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Does a post like this "there is healing in the name of Jesus" posted in the Cancer Forums hurt or help Religion?

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
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Joined: May 2005

This may get pulled/flagged/deleted, or all of Thee above but here goes...
Recently, a member made a post with the title "there is healing in the name of Jesus" and it had a link to a video with a comment saying "repeat the words in this song over and over. Only God can grant healing and miracles."
By member I mean someone who joined the same day or 1-2 days earlier, does not have a profile or diagnosis, the only friend(s) they have listed have similar profiles, and all they posted was the "there is healing in the name of Jesus" post.

Do you think they are truly religious or are they just making a post to stir things up?
Do you think that is does anything good to promote (in this case) Christianity or does it hurt that religion?
Do you think that if someone made a post saying "there is healing in the name of Mohamed" or another religious icon, that people would be as upset if others asked that the post be placed in this forum instead of the specific Cancer Forums or would they stand up for it with the same fervor?

I would find that post to be offensive even on here because it's claiming there is only one true God and if one had a different faith that they would/could not be helped. It does more to divide people than to bring us together. We all came from somewhere, we all have more in common than some may think.

Any opinions for or against this or is it really insignificant.
-p

Marcia527's picture
Marcia527
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No, a dog. She acts like a cat sometimes tho. lol.

Oh boy did this post end up in the wrong place!

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Hondo
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Wow you sure know how to keep the spark going don't you. I seen the post you were talking about, but did not pay it any mind as I do for a lot of things people post. I don’t see where getting up-set at things like that helps me to be a better or worse person, I just ignore it. As far as someone posting about some other religion I again would not be offended by something like that as I believe there will be in Heaven people from all religions. Who knows maybe people from the agnostic & atheist religions will be there too I can’t judge only God knows where they came from and why they believe what they believe.

I do believe very strongly in the power of prayer and believe it the reason I am still here. If you read about me you will find that I never did treat my NPC Cancer when it came back a third time in 2005. All I did was prayer and some alternative treatment that’s been over 6 years ago and the doctors are still puzzled as to why I am not dead. I can’t say why some people gets healed and others don’t as I know there are a lot of other believers who have more faith then I do, and have went to sleep. But I don’t blame it on God I blame it on Sin. I do believe a lot of people have the wrong conception about God I guess that it why the world blames him for all the Bad things that happen and gives no credit to him when something good happens

Just my take on the subject, have a great day
Hondo

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
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Think of how different/boring this site could be if not for me. OK. don't think too much, I may find myself voted off the Island!
One thing I do not do is get "upset" about it. This forum is really mainly just about exchanging ideas. I will say that that the posts by that "lady" who seemed to have joined for 1 day, had no profile so likely wasn't even someone with cancer, posted the same post that really had nothing to do with cancer, and it seemed more like just a disciple spreading the word. At least she could have personalized it for each forum she posted it in :-)

What I do enjoy seeing more of is that many people feel that they will see many people from many faiths. I certainly may be wrong, but I was taught t believe that unless one accepted the "whole package" they really were'nt true beleivers. I think that those are the "Terry Jones'" of the world and do not represent the majority of Christians in his case. I know the Catholic church is not very happy with the Buffett Catholics as they call them. One can not be Catholic and be pro-choice. They don"t want people to pick and choose what to believe, it's a packaged deal.

I also think there is power in positive thinking, prayer, meditation, and any other names it falls under. The mind is a powerful thing that we don't understand that much about. I certainly don't think that blaming God for cancer or sickness makes any sense. I know that when some things can not be explained, that it's given the label of an "Act of God" My personal opinion is that when someone doesn't know the explanation of something, it's much easier to bring God into it. Many cultures that date back many thousands of years had gods for everything they didn't understand. There were gods for planting crops, gods for harvesting crops. They didn't understand how weather patterns so they had godsfor rain. Today we call them "Weathermen" but often they blame things on "Acts of God"
-p

fanniemay
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PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
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Interesting post, I read it last night but didn't comment. Everyone's entitled to their views and can interpret what happened to them however they wish. The bottom line is who knows?
Thanks for posting if it were only briefly...
Do you know Freddie Mac?
:-)
Merry Christmas...
-phil

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kokomc
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To a person who is a true Christian it should not hurt at all, but to someone who is not a Christian I might see where they would get offended. I would think that if someone posted about their healing they would want stay to share the rest of the story and help give faith to others who may be having the same problems. Maybe they are just afraid if they stayed they would be bullied about their faith, I really don’t know but everyone is different in how they share their faith.

