparently the doctor didnt know how to write the compound and the new laws prevent the pharmacist from giving him a receipe, so he gave up and gave the lidocaine separate. So they know I am a nurse and I have a neighbor who is a pharmacist and he gave me one of the formulas. crazy.

its benedryl, which reduces inflammation to sores, pepcid to coat and protect, m.o.m as a backup to reduce acid, and lidocaine to numb.

 

 

donfoo's picture
donfoo
Posts: 1156
Joined: Dec 2012

That is what I figured, same story as I got, even the solution was the same. Throw in a couple bottles of viscous lidocaine in the bag with the regular MM prescription. lol

MICH4EL's picture
MICH4EL
Posts: 73
Joined: Mar 2013

I have Magic Mouthwash but also have not used it very much.  It is not seem to help enough to make it worth experiencing the numbness.  I have the most trouble with either acidic or sugary foods.  For a while,  I could not handle fruit smoothies or anthing with ice cream.  The worst is over for me, but some things still hurst to swallow.

I think it has as much to do with certain types of foods as it does with the effectiveness of the mouthwash for all foods.

 

 

 

SASH's picture
SASH
Posts: 276
Joined: Apr 2006

I opted to have mine made at the Cancer Center that I was being treated so they knew the formula that the Onc liked.  Mine did have lidocaine in it.  But the pharmacy didn't put a label on the shake well.  The first dose was pure lidocaine so my entire head was numb for 3 days.  When I told the doctor he laughed and said that you are supposed to shake it and based upon the amount of lidocaine I had it could have been leathal so I wouldn't recommend attempting this method to numb yourself.

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