CEA after liver resection

janie1 said:

Praying for you!

Praying for you!

Dear janie
Thank you very very much for your prayer! I really need it.

Love and hugs
Dora

PhillieG said:

It's not uncommon
to have the CEA only drop a little bit after a procedure or surgery. I had a RFA done last December and it barely dropped for the first 2-3 months. Now it's back down to (my) normal. I do not know all of the medical reasons why that happens but I know from my experiences that it happens every time for me. Also, CEA is not always the best indicator of disease. It's a tool that is sometimes more accurate in some people than in others.

I would be very pleased with a drop like that in the amount of time it happened in.
All the best Dora,
-phil
PS: I hope your Mum's oncologist isn't a "told you so" type person.

Dear Phil
Oh your message will definitely give me a good night sleep tonight.

The reason why I am so worried and scared it's because CEA does reflect my mum's situation... but knowing it doesn't always drop really make me feel better! Thank you very very much for your reply!

My mum's oncologist was the only one who did not agree with the liver resection. He asked me a couple of times to think twice before the surgery and said it's not worth taking the risk of a big surgery when 'cure' will not happen! He is a brutally honest oncologist and will never give us false hope!

I don't know what else can I do to make her live healthier... she always wants to eat something she is not supposed to (e.g., deep fried stuff, oily stuff and etc!), and I'm not always strong enough to stop her! SIGH

Thanks again for your prompt reply and I really appreciate it.
With all my warm wishes to you!
Dora

PhillieG said:

Hi Dora
My CEA reflects what's going on for me too. If I see it rise only 4-5 points then something is usually up. That being said, it does take a few months for it to go back down.

As far as your Mum's oncologist goes, he certainly sounds brutal and maybe he's honest but I'm a bit surprised that "cure" is not in his vocabulary. He doesn't seem to be giving a lot of hope either. Maybe I just don't know the entire situation your Mum faces. Try to remember that someone has to be those people who do beat cancer, there's no reason why it can't be your Mum?

I had some serious tumors on my hepatic artery (main vein to my liver) that prevented surgery. I did a 6 month cycle of FOLFOX and Avastin and that made my operable. That was Sept 2004. They removed between 60-70% of my liver and installed a HAI pump that gave chemo right to my liver for an additional 6 months and (knock wood) it's been fine every since. While my situation was serious, my oncologist was aggressive in her approach (which was exactly what I wanted) and we still look at this as something that can be cured. It's just taking time but that's A-OK with me.

While ideally we should avoid certain foods and drinks, I like a beer here and there and a few other things. Everything in moderation.
-phil

Dear Phil
My mum's oncologist was referred by her colon surgeon, they kind of work as a team.

Here are some info about my mum:
27 Oct 2010 dx colon ca with liver met (7 and all on one side of her liver - the bigger part)
28 Oct 2010 PET Scan
29 Oct 2010 colon surgery
26 Nov 2010 XELOX (diarrhea, stayed in hospital for 2 weeks till x'mas)
3 Jan 2011 changed to FOLFOX (diarrhea again, stayed in hospital for another 9 days)
11 Feb 2011 2nd FOLFOX
8 March 2011 3rd FOLFOX
28 March 2011 Liver Resection

I just come back from the visit to her oncologist today. I secretly asked the nurses to tell the doctor not to mention anything about the small drop of her CEA... in the end, he didn't say anything negative today.

My mum will start chemo (I guess FOLFOX) next Wed. I just hope we can control her diarrhea well this time! Her oncologist also worry a lot about it!

I know she is not supposed to have deep fried stuffs, but I let her had tempura for lunch as I know her taste will not be the same after chemo begins. I want her to taste something she likes... my husband always tease me to be her doctor-in-charge as I always try to stop her eating this and that!

I really want to thank you for your assurance. I was really miserable yesterday! I cannot imagine how am I going to get through this without finding this board, without finding you guys here!

Thanks again!
Dora

lisa42 said:

mine too
If my memory is correct, I believe it took a while for my CEA to go down after my liver resection too. I had my surgery back in 5/08, but I'm pretty sure that I had to wait a good two months before it really went down to under the normal level. So, tell this to your mum before even going in to the dr & if onc says anything tell him you've heard from other patients who have had liver resections that it may take awhile to go down.

Such a bummer that you have such a "brutally honest" onc for your mum. Another description might be "brutally pessimistic". Regardless of what he thinks, he should realize that the attitude he conveys to his patients affects their outcome- stress and feeling like there's no hope is not what cancer patients need! It makes me angry when I hear doctors are like this. I'm so grateful for my very upbeat oncologist. Even if I get frustrated that he doesn't research new ideas for me, I am very grateful that he is upbeat and open to new things I want to research or do.
Is your mum open to the idea of changing oncologists, or at least going to another one for another opinion, and then possibly changing?

Best wishes- it must be hard when you're not the patient and your mum isn't very involved in her own care or doesn't know the information well.

Hugs to you-
Lisa

Dear Lisa
My mum will start chemo again next Wed. So if her CEA drops again (keep my fingers crossed), we won't know whether it's because of the surgery or chemo. She really hates chemo due to her previous experience - severe diarrhea. I hope she can handle them well this time. I really hope we can go to US together to visit my sister and her son. My mum misses her grand son so much. But then I can see the hesitation from my Mum's oncologist. He asked me to buy her an open ticket just in case. He told us it could cost us a fortune if my mum needs to go to the hospital in US.

I did seek second opinion after the first treatment when my mun's side effects were so serious and her oncologist wanted her to stop chemo... In the end, we still come back to this one because him and my Mum's colon surgeon, liver surgeon kind of work as a team and they communicate well. He is kind and honest. The medical system here is different. We can either go to public hospital where goverment will pay for you (except target therapy), but don't expect to receive good service and have to wait for a long time for everything. Or else we can go to private practice doctors, who will provide fast and good service. But then, we have to be very careful not to go to those who are more profit making... My Mum's oncologist is a private doctor who is not 'profit making' type... That's why we still like him despite his 'brutally honest' characteristics. We usually get her blood test results within hours, PET scan result within 24 hours.

I don't have the guts to tell my mum about her CEA... She believes she is cured and has been very happy and energeic lately, I don't want to ruin her upbeat mood. I secretly asked the nurse to inform the oncologist not to mention anything about her CEA today. He didnt in the end. For the first time my mum ate a lot after seeing him!

Thank you so much for your sharing and I hope you are doing very well too!
Love and hugs
Dora