This is my first time on this forum; and I find it is kind of a paradox to me. Being it says Spirituality, Prayer, and Meditation, I see no one praying or asking for prayer, and I see no Meditation of any kind or any belief. Maybe this forum it is just named wrong and gives the wrong impression to people when they come here.

Mary

sea60's picture
sea60
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HA! Totally agree. I said the same a while back Mary. They totally need to rename this...LOL!

Marcia527's picture
Marcia527
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I see belief here on this forum.

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
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those who want to spread the word or make Christian posts don't want to preach to the choir, they want to post in specific cancer forums where people are asking questions about treatment options and not praying hard enough. They also seemed to resent being asked not to proselytize. The creation of this forum was an attempt to get the requests for "weekly prayer threads" and the posts telling people with cancer that if we didn't accept Jesus as our savior we deserve to be in Hell, off the colon cancer forum. Since I joined this site in May 2005, I HAVE NEVER ONCE saw any other religious group make a religious post in the colon cancer forum. Could it be that other faiths don't get sick? Or could it be that many people know that discussing religion is a hot topic (like politics) so when dealing with many people from various backgrounds and faiths that it's often better to keep posts to cancer questions and not make the site feel like it is a White-Christian-only site which alienates people and keeps many from joining and/or posting?

The people who this forum was supposed to benefit decided they'd rather keep violating the TOC of the site and were banned and are now on the other sites where Christians with Cancer is the main theme. That's great, they are with others who believe what they believe so they can exchange verses and complain about their perceived persecution of Christians.

This forum was a good place to ask questions about what people may believe happens to them after they die, if cancer has been all bad for them, and other topics that affect us all but there really wasn't a specific place for them. It's also become a great place for people to argue about who is right about the existence of "God" and who is wrong.

Of course I may be totally wrong with what I've seen in the 6+ years I've been on the forum.

Marcia is right though, some people DO discuss their beliefs on here but it's not that frequent.

kokomc's picture
kokomc
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Not just Christians pray and meditate; there are a lot of people of all Faiths, Religions, and Creeds that do the same and I am sure they come to this site seeking just that. I have friends who are of totally different faiths and beliefs and the common denominator between all of us is that we pray and meditate. I think that Muslims and Buddhist pray more than any faith or religion in the world; I see a few here posting now and then but none asking or requesting pray. I did see a few Christians asking for pray but again not many and I don't think they are here anymore. So back to my original question why is this forum called Spirituality, Prayer, and Meditation if that is not what it is used for.

There are always people of all faiths and religions Atheist included who will try and force their way of believing on everyone else. I can understand if these are the people you are talking about getting band from this site. My personal belief is that people should be free to believe or not to believe what they want. I don’t argue about my belief because I don’t try to force my way on anyone else. But when I see something that is saying Spirituality, Prayer, and Meditation that is what I am expecting to find. I guess this site is like religion everyone sees it in their own way.

Don’t get me wrong I am just trying to understand that if I want to ask for prayer or ask someone to meditate with me about something this is not the place to do it.

Mary

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
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It is misnamed. Few, if any, of those it was created for came here so this is what it became.
I do get it (now) that it would be nice if this forum kept to the title.
Let me meditate on it for a while
;-)
I hope you had a wonderful holiday and have a healthy new year
-phil

sea60's picture
sea60
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Hope you're having a wonderful Holiday.

Don't you think Mary has a point regarding how one can be thrown off by the topic name? It is confusing. There are some folks from different religions (not just Christian)that are radical and totally misrepresent themselves just as there are politicians who do the same. So, knowing that there are a few out there like the person you mentioned on the colon cancer board, does that mean ALL Christians are these pulpit thumping, hell threatening maniacs? Of course not. As long as there are people, there will be those who take things to the extreme. Getting back to Mary's comment, if the majority who are drawn here because it's labeled with the words "Prayer, Spirituality and Meditation" believe in God and ask for prayer or would like to share scripture that perhaps has given them strength through their ordeal, make them fanatical Christians trying to take over the forum?

