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Tagamet dose?

jen2012
Posts: 1195
Joined: Aug 2012

Did a little searching but decided to pose the question here to see what everyone recommends.

Ann...did you just use tagamet before and after surgery? What dose?

Tans...your wife takes a high dose every day?

Anyone else have any thoughts or advice on tagamet?

Chelsea71
Posts: 1170
Joined: Sep 2012

I don't know much, but I do know that Steve will be taking it if he ever goes for surgery. A lot of convincing evidence that is reduces the probability of spread during surgery. Ann Alexandria attributes lengthy remission to the possible use of Tagamet before and after surgery. I think she even received it intravenously during or immediately after her last surgery.

annalexandria's picture
annalexandria
Posts: 2204
Joined: Oct 2011

my surgeon okayed it, but then it turned out that they no longer make it.  So I took it orally for one week before the surgery and about one week after (may have been a little longer, can't remember now).  I have to say that the oral route would have been difficult if this had been one of my huge, gutted-from-top-to-bottom surgeries where I couldn't eat for days after.  I was just lucky that my last surgery was just a rectal resection of a small tumor, and a hysterectomy ("lucky"...only at Camp Cancer).  I was able to eat and drink right away after surgery.  If I do it again, I would look into the possibility of a liquid version, just in case I couldn't get down the pills.  Dosage, btw, was 800 mg per day, based on the study included in the article below.  The folks in that study actually stayed on cimetidine for a year, but in other studies there was a significant increase in prognosis in groups that just took it for the two week window around surgery.  AA

Chelsea71
Posts: 1170
Joined: Sep 2012

Hi Ann. Too lazy to read the study. Was 800 mg based on your weight or other individual factors? Did you take it all at once or gradually throughout the day?

annalexandria's picture
annalexandria
Posts: 2204
Joined: Oct 2011

that I FORGOT to post??  What a slacker you are, Chelsea!  Anyhoo, the 800 mg was not an individualized dose, just copying what was done in the study.  I took it in two doses, AM and PM, 400 mg. each.  And if anyone is feeling motivated and wants to read the study I was talking about, it's included in the article below, along with some other info about cimetidine and why they think it works for this.  AA

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2009/dec2009_Preventing-Surgery-Induced-Cancer-Metastasis_01.htm

tanstaafl's picture
tanstaafl
Posts: 960
Joined: Oct 2010

1200-1600 mg per day for almost 3 years in stage IV. Guys have more male side effects with cimetidine, women can check their prolactin levels. The literature suggests there **might** be some dose dependence for maximum tumor effect. LEF recommends 1000 to 1600 mg. The Japanese research successes for stage III were with 800 mg.

Cimetidine has big positives, especially short term immune response around surgery to prevent recurrences.

Cimetidine has multiple therapeutic roles in immune response, antiangiogensis (VEGF-A), and ERB-1 signaling. Ultralow CA19-9 blood results (less than 2) are probably a contraindication for long term use due to (in)effectiveness in anti-angiogenisis.

My wife also takes betaine hydrochloride and pancreatin sometimes to offset the digestive effect of suppressed acid production.

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

from memory don't the stage 3 studies use psk.

now i am trying ahcc just for fun and psk.

lucky i love mushrooms.

any suggestions.

I have been on cimetidine 400mg breakfast and dinner. 

I wonder is breaky, lunch dinner could be worth it. total daily would then be 1200. 

the old divided dose strategy or hit it hard break ad dinner 800mg each for a total 1600

hugs,

pete

luvinlife2
Posts: 172
Joined: Jul 2012

My stomach tolerates just about everything.....except cimetidine.  I wish I could take this but one dose and I have severe abdominal cramps, nausea and unbelievely....diarrhea.  LOL...I'm always trying to keep my system moving and this one pill does it for me and more, unfortunately.  Does anyone have any ideas on anything I can take with it to curb the side effects or am I just out of luck with this one?  Tans how does your wife tolerate this?

Thanks  Smile

tanstaafl's picture
tanstaafl
Posts: 960
Joined: Oct 2010

She tolerates cimetidine fine.  I would be suspicious that the irinotecan is really a larger part of GI-nausea source, beyond 5FU and other drugs' interactions. 

My wife takes ~5 grams  of glutamine, divided by 2-3x, which helps restore the GI lining for 5FU (UFT) - LV, without the irinotecan.  Glutamine can help with irinotecan, as does likely does your IVC.  Although highly experimental for her low residue state, we use MK-4 (+ vit c), along with a lot of other things, instead.  <a href="http://csn.cancer.org/node/255388#comment-1341815">also my reply</a>

pete43lost_at_sea's picture
pete43lost_at_sea
Posts: 3915
Joined: Nov 2010

but after reading seyfried cancer as a metabolic illness in got concerned about glutamine role as a cancer fuel as an alternative to glucose, so i backed off, this was at a time my markers were increasing constantly. i cannot say it was glutamine. its just another contradictory view. attempting to heal the stomach lining a nobel goal.

just doing it in the least cancer friendly way, is all i am still attempting.

hugs,

pete

luvinlife2
Posts: 172
Joined: Jul 2012

I'll ask my Dr. about the glutamine.  It's the cimetidine as the only 2 times I've had those side effects were after I took one 400mg pill each time during the 3rd week after my irinotecan/avastin infusion.  That's my good week!   Irinotecan and Xeloda never seem to bother me much.  I never have nausea or abdominal cramping with these drugs.  I'm interested in the glutamine and will check it out Smile

jen2012
Posts: 1195
Joined: Aug 2012

Thanks all for the info!  I will bring it up with the doctors soon.  

Ok....am I missing Ann's link?  I'd like to email to the doctor.  

annalexandria's picture
annalexandria
Posts: 2204
Joined: Oct 2011

I am an idiot, and can't manage to complete a single task without getting off-track.  Oh well, I have chemo to use as an excuse for the rest of my life!  AA

jen2012
Posts: 1195
Joined: Aug 2012

Ha...i figured you forgot to post it...until Chelsea mentioned it...then i thought i was just losing it! :) thanks for adding it!

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