I get the intent you want it to be and agree with the questions and topics you'd like to discuss, however, I do think they should consider somehow re-naming this forum.

Thoughts? Possibilities?

P.S. I like the play of colors on your pic! :)

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
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I see Mary's (and your) point. It is misleading. The attempt was made to create the space but few went here. I tried to ask some questions that would cover many faiths or beliefs like what happens when we die, etc. so people could share and learn about other faiths. The fanatics of any faith will keep doing what they do and certainly won't be corralled with like minded people. What's the fun of that?!

I have little if any influence with what goes on here but I will mention it to "the powers that be"
-phil
Thanks for the pic comment. Just playing around with photo apps ;-)

soccerfreaks's picture
soccerfreaks
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(Kris Kristofferson reference)

I've always considered this forum an area for discussion and exploration and perhaps that is an error in judgement on my part. In any event, I do not recall ever reading a post where someone was simply seeking prayers or joint mediation and then receiving comeuppance from some atheist or agnostic. If that can be pointed out to me, I will gladly accept it as a problem with the person responding rather than the original poster.

On the other hand, there have been some rather zesty debates about beliefs and non-beliefs, many of them quite thought-provoking, although I will agree that they can get out of hand, as any topic related to religion or politics, for whatever reason, seems bound to do given enough time.

In my recollection, these debates occur because of a statement of fact on the part of the poster, whether believer or non-, then questioned by others, supported by still others. These are not prayers or supplications or requests but purported statements of fact and therefore open to inquiry and alternate viewpoints.

I am an agnostic but have many theistic friends who somehow put up with me (heck, I'm married to one!). I hope that people do not feel alienated against seeking prayers or meditation on this forum. I concur that this is the place for such. But would you agree at least that there is no proper forum for preaching to people to give up their treatment and allow god to heal them?

Thank you for bringing up an important point.

Take care,

Joe

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kokomc
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I would say that everything has its proper place and debating ones believe or faith on a public forum like CSN is not the way to help people who are going through trials in their life like Cancer. But praying for someone is a totally different thing. If pray can help someone and lift up their spirits keeping them motivated or focus with positive thoughts, why not pray for them.

Being you are agnostic I would not expect for you to understand much about having pure Faith in God. When my husband was going through treatment we listen to what the doctors told us as they treated him. But we put our faith in God that he would lead the doctors to know exactly what to do to treat him. I also know of people who had tumors in their bodies, and were anointed by men of faith never receiving any treatment. When they went back to their doctors there tumor was gone, I know two these people so I know there testimony was true.

There are things in life that no one understands and having faith in God is one of them. Don’t underestimate the power of prayer because you don’t agree with it. Just be open minded enough to know there are many mysteries that we have no idea of how or why they are, believing and having faith is just one of them.

Mary

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Hondo
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Very well put, in the book of Hebrews it tells us what pure faith is. So for someone who does not understand what it is to believe, there is just No Hope for them. I can’t imagine how bad life must be with out hope in something better then this life. Also I find that all Atheist and agnostic are not the same. I worked for an Atheist for almost 20 years, and he knew the Bible just as well as I did. He admits that there is some kind of super intelligent, but his problem with it was where was he when he is needed. I tried to explain that too him but that is where the conversation always stopped and he sent me back to my office.

Thanks for sharing
Hondo

Guardianone 2000's picture
Guardianone 2000
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Does a post like this "there is healing in the name of Jesus" posted in the Cancer Forums hurt or help Religion?

Who cares, religion is man-made. I am a walking miracle because of Jesus, God and Holy Spirit. Jesus is just another name for God since they are One. During the crisis cancer creates in the lives of people it affects, what difference does it make? The truth is, without the Holy Trinity, you don't have a chance. You'll think someone who believes is trying to sell something.

I've lived with stage 4 melanoma and was sent home from Duke to die. I made a covenant with God and I am still here because of it. Quite frankly those who don't want to believe in Jesus don't have to read the post. They need to get off their high horses and remember that we all are different and if you don't like something then don't get involved in it. I do believe and I don't care what you think.

This is personal and as human beings we should try and understand what they are going through while trying to cling to life. I am going to share my story and you can make your own determination on whether you believe I believe what Iam saying.

Imagine traveling to Duke Medical Center for what is called a Hail Mary chance for life. A team of physicians, the top oncologist in the world are reviewing your case file and assessing your condition to determine what course of treatment is left or available. When they have completed their evaluation, the decision is made, there is nothing can be done to save or prolong your life.

In 2004, I was sent home with less than 2 months to live (stage 4). The melanoma tumor which started in my left eye had metastasis throughout my lymph system, liver, lungs and brain.

I couldn’t even be given experimental chemotherapy, because it would have no affect crossing the blood barrier in the brain. When the Dr. told me this, I looked up and said, “Thank You Lord, now You and I can work this out together.” My Dr. looked at me like I was crazy and then he told me, “They would keep me comfortable until I was gone.”

As we left the hospital, I was in shock. I had to try and comfort my sister who had driven me that day. I was on large doses of morphine for the pain and was unable to drive myself. She was really upset about what the Dr’s. had said. I told her everything was going to be alright. Everything was in God’s hands, not mine nor the Doctor’s.

On the way home I shut my eyes and started thinking about the things I was going to miss. I wasn’t even going to see my daughter graduate High School later that year.
I thanked God for all the blessing’s I had had in my life. I never asked God to save my life. I did say “Lord, You know I have been all over the world helping people and if it is Your Will for me to come home, then I am ready; however if You give me the opportunity, I will write three books in Your Honor.”

In 2005, I fulfilled my covenant with God and I am here today. I still have seven nods in my lungs. After the second book was written, my doctor’s and I realized I had had a miracle occur. All the cancer was out of my body. I was immediately tested again with cats, pets, bone scans, x-rays and labs.

In May 2010, I had stereotactic radiation to stop the bleeding and kill the nod that grew into a tumor. I’ve had surgery, radiation, pain medicines and thank God for Dr.’s and scientist.
The rest of this story can be found on my website: bradleydallasnorth.net

soccerfreaks's picture
soccerfreaks
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Due to your inflammatory introduction, I took your advice and decided not to read the rest of what you had to say.

Take care,

Joe

Guardianone 2000's picture
Guardianone 2000
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Just because you believe in yourself and all knowing. Have a great life! Oh, don't forget your meds, you need them...

Guardianone 2000's picture
Guardianone 2000
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Just because you believe in yourself and all knowing. Have a great life!

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
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Quite an attack for someone "new" to the forum.
I think you answered my question in your response to Joe...

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
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Are unique to each of us. We take what we need from them. Whats works or what I believe in, may not (or may) work for you.
Glad you found something that worked for you.
Question for you, you posted no profile info at all just your story in your post.
Are you here just to share your story?
-phil

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Guardianone 2000
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Phill,

I had Faith way before I ever had cancer. My name is David K. Sumrell and my story is already being shared. I just couldn't believe the post. Have any of these readers ever faced death, not only cancer. Why are you on here?

PhillieG's picture
PhillieG
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I too couldn't believe the post that I read initially. Glad we agree ;-)
I'm here because I enjoy hearing stories and I enjoy comparative theology.
Why are you here? Are you somehow more "important" than the rest of us with cancer?
Everyone faces death all the time whether we realize it or not...
-p

Guardianone 2000's picture
Guardianone 2000
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Do you look for arguments or to challenge others to think? "New" to a forum. Because you joined in 2005, does that make you more important than the rest of us or your opinion any more valid.

I personally don't care what other people want to believe, the question was wether or not using Jesus's name in a cancer forums help or hurt religion? Just because a person is religous doesn't make the a Christian,,, nor does it make them good or bad. It is their own personal choice, we don't have to debate the obvious about man made religions.

Did I come across as believiving I am more 'important' than the rest of you'll? If so I am sorry, but I do take it personal when someone hides behind a computer screen and wants to belittle my belief's. I read what you'll had to say, without condemnation. I am here for HOPE and as cancer patients, there are a lot of people searching for what they may never have experienced.

To me this is a battle ground for the ones like Joe. I am a warrior for the Lord and I will not back down from my belief's and I hope you can atleast understand my conviction in my own belief's.

I don't know how to post a profile...

soccerfreaks's picture
soccerfreaks
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A battleground for me? You, yourself, insisted that if folks didn't want to read your screed we should ignore it, and I simply pointed out that your introduction was enough to send me away.

Read what you say and heed it, or don't write it.

Take care,

Joe

Guardianone 2000's picture
Guardianone 2000
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Go back to the mirror and keep worshipping yourself. Don't care if you read it or not, it was put there for an answer to a question. Your opinion, although I don't agree with your point of view, is yours. I hope you have a great day and keep attacking people you don't agree with...it makes you a real man!!!

Marcia527's picture
Marcia527
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Up at the top next to members online is "Create or update About Me' page. Click where it says 'click here'.

Everyone here has had a hard load to bear. I take into consideration each members background when replying. So some of us read the profile page or About Me page.

We had a member who also had a healing but she was shy to talk about it. Not everyone receives what they ask for. And sometimes even when we do receive it, it's hard to talk about.

This ended up in wrong spot...meant to be at the bottom.

Guardianone 2000's picture
Guardianone 2000
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I just got my first lesson on CSN humility. You are absolutely right. I just got finished reading Joe's bio. I will try and be more humble in the future, I wasn't sure if this was an ambush page and I will fight for what I believe. I think I have realized for the first time ( I am not alone ) in this fight, there are so many of us fighting and struggling to understand and survive, while trying to make other's believe everything is ok.

Again Marcia,

Thank you!!!

Guardianone 2000's picture
Guardianone 2000
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I just read your profile and I want to say i am sorry for the remarks I made. You have been through hell and I am sorry for your situation. You are a Real man and I believe you hold alot of anger as to why? Just an (assumption) on my part and I know I've left myself open. We had a Bayside Hospital in Virginia Beach, I believe it has changed to Sentara Bayside now. Were you in this area when diagnosed?

Everyone involved in a cancer patients life is tested, and the trials are sometimes severe.

soccerfreaks's picture
soccerfreaks
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Your apology is accepted although I challenge the need to read my profile before making that apology.

We are all here dealing with serious diseases, either as survivors or caregivers, and most of us consider this site to be a place to share our experiences, our emotions, and, in this particular forum, even our thoughts about more esoteric subjects, religion, existence, so that they do not 'pollute' the other forums. I do not write that derogatorily, but to say, simply, that there is a place for everything and this is the place for expressing belief and forcing ourselves to think about such matters, if we so choose.

I think your acknowledgement of a certain humility is far more significant than an apology to me, although it is appreciated and, I think, well deserved.

Otherwise, yes, my first biopsy was at Bayside in Va Beach, from which I was ambulanced to Norfolk General, and I am still in the area (not of the ambulance, but Va Beach :)).

Welcome to the site. I wish you the best. (And I do not consider myself angry, not in the least, and have never asked why, not from day one: it is what it is.)

Hope and Humor!

Take care,

Joe

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Guardianone 2000
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I myself have never asked why either. I was born in Norfolk General and I am in Virginia Beach, born in Norfolk. I will explain my apology 'after' reading your profile. This is the first time in my whole life of 'cancer' to have been to any forum for cancer patients,survivors, etc. My experience on computer since we have had them is never trust anything or anyone until you know who they are. I felt vulnerable and by not knowing whether you were even a cancer patient (had not seen any profile, nor did I know there was one, until after the shooting started. I went back into survival mode, all my life I have always said I will die for three things; God, Family and Country and in any order.

I was defending my belief's when I percieved your words as an attact on my faith. This does not give me the right to launch a strike against you and for that I am sorry, because I was wrong. I have always tried to be a humble person. You and I might even share friends in our area, so with that in mind, maybe we can start again for a mutual respect for each other's belief, and possibly become friends!

Thank you!

David

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soccerfreaks
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And no more apologies are required :).

I think we all carry some baggage when we come into a place like this, anger, frustration, anxiety, depression, fear, denial, the typical gamut of grief-related tendencies, one or more of them, and it is understandable.

I was hostile myself when I first came in (in the Chat Room, where they were talking about everything BUT cancer).

I am frankly not sure that your fervent faith and my not knowing will combine well, but, yes, perhaps we can become friends and even get around to a lunch or something.

In the meantime, explore all that the site has to offer and think about making your own contributions.

You are a survivor.

Take care,

Joe

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PhillieG
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Sometimes I'll challenge people to think. I don't believe anyone's died from thinking (only from saying what they thought). I don't go looking for arguments either nor do I think I'm special because I've been on the site since 2005. I'm thankful I have good Doctors though. The only reason I was wondering about being new was that usually people edit their profiles to include their type of cancer, what treatments (if any) they've taken, or other words of wisdom. At the top of all pages in the light yellow area it says "Click here to create or update your member "About Me" page". Look for the "Edit" tab, it's next to the "My CSN Space".

You do come across as being very arrogant and combative.
I am not here looking for hope as much as I'm here to offer hope for others. Being someone who has Lived With Cancer for close to 8 years, I feel I'm in a position to share with others that cancer does not have to be a death sentence. It's very important to have a good medical team behind you, and if you happen to have faith in a higher power that certainly can have a positive effect on your outcome. Being one who was raised Catholic and went through 8 years of Catholic school, I've been an agnostic since my teens and I realized that every faith can't be right. I DO care about what others believe, mainly because the more you know about something the more you can find the common beliefs and common ground of which there are many.

Joe did nothing more than follow your advice about reading your post, I really don't understand your attack. Calling this (forum) a battleground for "ones like Joe" and being a "warrior for the Lord" certainly does not make you come across as someone who would welcome or acknowledge the opinions of a Muslim, Jew, Agnostic, Buddhist, Hindu, etc with cancer. While you're free to believe what you wish (as are all people) and I see your conviction, I don't understand how people can think they know what the "TRUTH" is to a question that has no answer. And so the wars will continue until the Best God wins I suppose.

Thanks for posting, the site's been dull lately.
Good luck with your doctor visits.
-phil

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Guardianone 2000
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Thank you Phil, I guess I am combative and arrogant ( I never thought so, but I have wrong on many ocassions). I am not against other beliefs people might have. I agree with you on whatever brings them comfort. I just read about Joe and got my first lesson on CSN humility. Please forgive my arrogance and accept my apologies. This has been a long battle and I am back on the front line fighting again.

David

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PhillieG
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Thank you for your reply. Cancer's real scary at times and I know that I don't always show my best side either when something's going on for me.
No need to apologize but thank you for doing so. Hang in there David and slay that Goliath called cancer!
-phil

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Guardianone 2000
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I am looking for my sling shot...

David

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Guardianone 2000
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Pet Scan revealled NO CANCER, anywhere in my body!!! Taliked with Radiology Oncologist this morning and he was shocked, amazed and full of joy, also. Both say I am a walking miracle! Thanks Phil for the encouraging words on Goliath!!!

David

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PhillieG
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Great news David. Continued success!
Phil

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z
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Great News! I wish you continued great news. Lori

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Guardianone 2000
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I go to oncology tomorrow and again on the 18 of January. I am stage 4 and have lived almost 9 years longer than the Dr's gave me and without medication. They again want to remove part of my lung. When God took the cancer out of my body, I was left with 7 nods in my lungs. I am not looking for sympathy, because I know why I am still here...

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Hondo
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I would love to hear your story, I had NPC cancer three times and the last time did not do any treatment except Alternative Treatment. When the doctors told me the odds, due more Chemo and may be get a year or two or don’t do treatment and only a few months. I believe God lead me to find just the right A.C.T. I needed because that had all been just about 7 years ago now. I go to MD Anderson in Houston Texas and the doctors are all puzzled about my case, my main doctors knows what I did but will not admit that it is what helped me. Faith can do a lot of things for someone who believes

Wishing you the best my friend
Hondo

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Guardianone 2000
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Joined: Jan 2012

Hondo,

My Doctors and just about every Dr. who has been exposed to my case call it a miracle that I am alive. With some of them it was a longer time coming, just because they knew I was going to die. If you go to my wesite: bradleydallasnorth.net and read my story and blogs it will help you understand my Faith, also. Dr.'s are human and they smart enough to know they don't know everything (normally older ones). My eye Dr. is a professor at Duke and he told me that he teaches every class about my case. He told me he tells them that when they think they know everything, read this!

If you contact me through my website I will make arrangements for us to talk and share more of our Faith and stories.

I hope to hear from you soon... (757-729-9740) IF anyone would like to talk, please call me.....

You take care, also!!!
David

Guardianone 2000's picture
Guardianone 2000
Posts: 30
Joined: Jan 2012

Sorry!

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